I think its funny that when we say bubble stun is OP, everyone screams at smash spec. in cas you havent noticed the plethra of smash spec QQ threads, that is where you take your smash QQ. This is a thread about bubble stun. Whats even funnyer is, if you have a carnage mara on you, you are going to die faster than if you have a smash mara on you, yet you dont see carnage qq threads lol.

 

If you dont wana get smashed, dont stand next to the target of the smasher.

 

If you are the target, be thankful he is smash speck instead of carnage!

 

Back on topic, it will be interesting to see what they do with the bubble, I do hope they make it easyer for sorc to do damage and heal, by way of not being able to be inturpted, or something like that. Knowin BW, they will crank up abilitys to insane levels so that your average sorc can compete and your not average awesome sorc will be doing smash spec damage haha. Then all the marauders will be complaing about how force storm is so OP or somthing lol.

Well silly me, I guess I thought most people in the gaming community would realise bubble stun was a direct counter to the smash bollocks we have currently.

Yes lets just remove bubble stun and leave smash (its fine).

If you dont want to get bubble stunned - pop it from range (see what I did there? probably not)

You could say its a direct counter to rage but the issue is it also counters all melee, regaurdless of spec. The melee is going to get stunned if he hits just one guy with the bubble or all 5 doesnt really matter, in fact i try to break all of them i can as to help my teammates, if im gettin stunnned anyway, might as well break them all lol.

point is, if i aoe or single target, as a melee, it doesnt matter. If I am rage/carnage/anni/imortal/veng without unstoppable, and jedi equivilents and/or shanky OP/smug, sloppy PT, or unlucky soul fighting a click-off-sorc you get stunned, alot.

Well silly me, I guess I thought most people in the gaming community would realise bubble stun was a direct counter to the smash bollocks we have currently.

 

Yes lets just remove bubble stun and leave smash (its fine).

 

If you dont want to get bubble stunned - pop it from range (see what I did there? probably not)

If i can and have time to setup for a range pop using a scream or throw, I will, and do. Doing this is a dps killer for sure and some times, if i want to kill somone, i have to do this. Take your average player though, they usually wont have the skill to do this, and if it is OP against the average player that doesnt know how it works then it just wont last.

to answer your first question, let me provide a answer to your prayers! I have an idea, make is so the stun only effects a warrior/knight when they use smash! poof everyones happy hahaha

You could say its a direct counter to rage but the issue is it also counters all melee, regaurdless of spec. The melee is going to get stunned if he hits just one guy with the bubble or all 5 doesnt really matter, in fact i try to break all of them i can as to help my teammates, if im gettin stunnned anyway, might as well break them all lol.

 

point is, if i aoe or single target, as a melee, it doesnt matter. If I am rage/carnage/anni/imortal/veng without unstoppable, and jedi equivilents and/or shanky OP/smug, sloppy PT, or unlucky soul fighting a click-off-sorc you get stunned, alot.

The problem I'd have with that point, is that what is "normally" the drawback to melee classes in other games is the inherent fact that they are melee. In SWTOR, there are plenty enough ways to get into melee range, and on short enough cooldown, that this disadvantage is largely diminished.

If the stun bubble is the only real counter to melee (with the exception of snipers who can just turret), then I don't think that is a good enough reason to nerf it as hard as many people suggest. I haven't seen any arguments in this thread that are persuasive (or thought out) enough to change my thoughts that removing the ability to end it prematurely is all that it needs to balance it better.

I think its funny that when we say bubble stun is OP, everyone screams at smash spec. In case you havent noticed the plethra of smash spec QQ threads, that is where you take your smash QQ. This is a thread about bubble stun. Whats even funnyer is, if you have a carnage mara on you, you are going to die faster than if you have a smash mara on you, yet you dont see carnage qq threads lol.

 

If you dont wana get smashed, dont stand next to the target of the smasher.

 

If you are the target, be thankful he is smash spec instead of carnage!

 

Back on topic, it will be interesting to see what they do with the bubble, I do hope they make it easyer for sorc to do damage and heal, by way of not being able to be inturpted, or something like that. Knowin BW, they will crank up abilitys to insane levels so that your average sorc can compete and your not average awesome sorc will be doing smash spec damage haha. Then all the marauders will be complaing about how force storm is so OP or somthing lol.

The difference between smash spec and carnage is you can easily stun a carnage marauder through his burst and smash spec gets it instantly (you used to be able to kb smashers and they'd miss the smash). I mean sure if you eat a carnage marauders burst you willl die if you eat the whole thing (this is the spec i play btw) but all you have to do is stun his armor pen window so anyone that dies really fast at the hands of one its down to the player not knowing how to deal with them. Many smart players do this so i don't really think combat/carnage is overpowered at all.

 

If you dont wana get smashed, dont stand next to the target of the smasher.

 

If you are the target, be thankful he is smash spec instead of carnage!

well applying that logic one would have to say if you don't want to get CC'd by the bubble don't get in range of it.

 

If the stun bubble is the only real counter to melee (with the exception of snipers who can just turret), then I don't think that is a good enough reason to nerf it as hard as many people suggest. I haven't seen any arguments in this thread that are persuasive (or thought out) enough to change my thoughts that removing the ability to end it prematurely is all that it needs to balance it better.

Maybe you should look at the video in this

Just make it that bubble casted on other classes doesn't have stun effect. It would still absorb damage and do its primary function - just without stun effect.

If sorc casts buble on himself/herself than keep the stun effect. Sorcs need this protection.

Just make it that bubble casted on other classes doesn't have stun effect. It would still absorb damage and do its primary function - just without stun effect.

 

If sorc casts buble on himself/herself than keep the stun effect. Sorcs need this protection.

Make predation only effect the caster, oh, and smash is single target now.

Because making something effect only one person rather than multiple people isn't much of a nerf right?

Make predation only effect the caster, oh, and smash is single target now.

 

Because making something effect only one person rather than multiple people isn't much of a nerf right?

Predation I would be fine with being single target, but if they did this, they would need to buff it, and they would effectively kill Carnage spec, so you would see MORE Rage warriors. Consider that before you request this nerf.

If Smash was single target they would also need to buff it slightly, and Rage would become the dominant spec in PvP and PvE both, and Id hate to see annihilation become obsolete in the PvE arena too.

Predation I would be fine with being single target, but if they did this, they would need to buff it, and they would effectively kill Carnage spec, so you would see MORE Rage warriors. Consider that before you request this nerf.

 

If Smash was single target they would also need to buff it slightly, and Rage would become the dominant spec in PvP and PvE both, and Id hate to see annihilation become obsolete in the PvE arena too.

OK... then if that's so- if bubble stun is self target only- by the very logic you are using- the bubble would need to be buffed, correct?

I don't see anyone considering that losing group utility for a sorc would kill them for RWZ viability- then again, I see a lot of marauders who really only want this removed to make the game easier for them- since that's what SWTOR is about after all, making the game easier for marauders.

.... also, what? If smash was single target rage would become (lol, become- it isn't already?) dominant spec and yet ALSO need a buff? Can you explain why, if it's the dominant spec, you would need to also buff it?

Yeah nerf predation to be single target only because that party buff doesnt help sorcs/sages at all.

Yeah nerf stun bubbles to be single target only because that party buff doesn't help sorcs/sages/other at all

Understand the point yet? Or is it still not clear enough for you?

.....endless root QQ....

 

You really want to make it look like you guys want something done about CC in this game? Stop asking for nerfs solely to classes you don't play

 

Regardless- carnage viable? It's pretty much a 'must have one of these' spec for RWZ teams- why not make the DPS specs of mercs, ops and sorcs viable since they are almost entirely absent from RWZ?

 

Oh right- those are classes that aren't warriors, that's why.

Dude, we get it. You are butthurt to the point of endless whining about your 1.2 sorc rebalance. But if you want to be taken seriously, go back and edit every post you made about bubble stun and change the word "nerf" to "bugfix."

What's really teh lulz is your attempt to project your anger into our posts. The community agrees that:

• Mercs need more viability - dps and/or utility
  
• Sorcs need more burst/escape potential
  
• Smash needs to be toned back down to pre-1.4
  
• Operatives need more dps viability - more sustained, easier restealth
  

And there are plenty of threads for each of these. THIS thread is about the broken bubble that adds incorrect resolve and can be clicked off while stunned. The bubble that gives every class an activatable AoE stun. The bubble that ruins the viability of dps operative who need to open from stealth within melee. So please get on topic with the adults.

Edit: And we have been over and over resolve not being affected by roots. Also very off-topic.

Honestly I am mad at myself for posting in this thread which has devolved into nonsense, especially when this thread is of such substantially higher quality, both in terms of debate and skill of contributors.

Dps sages need more work - bubble stun is making games very very boring. I dont want the only reason to take a dps specced sage to be a bubble stun (tbh you may as well heal if you are dps and bubble stunning, you are far more use to your team). I would much rather sages were given a bit more burst or had their dps brought into a more respectable area than having to rely on a stun that can be applied to any team mate and popped manually. It is silly - just as smash is laughably silly -it is, regardless of what people claim, i have a sent too and its a joke what you can do damage wise.

Most people spec bubble stun as dps as it makes it easier to deal with multiple melee but at the cost of what? Even worse dps. Buff balance, nerf bubble stun. Nerf smash (amount of people it hits to 3, knock off some crit and total damage), and then we might be in a better place. But right now rateds are just smashers and bubble stunning (boring).

Dude, we get it. You are butthurt to the point of endless whining about your 1.2 sorc rebalance. But if you want to be taken seriously, go back and edit every post you made about bubble stun and change the word "nerf" to "bugfix."

Anything done to the bubble will be a nerf, not a bugfix. the bubble is not bugged (unless you can find an official statement saying it is bugged) AFAIK they are looking into the bubblestuns, just like they are monitoring/looking into lolsmash.

What's really teh lulz is your attempt to project your anger into our posts. The community agrees that:

• Mercs need more viability - dps and/or utility
  
• Sorcs need more burst/escape potential
  
• Smash needs to be toned back down to pre-1.4
  
• Operatives need more dps viability - more sustained, easier restealth
  

Agreed

 

And there are plenty of threads for each of these. THIS thread is about the broken bubble that adds incorrect resolve and can be clicked off while stunned. The bubble that gives every class an activatable AoE stun. The bubble that ruins the viability of dps operative who need to open from stealth within melee. So please get on topic with the adults.

Easy workaround; Wait 'till someone else pops the bubble, then take away 10k hp of the squishy sage/sorc. (Protip, if enemy is bubbled and the sorc isn't there, it will pop itself after max 30 secs)

 

Edit: And we have been over and over resolve not being affected by roots. Also very off-topic.

Honestly I am mad at myself for posting in this thread which has devolved into nonsense, especially when this thread is of such substantially higher quality, both in terms of debate and skill of contributors.

Your last statement we agree on. way too much nonsense and drivel in the thread. There's good stuff in here too.

My personal opinion on the bubble; I like it as it is, except for one thing.

Make it impossible to manually remove. That would make it balanced.

A semi-spammable AoE CC on a shield like that is a very useful tool for a healer, it creates opportunities for the enemy melee to play smarter instead of facerolling while doing the assist train mindlessly.

It forces the metagame away from pure melee towards more balanced compositions

If only they changed that one little thing... Just make it impossible to manually unclick...

(Reason why I find 300 resolve instead of 600 fair: If the above change happens, then the actual CC timing is out of your hands completely. Enemy team can pop bubbles tactically to avoid the CC completely)

Back when 1.2 hit I was surprised at the knee-jerk reaction approach to pvp class balance changes. 1.4 brought both good and bad, I hope they don't nerf my sage to near uselessness again.

A semi-spammable AoE CC on a shield like that is a very useful tool for a healer, it creates opportunities for the enemy melee to play smarter instead of facerolling while doing the assist train mindlessly.

It forces the metagame away from pure melee towards more balanced compositions

If only they changed that one little thing... Just make it impossible to manually unclick...

 

Your opinions about the bubble stun trend toward survivability for the sorc and not necessarily team utility. And the ability to bubble a melee and have him leap/speed/stealth in shifts the metagame back to them. So my point/question is how do you feel about the stun only working on the sorc?

 

(Reason why I find 300 resolve instead of 600 fair: If the above change happens, then the actual CC timing is out of your hands completely. Enemy team can pop bubbles tactically to avoid the CC completely)

 

Sometimes if you hear something enough it starts to sound agreeable. I suppose it's possible Bioware intended it to give 300 resolve because it is not an on-demand hard stun in the typical sense.

Thanks for the cogent reply. Even with the balance changes that most of us have come around to agreeing upon, i still think bubbling your melee buddy creates a mess with the current state of the bubble. So either double the resolve or have the stun only work on the sorc. Yes, I realize this is a significant hit to the viability of the class and they will need something for compensation. But hopefully that something doesn't involve an ability that allows sorcs to troll whole warzones with nightmare cc.

(In before fungihoujo claims I am only willing to advocate for sorc buff in exchange for sorc nerf because I want to destroy the class / make it not viable / think the buff will never happen, blah blah.)

Can someone point me to the pre 1.4 thread about static barrier needing a buff?

It's the same argument as what smash/sweep are getting. No one complained about it before, then it got buffed and they come out of the woodwork. Perhaps that means there is a problem.

As a sorc, I honestly hate the bubble stun more than smash (possibly because I don't gravitate to stand with 4 other people on my team). Having someone leap to me, only to have their bubble popped by a ranged teammate does not help me escape at all. Having them leap to me and pop my bubble only to have them manually pop theirs to prevent my escape doesn't help either.

I can heal through a smash (self heal ftw), but I can't live through the melee train's constant bubble popping to stun me.

Dude, we get it. You are butthurt to the point of endless whining about your 1.2 sorc rebalance. But if you want to be taken seriously, go back and edit every post you made about bubble stun and change the word "nerf" to "bugfix.".

Changing an ability that put an aoe mez on every player in your team into an aoe stun- so it could then be turned from a buff you could place on your team into one that you yourself are the only beneficiary of- is a bugfix to you?

Having our group utility- the one thing we bring to RWZ- removed entirely is a bugfix to you?

If suddenly your class was nerfed to the point where it had a spot on RWZ simply due to one ability- then that ability's usefulness to the team was removed- you'd consider that to be a bugfix?

I call removing a group utility buff that I can use effectively to help with objectives and to stay alive by using the stuns on my team mates effectively- a nerf because it is a nerf.

Are you really so clueless that you cannot see how this ability has single handedly done just about everything sorcs have asked for?

We were unable to do enough damage to assist with taking objectives in the 30 second rez windows- but the stun gives us the ability to do so without needing to deal any damage at all.

We had very low survivability- the bubble stun makes running through teammates a much more viable strategy, and that is the main strategy people have been telling us 'sorcs can survive fine, just run through your teammates'. Now, before, that put our survival entirely out of our hands and into teammates- now though, I can control it with my own stun bubble, it's my ability that is protecting me.

Whether you think we can manage to do those things or not- if you deny that stun bubbles greatly improve my ability to survive and take objectives you are ignorant. By removing such an ability- both of those are greatly negatively effected.

If my ability to assist taking objectives and survive is going to be heavily penalized- I consider that a nerf.

Changing an ability that put an aoe mez on every player in your team into an aoe stun- so it could then be turned from a buff you could place on your team into one that you yourself are the only beneficiary of- is a bugfix to you?

 

<snip>

 

If my ability to assist taking objectives and survive is going to be heavily penalized- I consider that a nerf.

Snipped for length.

It seems like you didn't read my post very well because you don't seem to realize what aspects of the bubble I consider bugged. Changing it to a stun was a very understandable tweak that made the bubble worthwhile as a defensive measure that didn't just give someone free resolve.

I also don't consider putting it on teammates a "bug." But there is a case to be made that having 1 or 2 of these guys on each team makes warzones unfun stunfests. A very sloppy solution by Bioware.

It clearly is a bug that you can trigger the effect by clicking it off. I shouldn't be able to stun you while stunned myself.

I also happen to think the resolve amount is a bug. People make the argument that the stun is not [supposed to be] on demand, so the resolve amount is appropriate. Not a bad point, but did the old mez bubble give 150 resolve?

Once again, I'm very sorry that once these are fixed you will actually have to carefully consider who you bubble and when instead of handing them out like candy and seeing if you can get all 16 people in the warzone simul-stunned.

More feedback in the PvP forum?

No, its basically a copy/paste of the last thing they said about the bubble stun. Which was nothing constructive