Question in the title, why? Do muraders have it? I just now noticed it, and I never really noticed it before since starting at the beginning of the game. I thought only ops/scoundrels had it.

Yea Marauders have it, it's the same deal 4s duration 45s cooldown. It's not remotely the same as what operatives/scoundrels and assassins/shadows have.

Yea Marauders have it, it's the same deal 4s duration 45s cooldown. It's not remotely the same as what operatives/scoundrels and assassins/shadows have.

 

But still would like to know why.

Guess that's a question for whoever designed them, nobody here can give you that answer.

 

They have the most defensive cooldowns of any class/combo in the game. Part of why they're so powerful in PVP.

Why not?

 

I'm guessing "why" is a matter of utility for them and game balancing and not sure why it bothers you so.

Question in the title, why? Do muraders have it? I just now noticed it, and I never really noticed it before since starting at the beginning of the game. I thought only ops/scoundrels had it.

 

It is their threat dump, with an added bit of utility. And for PvE, that's fine.

 

For PvP though, they really shouldn't have it.

I use it to sneak past a trouble spot or as a threat dump in PVE. It is nearly useless in PVP, so don't get all bent up about it.

I use it to sneak past a trouble spot or as a threat dump in PVE. It is nearly useless in PVP, so don't get all bent up about it.

 

Oh that's not true, it's a fantastic gap closer and I've used it to escape in world pvp when things go wrong many times.

Because sentinels are this game's Bright Wizards and get to have everything. They even have group heals, for crying out loud.

 

They have the most defensive cooldowns of any class/combo in the game. Part of why they're so powerful in PVP.

 

Most defensive CDs, highest DPS, best DOTs, highest damage AE, the only healing debuff, SWTOR's equivalent of bloodlust, close to the highest mobility, most interrupts... Way to go, Bioware!

Edited March 26, 2012 by Caelrie

Sentinels and Marauders have force cloak so they can run away if you manage to start beating them in pvp.

I think its more of a WHY???

 

As in, lets say they gave the trooper force choke for instance, why the hell would a trooper have force choke? So lets just say, since when do jedi's cloak?

I think its more of a WHY???

 

As in, lets say they gave the trooper force choke for instance, why the hell would a trooper have force choke? So lets just say, since when do jedi's cloak?

 

oh this isn't the first game with a jedi stealth concept

Why does a class deserve to have good single target dps and best non tank survability?

 

Maybe because it is the only PURE melee class in the game full of knockbacks and permaroots?

Maybe the fact that they have the worst ability to CC in the game?

Maybe its because they start at 0 energy/heat and have to SURVIVE and STAY in melee combat for multiple GCDs before they can actually do damage?

Maybe because outside of rage spec(which sucks for marauders) they have basically 0 AoE.

Maybe because they have the worst initial burst of any class?

Maybe because they have the least amount of gap closers in the game?

 

Marauder have their strengths, but they also have glaring weaknesses. They do good damage and are hard to kill if they can stay in melee combat, but they are extremely susceptible to kiting and they do a poor job of protecting healers with guard or by peeling enemies off their healers(which is HUGE and why you won't see 4 marauders + 4 healers ever). There are just a few examples.

 

Please look at the entire classes strengths and weaknesses and not just at a single ability under a microscope.

Why does a class deserve to have good single target dps and best non tank survability?

 

Maybe because it is the only PURE melee class in the game full of knockbacks and permaroots?

Maybe the fact that they have the worst ability to CC in the game?

Maybe its because they start at 0 energy/heat and have to SURVIVE and STAY in melee combat for multiple GCDs before they can actually do damage?

Maybe because outside of rage spec(which sucks for marauders) they have basically 0 AoE.

Maybe because they have the worst initial burst of any class?

Maybe because they have the least amount of gap closers in the game?

 

Marauder have their strengths, but they also have glaring weaknesses. They do good damage and are hard to kill if they can stay in melee combat, but they are extremely susceptible to kiting and they do a poor job of protecting healers with guard or by peeling enemies off their healers(which is HUGE and why you won't see 4 marauders + 4 healers ever). There are just a few examples.

 

Please look at the entire classes strengths and weaknesses and not just at a single ability under a microscope.

 

Just to point a few things out:

 

Juggernauts/Guardians:

-- are pure Melee classes (you didn't say DPS)

-- also start at 0 energy and have to build up AND have to stay in melee range to be successful

-- have the same lousy initial burst

-- have same gap closers

 

Rage is about to be just as good (arguably better) for Marauders as it is for Juggernauts. So many of your counterpoints are weak or flawed.

I'm not saying guardians don't have their own issues, but come on... Here's a list that took me about 10 seconds to come up with of things you get that sentinels do not.

 

--force push, which enables a second focus generating leap

--taunt

--aoe taunt

--extra mitigation from heavy armor

--a 30m range damaging ability

--a friendly target leap

--sundering armor!

--a non channeled stun

 

Just to point a few things out:

 

Juggernauts/Guardians:

-- are pure Melee classes (you didn't say DPS)

-- also start at 0 energy and have to build up AND have to stay in melee range to be successful

-- have the same lousy initial burst

-- have same gap closers

 

Rage is about to be just as good (arguably better) for Marauders as it is for Juggernauts. So many of your counterpoints are weak or flawed.

Just to point a few things out:

 

Juggernauts/Guardians:

-- are pure Melee classes (you didn't say DPS)

-- also start at 0 energy and have to build up AND have to stay in melee range to be successful

-- have the same lousy initial burst

-- have same gap closers

 

Rage is about to be just as good (arguably better) for Marauders as it is for Juggernauts. So many of your counterpoints are weak or flawed.

 

Well I won't say juggernauts don't have some of the same weaknesses as marauders as they share the same pure melee base class, but you are downplaying their additional strengths like force push and taunt, and are wrong on an important point. Don't act like you can't charge twice and use guardian leap situationally. marauders only get ONE charge to your THREE.(Rage juggernauts have literally 4 gap closers even if half of them are situational.). Those extra gap closers are the difference between life and death for our pure melee classes.

 

As for rage being better for marauders.... Currently we both know juggernauts are FAR superior rage specced than rage marauders. With the patch.... It almost looks like they are nerfing it, but trying to hide it with a more obvious minor buff. I can't really say on this one currently until it is released.

 

On an added point juggernauts are hands down the best Huttball carriers in the game. Not even shadows come close to the insanity juggernauts can pull. Charge > push > charge creates incredible distance for example.

 

Juggernauts have 1 good spec(tank) and 2 subpar spec(dps). Marauders have 1 good spec(Annihilation), and 2 supbar specs(carnage/rage). This will likely change with future patches but atm it is somewhat equal.

 

I'm not arguing for or against either classes, but you need to look at both classes equally and not downplay your strengths. Both classes have abilities the other doesn't. Marauders are harder to kill, and juggernauts have multiple charges and can save healers with push/taunt/leap. If you think the grass is greener over here then by all means go level a marauder, and I hope you enjoy it.

This class needs more weakness, not less. I don't really see them having trouble with anything in this game.

This class needs more weakness, not less. I don't really see them having trouble with anything in this game.

 

They have no weaknesses. Maras/sents are everyone's hard counter. Good thing they're getting buffed, since it seems a few players in the game had problems playing them.

Sentinels melt like ice cream.

 

Without their Cloak or 5 sec damage reduction they are an easy kill.

Sentinels melt like ice cream.

 

Without their Cloak or 5 sec damage reduction they are an easy kill.

 

This. Any sniper using his tools and snares will annihilate any <heavy armor class. All the non jugg/guard jedi classes melt like the ice cream sammich I just had.

Sentinels melt like ice cream.

 

Without their Cloak or 5 sec damage reduction they are an easy kill.

 

Or the 20% damage reduction reactive (that hurts you for hitting them) or the 50% ranged/melee defense ward, you mean. Oh and particularly for snipers the one that gives you a 90% accuracy penalty for a few seconds, that's a fun one.

 

Yes, with no defensive cooldowns marauders and sentinels are SUCH chumps.

 

Pity their cooldowns are mostly on 1 min or less timers

Edited March 27, 2012 by hadoken

As i recall the first iteration of force camo was an ability in the watchman prestige class in KOTOR 2. there it let you stealth with out a stealth generator. This game contains a fair bit of Kotor in its core design so i would guess its a hold over name more than anything. though the buffing talent is in the watchman tree.