I know you said this was fixed or more adjusted but it is still really bad. Third ops in a row where the class we only had one of received multiple drops while the most common class got 1. It is so stupid to have 2 trooper rakata helms drop when there is only 1 trooper in the group. Will you consider changing to just generic armor tokens. Yeah i get it is a time sink blah blah blah. Its bad when our whole guild is just laughing at how stupid the system is. Its a real bummer that we had to waist both of this weeks HM EV and Karragas to literally get no gear for anyone but alts. We actually had not one piece of usable armor drop in HM EV. One Trooper in the group and almost ever piece that dropped was trooper gear or crappy exotech gear. Very similar thing happened with only 1 smuggler in teh group. LOTS of smuggler gear.

While I think the EV/KP system was basically ok, you'll be pleased to know that the Denova operation does indeed drop tokens that all classes can use.

Random drops is random. The sky is blue. Dogs bark.

 

TOR has some of the fastest gearing up processes in any MMO and people still whine that it's too hard? Seriously?

Adding multiple members of the same class to a group does not impact the drops given. The game only registers whether a class is present in a group, not how many of them are present, when determining drops.

Adding multiple members of the same class to a group does not impact the drops given. The game only registers whether a class is present in a group, not how many of them are present, when determining drops.

 

David,

 

Our guild has an overabundance of Consulars. We generally have 4-5 every night we raid. Generally we do two clears of normal content and two of HM/NMM as well as Denova Story.

 

We've noticed a very big bias towards whichever classes are represented least in the Op group, to the degree where we can almost predict what each boss will drop. Our raid yesterday is a prime example. We were running a few lesser geared people through EV HM to get gear for those wanting to do Denova. Our group makeup was 2 troopers (vanguard tank, commando heals), 2 knights (2 guardian dps), 4 consulars (sage heals, shadow tank, 2 shadow dps). Specifically we were looking to gear up the shadow tank, but prior to starting, due to previous runs, we guessed that there would be a lot of knight and trooper drops. Sure enough, we geared up fully one of the guardian dps and the trooper tank. Only one consular piece dropped the entire run.

 

We've seen this happen almost every Ops run since the patch change. To put it even further into perspective, our Knights are fully geared, their offspecs (if applicable) are fully geared and their companions are in full Rakata. Other than the occasional drop, our consulars are struggling to get gear. We're even considering limiting the number of consulars in Ops in order to gear up the mains that require the gear most.

 

I think the change to the loot system for Denova Hard mode is a great change however, given the loot issues we have with the previous tier. We don't believe that the loot drops on normal and in the previous tier are not biased in some way towards the least represented.

I thought I would add to this as I feel what my guild has experienced is relevant. We run a balanced raid. By balanced, I mean we have 2 warriors (juggernaut and marauder), 2 inquisitors (sorc and assassin tank), 2 operatives (sniper, agent) 2 bounty hunters (power tech and bodyguard merc). Our warriors have been the last to get any measure of upgrades to rakata level gear. To the extent of our ops/bh/inq gearing up through 2 HMs each.

 

The biggest reason we went with this raid comp is that we figured people would have a 50% chance of getting gear specific to their class, when it drops. After 2 months of doing HM EV/KP and SM EC, we finally got a warrior rakata main hand token to drop the other night.

 

We've tried using a different class for the party leader spot, as well as having different classes zone in first. I understand that the loot is supposed to be random, but when you see inquisitor drops throughout entire raids on a weekly basis, it loses the feeling of it being random. Just my 2 creds.

Edited May 18, 2012 by Taeric

Im the only jedi knight in our raid composition so im not complaining ... everyone else is rolling ranged to make ops raids easier , problem is i really enjoy the activeness of sentinal, so im stuck playing him. I have a lvl 50 trooper but i find standing still a little boring. Just a shame things like LI punish a full group of melee, we switch out for ranged and breeze through it in 2 goes. Slightly off topic but group comp for us would be mostly troppers, gunsligners and consolars.

Well with your setup the consulars would have a 1/3 chance of their loot dropping. You're just unlucky :/

Adding multiple members of the same class to a group does not impact the drops given. The game only registers whether a class is present in a group, not how many of them are present, when determining drops.

 

Thank you for the copy and paste reply from the CS playbook......now back to reality......

 

Ran EV SM the other night to gear up a few new members, show em the pulls, etc..... NO smugglers in the run.....full clear.........

 

Overall Columi level drops:

TWO Smuggler Chest

TWO Smuggler Pants

TWO Smuggler Boots

One Blaster Pistol

 

And this crap happens alot ... Trooper in raid, get 5 Trooper drops in one clear on another night......rest of us wondered why we came ......great for the trooper.........

 

So, David, your Copy / Paste response doesn't fly ....

 

Filled in many tickets, live chat agents, pretty much a waste of time after the first chat version of the Automated Droid Response to the lower back .......

This has to be one of the biggest BW fails yet.

 

So i have been raiding since week 3 with my BH healer I have NEVER I REPETE NEVER seen a BH main hand or offhand. I have done upwards of 30-40 ops with this toon and i am still stuck with 2 columi weapons.

 

Last night we had 4 BH 1IA 1SI and 2 SW and 10/10 were IA drops ....

 

This is some serious bull shyte. I have now paid for 6 months of this god dammed game and still i have NEVER EVEN SEEN THE BH RAKATA GUNS DROP let alone get to roll on one.

 

1.3 take the fkin class restrictions of everything ffs

I have to agree about this biased loot drop system. Ive been on my consular in ops (usually have 2-3). Most ops alot of other class items drop. Biggest issue i seen up to today and still ongoing is consular mainhand token drops. They are RARE very rare. I can sum up total ops i have doen since game launch easily 50% are smuggler items and alot knight aswell. Then follows troopers and last is consular. I dont know why it is so.

 

There has to be some change in system. How long will people put up runnig ops and OVER gearing knights and smugglers and their offgear and their companions while other class struggling with basic main gear.

 

I was sure OPS loot look at how many classes it contains and then makes adjustements of drops. Most important issue, WHY ther has to be 2 same item drops from one boss??? I mean we have one fully geared trooper and boss drops 2 mainhand weapons for that class but only one trooper is in ops....

 

This is stupidest loot distribution i have seen yet in MMO's i played. And i have played most past 5-6 year MMO's that have been on market.

Edited May 20, 2012 by Divona

I have to agree about this biased loot drop system. Ive been on my consular in ops (usually have 2-3). Most ops alot of other class items drop. Biggest issue i seen up to today and still ongoing is consular mainhand token drops. They are RARE very rare. I can sum up total ops i have doen since game launch easily 50% are smuggler items and alot knight aswell. Then follows troopers and last is consular. I dont know why it is so.

 

There has to be some change in system. How long will people put up runnig ops and OVER gearing knights and smugglers and their offgear and their companions while other class struggling with basic main gear.

 

I was sure OPS loot look at how many classes it contains and then makes adjustements of drops. Most important issue, WHY ther has to be 2 same item drops from one boss??? I mean we have one fully geared trooper and boss drops 2 mainhand weapons for that class but only one trooper is in ops....

 

This is stupidest loot distribution i have seen yet in MMO's i played. And i have played most past 5-6 year MMO's that have been on market.

I quoted this response because it really points out a major flaw in the loot table setup for SWTOR. I am currently getting into operations and just finally got my main (Sorcerer Healer) geared enough to start trying hard modes. However, all of the regular/normal runs seem to be experiencing the same problem all the other type of runs do...unbalanced loot drops.

 

I mentioned this to the group I ran with last week and as we were discussing this, a thought popped into my mind. What if "tokens" were dropped for rolls instead of actual loot items, it might make the loot tables more balanced because who ever got the "token" could just turn it in for the gear they needed and their character could actually use.

 

I can't say how many times I have just passed on loot because my sorc could not use it and I refuse to roll for a companion or alt if our mains are not getting gear they need.

 

...just a thought....perhaps a good idea...What!

Adding multiple members of the same class to a group does not impact the drops given. The game only registers whether a class is present in a group, not how many of them are present, when determining drops.

 

Hence his question why not go to a generic token based loot system. Get with the times BW or lose more people. I know my guild has had both tokens drop for Jedi Knight and we didn't have any. I'm guessing this change was somewhat recent or is it being fixed... again.

The drops are messed up. I tend to do them, the low lever ones alone. Did one last night with my Commando. Gear drops were for Jedi's yet neither me or my companion were Jedi.

Random drops is random. The sky is blue. Dogs bark.

 

TOR has some of the fastest gearing up processes in any MMO and people still whine that it's too hard? Seriously?

 

It doesn't seem random at all to be honest. I've never seen an Ops chest in an 8 or 16 man with gear for more than 2 classes. Seems like its always double smuggler/consular or double trooper/knight or whatever. I don't know why its like that but it's hillarious when you have one knight and he gets two drops out of every chest while no one else gets ****.

It doesn't seem random at all to be honest. I've never seen an Ops chest in an 8 or 16 man with gear for more than 2 classes. Seems like its always double smuggler/consular or double trooper/knight or whatever. I don't know why its like that but it's hillarious when you have one knight and he gets two drops out of every chest while no one else gets ****.

 

That's not how random works. If a boss drops 2 tokens, the first being a Knight token doesn't reduce in any way the chance of the 2nd also being a knight token.

 

You have the exact same probability of getting a Knight token every single drop for the entire ops as you do getting a completely different token each time. These types of "this isn't random BS" threads have existed in every MMO to date. In WoW I ran a raid for 3 months straight and never got the boots off the first boss (and he had 5 items in his loot table), I should have had 2 or 3 sets of boots after so many kills statistically. However. just because he hadn't dropped the boots for 3 months straight didn't increase the chance he'd drop them the next time.

 

Random is random, just because it doesn't work out to statistical averages doesn't mean anything

HM EC drops generic armour pieces for every class to use.

 

They have changed it, I guess it was too much to change the current armour sets. Hopefully they will continue this trend and all future armour sets will be generic

Just so people know. im not complaining about the amount of time it takes to gear up. This is end game content. It should not be itemized like regular flashpoints. I just think a generic token for the armor peices makes more sense. Yes, if there are 3 consulars and 1 trooper i would expect to see alot of consular armor drop. I just think the itemization scheme for the end game content is too random. Especially when u are locked out for a week. Maybe we just have a streak of bad luck but ins very annoying to be have fruitless runs on low pop servers where even pugging 1 dos is damn near impossible.

Looks like someone big in bioware (EA) now playing Smuggler/IA.

This week we have 24/44 items for 1 ia in raid ops. 5(droped 6) main hand from 3 raids to 1 IA in raid ops.

Last 2 raid all boss have at least 1 item for IA. 4 bosses drop loot only for IA/Sm.

Edited May 22, 2012 by Snean

Adding multiple members of the same class to a group does not impact the drops given. The game only registers whether a class is present in a group, not how many of them are present, when determining drops.

 

Actually that could impact the drops given.

 

If the game only registers what classes are present, then the more of any class you stack, the more likely you are to entirely lack a certain class. Lacking an entire class in turn removes it from the loot table and increases your odds getting loot for the other classes.

 

After all, if it didn't, there would be absolutely no point to having made the change to make the loot system smarter in the first place.

Edited May 22, 2012 by Khadroth

Actually that could impact the drops given.

 

If the game only registers what classes are present, then the more of any class you stack, the more likely you are to entirely lack a certain class. Lacking an entire class in turn removes it from the loot table and increases your odds getting loot for the other classes.

 

After all, if it didn't, there would be absolutely no point to having made the change to make the loot system smarter in the first place.

 

You're just being clever now, it's obvious what he meant.

OMG - this is SOOO simple to fix.. GREAT IDEA below:

 

BW Team-

 

Can we for simple sake.. ONE GENERIC TOKEN for each item type and gear level. (Tionese Token - CHEST - ANY, Columni Token - BOOTS - ANY, etc). Keep it BOP still, but generic enough to spread out loot as needed.

 

Doesn't require complex math and/or teaming and whomever is on the mission can get the one person they need gear and extras goto Companions.

 

I mean, ton's of happy people here and hardcore folks can start pulling NOOB's into HM's with real gear and don't have to hang out in Normal Mode missions. Plus you have less ticked off folks.

Our ops genereally make up quite a few jedi knights and consulars( the split is usually either 4/3 either way) and 1 trooper or smuggler. What tends to happen is on a lot of bosses 2 pieces will drop for the trooper or smuggler and 1 piece for either jedi knight or consular.

 

Seems to be clearly favoring the under represented class.