As a gay man i decided to watch a video of the Quin romance as i myself have never done it (male Warrior i have) and i have to say while his actions are odd i do not see them as how 2 men court.

If anything Quin's actions seem more like a man who is prompted by someone who he may feel he shouldn't, sort of like if a CEO of a company started flirting with a Entry level member of their staff. (not that im experienced in that either just by what i see on tv )

Anyway my point is that is Quin was originally a Gay romance it isnt seen much in the video i watched.

Fair enough, I just had been told that by some others... course they could also have been projecting their hatred of Quinn haha.

Then as for the debate with Divacius, though I do not overall agree with him (though later in the thread he makes some very good points) I think that the "tumblr buzzword" he quoted was "HETERO-FACIST" after which he mentioned heteronormative later. Even though I don't agree with him, I did even myself go "whoa" when I saw "hetero-facist male"

Words like that just get people's hackles up unnecessarily.

I attempted to avoid usage of the term "traditional marriage" specifically because of the baggage I've implied, then you implied, and now here you stated. Yes, Gay marriage is no less valid than straight marriage. That's not my point! My point is that the real-world definition of the term "traditional marriage" applies to Vette, apart from being a Twi'lek. I'm NOT saying that "traditional marriage" is a thing in Star Wars. I never did. Ever. But you're trying so bloody hard to pretend that's what I said that you're embarrassing us both. In fact, I'd like to think that sticking an adjective onto marriage in the SW universe isn't a thing. I'd like to hope, because this is 2015. But you and I both know George Lucas won't have any of that - which is probably a fair amount of why he's only an advisor and not actually part of the staff for the new movies.

So why not just say that you think Vette is straight?

Look, I'll say it if you bloody want me to. Will it make you feel better? Will it make you feel superior to have your suspicions about my gender and skin color validated? I'm a straight, white, male. I'm 26, attached but unmarried, and I work two jobs; as a history and biology teacher, and a freelance web developer in my free time. I am not religious. I am pro-LGBT and -choice. I also live in Quebec, Canada, and although I am fluently tetralingual (English, French, German, and Latin), I am seen by the QC government as being English because it is my native language, and so I am discriminated against in policies. I am pretty aware of the flak the LGBT community gets undeservedly, even though I'm well aware that the discrimination I face is not nearly as terrible.

 

And absolutely none of what I just wrote should matter, but apparently it does to you.

 

Saying "my men" is both condescending and unfairly stereotyping, and you should be ashamed. (And also untrue, five out of my nine characters are female.) I think it's almost literal bull **** how virtually all of EA/Activision's protagonists from the past decade are stubbly white men (who incidentally I vaguely resemble because my bead grows phenomenally fast, although I wear my hair more like Orlando Bloom's Pirates of the Caribbean character). So you know what the best gaming news I've seen all year is? Mirror's Edge prequel with an east-Asian woman as a protagonist. Dishonored 2 with a female protagonist. MORE CHOICE IN PROTAGONISTS! YAY! It's something that - even though I'm not gay, or a woman, or a part of most of the other groups of people that aren't well represented by NPC's in games - I still advocated for, and now we're starting to get! That should be great news!

 

Yet here you are, lumping me in with "hetero-fascists" and other obnoxious terms (note to you all: you're also insulting your fellow women with those terms because women can be straight too), even when I'm TRYING to be on your side. That's why this makes me so angry. I fight tooth and nail for equality, and then you *** holes come in here and try to tell me I'm evil and oppressing you literally by virtue of the circumstances of my birth.

 

That, my friends, is fascism. You're all homosexual-fascists now.

I said "your men" because you were afraid of people allegedly demanding that male protagonists, whom I presumed that you played, be removed from video gaming or somesuch, which no one here said.

You're not wrong for most of that paragraph. What I'm up in arms about is exactly what I stated above. It certainly sounds like a certain small but vocal group of people who have made their way to this thread in the past two days want that. It certainly sounds like a certain small but vocal group of people who have made their way to this thread in the past two days want anyone who is not what they are - that is, gay and/or female - to be ashamed of what they are, by virtue of what they are. I will NOT pay for the sins of my father, because I am NOT my father.

No we don't.

I attempted to avoid usage of the term "traditional marriage" specifically because of the baggage I've implied, then you implied, and now here you stated. Yes, Gay marriage is no less valid than straight marriage. That's not my point! My point is that the real-world definition of the term "traditional marriage" applies to Vette, apart from being a Twi'lek. I'm NOT saying that "traditional marriage" is a thing in Star Wars. I never did. Ever.

I'm really not sure what you're trying to say here. TOR doesn't have traditional marriage, but Vette wants traditional marriage, and traditional marriage isn't the right phrase, but you aren't going to explain what you're actually mean when you use it in this context, but how dare people assume the words you're using mean what they generally mean? This is a mess of an argument. If you want to explain what exactly Vette's looking for that she can't get from "nontraditional marriage", or whatever you'd like to call same-sex in this context, by all means. But you're just repeating the phrase over and over while not explaining it and getting irritated when people take it to mean what everyone else uses it to mean. I mean, looking at your other posts it looks like you don't think Vette can be bi because she's monogamous, which is its own kind of screwed up, but I could be misunderstanding you and I'm willing to hear you out if you want to explain your position.

Yet here you are, lumping me in with "hetero-fascists" and other obnoxious terms (note to you all: you're also insulting your fellow women with those terms because women can be straight too), even when I'm TRYING to be on your side. That's why this makes me so angry. I fight tooth and nail for equality, and then you *** holes come in here and try to tell me I'm evil and oppressing you literally by virtue of the circumstances of my birth.

If I was talking history and I mentioned fascist Germany, would you feel the need to jump in and tell me that Germany is no longer fascist and how dare I assume all Germans are fascist? Or would you understand I was talking specifically about the period when Germany was fascist? Because this is pretty much the same thing. Hetero-fascists are people who are fascist about sexuality. Not all heterosexuals. I'm not a huge fan of the term myself, but it doesn't mean what you think it means.

You're not wrong for most of that paragraph. What I'm up in arms about is exactly what I stated above. It certainly sounds like a certain small but vocal group of people who have made their way to this thread in the past two days want that. It certainly sounds like a certain small but vocal group of people who have made their way to this thread in the past two days want anyone who is not what they are - that is, gay and/or female - to be ashamed of what they are, by virtue of what they are.

I don't actually think that's happening.

I think part of the problem is that because there are so few female companions, they end up all romanceable.

That is actually the entire problem. You're coming at this from the wrong direction: these characters didn't drop from the sky fully-formed, they were created by a writing team. And that writing team had no problem writing male characters who were elderly, or bizarrely inhuman, so why is it that every single female character (minus, admittedly, Scorpio) is young, attractive, and willing to sleep with the PC?

On the other hand, there ends up being many extra male companions not romanceable, simply because there's more male companions. Hopefully with the upcoming expansion we'll get more female companions who end up not romanceable. That would be equal, and satisfy us both, yes?

On that we can agree.

That is completely nonsensical. Gay people don't have some kind of secret code language to replace the game's dialogue with. Unless you're talking about the ridiculously effeminate and stereotyped affectations of the two gay men characters from that awful, awful, "Will and Grace" show.

Flirting, dude.

And that writing team had no problem writing male characters who were elderly, or bizarrely inhuman, so why is it that every single female character (minus, admittedly, Scorpio) is young, attractive, and willing to sleep with the PC?

As a straight guy, I think this is an outstanding question, & one which deserves a much better answer than anything the gaming populace has ever got. A lot of us are adults, Bioware; trust me, we can handle the dialog.

Are the Jedi classes even capable of romancing anyone at all? If so, why?

Are the Jedi classes even capable of romancing anyone at all? If so, why?

Yes. Kira Carsen and Doc for the Knight, Nadia Grell and Felix Iresso for the Consular. The Knight is explicitly breaking their Jedi vows, the Consular is much more nuanced and goes into detail about how love and relationships aren't necessarily dark side in nature.

The Knight is explicitly breaking their Jedi vows

Awesome, I'm looking forward to that part of the story, so I can explicitly uphold my vows by refusing to fall for this "romance" stuff

Awesome, I'm looking forward to that part of the story, so I can explicitly uphold my vows by refusing to fall for this "romance" stuff

Basically, the Knight takes after Anakin and Luke Skywalker, secret marriages and the temptations of passion and all. The Consular explores why love sometimes leads to the dark side - and why it does not have to. You will notice in TOR that almost every senior Jedi, up to and including Grand Master Satele, is married, has at least one child, or both.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I tried, y'all. It's amazing to me how hard people will work at telling you they are explicitly NOT the very thing that they ARE. They truly don't see themselves as hurting anyone.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I tried, y'all. It's amazing to me how hard people will work at telling you they are explicitly NOT the very thing that they ARE. They truly don't see themselves as hurting anyone.

Please believe me when I say that it's not my intention to enact a final solution to the LGBT-haters involving total annihilation; because people can change for the better, and so far as I can see, the posters in this thread aren't hating on LGBT people.

So why not just say that you think Vette is straight?

Better yet, Diviciacus, why not say that you think Vette would like to marry a partner who just happens to be male? After all, it's not necessarily a foregone conclusion that Vette will only ever be interested in men.

I said "your men" because you were afraid of people allegedly demanding that male protagonists, whom I presumed that you played, be removed from video gaming or somesuch, which no one here said.

Precisely, no-one here hates straight culture or straight people or male protagonists in gaming, or is making a concerted effort to try to undermine and eradicate it or them; regarding LGBT culture, no-one can say there hasn't been some effort by even the smallest group of people in society to try to combat it as though it's a disease to be eradicated. And I'm not saying that anyone posting in this thread is anti-LGBT in feeling/sentiment, because there's no evidence to support such a contention.

No we don't.

What she said. Straight, male and white is not at all a problem, and if it seems like that's what I was saying, I apologise.

It's when being straight, regardless of gender, race, or any other characteristic, is treated as the norm when it is in fact merely more common, and having been declared the norm, having been taken to a whole new level of superiority by SOME people, who then blast any and all examples of LGBT culture present in any medium anywhere in an hailstorm of reactionary bile, and then some.

I shouldn't really have to repeat this, but I do not believe that the posters of late in this thread fit the anti-LGBT bill; so please, stop making it sound like I feel they're all wankers when I clearly don't.

...Risha, and as ranged DPS she's pretty useless for a smuggler).

If you've ever come across Sawbones, you might try it and find that Reesha has some more appeal; though 3.3 will see some changes for it, how positive or negative these will or will not be remains to be seen.

I'm sure some people would contend this, but the most viable player and companion role combinations, imho, are most usually(with player/companion notation): tank/dps, dps/tank, heal/dps, dps/heal, for the best balance combined with the most reasonably efficient. Heal/heal, tank/tank, tank/heal and heal/tank if you like the operatic representation of swtor combat. Dps/dps is no doubt the quickest road to either victory or defeat, but you really need to be the best-geared for your level that you can possibly be.

Basically, the Knight takes after Anakin and Luke Skywalker, secret marriages and the temptations of passion and all. The Consular explores why love sometimes leads to the dark side - and why it does not have to. You will notice in TOR that almost every senior Jedi, up to and including Grand Master Satele, is married, has at least one child, or both.

And this is the clincher, the Jedi's board of directors *ahem* Council, can do it, and have not all turned into raging dark jedi, so we can as well, quite safely, especially if all thoughts and impulses are appropriately compartmentalised.

Awesome, I'm looking forward to that part of the story, so I can explicitly uphold my vows by refusing to fall for this "romance" stuff

I remember basically telling Doc to get lost, Kira was so right when she called him a "walking hormone".

I also think, in a nod to the T in LGBT, it'd be great if characters were able to change their body gender, if not voice-over gender due to specific scripts(like flirt options) that exist and actions taken place.

E.g. Say you make a male character, get access to an appearance designer, and in that page would appear to be, alongside all the other options, an option to change the gender appearance to female and back again, their voice would remain the same. The same option, naturally, applying to female-initially characters can then be changed to male, and back again. Like all the other options, gender change would not have a limit imposed on the number of changes between male and female.

Just throwing that out there...

Quite frankly, I think both Talos Rellick & Malavai Quinn are gay.

I can't say why I think that, tho. I just do. There's nothing at all wrong with either of them being gay. Bioware, pull them out of the closet!

Basically, the Knight takes after Anakin and Luke Skywalker, secret marriages and the temptations of passion and all. The Consular explores why love sometimes leads to the dark side - and why it does not have to. You will notice in TOR that almost every senior Jedi, up to and including Grand Master Satele, is married, has at least one child, or both.

Wait. I thought Luke got rid of that rule and didn't hide his marriage at all.

Hey everyone. So I'm a new player/subscriber and I wanted to get the lay of the land. I'd been wanting to try out this game for a long time but I have a personal poilcy that I don't pay for games that include romance content but not same sex romance content. I've been checking on this thread every couple of months and have read that companion SGR will only likely happen with new companions. When I heard about the KOTFE expansion at E3 I decided to take the risk and start a subscription now so I can complete the main story before the expansion.

I realise there's currently no SGR with companions but from what I understand there is some content in ROTHC and SOR (which I also bought). So my question is, is any of it missable? I'm only a level 35 Jedi Knight right now but I don't want to get locked out of content because I'm not an Imperial or for some other reason. I'd be grateful if anyone would be willing to point out what actually is available now while keeping spoilers to a minimum? I understand there's something with Theron Shan who seems cool (and hot! haha)... but I don't want to watch youtube videos to find out too much.

PS: Forgive my user name. When I signed up, I worried that I should make a SW sounding name in case it was used in game and I might want someday to play on the RP server. I used a SW name generator and it is dumb, unpronounceable and I hate it. If anyone replies just call me Forj

Wait. I thought Luke got rid of that rule and didn't hide his marriage at all.

Correct. Luke never hid any of his relationships - and he wasn't the first of his New Order to marry and have kids, either. None of that forced celibacy/ban on romance was known at that point as it never came up in his training to kill Vader and the Emperor.

I realise there's currently no SGR with companions but from what I understand there is some content in ROTHC and SOR (which I also bought). So my question is, is any of it missable? I'm only a level 35 Jedi Knight right now but I don't want to get locked out of content because I'm not an Imperial or for some other reason. I'd be grateful if anyone would be willing to point out what actually is available now while keeping spoilers to a minimum? I understand there's something with Theron Shan who seems cool (and hot! haha)... but I don't want to watch youtube videos to find out too much.

Imperials have a gay male Sith lord on Makeb - he's part of the planet-quest and you literally cannot miss him.

Conversely, the Republic has a bisexual scientist/researcher in the same role (she, I imagine, is more relevant to you as a Knight).

There is also a female Czerka executive on CZ-198 who can be flirted into a one night stand by anyone, but I believe she is Imperial only.

In 3.0 content, two recurring characters who are not companions are (seemingly) herosexual. One male and one female.

Presumably there will also be SGR content in the upcoming expansion (especially considering one of the preceding two characters is confirmed to appear), but no official word or datamined confirmations yet.

Imperials have a gay male Sith lord on Makeb - he's part of the planet-quest and you literally cannot miss him.

 

Conversely, the Republic has a bisexual scientist/researcher in the same role (she, I imagine, is more relevant to you as a Knight).

 

There is also a female Czerka executive on CZ-198 who can be flirted into a one night stand by anyone, but I believe she is Imperial only.

 

In 3.0 content, two recurring characters who are not companions are (seemingly) herosexual. One male and one female.

 

Presumably there will also be SGR content in the upcoming expansion (especially considering one of the preceding two characters is confirmed to appear), but no official word or datamined confirmations yet.

Ah so as I'm playing as a male, I should've picked Imperial. I know that it's possible to play a light side Imperial but in all of my interactions so far with the Empire, everyone has seemed pretty evil. I'm not against playing dark side, just not for my first playthrough,

edit: While I have seen all the SW films, my knowledge of lore is extremely limited.

I want to say that not all Female companions are "young and pretty", seeing as such definitions are dependent on the observer. And I can tell you that a number of straight men wouldn't romance Vette or Ashara simply because they weren't human. And a number of them wouldn't romance Vette just because they thought she was annoying. I personally love Vette's personality and attitude, but we all have different tastes.

The Smuggler companion, Akaavi Spar, I wouldn't say is very 'pretty' by that definition. And she is someone who sounds like she could be in her 30's. And yet I absolutely enjoyed her, and she is one I believe could've been equally gay, straight or bi. Because she didn't her knickers all moist from whispered sweet nothings or boxes of candy or things like that. No, Akaavi made her choice based on how tough you are, if you had any kind of honor at all, and whether you not you respected her for the Mandalorian that she is, and not just because she's a woman. And I liked that. And she is rather butch and feels like she could crush you with one leg, but that's part of her charm.

Even Risha was 30'ish and she was very manipulative. She didn't fall for the sweet-talking crap. At least not at first. Not until the Smuggler showed he isn't just all talk. And that's what I get from these companions. Whether they're straight or not depends on their personality. And I do feel that every class should've had 2 female and 2 male companions that could be romanced between gay, straight, and/or bi so everyone has their option. But only 3 of those 8 classes has at least 2 Female companions and they're all straight. Though I do agree that Kaliyo seems like she should be bi.

Though on that, I get the feeling Kaliyo doesn't adhere to any kind of gender specification when it comes to this. She does what she does because she enjoys it. Who she does it with doesn't seem to matter so long as it makes her feel good. Whether male, female, or something we can't identify, for me it seemed like Kaliyo just wouldn't give two F**ks so long as she was made to feel like the top gal at the ball. And if you looked at anyone else she'd kick your teeth in.

Honestly I think it would've been fun to romance SCORPIO and see how that could all play out. Being artificial, Scorpio would be one who wouldn't care whether male or female as it'd allow her to continue learning about you fleshy creatures and maybe how to better eliminate you should the need arise.

I think there was a lot of potential that was missed, but I'm not going to get upset about it. With KotFE I feel like we're going to get a clean slate. We're being stuck in ice for 5yrs and there's no telling how our old companions may have changed in the meantime. Maybe Talos Drellik mans up, becomes a beefcake and teamed with Xalek to discover sith secrets. Maybe Khem-Val got all depressed and went on an eating binge and when you find him he looks like Fat Ba$tard. Maybe Guss Tuno finally grows a pair and...no that's not realistic. Guss will always be an annoying useless hanger-on.

But I think you see my point. I want to hold out the hope that things'll change, that we'll have the chance to really build the relationships we've wanted with our companions and even these new ones. I feel this will be Bioware's last chance to really deliver on this front, and we can only hope that they do so.

Even Risha was 30'ish and she was very manipulative. She didn't fall for the sweet-talking crap. At least not at first. Not until the Smuggler showed he isn't just all talk.

Risha's actually 20! She's just a hell of a lot more worldly than most considering who her father is, and what she had to endure because of him. Just goes to show that mostly age is just a number. We should just all be lucky she didn't turn out like Skadge.

But I think you see my point. I want to hold out the hope that things'll change, that we'll have the chance to really build the relationships we've wanted with our companions and even these new ones. I feel this will be Bioware's last chance to really deliver on this front, and we can only hope that they do so.

Indeed. Perhaps this is why they're wrecking everyone's **** lorewise with the expac. Gives them a convenient tabula rasa while still making narrative sense.

Ah so as I'm playing as a male, I should've picked Imperial. I know that it's possible to play a light side Imperial but in all of my interactions so far with the Empire, everyone has seemed pretty evil. I'm not against playing dark side, just not for my first playthrough,

 

edit: While I have seen all the SW films, my knowledge of lore is extremely limited.

Not at all. Makeb goes pretty fast and, sadly, interactions with the male Sith Lord you meet there seems to be limited to that planet. However, once you're past Makeb and into Forged Alliances, your M/M romance option becomes epic. Not that I'm biased or anything.

Not at all. Makeb goes pretty fast and, sadly, interactions with the male Sith Lord you meet there seems to be limited to that planet. However, once you're past Makeb and into Forged Alliances, your M/M romance option becomes epic. Not that I'm biased or anything.

Cytharat can't reappear in any significant way due to plot constraints: you can kill him on Makeb.

Ah so as I'm playing as a male, I should've picked Imperial. I know that it's possible to play a light side Imperial but in all of my interactions so far with the Empire, everyone has seemed pretty evil. I'm not against playing dark side, just not for my first playthrough,

 

edit: While I have seen all the SW films, my knowledge of lore is extremely limited.

You can totally be a LS sith (the story for this is actually really good imo), bounty hunter, or imperial agent. I do find that the romance with Theron Shan is better for a republic character, and the thing on Makeb is short. You're not missing much with Lord Cytharat.

That's like saying "adventurers make up less than 1% of the population, do they really need to be in the game?" What's in a game is what's fun, and more gay/bi (really, they're all bi except for Lord Cytharat)

Personally, I hope not all new NPCs or our old Companions are all bisexual. I prefer a good solid mix really. I want heterosexual, bisexual, completely gay or completely lesbian NPCs or Companions. Don't misunderstand me, I'm glad that both Lana and Theron seem to be bisexual (though as some say, they're probably more playersexual), but I don't want ALL SGRs to be bisexual. I liked that Cytharat was gay only. Sure it sucked they had him only on the imp side, but the point that he was completely into men and not women also was a nice change.

I'll still play the game if all we ever get from now on are bisexual or player sexual NPCs/Companions, but I DO prefer the mixture.

Edited numerous times cause I can't spell worth a toot.

Personally, I hope not all new NPCs or our old Companions are all bisexual. I prefer a good solid mix really. I want heterosexual, bisexual, completely gay or completely lesbian NPCs or Companions. Don't misunderstand me, I'm glad that both Lana and Theron seem to be bisexual (though as some say, they're probably more playersexual), but I don't want ALL SGRs to be bisexual. I liked that Cytharat was gay only. Sure it sucked they had him only on the imp side, but the point that he was completely into men and not women also was a nice change.

 

I'll still play the game if all we ever get from now on are bisexual or player sexual NPCs/Companions, but I DO prefer the mixture.

 

Edited numerous times cause I can't spell worth a toot.

I, too, like this kind of variety; thing is that if you want the most appeal for your game, hero-sexuality becomes the name of the game so that regardless of companion or player gender, the potential is there and the possibilities limitless.

I think the reply section has a Word-style spellchecker, though I know it can be easy to miss words if you type words that are spelled correctly but still underlined in red.

You can totally be a LS sith (the story for this is actually really good imo), bounty hunter, or imperial agent. I do find that the romance with Theron Shan is better for a republic character, and the thing on Makeb is short. You're not missing much with Lord Cytharat.

I would say the Light Side agent is the most amazing story in the game. My first agent was light and now I'm doing dark and while it's fun I really think the light side agent is truly amazing. I can't wait for Fallen Empire to see what happens with HER.