Well, it comes as no surprise. I have compared our tacticals to my Sin and we got the short straw again unless someone can correct me. You can swap tacticals out-of-combat so sins are using their "2 charges stealth out" one, then switching to a "heal to full at 20%" or "buffed autocrit DPS" one leading to 50k singl crits not including the lead-in damage.

 

For us, double Holotraverse, the buggiest teleport in the game so we now get two chances to launch out of the map, or requiring perfectly flat ground with no obstacles and requiring no impairing effects unless you talent for it. We get "acid blade" buff - which does at most 15k. We get the "Velied strike" buff that changes our opening rotation as the backstab buff has to wait for its CD or you wait to use it after Volatile / Veiled, and forego its stealth/position buff.

 

Not exactly burst, is it? Since we wont hit 50k unless both Vol and BS crit. With the nerf to the crit yield curve, we now top out at sub-45% crit chance at 306 + augments so we doubly reduced our chance of that scale of damage, considering the loss of set bonus autocrit.

 

Now I hear what you are saying: "wah" or "L2P"

 

Its just that I have played my Sin now and it is everything Op used to be when we had knockdown on backstab at a competitive crit burst yield, combined with a fast ticking poison with some teeth (Acid blade). That heal Tactical switch on stealth-out is powerful, and awesome.

 

Okay, so you think "Debilitator set, stunlock FTW" but Sins have had double hardstun forever so again, no advantage, especially in Whitebar Land. I'm looking at you Ranked.

 

All you really need to do is see how often folks are getting globalled now ( and that rate is measurably up) and then see how many more burst combos you need to get your opponent from 100-0.

 

I may be wrong, I may be a bad player, but all things equal from the last patch, I feel diminshed relative to other specs I play. Same old story, yes?

 

I dunno, I guess we will see how it plays out in time, but I'm going back to my Sin until then, its good old fashioned stealth burst fun, now with heals.

 

Ciao for now.

Edited October 28, 2019 by Taeshinobu

Well, it comes as no surprise. I have compared our tacticals to my Sin and we got the short straw again unless someone can correct me. You can swap tacticals out-of-combat so sins are using their "2 charges stealth out" one, then switching to a "heal to full at 20%" or "buffed autocrit DPS" one leading to 50k singl crits not including the lead-in damage.

 

For us, double Holotraverse, the buggiest teleport in the game so we now get two chances to launch out of the map, or requiring perfectly flat ground with no obstacles and requiring no impairing effects unless you talent for it. We get "acid blade" buff - which does at most 15k. We get the "Velied strike" buff that changes our opening rotation as the backstab buff has to wait for its CD or you wait to use it after Volatile / Veiled, and forego its stealth/position buff.

 

Not exactly burst, is it? Since we wont hit 50k unless both Vol and BS crit. With the nerf to the crit yield curve, we now top out at sub-45% crit chance at 306 + augments so we doubly reduced our chance of that scale of damage, considering the loss of set bonus autocrit.

 

Now I hear what you are saying: "wah" or "L2P"

 

Its just that I have played my Sin now and it is everything Op used to be when we had knockdown on backstab at a competitive crit burst yield, combined with a fast ticking poison with some teeth (Acid blade). That heal Tactical switch on stealth-out is powerful, and awesome.

 

Okay, so you think "Debilitator set, stunlock FTW" but Sins have had double hardstun forever so again, no advantage, especially in Whitebar Land. I'm looking at you Ranked.

 

All you really need to do is see how often folks are getting globalled now ( and that rate is measurably up) and then see how many more burst combos you need to get your opponent from 100-0.

 

I may be wrong, I may be a bad player, but all things equal from the last patch, I feel diminshed relative to other specs I play. Same old story, yes?

 

I dunno, I guess we will see how it plays out in time, but I'm going back to my Sin until then, its good old fashioned stealth burst fun, now with heals.

 

Ciao for now.

 

Sin is probably going to get a nerf because they are a few paces short of being pre-nerf OP Scoundrels. So comparing them with us isn’t going to cut it for me. Along with the swap-on-stealth.

 

Every class got their useless tactical or heavily situational one. You saying Acid Lash sucks shows you’re not paying attention to what the tacticals do.

 

Acid Lash basically makes you in a hybrid monster. You have enough DPS to rival Ruffian in PvE DPS. And the constant FAST ticking DoTs combined with Vital Shot means no downtime on DPS in PvP or PvE.

 

Again, you’re sacrificing increased damage for more mobility and healing. You’re supposed to be an annoyance.

 

And again pay attention to the tacticals. Cause you clearly didn’t read them. With Volatile Strike Bludgeon will automatically crit if you have an unexplored Blood Boiler and then make the Next Back Blast automatically crit.

 

Unless you’re complaining about Catalyzed Toxins we have nothing to discuss here.

 

The 2 Stunlocks are meh in my opinion and I didn’t get the fuss about it when it came out. I would rather keep more DPS because that actually wins fights.

 

This is clearly an L2P issue.

Edited October 28, 2019 by UltraFlashStar

Hmmm. Except that I have them and have used them. On both classes. I am not speculating based on reading the tooltips here. I am parsing.

You kind of make my point for me, we are a 'hybrid', an 'annoyance' worried about 'damage uptime' I totally agree with you that this is the outcome of our palette of tacticals. I got into Op at launch as a burst class, so to me, this represents a nerf. A diminution of our former role and not aligned with my play style. We are simply not an 'imminent threat' class any longer.

 

So we must agree to disagree and let the stats tell the tale. We shall see.

As for L2P, sure I could improve, but I am playing both classes at equal badness, and the divergence of Sin vs Op is profound. Simply my observation.

Hmmm. Except that I have them and have used them. On both classes. I am not speculating based on reading the tooltips here. I am parsing.

You kind of make my point for me, we are a 'hybrid', an 'annoyance' worried about 'damage uptime' I totally agree with you that this is the outcome of our palette of tacticals. I got into Op at launch as a burst class, so to me, this represents a nerf. A diminution of our former role and not aligned with my play style. We are simply not an 'imminent threat' class any longer.

 

So we must agree to disagree and let the stats tell the tale. We shall see.

As for L2P, sure I could improve, but I am playing both classes at equal badness, and the divergence of Sin vs Op is profound. Simply my observation.

 

Scoundrel is still a burst class. The literally just added a tactical that improves your DPS by keeping a DoT up that you can basically ignore and get greater DPS. We got better healing, we got better defense, we got better damage. I don’t know what game you’re playing because it’s definitely not this one. I have all three tacticals on the two DPS specs and regularly swapped between them and parsed each thoroughly. Who cares if you’re not an imminent threat. That’s good! You still do more damage than 6/8 or of the classes. Im outdpsing DoT specs on my Scrapper. You’re acting like they took something away from the class when they didn’t.

Edited October 28, 2019 by UltraFlashStar

I raid in scrapper. It's awesome. You get a raid buff, offheals, scamper for cheesing mechanics, stealth rez, and dodge reflect for cheesing mechanics.

 

Scrapper wasn't nerfed. Deception/Infiltration might have been given YUGE opening burst from Force Cloak rinse repeat, but I expect it to be nerfed.

Edited October 29, 2019 by Rion_Starkiller

I think we have the best time since 1.0 for scoundrels

 

The Veiled Strike Tactical is imo realy nice. I mean u have to see the combination. Veiled strike crit 25-35 k Backstab Krit 55-65 k (im not bis gear) bloodboiler 15-35k. This with 2 hardstuns and reset of bloodboiler...

I dont know what u are complaining about. enough pressure. do you want to kill people with 3 skills?

 

if u dont like 6 sek roll(lol) and 2 hardstuns go for the tactian set.... imo the better burst set. 10%krit + 5% flat dmg/heal inrease and +1 tactical advantage..means +70K backstabs

backstab reset on overdrive.....so if u want u can one shot a player in one hardstun every 3 minutes :-)

 

im in love with that new gamestyle. And if u want rofl dps... go leth. ae tactical. have fun^^ also very nice to play

 

i mean yeah... the sin set... its overtuned.... but a nerf will come..

and about tactical swap... its not that big deal....

It is bugged tactical it seems. If you swap "luck always changes" crit rate goes down to base. So "2 stealth" must be set to 1 as well when tactical removed.

 

Also I don't see 2 items bonuses in stats and don't see any additions from armors' skills (however icons are shown), for example damage reduction not changing in stats.

Edited October 30, 2019 by alexzk

I think we have the best time since 1.0 for scoundrels

 

The Veiled Strike Tactical is imo realy nice. I mean u have to see the combination. Veiled strike crit 25-35 k Backstab Krit 55-65 k (im not bis gear) bloodboiler 15-35k. This with 2 hardstuns and reset of bloodboiler...

I dont know what u are complaining about. enough pressure. do you want to kill people with 3 skills?

 

if u dont like 6 sek roll(lol) and 2 hardstuns go for the tactian set.... imo the better burst set. 10%krit + 5% flat dmg/heal inrease and +1 tactical advantage..means +70K backstabs

backstab reset on overdrive.....so if u want u can one shot a player in one hardstun every 3 minutes :-)

 

im in love with that new gamestyle. And if u want rofl dps... go leth. ae tactical. have fun^^ also very nice to play

 

i mean yeah... the sin set... its overtuned.... but a nerf will come..

and about tactical swap... its not that big deal....

 

We are talking SWTOR here if you think sins will get nerfed anytime soon I don't think you lived through 5.0 and Mercs

This is the first time I have been visiting the forums since 6.0 launch and I am surprised. Concealment with acid lash rivals lethality dps in parses now and is the highest parsing burst spec. For PvP the 3 overperforming classes now are lightning sorc, deception sin and concealment oper (volatile strike). I will only speak for the pvp side now, because I don't really do pve. They have changed oper from a hit and run spec to a spec that can actually keep pressure on someone by attacking them. We can play way more offensive now. The changes are amazing. And the first post I see here is about the bad state of opers... Edited November 3, 2019 by ThePsyEagle

This is the first time I have been visiting the forums since 6.0 launch and I am surprised. Concealment with acid lash rivals lethality dps in parses now and is the highest parsing burst spec. For PvP the 3 overperforming classes now are lightning sorc, deception sin and concealment oper (volatile strike). I will only speak for the pvp side now, because I don't really do pve. They have changed oper from a hit and run spec to a spec that can actually keep pressure on someone by attacking them. We can play way more offensive now. The changes are amazing. And the first post I see here is about the bad state of opers...

 

In that case you haven't seen MM snipers, Maras , PT's and Mercs , all of these outdamage it also oper is still the most easily kited class in this game even with rolls. Go play huttball and tell me how easy it is to actually finish down a target , newsflash you won't.

Edited November 3, 2019 by offence

I have played a lot of regs and solo ranked since 6.0. Operative is better in all aspects. MM snipers have gotten a mobility buff, but I don't really see the problem with mercs. One more rocket out doesn't change much. PTs got changed to the point were they are viable again instead of the worst class. Yes, marauders frequent vanish is annoying but operatives therefor got a better damage increase. Edited November 3, 2019 by ThePsyEagle

In that case you haven't seen MM snipers, Maras , PT's and Mercs , all of these outdamage it also oper is still the most easily kited class in this game even with rolls. Go play huttball and tell me how easy it is to actually finish down a target , newsflash you won't.

 

I agree that it's pretty easy for a sage/sorc to kite an op/scoundrel, particularly since you only have 1 root, and your 1 slow is reliant on taking a utility slot needed for something else. If you want to take an extra root break on your Surrender/Aggro dump, then that costs you another valuable utility. For a root break on holotraverse, that costs another utility.

 

As for huttball, however, you should be the ball carrier and playing offense anyway And PT's and Mercs can easily be beaten down by a scoundrel/op. Concealment/Scrapper is good right now, even in pvp.

I agree that it's pretty easy for a sage/sorc to kite an op/scoundrel, particularly since you only have 1 root, and your 1 slow is reliant on taking a utility slot needed for something else. If you want to take an extra root break on your Surrender/Aggro dump, then that costs you another valuable utility. For a root break on holotraverse, that costs another utility.

 

As for huttball, however, you should be the ball carrier and playing offense anyway And PT's and Mercs can easily be beaten down by a scoundrel/op. Concealment/Scrapper is good right now, even in pvp.

 

True and yes it is good , our dmg is finally on par but im having too much fum with lethality min-maxed to ever come back to conc. Still they nerfed our rolls and nobody talks about it while assassin is utterly broken.

Edited November 7, 2019 by offence