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Crafting Changes Coming in December (6.0.2)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Crafting Changes Coming in December (6.0.2)
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yanyost's Avatar


yanyost
12.19.2019 , 10:51 PM | #161
Don't know if you need another person to chime in here - but the amount of materials you need to make base green items is just dumb.

DavidAtkinson's Avatar


DavidAtkinson
12.19.2019 , 10:57 PM | #162
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Dunno, there is a lot to fix still but I've seen augment prices going down already on my server by a couple of million credits. Still expensive but lower nonetheless.

Material costs are still an issue though I agree for things like stims/adrenals. They aren't much better than the previous ones but they do cost a LOT more still to make. For me the only thing I do with Biochem in 6.0 is medpacs. The rest isn't worth it.
On DM the prices should be around Ossus levels now if I'm not mistaken... Still expensive yes, but I don't see the prices going down. There is an ongoing inflation on the market that will never go away. I think the last time augments were cheap was in 4.0 ? It's crazy how much anti casual this game has become in terms of augment prices.
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Transcendent's Avatar


Transcendent
12.20.2019 , 02:43 AM | #163
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Dunno, there is a lot to fix still but I've seen augment prices going down already on my server by a couple of million credits. Still expensive but lower nonetheless.

Material costs are still an issue though I agree for things like stims/adrenals. They aren't much better than the previous ones but they do cost a LOT more still to make. For me the only thing I do with Biochem in 6.0 is medpacs. The rest isn't worth it.
Augment prices may be affected by a slightly lower point of entry and more players crafting those? Competition will always lower prices a bit. Material costs are still too high, they shifted slightly in the right direction but I honestly can't see BioWare being magnanimous to new players trying to get into Grade 11 crafting.

As it currently stands Grade 11 crafting is still too heavily time and cost intensive compared to everything prior to it. It isn't fun in the slightest.

I'm actually not touching the new augments, 228 purple is sufficient for all content if you're not running the new operation imo.
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TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
12.20.2019 , 03:49 AM | #164
Quote: Originally Posted by DawnAskham View Post
The question is whether this is due to malice or sheer incompetence.

Personally, I'm going to go with incompetence - of the management 'we just don't give a crap' variety.
.
At this point, what else can we think??

We told them and provided numbers and everything on the pts

AND THEY TOTALLY IGNORED IT after asking for said feed back.

They push a bad system live, take 4 weeks to announce they are going to fix it and still don’t pay any attention to all the feed back and numbers given to them. On top of that, they still do not fix the bugs and silly mistakes that are obviously attention to detail things and not a massive job.

So I ask you, WHAT THE HELL DID THEY ACTUALLY DO FOR 4 WEEKS while developing this patch?? Work on anthem reboot ideas?

Even trying to tank the game on purpose has been suggested by some and normally I would say that’s a load of rubbish. But the more the years go on and the worse they get (which I didn’t think was possible) the more you have to question the possibility that some in the team maybe trying to sabotage the longevity of the games existence so they can move to another project in Bioware/EA. I know if I was Musco I’d be wanting out after all these years. And his attitude towards us comes across as him not wanting to be there.

Consider this, It would only take a few people in key positions to let that happen. I mean, how many of the devs read the forums? Probably none or not many. They rely on Musco and team to provide player feed back on everything, including bugs. If the devs aren’t getting the feed back, then they might think everything is hunky dory.

IE, the incorrect gear drops for class specs took them 5 weeks to acknowledge it as a possible bug. That was after 5 weeks, 6 threads and many different posts/posters reporting the same bug. Apparently they didn’t even have it on their bug board?? How is that even possible unless Musco wasn’t telling them about the bug reports.
It wasn’t until our swtor “volunteer” tech support guy (Owen) got involved in the conversation did we even get a response from Musco the next day. Funny that, when you consider Owen raids with Kieth and obviously told him and Keith told Musco to do his job.
Since then, Musco made one post in the bug section and asked for feed back. It’s now 4-5 weeks later and we’ve provide heaps of feed back. Typical Musco, he has gone afk and hasn’t come back to the thread once. The bug is still not fixed. There is no update on when or if it will be fixed. He won’t even give us the curtesy of tell us if they have enough data or should we keep posting it??

So I feel we can’t rule anything out anymore when it comes to these guys. No one could be this absolutely incompetent and get away with it in a normal job. They’d be fired in an instant for shoddy workmanship and attitude. It actually feels like this is by design and not incompetence.

And it’s not like this is an isolated event. They were getting worse all the time during Ben Irving’s rein.
It’s been nearly 3 years since he left and they have continuously gotten worse in quality of workmanship and I dare say attitude to player enjoyment. I had such high hopes for Keith at the start and he seemed to deliver for 8 months. Then something happened and now I think he is actually worse than Ben was when it comes to understanding the players and what they need or want to have fun.

I’m sure part of the team is definitely worse or have less experience/training because the amount of bugs and quality is so bad that you would think lots of the game is still in beta testing. If I was a new player and didn’t know that Bioware don’t give a crap about quality or fix stuff they break, I’d be asking that question. It’s no wonder new players don’t stick around and players just reach their lo it with these bozo’s and leave without so much as a good bye (who can blame them).

Anyway, enough of a rant about Bio incompetence. It’s obvious the game is only held together by our love of it and some Wookie gum.

Merry Xmas

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
12.20.2019 , 03:59 AM | #165
Quote: Originally Posted by yanyost View Post
Don't know if you need another person to chime in here - but the amount of materials you need to make base green items is just dumb.
That’s an understatement, but you aren’t wrong

Tsillah's Avatar


Tsillah
12.20.2019 , 07:26 AM | #166
Quote: Originally Posted by DavidAtkinson View Post
On DM the prices should be around Ossus levels now if I'm not mistaken... Still expensive yes, but I don't see the prices going down. There is an ongoing inflation on the market that will never go away. I think the last time augments were cheap was in 4.0 ? It's crazy how much anti casual this game has become in terms of augment prices.
Yeah the prices on DM are now below 5 milion so effectively the augment prices have been cut in half.

It's odd that they throw BiS gear at everybody and then make augments such a pain by comparison. But worse is the crafting of relics etc which is a lot more expensive and compared to how the game throws 306 gear at you, I find it odd that crafting them should be so prohibitive even just or especially just to get the schem.

I found that the 3-tiered component system is also still very flawed. The green mats are fine IF you don't have to fight over nodes but that depends on the day so that's not entirely great but I find I run out of purple mats to craft like artifical durasteel or data spikes for example. On good days I can make lots of green and blue tiered but then I can only craft 2 purples because I ran out of purple mats again. On other days I don't get the green mats I need because people are gathering and we're fighting over nodes on the two locations we have.

There just are some fundamental flaws in not so much the crafting cost themselves but the acquisition paths of the mats. That's where I see the bottleneck. I mean it does translate into higher cost because you end up having to buy mats but that's because the mat acquisition is not in a good place. This could be solved by lowering the mat costs in schematics like instead of 12 artifact data spikes making it 6 for example, or it could be solved at the other end by making acquiring them easier.

It's really boring to have to alt around for a few hours between my crafting toons just starting crafting missions and not having enough missions of each type to get a flow. I mean Rich missions that give you 3 purple mats when you need 12 for a single craft is bs.

The problem with biochem runs a bit deeper still because you have stims now that are only mariginally better than the previous ones but require a lot of credit cost because of the white/gree/blue items you have to buy from the vendor because you only have 1 crafting mission for those and you need hundreds of them. This means that current stims are not viable costwise. I haven't bothered to get the schems sorted because it's not worth it. Only the medpac is because at least that one is significantly better...but then it had to be with the ridiculous hitpoint increase we got in 6.0.

I also still firmly believe that amplifiers should be part of crafting because it will give crafting more meaning and it can resolve that RNG fest at the same time. Amplifiers is a crap system and people will know how crap the next time we get a gear upgrade and people will have to redo all their amplifiers on their mods.
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Cupelixx's Avatar


Cupelixx
12.20.2019 , 01:09 PM | #167
I've just resigned myself to realizing that Bioware in fact wants things to be this way.

-We get bull---- credit sinks that have zero effect on the wealthy and only burden the joe/jane average player. They won't put in attractive credit sinks to replace the bull---- ones because they won't allow anything to spend credits on that takes away sales from the Cartel Market.
-We get a bull---- system of layered RNG on gearing now because it's the easy-cheezy way of "stretching things out". We can't have amplifiers tied to crafting because that would cut out the RNG time sink, and also cut out a way of sucking away credits from players.
-We get a bull---- new crafting tier that is not just double, but multiple times more expensive than the previous tier. Not just in credit costs, but materials. On top of that, most of the new craftables are only a few % better than the previous tier. On top of THAT, reverse engineering chances of learning higher quality schematics took a huge nerf to make things even more RNG and take longer. We then get a patch because "we listen to feedback" that doesn't do nearly enough to bring things back into balance.
-We get a bull---- nerf to credit payouts on heroic missions, making the previously mentioned credit sinks have a larger effect on the joe/jane average players. Less money for crew skills, less money for buying gear, less money for amplifiers. But it's all G right, because we can keep players on the treadmill longer!

The writing is on the wall. This type of game design is incredibly transparent. These elements are all indicative of the philosophy "if we give players an endless mile to run, they'll just keep playing and we can devote less resources into development". The problem is that this approach will be perceived as annoying and lazy. It doesn't make for a game that's fun to play. It doesn't give the impression that the company cares about what they're shoveling out. It doesn't guarantee that everyone is just going to lap it up and keep playing/paying. Some players will soldier on through it, some will just have enough and then move on. Seeing this type of thing in WoW was enough to make me quit that game for good.

FF14 is still there for me if things don't change here or I get fed up. Plenty of stuff in my Steam queue as well. I have accepted that this is just how SWTOR is now because the company does not care about the player experience. Only question now is when I get tired of it and move on to something else.

Toraak's Avatar


Toraak
12.20.2019 , 01:14 PM | #168
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Yeah the prices on DM are now below 5 milion so effectively the augment prices have been cut in half.

It's odd that they throw BiS gear at everybody and then make augments such a pain by comparison. But worse is the crafting of relics etc which is a lot more expensive and compared to how the game throws 306 gear at you, I find it odd that crafting them should be so prohibitive even just or especially just to get the schem.

I found that the 3-tiered component system is also still very flawed. The green mats are fine IF you don't have to fight over nodes but that depends on the day so that's not entirely great but I find I run out of purple mats to craft like artifical durasteel or data spikes for example. On good days I can make lots of green and blue tiered but then I can only craft 2 purples because I ran out of purple mats again. On other days I don't get the green mats I need because people are gathering and we're fighting over nodes on the two locations we have.

There just are some fundamental flaws in not so much the crafting cost themselves but the acquisition paths of the mats. That's where I see the bottleneck. I mean it does translate into higher cost because you end up having to buy mats but that's because the mat acquisition is not in a good place. This could be solved by lowering the mat costs in schematics like instead of 12 artifact data spikes making it 6 for example, or it could be solved at the other end by making acquiring them easier.

It's really boring to have to alt around for a few hours between my crafting toons just starting crafting missions and not having enough missions of each type to get a flow. I mean Rich missions that give you 3 purple mats when you need 12 for a single craft is bs.

The problem with biochem runs a bit deeper still because you have stims now that are only mariginally better than the previous ones but require a lot of credit cost because of the white/gree/blue items you have to buy from the vendor because you only have 1 crafting mission for those and you need hundreds of them. This means that current stims are not viable costwise. I haven't bothered to get the schems sorted because it's not worth it. Only the medpac is because at least that one is significantly better...but then it had to be with the ridiculous hitpoint increase we got in 6.0.

I also still firmly believe that amplifiers should be part of crafting because it will give crafting more meaning and it can resolve that RNG fest at the same time. Amplifiers is a crap system and people will know how crap the next time we get a gear upgrade and people will have to redo all their amplifiers on their mods.
Hold up here, They don't Throw BiS at you. Just because you have 306 gear doesn't mean it's BiS. There are so many Variations of the mods and enhancements that getting the proper BiS ones can take some time due to RNG..
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