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Stop forcing Group content


_NovaBlast_

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If you want access to everything in the game, then *play* everything in the game.

 

You bought an MMO knowing it's an MMO and now you want everything to be single player. Single player should *never* be the focus of any MMO and should *always* be limited.

 

Ok, I want all the PvP rewards by crafting stuff. I mean, you say everything should be equal regardless of play style, right?

 

I have a better suggestion for you: don't buy MMOs.

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I was sympathetic to you, since I don't like solo storylines leading into group content and operations you can't remove from your mission log - BUT - you want to have the same rewards for group content and a solo alternative? No, just no.

 

Request a solo alternative to group content to see the storylines, that would be fine, but to get the same the rewards as people who did the harder content is not fine.

 

Shadow of Revan is done right - you can go solo, or do the operation. The story is finished by doing either, but the rewards are different because the content and difficulty level is not the same.

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If you want access to everything in the game, then *play* everything in the game.

 

You bought an MMO knowing it's an MMO and now you want everything to be single player. Single player should *never* be the focus of any MMO and should *always* be limited.

 

Ok, I want all the PvP rewards by crafting stuff. I mean, you say everything should be equal regardless of play style, right?

 

I have a better suggestion for you: don't buy MMOs.

 

I disagree with you ...mmo does not mean group especially in SWTOR MMO is simply a platform where multiple people access the same content in real time. it's not inherently about guild raids pvp or any of that those are simply aspects of the game.

 

As I said give everyone freedom of choice...if the group ques / pvp dies ..the play base has spoken.

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I was sympathetic to you, since I don't like solo storylines leading into group content and operations you can't remove from your mission log - BUT - you want to have the same rewards for group content and a solo alternative? No, just no.

 

Request a solo alternative to group content to see the storylines, that would be fine, but to get the same the rewards as people who did the harder content is not fine.

 

Shadow of Revan is done right - you can go solo, or do the operation. The story is finished by doing either, but the rewards are different because the content and difficulty level is not the same.

 

Why do harder level deserve inherently deserve more? that is a very elitist comment...what makes your preference of play better than the others?

 

...You are supposed to do harder levels because you Enjoy doing harder levels ...not because you are paid more.

 

If you say that you would not do harder levels if you were "paid" the same as weasy levels ...then you have just proved my point I made inthe image. You are not doing it because you enjoy it but because you want more loot..

 

That's why Bioware does it. its also way they hide things like M1 4X companion in pvp and making raids part ofthe story and undroppable, give bonuses to joining a guild........they have to "bribe" people because the player base is to small for group activities that they need to artificially inflate it.

 

The fact that both of you are arguing against my point....of "freedom of choice" and letting very play mode stand on its own merits and seeing which survive .

 

How can either of you argue against pure freedom of choice ..unless there is some merit to what post said?

Edited by _NovaBlast_
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I disagree with you ...mmo does not mean group especially in SWTOR MMO is simply a platform where multiple people access the same content in real time. it's not inherently about guild raids pvp or any of that those are simply aspects of the game.

 

As I said give everyone freedom of choice...if the group ques / pvp dies ..the play base has spoken.

 

Actually MMO means Massive Multiplayer Online ... so yeah it kinda does, nulliifying your whole point. MULTIPLAYER. Get used to being forced to play group content, if you can't or don't want to, well that's to bad but that means you don't have access to everything, but that is your choice.

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Actually MMO means Massive Multiplayer Online ... so yeah it kinda does, nulliifying your whole point. MULTIPLAYER. Get used to being forced to play group content, if you can't or don't want to, well that's to bad but that means you don't have access to everything, but that is your choice.

 

Multiplayer does not mean group....you take every bit of group contented out of swtor it is still by definition a MMO because multiple people are accessing the same environment in real time. That is the only requirement for a massively multiplayer game.

 

.. take second like it has no raids or pvp or even story of its own it's still a mmo .

 

"Second Life is an online virtual world, developed and owned by the San Francisco-based firm ...... 2006, former Governor of Virginia Mark Warner became the first politician to appear in a MMO when he gave a speech in Second Life"

 

Soo you are very wrong.

Edited by _NovaBlast_
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Multiplayer does not mean group....you take every bit of group contented out of swtor it is still by definition a MMO because multiple people are accessing the same environment in real time. That is the only requirement for a massively multiplayer game.

 

.. take second like it has no raids or pvp or even story of its own it's still a mmo .

 

"Second Life is an online virtual world, developed and owned by the San Francisco-based firm ...... 2006, former Governor of Virginia Mark Warner became the first politician to appear in a MMO when he gave a speech in Second Life"

 

Soo you are very wrong.

 

Believe what you want dude, but your idea of a MMO is very different from what most players believes a MMO is.

 

I stopped taking your post seriously after your claim that you wanted the same rewards for less work or difficulty level.

 

Nice troll post.

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Believe what you want dude, but your idea of a MMO is very different from what most players believes a MMO is.

 

I stopped taking your post seriously after your claim that you wanted the same rewards for less work or difficulty level.

 

Nice troll post.

 

nice troll response...sorry but it doesn't matter what you "believe" ...if you want to believe red is white ...that is you right ..doesn't make it fact.

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Slow your roll, Veruca Salt. A few points for you here:

 

1. No one is FORCING you to do group content. Chill out and get real here. No one's pointing a gun to your head or telling you your account will be banned if you don't run an operation or something ridiculous like that. If you don't want to do group content... then don't do group content. It's that simple. And no, having specific rewards for people who complete group content is not FORCING you to complete group content. It's simply a carrot on a stick. You don't have to go for the carrot. Your life will not end if you don't get the carrot.

 

2. Requiring effort to get rewards is not 'elitist'. It's how all games work as a rule. You have to actually play them and complete tasks in them to get your fake money and shiny pixels. Why do you play games at all if you don't want to put any effort in and instead want everything handed to you at the start?

 

3. Demanding all the rewards possible in a game without being willing to actually do the content required to get said rewards is an extremely entitled viewpoint. Why do you deserve virtual rewards without lifting a finger that other people spent a lot of time and effort working to achieve in a team with other people? To repeat your own question, what makes your preference of play better than the others?

 

4. If you want a single player game with only single player content, go buy and play a single player game. There's literally hundreds upon hundreds of single player games available in this world! TOR is a multiplayer game. The fact there is solo content available in a multiplayer game does not make it any less a multiplayer game. Deal with it. :rak_03:

 

In conclusion: if you hate this game so much, stop giving it money. Vote with your wallet. You're making such a big noise about 'freedom of choice'... so exercise yours. Tantrums like this accomplish nothing but make you sound irrational and childish.

Edited by AscendingSky
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I agree with the sentiment, but for a different reason. I don't care for the rewards, I care about the story itself and would love to see solo modes come out for the remaining flashpoints and the Makeb/Oricon operations. Like the current solo modes already in the game I would still expect the rewards for them to be next than nothing because the reward in my case would be the ability to finish the Oricon/dreadmasters storyline without having to rely on other people.

 

I know its unlikely that such thing will ever exist, so the only thing I can ever hope for is that Bioware never mix solo story and group content again and keep such things separate even though I feel they did repeat that once again with Iokath and the Gods of the Machine.

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my above points

 

What points? You only play with terms and their definition, well there are none! In your CS ticket you write that this game should have story level soloable. Where did you find this statement? Did you sign that somewhere when you downloaded or purchased the game? This game belongs to Bioware and if you don't like what they are doing with it, then don't play or pay for it, its simple as that.

 

To discuss whether MMO means that there simply are people around you or that you have to group up with people around you makes no sense. This game is as it is. As a subscriber, you have the ability to post on the forums. Developers read the forums and you can use your right to post here what your opinions are. If you find same minded people you can group up and reach the Devs. If the Devs think its a good idea they will do it. Simple as that. Complaining in this way however doesn't help anyone.

 

Instead of making such an angry thread you should have posted in some of the already existing threads which request the GotM mission removed.

Edited by merovejec
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I agree with the sentiment, but for a different reason. I don't care for the rewards, I care about the story itself and would love to see solo modes come out for the remaining flashpoints and the Makeb/Oricon operations. Like the current solo modes already in the game I would still expect the rewards for them to be next than nothing because the reward in my case would be the ability to finish the Oricon/dreadmasters storyline without having to rely on other people.

 

I know its unlikely that such thing will ever exist, so the only thing I can ever hope for is that Bioware never mix solo story and group content again and keep such things separate even though I feel they did repeat that once again with Iokath and the Gods of the Machine.

 

All of this. I do hope at some point they will consider giving some of the remaining flashpoints solo modes.

 

And aside from anything else in the Op's CS ticket, not being able to remove the Iokath Op from your mission log IS annoying. You shouldn't have to lose a mission slot if you don't want to do an Op. They should let people abandon it.

Edited by IoNonSoEVero
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Message in Image

 

screenshot of cs ticket

 

It is mmo not a single player game. Of course you cant avoid group content if you wish to receive cool rewards which are exclusive to group content. This is nonsense to ask to make group content solo able because it will destroy this game as mmo and will change it into single player game.

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It is mmo not a single player game. Of course you cant avoid group content if you wish to receive cool rewards which are exclusive to group content. This is nonsense to ask to make group content solo able because it will destroy this game as mmo and will change it into single player game.

 

Some might say that that station has already been passed.

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You shouldn't have to lose a mission slot if you don't want to do an Op. They should let people abandon it.

 

Personally I think the new op should have been completely separate from the story and not eluded to at the end of the Iokath chapter, something like you start to hear about shadows working in the background after taking control of the planet and the op being about those shadows well after the story there finishing, rather than having a big bad guy in the Iokath chapter saying I will return and then your character talking about "finishing what they started" oops no sorry I won't finish what I started because you have started me off on a operation to conclude Iokath that I never wanted.

Edited by Jedi_riches
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I disagree with you ...mmo does not mean group especially in SWTOR MMO is simply a platform where multiple people access the same content in real time. it's not inherently about guild raids pvp or any of that those are simply aspects of the game.

 

As I said give everyone freedom of choice...if the group ques / pvp dies ..the play base has spoken.

 

Actually MMO does mean Group Content, and here's why.

 

If you take out all group content, then there is no reason to have any other player (Massively multiplayer) in the game. You may as well have it a SINGLE player game at that point for one simple reason. Everything is soloable at that point.

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Actually MMO does mean Group Content, and here's why.

 

If you take out all group content, then there is no reason to have any other player (Massively multiplayer) in the game. You may as well have it a SINGLE player game at that point for one simple reason. Everything is soloable at that point.

 

In SWTOR one can do all of the class stories, expansions and priority missions - with the exceptions of totally completing Oriconm Iokath, Seeker Droid and Macrobinoculars - completely solo. Even in the four places where ,grouping is required to totally finish the quest chains, that's just at the very end, so most of the quest is also done solo.

 

Thus, it's not ridiculous for players to focus on solo play in this game given all of that, regardless of what people feel MMO means. It's not like, say, Overwatch where you actually can't play solo.

 

There are other aspects such as player crafting/trade/GTN and stronghold visits that require other players to be viable, but aren't group activities. Plus seeing others walking around in your characters' world makes it more authentic.

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In SWTOR one can do all of the class stories, expansions and priority missions - with the exceptions of totally completing Oriconm Iokath, Seeker Droid and Macrobinoculars - completely solo. Even in the four places where ,grouping is required to totally finish the quest chains, that's just at the very end, so most of the quest is also done solo.

 

Thus, it's not ridiculous for players to focus on solo play in this game given all of that, regardless of what people feel MMO means. It's not like, say, Overwatch where you actually can't play solo.

 

There are other aspects such as player crafting/trade/GTN and stronghold visits that require other players to be viable, but aren't group activities. Plus seeing others walking around in your characters' world makes it more authentic.

 

I never said everything had to be exclusively group content did I? all I said is MMO is about group content. This game, and even WoW has a ton of solo content, that is part of an MMO as well, but here's the thing the main thing about EVERY MMO is the group content. I'm not saying everyone will get into that or should have to.

 

Now about getting the DF/DP quest or the GoTM quest stuck in your log as a solo player. How many group players have gotten First Strike stuck in our logs for 3-6 years or those that never bothered to finish Makeb so they have that stuck in their logs as well? Just ignore it. It's 1-2 quests let them sit there, it's not harming anyone.

Edited by Toraak
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I think that if it is a story element, there should be an option to do it in story mode so you can see the conclusion. Most of the recent content was written for a single player experience, however, the ending of the "Machine Gods" piece is in an OP so many may not see the end of the arc play out. So, as everyone wants to see the end of the story. Insert cut scene for those that don't want to play the group content, and badda boom badda bing..... solo story completed.
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Message in Image

 

screenshot of cs ticket

Like yourself, I don't like forced group content, but sad to say, I don't see anything *FORCING* group content in your message.

 

After all, it's not like you see in FFXIV, where you leave your starting area and there is quite literally NO way to advance your story without completing a dungeon, roughly the equivalent of a short Veteran-level "trinity" flashpoint, and definitely not amenable to soloing if you are "at level". And this repeats throughout the main story. That's "forced group content".

 

The fact that a side-story like Oricon has a group-only element at the end is neither here nor there. In the same way, the Iokath operation is optional. NOTHING requires you to finish it or even to begin it, unless you have some burning desire to clear your mission list. (Personally, I don't have any such desire. I just open the mission in my mission log and press the "Untrack" button. Problem solved.)

 

-1 Meh.

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I never said everything had to be exclusively group content did I? all I said is MMO is about group content. This game, and even WoW has a ton of solo content, that is part of an MMO as well, but here's the thing the main thing about EVERY MMO is the group content. I'm not saying everyone will get into that or should have to.

 

Now about getting the DF/DP quest or the GoTM quest stuck in your log as a solo player. How many group players have gotten First Strike stuck in our logs for 3-6 years or those that never bothered to finish Makeb so they have that stuck in their logs as well? Just ignore it. It's 1-2 quests let them sit there, it's not harming anyone.

 

But my point is that group content is NOT the main thing in SWTOR. It never has been. It's been a large thing for a lot of players, but it's always been completely voluntary and not integral to finishing any of the main content. IMHO that does differentiate it from games like WoW and Overwatch.

 

Many people play this game only doing flashpoints or grouping up with a buddy every blue moon, or not grouping at all. Even when there was briefly a section that had to be grouped to complete (the Forged Alliances flashpoints at first) it was quickly changed. I'd wager that most people doing Yavin 4 opt for the solo missions rather than the Op. And given the massive complaints about Oricon and Iokath, most people weren't keen on being expected to group there, and will leave those chains unfinished rather than doing so.

 

Thus, all of the "OHE NOES MMO! MMO! YOU MUST GROUP!!!!!" nonsense that people seem to get here when they mention they don't like grouping or don't want Iokath stuck in their logs is a bit misguided.

 

The devs won't let people abandon Iokath specifically to try to push them to do it - and that's not cool. There's no reason anyone should have to keep a quest they don't want in the log. Yes, it's a captain obvious move to untrack and ignore it, but if you want to let it go, you should be able to do so.

 

AND the devs also wrote the Iokath story so that it led into the Op and cannot really be resolved without it, which is also uncool. Main story should not be tied to group content that way. Yeah, you can ignore the Op, but from a story standpoint you have a pretty gaping plot hole.

Edited by IoNonSoEVero
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