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10-49 Bracket fairer than 50's bracket??


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This needs it's own thread.

 

There are a lot of people on the forum screaming how the 10-49 bracket is fairer than the 50 bracket and they wish they could stop leveling due to the "unfairness" of the level 50 bracket.

 

I'm not claiming the level 50 bracket is fair, or the pvp system at level 50 in general is fair, but I want to clarify all the misconceptions going on.

 

The most imbalanced, unfair system in SWTOR is none other than....

 

...the 10-49 bracket for PvP. The level 50 bracket, where as "unfair" is tremendously better than the level 10-49 bracket.

 

A level 10 vs. a level 49 is just stupid. A level 49 has all of their abilities sans level 50 abilities, and all of the skill points sans 1. A level 10 has 1 skill point, and a few abilities. No level 10 has their "key ability" that define's their class and makes them "uber" either. For example, a Level 10 Jedi Shadow...cannot even cloak.

 

So many people cry "I want to stay in the 10-49 bracket cause it's fair". You sir are the biggest hypocrite in the world and should not be allowed to play said games. You truly just want to be able to pwn up on level 10s as a level 40 something with the insane advantage you have over others.

 

Now if just the skill point and abilities differences weren't enough, guess what. The 10-49 bracket has huge gear disparities as well.

 

Relics and gear: Level 10s can't get relics. Also the buff they give you doesn't "bolster" as well. Pretty much bolster only does your endurance and main dmg/healing stat. If you gear benefits from crit rating and such, bolster doesn't do anything about it to make it "fair. Starting at ~level 40, your gear starts to out do the bolster effect.

 

Expertise: Guess what, expertise doesn't start at 50. At level 40 I was able to get about ~80 expertise by swapping out weapon expertise enhancements to put in my orange gear. It works out pretty well if you buy a weapon for your companion and swap out hte expertise, you can then put the expertise on your armor. A level 10 can't get expertise.

 

So lets talk about fair. A level 10 can't do anything except level up to close the gap, all while getting creamed in PvP.

 

So what's more fair. A level 50 w/ battlemasters vs a level 50 without battlemasters, or a level 10 with 2 abilities and 1 skill poitn vs a level 49 with all their abilities and all their skill points (Sans 1)?

 

Which is easier to close the gap?

Getting PvP Gear at level 50 or leveling up to level 49?

 

tl;dr

The level 50 PvP may be broken, but don't you dare say "10-49 bracket is more fair."

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At level 10, on 4 different classes (ie, all of them) i top damage or healing (or both) and killing blows in every single warzone I've ever joined in the 10-49 bracket. I can easily beat 40's+ in a 1v1. It has nothing to do with beating up on lowbies as a 40+ for me. The bracket is just better. There's less burst, less consumable stacking, less relic swapping and abuse, and you don't require a premade to be somewhat effective like the 50 brackets which 75% of the games are composed of at least one premade per side.

 

Also, and the main reason people don't want to join the 50 bracket, is because of the absolutely massive gear differences. A fresh level 50 has no chance at all against a player in even full centurion gear (battlemaster geared players can literally solo three fresh 50's that have a mix of green scrub leveling gear). That combined with the fact that getting gear is 100% luck based and it could literally take weeks or months to even become competitive. I don't want to get farmed by terrible players that simply have a gear advantage over me for 1-2 months until i have comparable gear.

 

You're seriously the most ignorant poster i've ever seen. Well, you and the fan boys that think this game is actually good.

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At level 10, on 4 different classes (ie, all of them) i top damage or healing (or both) and killing blows in every single warzone I've ever joined in the 10-49 bracket. I can easily beat 40's+ in a 1v1. It has nothing to do with beating up on lowbies as a 40+ for me. The bracket is just better. There's less burst, less consumable stacking, less relic swapping and abuse, and you don't require a premade to be somewhat effective like the 50 brackets which 75% of the games are composed of at least one premade per side.

 

Also, and the main reason people don't want to join the 50 bracket, is because of the absolutely massive gear differences. A fresh level 50 has no chance at all against a player in even full centurion gear (battlemaster geared players can literally solo three fresh 50's that have a mix of green scrub leveling gear). That combined with the fact that getting gear is 100% luck based and it could literally take weeks or months to even become competitive. I don't want to get farmed by terrible players that simply have a gear advantage over me for 1-2 months until i have comparable gear.

 

You're seriously the most ignorant poster i've ever seen. Well, you and the fan boys that think this game is actually good.

 

Lol you fail. I just proved, very solidly that the bracket is unfair.

 

What you are claiming on about is "Skill difference" The same "Skill difference" exists in the 50's bracket. Additionally, people in the 10-49 bracket haven't had as much TIME to learn their class etc then those who have made it all the way to 50 and valor rank 60. Thus there is an even bigger disparity when it comes to Player Skill Gaps.

 

You have SO MUCH MORE of a chance to kill a 50 battlemaster geared player than you do a level 49 as a level 10 assuming equal skill.

 

The reason you do so well in the 10-49 bracket is because MOST players in that bracket...wait for it...SUCK! The "MASSIVE GEAR DIFFERENCES" in the level 50's bracket is NOTHING compared to the MASSIVE SKILL AND ABILITY differences in the 10-49 bracket.

 

To not see this is to be completely ignorant yourself.

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At level 10, on 4 different classes (ie, all of them) i top damage or healing (or both) and killing blows in every single warzone I've ever joined in the 10-49 bracket. I can easily beat 40's+ in a 1v1. It has nothing to do with beating up on lowbies as a 40+ for me. The bracket is just better. There's less burst, less consumable stacking, less relic swapping and abuse, and you don't require a premade to be somewhat effective like the 50 brackets which 75% of the games are composed of at least one premade per side.

 

Also, and the main reason people don't want to join the 50 bracket, is because of the absolutely massive gear differences. A fresh level 50 has no chance at all against a player in even full centurion gear (battlemaster geared players can literally solo three fresh 50's that have a mix of green scrub leveling gear). That combined with the fact that getting gear is 100% luck based and it could literally take weeks or months to even become competitive. I don't want to get farmed by terrible players that simply have a gear advantage over me for 1-2 months until i have comparable gear.

 

You're seriously the most ignorant poster i've ever seen. Well, you and the fan boys that think this game is actually good.

 

How is that any different from any other game with PvP? There will always be a gear advantage for people that have been pvping at top level vs people that have just reached top level. They are ahead of the race and the longer it takes you to start accumulating the gear the more people that will get ahead of you. Everyone starts from the bottom, its not like those battlemasters hit 50 and all had full battlemasters gear day 1 they were fresh 50s at one point and they worked fro what they have.

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So what you're crying because people dont want to be your new fresh meat at the 50 bracket? Cry more.

 

10-49 is fun. Of course a 49 is going to be better than a level 10 but atleast they have a chance to put up a fight even if it's a tiny fight. Not like before stun then dead. But the fact is it's not as black and white as you think it is. I've been leveling my alt from pvp only before brackets where introduced. Now that there is the 10-49 it was a wide range of levels playing together. Even if you do come up against a 49 it's not like 3xish isnt going to kill him. I'm level 43 with level 43 valor I would had level 50+ valor if I didnt get capped at the end of each level and I can tell you 10-49 is insanely fun. I plan to reroll when I hit 49. I know what 50 bracket pvp is like cause I also have 50 Sorc. I rather reroll than play in 50 bracket because it's just plain *** boring until we get rated warfronts. So I dont blame people wanting to stay where there is better PvP.

 

 

If people want to stay in 49 bracket who cares? Obiviously you care alot I know because you and your 600 expertise want to lolfreekilllol those without expertise. The unfairness of the 10-49 is far less than 50 bracket unfairness. Deal with it. On every server low level is PvP is booming.

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tl;dr

The level 50 PvP may be broken, but don't you dare say "10-49 bracket is more fair."

 

I think people missname "fun" as "fair", this is indeed true that 10-49 is fun (you are playing close to Q3 deathmatch style), but 50 is frustate (if you are not battlemaster geared ofc :)) (your a playing real mmo battleground, when fresh dinged 50 got stomped to the ground)

 

As a 10 lvl you have alot more chances to kill 49, than fresh 50 against battlemaster 50. I don't know exact algorith of Bolster but it seemes gives a bigger bonus damage\healing to lower lvls to compensate not having lot's of talents points, 11 lvl sorc crits 900 per once force lightning tick, when 39 is crits around 600, while have other damage spells (i just have both so it's not a numbers pulled from one place, but a real ones :))

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Let's see some of my latest experiences:

 

Level 12 Gunslinger: 2nd highest damage, 2nd highest kills, 2 deaths overall.

Level 15 Scoundrel: Highest healing on my team, 2nd highest overall.

 

You most certainly can do well in PvP at lower levels. Yes you are missing some abilities and such, but most of your core abilities are ones you get early on anyway. Now personally, I think you need to get to level 14 to be really competitive since sprint is so useful, but it can be done at lower levels for sure.

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I'd say that they need to bracket even more but I'm afraid that if they did there would be huge waits in queues.

 

However, if they were able to do cross server PvP. This wouldn't be an issue. you could do 10 - 19 ; 20 - 29 ; 30 - 39 ; 40 - 49; and then 50's. This would make if much more fair for everyone, not to mention give them a better idea of where things need "balanced".

 

Just my 2 cents.

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This needs it's own thread.

 

There are a lot of people on the forum screaming how the 10-49 bracket is fairer than the 50 bracket and they wish they could stop leveling due to the "unfairness" of the level 50 bracket.

 

I'm not claiming the level 50 bracket is fair, or the pvp system at level 50 in general is fair, but I want to clarify all the misconceptions going on.

 

The most imbalanced, unfair system in SWTOR is none other than....

 

...the 10-49 bracket for PvP. The level 50 bracket, where as "unfair" is tremendously better than the level 10-49 bracket.

 

A level 10 vs. a level 49 is just stupid. A level 49 has all of their abilities sans level 50 abilities, and all of the skill points sans 1. A level 10 has 1 skill point, and a few abilities. No level 10 has their "key ability" that define's their class and makes them "uber" either. For example, a Level 10 Jedi Shadow...cannot even cloak.

 

So many people cry "I want to stay in the 10-49 bracket cause it's fair". You sir are the biggest hypocrite in the world and should not be allowed to play said games. You truly just want to be able to pwn up on level 10s as a level 40 something with the insane advantage you have over others.

 

Now if just the skill point and abilities differences weren't enough, guess what. The 10-49 bracket has huge gear disparities as well.

 

Relics and gear: Level 10s can't get relics. Also the buff they give you doesn't "bolster" as well. Pretty much bolster only does your endurance and main dmg/healing stat. If you gear benefits from crit rating and such, bolster doesn't do anything about it to make it "fair. Starting at ~level 40, your gear starts to out do the bolster effect.

 

Expertise: Guess what, expertise doesn't start at 50. At level 40 I was able to get about ~80 expertise by swapping out weapon expertise enhancements to put in my orange gear. It works out pretty well if you buy a weapon for your companion and swap out hte expertise, you can then put the expertise on your armor. A level 10 can't get expertise.

 

So lets talk about fair. A level 10 can't do anything except level up to close the gap, all while getting creamed in PvP.

 

So what's more fair. A level 50 w/ battlemasters vs a level 50 without battlemasters, or a level 10 with 2 abilities and 1 skill poitn vs a level 49 with all their abilities and all their skill points (Sans 1)?

 

Which is easier to close the gap?

Getting PvP Gear at level 50 or leveling up to level 49?

 

tl;dr

The level 50 PvP may be broken, but don't you dare say "10-49 bracket is more fair."

 

then why do i see... level 10's, 11's, 15's, 20's, 30's, etc, etc... topping the damage, kills and medals??

 

the problem isnt more or less skills. players can compensate for that with PLAYER SKILL ...but when you are being 2 shotted by a level 50 sorc in full PvP gear... all the player skill in the world wont help you.

 

people that were playing 50's before the brackets got soft... and now its caught up them. lol. now it REALLY is all about skill and class balance.

 

enjoy.

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I prefer the 50's brax tbh. In the 1-49 brax on my alts, a lot of players don't know what they're doing (more so than the 50 brax anyways), queue up at level 11 and spam their basic ranged attack, lack a lot of their abilities possibly causing one side to be imbalanced. I feel like I'm just n00bstomping in the 1-49. Capping a turret, scoring, or planting a bomb in the 50's brax feels so much more rewarding. People die much slower in the 50's brax and are generally more organized. I think that's a good thing. Edited by kckkryptonite
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I'd say that they need to bracket even more but I'm afraid that if they did there would be huge waits in queues.

 

However, if they were able to do cross server PvP. This wouldn't be an issue. you could do 10 - 19 ; 20 - 29 ; 30 - 39 ; 40 - 49; and then 50's. This would make if much more fair for everyone, not to mention give them a better idea of where things need "balanced".

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

this makes way way WAY too much sense, brother.

 

itll never happen.

 

just like having expertise on ALL PvP gear... makes way too much sense for these folks.

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Lol you fail. I just proved, very solidly that the bracket is unfair.

 

What you are claiming on about is "Skill difference" The same "Skill difference" exists in the 50's bracket. Additionally, people in the 10-49 bracket haven't had as much TIME to learn their class etc then those who have made it all the way to 50 and valor rank 60. Thus there is an even bigger disparity when it comes to Player Skill Gaps.

 

You have SO MUCH MORE of a chance to kill a 50 battlemaster geared player than you do a level 49 as a level 10 assuming equal skill.

 

The reason you do so well in the 10-49 bracket is because MOST players in that bracket...wait for it...SUCK! The "MASSIVE GEAR DIFFERENCES" in the level 50's bracket is NOTHING compared to the MASSIVE SKILL AND ABILITY differences in the 10-49 bracket.

 

To not see this is to be completely ignorant yourself.

 

Every single thing you have stated is very wrong. Once they gave 50s their own bracket, the lower bracket became awesome! No people just going for medals and that's it. No people standing in the green stuff in Huttball to cheese medals. No 50 operatives just staying stealthed until they ran into someone lower level and 2 shotting them and then going back stealth to do it again to someone else. People began playing the warzones to win sub 50! I would get into a game, and we would suggest a strategy. We would agree and execute it. Every extremely fun warzone I have played has been in the lower bracket.

 

On my sorcerer who is now 50, the warzones are not nearly as fun. The reasons are many. Just two off the top of my head...very geared players in full battlemaster gear or full champion gear and players who freshly ding and are hoping to get items from bag drops in the future and the giant gear discrepency. 50s just trying to get as many medals as they can ignoring all objectives causing serious frustration for people who are there to work as a team to try and win the warzone. The list could go on.

 

Basically what I am telling you is, this is something you can have an opinion on. But to sit there and say that everyone else is wrong, and the 50 bracket is more fun for a fresh 50 than when they were pvp'ing in the lower bracket is just ridiculous and completely false.

 

Calling people fail and lol'ing at them doesn't make your argument any more true than when you originally typed it up. You sound like a child in your OP and responses.

 

You will be flamed hardcore for your post because it doesn't make any sense and you proceed to make fun of and speak down to anyone who disagrees.

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No, 10-49 is if anything even less fair.

 

The difference isn't fairness. The difference is in the 10-49 bracket you can pwn noobs with only a few hours of investment instead of a few weeks.

 

A level 10 is even gimper compared to a geared level 49 than a new 50 is to a BM. But with only a few hours' work the level 10 become a level 20 and then it can farm level 10s.

 

Basically 10-49 is just as unbalanced, it's just easier to move from the farmed seat to the farmer seat.

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What I think is funny is people who are 50 now, still ahead of the curve, instead of gearing up to be on par will continue to 10-49 until that bracket is relatively small and then see in 50 they are behind everyone. It is illogical behavior. The long term pvp environment in the game will be at the level cap. Complaining it is too unbalanced and then purposefully making it much harder for you in the long run makes no sense.
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Thank you for posting this, I'd just like to share my point of view as a level 49 Sith Assassin playing on a server where the Empire is mostly dominant.

 

My friends and I started playing Republic, but as soon as we realized how imbalanced the factions were we rerolled Empire. We mostly PvP now seeing as there is no way we can get enough people to down a world boss or do any challenging 50 flashpoints. I'll admit, that the Empire is much stronger than the Republic, maybe not innately, but just because so many more people are dedicated on the Empire side, or at least, on my server they are.

 

From my person perspective, I'm very concerned about leveling up to 50. I feel as though I need to have as many Mercenary and Warzone commendations as possible or else I'll be at a grave disadvantage against other level 50s whom already have a set of PvP gear whereas I do not. I've heard Ilum is poor as well, so no dice there either. So I'm desperately clinging to the last few bars I have left before hitting 50, trying to scrounge just a few more measly points of valor out of it. I don't like the idea of people stomping on low levels in the 10-49 bracket, but that's going to happen with or without level 50s, and worse yet, there's going to be no 50s to defend or carry the lower level players effectively screwing them unless they have a very active faction.

 

My advice? BioWare needs to allow 50s back in the regular PvP pool and try to bridge the gap that expertise creates. I know for a fact that I won't be even able to PvP anymore after I hit 50, so why am I being punished for leveling quicker than others? I thought MMOs were supposed to reward time spent and progression, not condemn it. Let's face it, a level 49 vs a level 10 will end the exact same way as a level 50 vs a level 10 would, there's no sense in completely barring the level 50s from any PvP whatsoever.

 

Ilum is another topic altogether, and one I can't rightly comment on since I haven't hit 50 yet.

 

Tl;dr: Allow level 50s to rejoin the 10-49 bracket and attempt to bridge the gap that expertise causes. A high level player vs a low level one will always end the same way, with or without 50s.

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No, 10-49 is if anything even less fair.

 

The difference isn't fairness. The difference is in the 10-49 bracket you can pwn noobs with only a few hours of investment instead of a few weeks.

 

A level 10 is even gimper compared to a geared level 49 than a new 50 is to a BM. But with only a few hours' work the level 10 become a level 20 and then it can farm level 10s.

 

Basically 10-49 is just as unbalanced, it's just easier to move from the farmed seat to the farmer seat.

 

No, you're just bad. I farm level 49's all day on my level 10-15 alts. I win maybe 80% of my warzones queuing alone as a level 10-15 because i can carry the team even at that level. I top damage/healing, kbs, and objectives every single warzone by a massive amount. There was never a single moment when i was going up against a 49 where i felt i had literally no chance. A fresh level 50 in greens will die in 3 gcds to any halfway competent Battlemaster geared player with absolutely no chance. The fresh 50 in greens probably would take at least 10+ gcds to kill the BM geared player even if that player was afk.

 

A level 10 usually has about 13k hp after bolster, a level 49 usually has about 12k. A level 10 actually hits harder than a level 49 with the few skills that do have. In comparison, at level 50, a fresh 50 has 12k hp and a BM geared player has 17k+ plus 10% damage boost and reduction from expertise. That's not even counting all the other stats too, because the difference is massive.

Edited by SeanPoe
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My advice? BioWare needs to allow 50s back in the regular PvP pool and try to bridge the gap that expertise creates. I know for a fact that I won't be even able to PvP anymore after I hit 50, so why am I being punished for leveling quicker than others?

 

Well, why do you feel you're being punished for leveling quicker than others when your reason you won't be able to pvp anymore at 50 is you'd have to fight against level 50 players who leveled quicker than you? I don't really think you've thought this through. Besides, you'd still have to fight them in a combined bracket anyway, except half your team would now be even less helpful.

 

The other thing is that it's not only expertise. That's only one stat. The other stats on champion gear, or level 50 PVE gear, are also much better. A level 10 won't have very good chances against a level 49 in a warzone due to lack of skills, but if he's well geared (for level 10) then he'll at least have similar stats to a well-geared level 49. At 50 though, gear from hardmodes and ops comes into play as well as level 50 pvp gear, and this is no longer the case.

 

That's why level 50 players need to be in their own bracket. They break the bolster mechanic due to level 50 gear progression kicking in in addition to the character level.

 

(And BTT, I have a level 50 character but I do prefer playing various alts from 20 to 46, currently mostly playing a level 33. Being squarely in the middle of the bracket feels fairly balanced right now, that's subjective of course, but it's more fun for me right now than anything else.)

Edited by dannythefool
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this thread is epic fail.

 

if you read the big thead about this bracket, everyone says its better...many many people stated they jumped into a BG with their lvl 20 toon and have tons of fun, contributed lots.

 

Also a well geared 49 has like 13k HP, and a lvl 15 will have 12K HP

 

in the 50 bracket a fresh 50 has 13k HP and a geared 50 has 18K HP(at least)

 

 

who gives a **** about the talents they help obviously but still not game breaking by any means.

 

 

/thread

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I prefer the 50's brax tbh. In the 1-49 brax on my alts, a lot of players don't know what they're doing (more so than the 50 brax anyways), queue up at level 11 and spam their basic ranged attack, lack a lot of their abilities possibly causing one side to be imbalanced. I feel like I'm just n00bstomping in the 1-49. Capping a turret, scoring, or planting a bomb in the 50's brax feels so much more rewarding. People die much slower in the 50's brax and are generally more organized. I think that's a good thing.

 

i agree completely. solo queueing at lower levels and getting huttball was a complete nightmare...its amazing to queue up at 50 and even a pug group knows what its doing (somewhat).

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i have yet to reach 50, but i love pvping on my lvl 26 JK and my lvl 17 sniper, it reminds me vanilla wow in that no one has super uber gear that makes them unkillable without 20min of free time and a pocket healer. i am honestly afraid of the 50s brackets, both from my experience in wow, and from what i am hearing in the forums
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