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PTS conquest changes are disasterous


ShinLunaAzure

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If they have upped the point % and 50k an alt is basically the same as 15k, WHY change it?

Why are they so bent on re-inventing the wheel so to speak?

 

This is going to tank the guild that the hubby & I have slowly built since spring.

It's already hard enough to get people to join & stay so you can grow to have members to actually do guild stuff. Most want either want to remain unguilded or already join an active established guild.

 

Conquest is mainly run & completed by the hubby & I. I take care of Pub and he takes care of imp. Once Pub is complete I'll hop to the other side & help bring it to low yield.

That's usually 5-7 toons for me alone conquest. Just doing conquest goals. (We do have a few members that help. Like 1-2 each side, but we can't rely on them as a lot seem to be focused on the stories/leveling. With one member, he conquests as he levels it seems so depends on what toon he's working on, what side he's helping.)

 

We also have RL so we can not spend 24/7 in game. As it is now, we only have 2 expansions unlocked on the Imp ship. None on the pub ship.

 

With the conquest mats already being tied into High Yield from what I read the other day, it seemed small/med guilds will be done for.

Seeing as now for small yield it will also be 500k for it. We are doomed. The only time we might make 500k on conquest is Dantooine. (And according to some above, they've changed that on PTS.) I also already plan my conquest. I alt around & get points to maximize toon capping.

 

This is ridiculous. *sighs*

 

It's honestly to the point should we try to even keep the guild going or just sell it & urge the few active players we have into larger guilds.

 

They increased the points for the official conquest objectives only.

The misc points that some people, including me, generally use to hit conquest goals instead of the official objectives are not getting the same increase.

 

So where it might take me doing CZ198 and 10 fast heroics to meet the goal, now it will take 30-40 heroics and cz198.

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I’m not thrilled about the changes, as I indicated above. But at least I can understand the reasoning behind the argument. I mean it is worth debating whether a guild of maybe 12 actual people ought to be able to legitimately hit a large yield planet. It’s worth debating whether an individual person ought to be able to meet personal conquest goal for 2, 5, 10 alts.

 

It’s not worth debating, for example, whether green premium crafted gear should require purple conquest and blue exotics. Thankfully the devs realized this before it went live.

 

So, like I said I’m not happy about the changes, and I think I know how it will (negatively) affect me and my guild. But I’m willing to acknowledge that it might be good in the long run for the game.

 

I was looking through the list of set bonus shells and where they drop. A large number come from Conquest. So, I’m guessing that the devs weren’t concerned about the smal guilds hitting large yields and many alts hitting personal goal when it was only about the soon-to-be obsolete CMTs. But now that it will be about highly desirable things (Revitalized Mystic set, for example), they are much keener on nerfing it.

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I’m not thrilled about the changes, as I indicated above. But at least I can understand the reasoning behind the argument. I mean it is worth debating whether a guild of maybe 12 actual people ought to be able to legitimately hit a large yield planet. It’s worth debating whether an individual person ought to be able to meet personal conquest goal for 2, 5, 10 alts.

 

It’s not worth debating, for example, whether green premium crafted gear should require purple conquest and blue exotics. Thankfully the devs realized this before it went live.

 

So, like I said I’m not happy about the changes, and I think I know how it will (negatively) affect me and my guild. But I’m willing to acknowledge that it might be good in the long run for the game.

 

I was looking through the list of set bonus shells and where they drop. A large number come from Conquest. So, I’m guessing that the devs weren’t concerned about the smal guilds hitting large yields and many alts hitting personal goal when it was only about the soon-to-be obsolete CMTs. But now that it will be about highly desirable things (Revitalized Mystic set, for example), they are much keener on nerfing it.

 

 

They took the purple / conquest mats out.

They didn't take the blue / iso mats out. Still going to need 20 of them for every green item you want to craft (according to what they wrote).

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I feel “play your way” was the biggest propaganda lie Ive seen in this game. That was never their intention. Right up their now with Ben Irving telling us RNG is exciting :mad:

 

I won’t be surprised if “play your way” becomes a swtor meme for “play the way we tell you too”.

A bit like the WoW classic meme that’s based on the head of Blizzard responding to players asking for classic 2 years ago, “You think you do, but you don’t”.

And WoW classic has gone not to be more successful than their last 2 expansions for live WoW,

 

I dont think that could have been said any better I was in a discussion about that with some guild members. How play your way is nothing but a joke. The hoops that people will have to jump through now for things is atrocious. Well said.

 

IDK, "Play Your Way" still seems fairly accurate in that you can wear whichever tac/amp/set bonus you want via horizontal gearing. It has nothing to do with acquisition.

 

It also has nothing to do with this thread.......

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IDK, "Play Your Way" still seems fairly accurate in that you can wear whichever tac/amp/set bonus you want via horizontal gearing. It has nothing to do with acquisition.

 

It also has nothing to do with this thread.......

 

I brought it up in the context of how an individual person pursues conquest on any number of toons. Play Your Way isn't just about gear acquisition, its a philosophy. When the Devs:

  1. increase the total for personal goal
  2. increase the totals for guild targets
  3. increase one-time-only "event-specific" objective values
  4. decrease repeatable objective point values

then the logical outcome is that as the week progresses, you will have less and less event-specific objectives available to your alts. This serves as a practical limit to the number of alts you can get through conquest. Its not a theoretical limit, because, in theory, you could craft 690 invasion forces per toon and get the personal goal. But what can happen "in theory" and in practice are two very different things.

 

Alt play, and alt involvement in conquest, is a means for an individual player to contribute their efforts to the success of the guild and still have those efforts benefit multiple toons. It is also the only way small guilds can often compete for medium/large planets or compete on the leaderboard. There can be no doubt this is a nerf to alt participation in conquest, whether or not you agree its good for the game long term.

 

By nerfing and otherwise dis-incentivizing alt participation in conquest, you are nerfing a form of the "Play Your Way" philosophy. Hence, its very on-topic.

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Oh Trixx, you are not going to let your SWTOR subs lapse, sheesh. Especially for WOW, ROFL! I was surprised reading that you actually do the conquest stuff, now. :p

 

After 5.0, I did conquest even less and cared that much less about it. The legacy restrictions for points gained was idiotic imo and it seems that part is still in place and will be with 6.0 too.

 

The only conquest I complete is purely accidental now, mostly via PVP.

 

I guess that's why I don't even bother worrying on what they change with conquest now. They obliterated it and any changes could only make it better from my perspective.

 

Only started doing conquest again after the changes made when Dantooine was introduced. Before that we didn’t bother.

 

My sub lapsing will depend highly on what they actually release in 6.0 and if they e listened to the feed back enough. I don’t want to have to play for 8 months till they make it acceptable.

Plus, I’ve prepaid, which I’ve never done before. My sub has always been on renew.

 

WoW classic is actually fun. We are taking our time and not speeding to end game. My wife and I have one of every class between lvl 20-26 :)

It will all come down to how pvp WZs feel in the next phase (they aren’t active yet)

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IDK, "Play Your Way" still seems fairly accurate in that you can wear whichever tac/amp/set bonus you want via horizontal gearing. It has nothing to do with acquisition.

 

It also has nothing to do with this thread.......

 

Play your way isn’t just about gearing. The context for me is play what you want and be able to have fun doing it. If conquest and crafting go live as they are (I know crafting has changes coming), then they will stop continuing to be fun for players who likes to focus on that.

 

RNG at the lvl added to 6.0 is also too much. People who want to gear for end game content will be forced to run flash points as these will be the most accessible for the masses to gear up faster. Pvpers will once again be the last to gear if all they want to play is pvp. Which means no pvper who wants to play ranked or even Regs, will gear up that slow. They will grind flash points to gear. Which isn’t play your way.

Edited by TrixxieTriss
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I thought the idea of "Play your way" was for the game to be more Legacy-friendly -- less vertical, more horizontal.

 

I'm not a fan of RNG gearing, but I don't think RNG has anything to do with "Play your way." It's never going away, unfortunately. EA will never let RNG go. I'm actually scared for DA4 because of this :(

Edited by Rion_Starkiller
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I thought the idea of "Play your way" was for the game to be more Legacy-friendly -- less vertical, more horizontal.

 

I'm not a fan of RNG gearing, but I don't think RNG has anything to do with "Play your way." It's never going away, unfortunately. EA will never let RNG go. I'm actually scared for DA4 because of this :(

 

Why do you keep saying EA dictates what BW does from a game design point, I am curious. I mean does it really matter, not really but if you got this idea from a reliable source I'd like to see it because nothing indicates from my perspective that EA has forced BW to do anything.

 

I mean it's a moot point tbh, but I just hate assuming something without real facts to base the assumptions on. I do agree with you that the RNG will not go away, however I think it's more of a modern game design change than it is some EA agenda to make all games across the world have RNG-based gearing/loot systems.

 

Players can either adapt to SWTOR's new loot system or not. It appears most of us are adapting "a wait and see" approach to 6.0, seeing we are all MMO gaming addicts and the thought of leaving is far worse than suffering through an ill-conceived gearing system that is heavily RNG-based that isn't fun or exciting. It takes a lot for addicts like us to actually reach a threshold of misery and unhappiness when it comes to bad game designs.

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Part 1:

I thought I explained it in another thread somewhere on the forums where I said you can look at every game EA has released in the past few years and you will see RNG loot boxes. Now whether this is more of an industry trend, or an EA imperative, I do not know. But I do know that holding companies/publishers like EA have far more say in BW's day to day than you think. After all, the BW Austin studio, is actually a multi-EA studio "campus." https://www.ea.com/news/tour-the-ea-austin-studio

 

Part 2:

I played Star Wars Galaxy of Heroes (SWGOH) mobile game for a couple of years. The loot systems are eerily similar, right down to the Green-Blue-Purple-Gold colored loot. Now let's take this Kai Zykken vendor. He sells a random bunch of items that change weekly. SWGOH has this EXACT SAME type of vendor. Exactly the same, but with a different name. BioWare did not make SWGOH. The only things in common they share are 1. Star Wars, and 2. EA.

 

So it's possible RNG Loot Boxes are a Star Wars thing (see SW Battlefront, SWGOH, SWTOR), and not particularly an EA thing.

Edited by Rion_Starkiller
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Part 1:

I thought I explained it in another thread somewhere on the forums where I said you can look at every game EA has released in the past few years and you will see RNG loot boxes. Now whether this is more of an industry trend, or an EA imperative, I do not know. But I do know that holding companies/publishers like EA have far more say in BW's day to day than you think. After all, the BW Austin studio, is actually a multi-EA studio "campus." https://www.ea.com/news/tour-the-ea-austin-studio

 

Part 2:

I played Star Wars Galaxy of Heroes (SWGOH) mobile game for a couple of years. The loot systems are eerily similar, right down to the Green-Blue-Purple-Gold colored loot. Now let's take this Kai Zykken vendor. He sells a random bunch of items that change weekly. SWGOH has this EXACT SAME type of vendor. Exactly the same, but with a different name. BioWare did not make SWGOH. The only things in common they share are 1. Star Wars, and 2. EA.

 

So it's possible RNG Loot Boxes are a Star Wars thing (see SW Battlefront, SWGOH, SWTOR), and not particularly an EA thing.

I believe it more a industry trend look at how many publishers/studios operate with the same loot model that is being introduced in 6.0 I wish they would get off this massive RGN kick and go back to a method of small percentage of RNG with dedicated drops or tokens based model that would let us better chose what items we wanted.

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I believe it more a industry trend look at how many publishers/studios operate with the same loot model that is being introduced in 6.0 I wish they would get off this massive RGN kick and go back to a method of small percentage of RNG with dedicated drops or tokens based model that would let us better chose what items we wanted.

 

Yeah, I lean this way too.

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Aaaand musco sprung it on us that for this week we have to hit the NEW GOALS with the OLD points values. And our cxp bonus perk is going to give a quarter of the benefit it did pre-6.0

 

For context.

 

Hey all!

 

Some good reminders in here already so I thought I would tack on a few reminders as well. Most of these are known already but good to get them in one place ahead of Onslaught's launch next week.

 

  • Galactic Command Rank is resetting to 0 for all characters.
  • The Achievements for earning Command Rank 300 on Classes will become Feats of Strength with Onslaught's launch.
  • Numerous currencies are being converted to credits at a low rate. Command Point Consumables, Alliance Recon Data, Command Tokens, Command Gear Pieces, and Unassembled Components.
  • All utilities will be reset on launch day so be sure to spend your points when you login.
  • All set bonuses are now on item shells instead of armorings, this change is retroactive.
  • Conquest Guild Targets for this week's Conquest will be judged against the NEW values, not the existing ones. You will also receive NEW Guild rewards for completing them. This has no effect on Personal Conquests.
  • No reason to stockpile Command Crates either as they will not convert into Renown crates and Command Tokens will become credits.
  • All Legacy Perks for GC will now affect Renown. The Commanding Legacy Perk has been adjusted, it no longer stacks but is a 25% increase for Renown gain across the Legacy.

 

Thanks all!

 

-eric

 

This post just freed up hours of my time since I can now completely ignore conquest for the week.

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Smaller guilds are really really worried. First a lot of players are not at 150% conquest bonus. Opening all the strongholds costs a lot of credits. For them 15k is hard especially as a casual player. I wonder how many guilds are just barely making 175k.

 

A full guild ship expansion cost about 2.5B on the gtn is that going to be 5B. If small guilds have trouble making conquest the plan costs will double to 2M and frames to 100M on the gtn. Larger guilds are already farming for credits and conquest points. Make DvL bosses drop encryptions? Make encryptions craftable again?

 

Vender mats are already cheap check the gtn prices for value players are willing to pay.

 

Need perks for small and less active guilds. Perks are geared to very active and large guilds. Makes me wonder how many perks slots are unused by smaller guilds.

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lol, all these people saying the new small, med, large are all easily to obtain, perhaps the ones with the large conquest driven guilds will be, my guild does medium yield and has done 1.8 million in points once we mostly get between 600k and 800k a week and we will have to change from medium yield to small. 50k for personal, lol to get the points for the medium yield right now, many of our guild does multiple alts, but now, we may have to cut the number of alts we do a week, to perhaps 2 or 3. I have gotten 10 to 12 alts at times to help my guild reach goal, but now 3 might be my new max.

 

People have always said this was easy and that as easy, someone once said you could go from lvl 1 to 50 in about 8 to 10 hours, another said you can make 20 - 40 mil a night on the gtn by crafting, it perhaps can be done, but not by me.

 

 

And now they saying that 50k is easy to get for a alt, I sometimes do heroics so I can get the rampage points, plus points for the heroic, but with galactic rampage gone it will be harder to get and I do minor pvp, but not much, I mostly get my points by doing rampages and heroics, as well as getting a wb or 2.

 

 

if the raising of points is supposed to stop the larger conquest guilds as someone said in this forum, it will not I have seen large guilds with 12 to 20 mil conquest points in large yield, and it seems that unless you have a guild of active conquest alts, don't worry about getting the new armor and such, because it might be beyond your reach

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So do I get this right, You get the new 6.0 guild reward if you now hit the 6.0 personal conquest, which was 50000 I think, and your guild hast to reach it (what was the target for the big reward?), too?

 

the conquest points would have to be raised for me to get anywhere like 50k personal, in one night when I am on for about 3 to 4 hours, if not it will take me days to do so.

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Hey all!

 

Some good reminders in here already so I thought I would tack on a few reminders as well. Most of these are known already but good to get them in one place ahead of Onslaught's launch next week.

 

  • Galactic Command Rank is resetting to 0 for all characters.
 
This was expected as you want everyone to be one the same level.
 
The Achievements for earning Command Rank 300 on Classes will become Feats of Strength with Onslaught's launch.
 
This was also expected.
 
Numerous currencies are being converted to credits at a low rate. Command Point Consumables, Alliance Recon Data, Command Tokens, Command Gear Pieces, and Unassembled Components.(from second post) Masterwork and Monumental Crystals will both be going away / converted to credits. The intention is that those vendors on Ossus will change to selling their items for credits. There is a known issue at launch where they are still requiring the currency which we will fix in our next patch.
 
"converted to credits at a low rate" Now this is normal BW cheap Expected, surprised for you to admit it. What do you mean known issue at launch if the new expac has not even launched yet? You know you are launching a broken 6.0?
 
All utilities will be reset on launch day so be sure to spend your points when you login.
 
Expected as the way the utilities were set up changes. Nothing new here.
 
All set bonuses are now on item shells instead of armorings, this change is retroactive.
 
Really wondering on this as I have a 216 set that when I was on the pts did not convert over properly to show that there was a set bonus originally on the gear. I am sure some still use level fifty skins that had the set bonuses as well. Really a disappointment if this does not work right. Bad enough I lose my set bonus that I have had for years to then lose it on the set I first earned it on.
 
Conquest Guild Targets for this week's Conquest will be judged against the NEW values, not the existing ones. You will also receive NEW Guild rewards for completing them. This has no effect on Personal Conquests. (from second post) My understanding is that you become eligible for the Guild Reward when you complete your personal reward, meaning that would track against you completing your 15K number.
 
So no one in a guild that does not get the new guild target level will get a conquest guild reward and then if they do the toon most likely will have to have had the 50k points as well. So this is is going to upset everyone even before they can even do the first quest. Yup I want my rewards I don't care if it is the old type reward or the new. What do you mean by "track against you?"

No reason to stockpile Command Crates either as they will not convert into Renown crates and Command Tokens will become credits.
 
This is expected. Spend you command token on anything you can as they will give you pennies for what you have.
 
All Legacy Perks for GC will now affect Renown. The Commanding Legacy Perk has been adjusted, it no longer stacks but is a 25% increase for Renown gain across the Legacy.
 
I earned the 100% but then again it is so much like you to steal what does not really affect you at all. You think I care whether I get anything in this new expac? You just make it harder and harder to do things going form 5000 to 160000 to gain a crate and then take away the bonuses we worked for to get things faster. We did the work you need to leave the perk alone. Stop stealing when it does not affect the game and only gains you negativity. I expected that you would be cheap on converting all the current in game currencies, but frankly my dear you sure know how to show your Bogart.

 

Thanks all!

 

-eric

 

I really hope your cust service team is ready for the storm of complaints that it is about to receive on top of all the other complaints as they witness what you did to the game. There is going to be shock on top of shock. I have had my shock since I was on PTS, but how many people really tested out the PTS? 1 percent?

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Aaaand musco sprung it on us that for this week we have to hit the NEW GOALS with the OLD points values. And our cxp bonus perk is going to give a quarter of the benefit it did pre-6.0

 

We knew ahead of time the CXP bonus would only be 25% from the perk. They told us that awhile back in one of the streams. But yeah they should have announced the conq thing for this week before we picked the planets on tuesday. That should have been announced on Monday at the latest.

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