DPS classes are balanced. The dps pecking order is not determined by the highest number, it is determined by the lowest. Compare that lowest number against others that play that class well, and I guarantee you balance.

 

Bad players are the ones who spend less time perfecting their craft and more time on these forums asking for buffs/nerfs.

 

Grow up.

Says the guy playing the spec with the highest performing DPS. I've played since pre-release. I have four 50s. I raid on all of them. One is a Sentinel. I know what I am talking about.

First...rage does not do the same dps as carnage or annihilation. Period. ST is still below the other 2.

Second...melee dps has to avoid more mechanics that require moving away from and back to bosses.

Third...if you look at overall operations performance a well geared and well played sniper often times outperforms ALL melee dps because they can sustain damage more for longer periods meaning greater damage on target.

Fourth...if you play a sentinel then you understand that a lot of times you are, in fact, not on the boss full time like ranged dps. You must also ramp up for burn windows, whereas ranged dps drops into a "burst" phase of their rotation.

Fifth...if you play melee dps and switch to ranged for ops it is easy mode. You have to have FAR less situational awareness.

Sixth and final point...melee dps are mostly pretty close...though rage isn't used by anyone serious about raiding and annihilation isn't used by most serious about pvp. I simply want to see the fullspeed dps ramp up time of annihilation reduced. Max dps is fine where it is.

I think I have to quote myself again to let people know what's the thing with rage marauders nowadays ^^ Bad players whine because the rage marauders know their classes better and kill them! End of story, move along, nothing more to see here!

As a bit of a pre-requisite for my post, I'll state that I, an Advanced Prototype Powertech, can take out smash derps 1v1. That said, the thing that makes smash imbalanced isn't that it does such high damage in a single hit, it's that it does that high damage to multiple targets.

6k in a single hit on a target? That's fine. There's other specs that can do that.

But 6k against 5 targets? Sorry, but that's ridiculous.

I don't like nerfs, but 30k damage in a single hit is just....stupid. They need to find a way to keep smash as a hard hitting attack so the spec isn't weak, without allowing it do such absurd aoe damage. The easiest thing would be to make it single target, but then it wouldn't serve it's purpose.

I don't know what the answer is for rage spec. I don't like nerfs, but that much damage to potentially so many targets is just plain imbalanced. It has nothing to do with bad players.

I don't like nerfs, but 30k damage in a single hit is just....stupid. They need to find a way to keep smash as a hard hitting attack so the spec isn't weak, without allowing it do such absurd aoe damage. The easiest thing would be to make it single target, but then it wouldn't serve it's purpose.

 

I don't know what the answer is for rage spec. I don't like nerfs, but that much damage to potentially so many targets is just plain imbalanced. It has nothing to do with bad players.

I think the answer is what Blzn and I put forward...

Remove the auto-crit.

Increase single target DPS (e.g. talents to buff Force Scream).

It's fine if Smash *can* hit that hard, given the amount of prep work to get big numbers, but the fact that it *always* hits that hard is the problem.

Without the auto-crit Smash, it's not an obvious choice to 100% Power/Surge gear at the expense of everything else, and mindlessly flying into the middle of a big group to drop a 30k bomb is a less enticing idea.

I think the answer is what Blzn and I put forward...

 

Remove the auto-crit.

 

Increase single target DPS (e.g. talents to buff Force Scream).

 

It's fine if Smash *can* hit that hard, given the amount of prep work to get big numbers, but the fact that it *always* hits that hard is the problem.

 

Without the auto-crit Smash, it's not an obvious choice to 100% Power/Surge gear at the expense of everything else, and mindlessly flying into the middle of a big group to drop a 30k bomb is a less enticing idea.

Removing the Auto-crit is a fine idea for Focus/Rage but I doubt BW will consider doing any class balancing till the new Expansion. I would prefer they increase Armor Penetration to 40% and play around with Vicious Slash and Scream. Good or Bad idea?

Removing the Auto-crit is a fine idea for Focus but I doubt BW will consider doing any class balancing till the new Expansion. I would prefer they increase Armor Penetration to 40% and play around with Vicious Slash and Scream. Good or Bad idea?

Basically from the looks of things datamined by Darth Hater that they posted all BW's doing is reducing the number of Singularity/ Shockwave stacks and adding a damage buff after using Sweep/ Smash.

Mind you that this is just datamined stuff and hasn't appeared on a PTR or anything.

Basically from the looks of things datamined by Darth Hater that they posted all BW's doing is reducing the number of Singularity/ Shockwave stacks and adding a damage buff after using Sweep/ Smash.

 

Mind you that this is just datamined stuff and hasn't appeared on a PTR or anything.

That's not a horrible idea but it still leaves Smash with an Auto-crit. Hmm. Interesting.

That's not a horrible idea but it still leaves Smash with an Auto-crit. Hmm. Interesting.

True, but it will hit for 75% additional damage now as opposed to 100%

True, but it will hit for 75% additional damage now as opposed to 100%

That'll help tone it down a little bit. Figure the average hit on a low armor target is 6800. It'll drop a good enough chunk to keep most happy, hopefully. Who knows.

I'm not saying nerf the spec, I'm saying balance out the damage it does. Remove the Auto Crit from Smash, buff single target damage.

As far as single target damage for rage spec goes, I thought you guys might find this interesting.

http://www.torparse.com/a/133335/time/1360990202/1360990570/0/Overview

It's a hybrid build (13/0/28) with no BT or adrenals so only about 100dps behind full annilation single target (maybe less) and if you have any adds in a fight I think it beats it out.

As far as single target damage for rage spec goes, I thought you guys might find this interesting.

 

http://www.torparse.com/a/133335/time/1360990202/1360990570/0/Overview

 

It's a hybrid build (13/0/28) with no BT or adrenals so only about 100dps behind full annilation single target (maybe less) and if you have any adds in a fight I think it beats it out.

That's actually about 200 less than Annihilation single target still.

That's actually about 200 less than Annihilation single target still.

In theory that is true, but I'm still not quite bis 63'd out yet, and I'm only hitting 2k in full annilation. Still I admit it's probably behind the main PVE specs slightly. I just thought it was pretty cool that a hybrid gives them a run for their money, as well as having some extra raid utility with the 6k aoe smashes.

That's actually about 200 less than Annihilation single target still.

Actually that's about 300 less than BiS Annihilation...and 378 less than the best annihilation dummy parse...

Though I don't expect everyone will hit 2288 on a dummy...

Actually that's about 300 less than BiS Annihilation...and 378 less than the best annihilation dummy parse...

 

Though I don't expect everyone will hit 2288 on a dummy...

That isn't true, the 2288 was edited to give higher values to attacks than they actually had. That is why I hate misinformation on these forums. Someone go parse over 2100 or even 2050 on annihilation without BT or adrenals and I'll admit my statement was incorrect.

I'll make an argument against my own opinion. With enough rage built up, Annihilate can max instantly at anytime you like just as long as it's not on cool down obviously. Sure Smash can be casted instantly just like Annihilate, but you won't get the most out of it by doing so. You have to go though the timed process of getting 4 stacks of Shockwave then either Force Leaping or Obliterating to insure that Smash with get a critical hit, so because this process takes longer you should be rewarded the higher crit, but I don't know that you should be rewarded the higher crit and the AoE'ness of Smash together. Perhaps a way to 'fix' or balance Rage spec more would be to distribute the damage of Smash more based on the number of enemies hit. So for example if you were to Smash 1 enemy you might crit them for 6000 damage, but if you Smash 2 enemies instead you would do 5500 damage to each of them instead of 6000 to each of them (my math is obviously not to scale for this but there would have to be an equation to figure out what this damage distribution would be that a programmer would be able to determine). Thoughts?

I competely disagree with this point!

The pace that Rage speced player gathers stacks of fury is blinding quik! If you smash on 3 targets

you get 25+ stacks and you are ready to go again.

You can charge/obliterate your opponet and force choke and you gather stacks of shockwave while he cant do anything if his cc breaker is on cd them exact monemt he can move u can him asap with you apex combo!!

imo the problem with rage is not how mauch dmg it does , the actual problem is that it is TOO EASY!!! It is completely reasonable(to me) why people call rage spec warriors "SMASH MONKEYS"

As far as Annihilation spec is concerned imo annihilate should be devastating but its not and if they buff it wiill create great imabalance.

Given that i have 2 suggestions:

1) It should be a bit easier to get 3stacks of annihilator buff(i.e. get 3 stacks when you pop beserk)

but we DEFINETLY need anihilator buff to last longer it takes great effort to build it* and it is very easy to lose it especially on pvp

2) i think that Anni spec somehow has to get quiker of building stack of fury

P.S. annihilation is very good spec well balanced but its good only for Opeartions.

-On pvp you are pretty much forced to play Rage if y wanna do RWZ even if Annihilation is still the indisputed king of 1v1 you can not be as usefull as a rage speced player on a rwz team.

-pve-wise as i said above on ops the dmg output is amzing due to its sustained dps, it is completely nerveracking to do planetary dailiy quests with it. Many of you might consinder it a mere issue but for me it is not.

i.e. imagine trying to kill a pack of 4+ weak mobs and 1+ stong monb(s) it is pure misery

As far as Rage spec is concerned i dont have much to say its not OP not at all but it is EASY actaually it is effortless!

I read many replies arguing that getting maximum dmg on smash requires a long proceedure blah blah.

We all know that this is a lie.Obvisously you see that the spec is going to be nerfed and you are making excuses. It soooooooooooooo easy to gather fury on this spec , personanly when i am on rage spec every time after i smash all i need is charge/oblieterate(maybe a v-slash maybe...) and my beserk is up again.

imo devs should (kind of )nerf Rage spec but it should orianted towards the rotaion and certainly NOTon the dmg output

Annihilation is actually much better at solo-pve, its just less of a thrash cleaner.

But it remains the sole dps spec, all class together, I was able to solo a pylon guardian with.

Anyway this whole thread is pointless.

Annihilate has awesome damage for an ability that doesnt need any setup, (I see crits in the high 4k/low 5k on the mainhand) and smash is getting nerfed to the ground.