Just about finished doing this. It had been years since I did all the original stories. Have to disagree, I've had a lot of fun re-doing the stories.

 

I don't know if they have the staff to bring out new content like those original stories or the budget, no idea but I would love to see more like it. KoTFE etc. was okay but I'm not crazy about being funneled down as we were.

Knights of the Failed Experiment and Extended Trauma were also not my favourite.

Redoing a couple of the original stories while making sure I do not get overleveled has proven the most story fun I've had in a while in this game. The stories are just more fun to me when enemies don't die the moment you fart in their general direction....as it were.

Just the main story bosses could use a bit more oomph really. They are just champion mobs that don't really feel like the powerful enemies they are supposed to be.

The Agent story was great to repeat. Ok being able to beat Jadus in a fight, forcefield or not, was a definite weak moment but the rest is good enough to make up for that unfortunate writing error. A writer can be forgiven for an occasional lapse of reason.

Knights of the Failed Experiment and Extended Trauma were also not my favourite.

 

Redoing a couple of the original stories while making sure I do not get overleveled has proven the most story fun I've had in a while in this game. The stories are just more fun to me when enemies don't die the moment you fart in their general direction....as it were.

 

Just the main story bosses could use a bit more oomph really. They are just champion mobs that don't really feel like the powerful enemies they are supposed to be.

 

The Agent story was great to repeat. Ok being able to beat Jadus in a fight, forcefield or not, was a definite weak moment but the rest is good enough to make up for that unfortunate writing error. A writer can be forgiven for an occasional lapse of reason.

I appreciated the ease this time 'round. Having already paid my dues, so to speak, years back it was nice to be able to basically breeze through. Now as to how that would feel for a new player, that would depend upon what level of challenge they wanted. If they were after a challenge then the changes would certainly disappoint.

I appreciated the ease this time 'round. Having already paid my dues, so to speak, years back it was nice to be able to basically breeze through. Now as to how that would feel for a new player, that would depend upon what level of challenge they wanted. If they were after a challenge then the changes would certainly disappoint.

I don't know what motivates people but I find that if something's too easy it doesn't really have much value for me. I suppose if I get into a story, the ease of killing of powerful enemies is like reading a book where the last chapter is just one page with a few lines saying that you knock him over the head and he died. The end.

It's just not satisfying to me.

But to each their own.

I appreciated the ease this time 'round. Having already paid my dues, so to speak, years back it was nice to be able to basically breeze through. Now as to how that would feel for a new player, that would depend upon what level of challenge they wanted. If they were after a challenge then the changes would certainly disappoint.

As a newish player the only thing that caused me any level of problems was the two Jedi fight on Tatooine, sans companion. A quick L2P adjustment and that was sorted.

The only thing that halts progress 10 toons later is those pesky bugs.

I don't know what motivates people but I find that if something's too easy it doesn't really have much value for me. I suppose if I get into a story, the ease of killing of powerful enemies is like reading a book where the last chapter is just one page with a few lines saying that you knock him over the head and he died. The end.

 

It's just not satisfying to me.

 

But to each their own.

Absolutely agree with respect to "first time 'round". I wouldn't have liked it as much but for the second (and sometimes more) time, I'm happy to have it easier.

Then again, life offers me so damn many challenges, I kind of enjoy being all über and stuff during my gaming time.

Just out of curiosity, what did the players preferring story and solo content do before 4.0/5.0, once they were done with the expansion story? Played RotH one time as a Rep and as an Imp, did SoR once? Stopped playing or replayed what was there?

 

Back then there was one bigger chunk of story with the expansion release and the rest until the next expansion was the same "5 min" little pieces of the introduction of either new daily areas, like Section X, Czerka and to a degree Oricon (as there it was the introduction of the two Ops), events or FPs and Ops?

Ziost is the only exception being a bigger addition story wise, while on the other hand it was at the same time introducing the daily area and the one boss raid too. So not stand alone for only one niche either.

Czerka story is essentially the little conversation at the fleet, doing dailys and the FPs one time and then another conversation at the fleet. Same for Sec X, though with HK there is something one could sort it into the story category but with FPs needed (befor the solo mode) and the searching being easier in groups it also was a group activity.

 

From 1.0 to the 3.0 cycle the story coming with patches was never stand alone, it was always also an introducing element for new activities like daily areas, events, FPs and ops, Strongholds and so on. It was always a mix.

So why is going back to this mixed and as such more balanced approach to all activities this bad and such a surprise? Or are those who yell for story like that all new players since 4.0 and don't remember the way content was released before?

 

The quality of the content or if you like it or not, is a whole other discussion and that there is not enough new coming on all fronts is something we all know. Though with the limited resources a mix with something for everyone is way better than waiting months and years for new stuff for your specific niche.

At least in my opinion, but after all I dabble in all activities in-game even the occasional WZ once every few months, except for Uprisings, I just don't do them.

Yes, I came back to the game when they were advertising that they were doing lots of story content. I had played a bit near the start but left because there was something about the gameplay I didn't like at the time (I can't remember what now). I played gw2 for a while, and then when gw2 had a long content drought, I saw that swtor was focusing on story and so came back. I was enjoying it until they decided to ditch doing story content. Now, idk, probably back to gw2. However, I would prefer to get swtor story content, so that is why I have been posting.

I don't know what motivates people but I find that if something's too easy it doesn't really have much value for me. I suppose if I get into a story, the ease of killing of powerful enemies is like reading a book where the last chapter is just one page with a few lines saying that you knock him over the head and he died. The end.

 

It's just not satisfying to me.

 

But to each their own.

It took me over a year back at launch to get my 1st character to 50. (Literally... RotHC had just released) I had to get help to finish several of the class mission fights. Now.... all these years, holocrons, high influenced healing companions, and XP boosting armor set later.... it still takes me about a month/ month 1/2. I for one am glad that it's easier. For me it makes the game feel like I'm actually the bad *** everyone says I am. It Makes me step outside my "character class comfort Zone" & try AC's I typically wouldn't play. When I want a challenge...I go outside and try NOT to click on some idiot talking sideways.

But that's just me. I still use cheat codes, god mods, and play most games on "easy".

As a newish player the only thing that caused me any level of problems was the two Jedi fight on Tatooine, sans companion. A quick L2P adjustment and that was sorted.

 

The only thing that halts progress 10 toons later is those pesky bugs.

back in 2012 I got to this battle 2 levels below mission level. On marauder. Had to level up to beat it.

This "too easy" content is tied with level sync. Now we can't over-level hard content to finish it, so they made it easier so that even a bad player can beat everything.

But, IMO they made it too easy, they went too far.

Final Bosses (Baras, Vitiate etc) are too weak. The final showdown, which we're looking to through all our journey ("finally I'll kick this fat *****") is a joke.

Supposedly tough battles, like Lord Praven in JK story or final fight on Tats in Smuggler story -end up so quickly that we're left dissatisfied -where is that hardship our heroes were supposed to conquer? This is piece of cake, not some worthy achievement. They won't let me into Sovengard for this!

Also leveling on starter planets -kill 2 flesh riders and u're 2 levels up. Doesn't feel like I earned this...

All of us have different preferences of course, but I'm thinking about new players here. Will they stay in the game if the gameplay without any danger of dying (and dying isn't an issue in MMO -you just respawn) -will make them bored? Will they try out another story? Part of the motivation after all is: I wonder how strong my gunslinger will be compared to my marauder? Now we're strong no matter what.

Also -this killed the need for crafting below level 70. It was really something to run in blue or purple gear and feel so much tougher than in green gear. It made me seek mats, seek schematics, craft for alts. Now we kill everything in seconds and gear does not matter.

digression

The only time I had game-play fun (not story fun) after 4.0 is when I got to Alderaan 5 levels below content and just couldn't hit mobs. It was not low damage issue, but a "miss" all the time. 4 levels below content I missed half my attacks and game was cool once again. Had to sneak, try to go past mobs undetected or use all defensive tools I had to survive if detected. Somehow I (sadly) quickly leveled up and fights became tedious again. But that just me, I digress.

/digression

Again: for me personally new story content is meh. Because the story is meh, and fights are awful.

Old content has great story, but they made fights meh. So if it was up to me, I'd come up with an OPTION to make vanilla gameplay a bit more hard than it is now.

OPTION, because some of us would want it easier, while some others would like it harder. I'd very much prefer BW spend their scarce resources on this instead of trying to come up with next 5 minutes of meh story.

I don't know what motivates people but I find that if something's too easy it doesn't really have much value for me. I suppose if I get into a story, the ease of killing of powerful enemies is like reading a book where the last chapter is just one page with a few lines saying that you knock him over the head and he died. The end.

 

It's just not satisfying to me.

 

But to each their own.

beginning story isnt supposed to be difficult. It is not at all hard to increase your own difficulty in this game. be responsible for your own experience if you so much want higher difficulty.

beginning story isnt supposed to be difficult. It is not at all hard to increase your own difficulty in this game. be responsible for your own experience if you so much want higher difficulty.

I suppose people these days do not understand words like nuance and gradation anymore. The short version is that if you say you want something to be less white, you are not asking for it to be black.

Aside from that, my view is that it is good to have a little challenge. As I explained I liked the experience much better now that I make sure that my character stays on level. That works for 99% of the content but I find the boss fights still extremely underwhelming.

Of course you guys make the assumption then that I want to make it more difficult for everyone. This is a false assumption. The good thing is that these story bosses are mostly, if not all, instanced. So my only change that I would suggest is a HM version of a list of instanced story bosses with the choice for people to turn that on or off. Defaulted to off of course.

I really don't think it's right that I have to send my companion away or set them to passive AND strip down naked to get challenge out of a Dark Council member. Sorry, that goes too far for me.

I do understand that some people like to roflstomp everything. I do not share that view but I get that some people like that. But my solution won't hurt the roflstompers. For the rest nerfing classes and me making sure I'm never overleveled are enough.

Also my definition of the beginning story is the starter planet. Not the level 1-50 story.

I suppose people these days do not understand words like nuance and gradation anymore. The short version is that if you say you want something to be less white, you are not asking for it to be black.

 

Aside from that, my view is that it is good to have a little challenge. As I explained I liked the experience much better now that I make sure that my character stays on level. That works for 99% of the content but I find the boss fights still extremely underwhelming.

 

Of course you guys make the assumption then that I want to make it more difficult for everyone. This is a false assumption. The good thing is that these story bosses are mostly, if not all, instanced. So my only change that I would suggest is a HM version of a list of instanced story bosses with the choice for people to turn that on or off. Defaulted to off of course.

 

I really don't think it's right that I have to send my companion away or set them to passive AND strip down naked to get challenge out of a Dark Council member. Sorry, that goes too far for me.

 

I do understand that some people like to roflstomp everything. I do not share that view but I get that some people like that. But my solution won't hurt the roflstompers. For the rest nerfing classes and me making sure I'm never overleveled are enough.

 

Also my definition of the beginning story is the starter planet. Not the level 1-50 story.

It is very simple. The devs cannot change the difficulty of content just for you. It really is not all about you. Show a little bit of responsibility for your self and edit your own experience to your liking. You are like the guy that goes to the resteraunt and demands that the chef add salt to every dish for all customers because you like salt. You can add it yourself easily, but you insist that the chef give it to everyone because you are too lazy to do it yourself. show a bit of initiative and deal with it.

It is very simple. The devs cannot change the difficulty of content just for you. It really is not all about you. Show a little bit of responsibility for your self and edit your own experience to your liking. You are like the guy that goes to the resteraunt and demands that the chef add salt to every dish for all customers because you like salt. You can add it yourself easily, but you insist that the chef give it to everyone because you are too lazy to do it yourself. show a bit of initiative and deal with it.

Did you even read my post?

You are making all this stuff up.

Do you have reading issues or do you just fantasize about what you want me to have said and react to your fantasy instead of to what I actually said?

Because what you are accusing me of is simply false.

Did you even read my post?

 

You are making all this stuff up.

 

Do you have reading issues or do you just fantasize about what you want me to have said and react to your fantasy instead of to what I actually said?

 

Because what you are accusing me of is simply false.

I really don't think it's right that I have to send my companion away or set them to passive AND strip down naked to get challenge out of a Dark Council member. Sorry, that goes too far for me.

this is directly from your post. you dont want to have to adjust your play to give yourself the difficulty you require, you want everyone nerfed to accomidate you.

I kind of feel like we're not going to see the likes of the class stories again which, if true, is sad.

We wont, they had their chance with KotFE but failed. Even with the same plot, each character's personality could have been preserved in the dialogues for little extra cost, but they didn't even manage to do that.

this is directly from your post. you dont want to have to adjust your play to give yourself the difficulty you require, you want everyone nerfed to accomidate you.

he said this:

Of course you guys make the assumption then that I want to make it more difficult for everyone. This is a false assumption. The good thing is that these story bosses are mostly, if not all, instanced. So my only change that I would suggest is a HM version of a list of instanced story bosses with the choice for people to turn that on or off. Defaulted to off of course.

how is that even remotely "wanting everyone nerfed"?

this is directly from your post. you dont want to have to adjust your play to give yourself the difficulty you require, you want everyone nerfed to accomidate you.

Your conclusion is utterly false, even based on that. But morever you skipped entirely over this part:

So my only change that I would suggest is a HM version of a list of instanced story bosses with the choice for people to turn that on or off. Defaulted to off of course.

You have some serious reading comprehension problems.

My suggestion doesn't affect others negatively and it's a suggestion, not a demand.

Your conclusion is utterly false, even based on that. But morever you skipped entirely over this part:

 

So my only change that I would suggest is a HM version of a list of instanced story bosses with the choice for people to turn that on or off. Defaulted to off of course.

 

 

You have some serious reading comprehension problems.

 

My suggestion doesn't affect others negatively and it's a suggestion, not a demand.

Back to the topic: it would be great to have an OPTION to pick higher difficulty on end game instanced bosses. That would be a good start.

But IMO all vanilla game needs difficulty adjustment.

In a perfect world, I'd love to see veteran and master mode added to all content. It shouldn't even be that hard to do -they could use the data from before 4.0 for mobs, and nerf the companions to the level they were in one of first patches after 4.0 (the companions were nerfed to reasonable power levels, but that was reverted due to community outrage).

So in veteran mode mobs and bosses would have pre-4.0 strength and hp, and companions would be on the desired post 4.0 strength.

Again: this should be an OPTION for those of us who prefer a bit more gameplay challenge.

Maybe even this should be default mode, with heavily advertised option to turn on easy mode ? I imagine that way the game would be more engaging for newcomers? Just a thought...

First let me apologize. I created this thread and then disappeared. I have been keeping up, but this week - long story short - I put in a LOT of extra hours at work and did not have time to respond.

When I made this thread it was due an outrageous statement that the devs don't care about solo/story players now that they are switching focus to group content. It was a pleasant surprise that I was not the only one who thought the statement made was hyperbolic.

Would I like to see a more balanced approach where everyone gets something with every content patch/expansion? Sure I would! As I said in my OP, I enjoy solo play as much as group play. But I am also realistic in my expectations. I know that BWA is WAY understaffed to produce sufficient quantities of everything; the situation all but requires them to produce a bunch of one aspect, then switch gears to work on another.

And IMO this is proven by the "big surprise". This last year of "lack of content" and lots of "back end maintenance" is explained now that we know what the "big surprise" is...They trickled out a little story and little group content while they focused on the technical and logistical issues of server merges. As a realist, I can accept that they poured their limited resources into that project. And now that it is coming to an end they will again shift focus to producing playable content again.

And they did say that the focus would be flashpoints. Meaning that solo/story players will have a path to continue the story as solo players.

Back to the topic: it would be great to have an OPTION to pick higher difficulty on end game instanced bosses. That would be a good start.

But IMO all vanilla game needs difficulty adjustment.

In a perfect world, I'd love to see veteran and master mode added to all content. It shouldn't even be that hard to do -they could use the data from before 4.0 for mobs, and nerf the companions to the level they were in one of first patches after 4.0 (the companions were nerfed to reasonable power levels, but that was reverted due to community outrage).

So in veteran mode mobs and bosses would have pre-4.0 strength and hp, and companions would be on the desired post 4.0 strength.

Again: this should be an OPTION for those of us who prefer a bit more gameplay challenge.

 

Maybe even this should be default mode, with heavily advertised option to turn on easy mode ? I imagine that way the game would be more engaging for newcomers? Just a thought...

I agree difficulty modes for the original story would be nice, but it is probably not that simple. KOTFE/ET were designed with difficulty modes in mind; they setup the back end code and flags to deal with it; they instanced almost everything so that one player's difficulty choice would not interfere with someone else. The original stories have no such coding and while there is some instancing it is not nearly as prevalent. My point is that where in FE and ET choices in higher difficulty do not impact choices made in the "story mode", theoretically in original story higher difficulty choices made could alter flags and break the game. Would you be OK if there was another year like this past one to make those modifications?

You're lumping story and solo play together.

Yes, SWTOR has put more attention into story than any other mmo, it's the main draw of the game and it's to be expected from BW, a company known most for its stories. I'm pretty sure it gets a lot of players back each time it does a big story drop (I certainly come back for those).

During those big story drops you have a chance to get those players involved with group play, so you need to find ways to encourage that naturally. Problem is, solo play really hasn't evolved- the newest dailies are outdated compared to the public quest system that GW2, WoW, FFXIV and even dead, old games like WAR use that merged solo dailies with potential group play.

You have a tedious system for loot (Galactic Command) that turns people off of getting loot- while anything group related has players that are frankly d-bags to anyone who hasn't maxed their gear. Some of us are used to that and can ignore it- but I can see why for solo players that attempt to branch out it is an immediate turn off.

If you can even use the system at all- it doesn't even work for non-subs, who have limited group play anyway. I don't mind the cosmetic crates and certain other parts of your f2p model EA, but putting limits on group play in a game that struggles to provide timely grouping is bad for everyone, yourselves included.

I don't the problem is amount of group content- there's a massive number of current level FPs and Ops in this game considering. You could probably use another mode or two in PvP and GSF; but even there, I think you should consider League of Legends- for the first few years they had only two modes (and even then, everyone stuck to Summoner's Rift) yet it is one of the biggest games out there.

Fun play and some balance go a long way. What I'm saying is- nobody likes arenas, ranked PvP is going to go nowhere. There's a reason it takes 3 hours in the arena queue to not get a match at all, while 30 seconds gets me into the regular WZ matches at any time of day except for like, really late at night.

Add something enjoyable to ranked queues, and link FPs/Ops to solo content to get people interested, and solo play to group content (public quests). Frankly, WoW steals from everyone and perfects it- and their current daily world quest system is the best take on what is really a repetitive, dull grind with how they've done it in Legion- copy them, herd players to certain areas if you want them to play together, players won't just start grouping on their own that's not how it works.

 

I agree difficulty modes for the original story would be nice, but it is probably not that simple. KOTFE/ET were designed with difficulty modes in mind; they setup the back end code and flags to deal with it; they instanced almost everything so that one player's difficulty choice would not interfere with someone else. The original stories have no such coding and while there is some instancing it is not nearly as prevalent. My point is that where in FE and ET choices in higher difficulty do not impact choices made in the "story mode", theoretically in original story higher difficulty choices made could alter flags and break the game. Would you be OK if there was another year like this past one to make those modifications?

yeah, this would not be easy. Just saying that I would prefer this over new stories, since new stories aren't that engaging or repeatable.

How about they made separate planetary instances (like now Tython1, Tython2 etc) one for story mode and one for veteran? Changing instances would change difficulty.

Tython1 would be as it is now, Tython2 would be as pre 4.0 with companions nerfed.

I also agree that story player does not have to be solo player

Add something enjoyable to ranked queues, and link FPs/Ops to solo content to get people interested, and solo play to group content (public quests).

BW tried that!!!

Remember the HK-51 recruitment story? A series of missions involving solo play, heroic mission locations (when heroics all but required grouping; back then I managed to solo them with a tank PC in full Rakata gear and healer companion in full Columi), and even a couple of HM/MM flashpoints.

Remember a thing called Oricon? Solo play to start, then a heroic (where back then soloing heroics was very difficult), then two Operations to complete the story. At the time this was a clear attempt to get players interested in large group content. And it worked...for about a month. Then the PuG runs dried up. Since then there have been complaints about no solo option (even though with 4.0 and beyond when DF and DP are the GF OP of the day there are plenty of groups forming on fleet because they are now two of the easier operations to run).

Remember Forged Alliances? a story in the form of four flashpoints BEFORE there were solo modes?

Remember Shadow of Revan? There were two flashpoints woven into the story, but they offered solo mode. Guess how many actually did those flashpoints in group mode during a story run through? Then at the end of Yavin IV players were given the option: "rally the troops" AKA a series of daily missions or "go into the temple with a strike team" AKA an operation. Guess how many partook of the operation path during a story run through?

The problem is that given the option of solo or group during a story run, 99% of the population will choose the solo path, mostly because it is more time efficient; why waste time forming a group and then do the content, when in the time it takes to form a group you can be done with the story? And when there is no solo path a plurality of the population complains that they cannot complete the story.

@IoNonSoEVero,

 

I saw your post in "call for patience" a thread about RP and server merges. and I just have a comment about a statement you made:

 

 

 

BW did nothing but story and solo play for two years, and now they are switching gears to group content and you complain about it?

 

Before you jump on me as a "hardcore player" who wants nothing but group content, that cannot be further from the truth. I love the story aspect of SWTOR, I love the ability to play solo when I want to. But I also want new and challenging group content.

You are almost right in the post topic.

BW/EA does not care about players at all!

All I care about is that Bioware does NOT do what they did with Oricon again. I don't mind playing in a group, but when it comes to STORY, I want to do it alone. I don't want people rushing my *** or saying they've already seen it so let's get going when I'm just beginning.

They can have their group content and raids, I'm fine with that. But if MY story is in a operation or flashpoint, I better be able to do it solo. Want my story in an operation like thing? Do what you did for Revan fight, operation and solo mode. Want me to do flashpoints for my story? Make sure there's a group version and my personal story version.

That's all I ask.

 

Comments like these do not help, at all. There are a vast number of reasons why people prefer to solo or only play with a friend or two -- often times these are related to mental illnesses outside of those peoples control. Should they be completely cut off from playing these amazing games just because they play it differently to some?

Thank you for this. Thank you SO much for this. I am one of those who are managing mental illness and have had multiple negative experiences trying to group with people who yell at me for not keeping up, not doing it right, not using any of the voice chat clients... so I solo. I solo, and I have 12 lvl 70's that took me a lot longer than most "normal" players to level because grouping triggers amxiety and sensory overload - but I got there. To be told once again that I don't matter because I don't group, to essentially be told once again to quit because I don't belong in an MMORPG... It sucks. And I don't really expect any of those people who want to blow off solo players and make everything all about them to understand any of this. I just appreciate that you, and some others, DO.