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Why im bummed about 2.0.


gabarooni

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I was really hoping that as future expansions for Swtor came out and it started to stand on it's own two feet it would start to move more and more away from the EQ/WoW style of gameplay. But everything ive seen is the same old gain a few levels and then grind gear till next year. There are no new types of gameplay or progression, no new things to do at endgame, no new types of world interaction or exploration. It's just the same old hamster wheel gear grind that appeases the raiders and the latest gen of MMO players that grew up with WoW (And maybe not even them anymore if you look at the amount of ppl looking or a return to Sandbox style MMO's)

 

It's a shame really with such games like The elder scrolls online, EQ Next, Camolot Unchained , The secret world etc etc etc all with new systems, new ways to play, end game progression not just for raiders and pvpers but for everyone, and real inovation that Swtor continues to play it "safe" and just add the same old hum drum content.

 

There not making their "Galaxy" bigger they are just putting in new pixels.

 

Oh well I know this is just the first round of PTS patch notes and there could be more stuff on the way but to Quote a certain scruffy nerf hearder im gonna say "I got a bad feeling about this".

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There are no new types of gameplay or progression, no new things to do at endgame, no new types of world interaction or exploration.

 

There is a whole new planet to explore. A new operation and there will probably be 1-2 new flashpoints when Makeb's released. There's a rep system, there will be an achievement system etc.

What exactly would you expect from a game that's set up like Wow? How could it become something entirely different without alienating its base?

 

It's just the same old hamster wheel gear grind that appeases the raiders and the latest gen of MMO players that grew up with WoW (And maybe not even them anymore if you look at the amount of ppl looking or a return to Sandbox style MMO's)

 

Well you have to remember that this is business, not "art for the sake of art".

As long as people (seem to) prefer theme park MMOs, that's what we'll most likely get until times change and people want something different.

 

It's a shame really with such games like The elder scrolls online, EQ Next, Camolot Unchained , The secret world etc etc etc all with new systems, new ways to play, end game progression not just for raiders and pvpers but for everyone, and real inovation that Swtor continues to play it "safe" and just add the same old hum drum content.

 

And how did that work out for The Secret World?

Or SWG for that matter?

Don't get me wrong, it has some great ideas (especially the modern day setting and the lack of classes) but if we're being honest here, TSW was a huge failure. If people call SWTOR "Tortanic" there is no word to describe accurately how bad TSW did.

Sure they might be doing better now with the B2P model, but one thing's for sure: it will never be a hit. And like it or not, that's what companies want - hits. Not a game that's visually stunning and/or bug-free. They don't care about those things. They could have the best game ever made in their hands and if it's not making enough money, it's a failure. Also, TSW had the luxury of being a relatively unknown game with its own lore that they can make up on the go. People had such huge expectations of SWTOR that they had no choice but to play it safe.

 

Oh well I know this is just the first round of PTS patch notes and there could be more stuff on the way but to Quote a certain scruffy nerf hearder im gonna say "I got a bad feeling about this".

 

Maybe. Maybe not.

But the truth is that SWTOR is what it is. It's not SWG or ESO (which I can guarantee you people will LOVE until it comes out and start bashing it), it's a different game with its own ways. And it already went through a huge change (P2P->F2P) that there is no chance it could survive a second massive overhaul of its basic mechanics.

Edited by TheNahash
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Explain to me how its not an expansion?

 

-You pay for it.

-Level increase.

-New gear.

-New talents.

-New zones.

 

Isn't that what a expansion is?

 

 

2.0 is free to all players. You don't have to pay for it, and you can level to 55, get new skills and new talent trees. Everything that is on the PTS will be free for everyone, not the expansion.

 

ROTHC is the expansion and requires you to pay for it.

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2.0 is free to all players. You don't have to pay for it, and you can level to 55, get new skills and new talent trees. Everything that is on the PTS will be free for everyone, not the expansion.

 

ROTHC is the expansion and requires you to pay for it.

 

If that is the case, then i am extremely confused at the moment..

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If that is the case, then i am extremely confused at the moment..

 

The expansion contains access to Makeb, new pvp warzones, new FP, new gear, etc. You want to run those, you need to pay for it. If you just want to level to 55, you don't need to buy the expansion.

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The expansion contains access to Makeb, new pvp warzones, new FP, new gear, etc. You want to run those, you need to pay for it. If you just want to level to 55, you don't need to buy the expansion.

 

Then why does the Rise of the Hutt Cartel page say the new levels are are a part of the expansion? If they changed the plan, I missed the post(s). (Not being snarky, just really curious as to why the sudden change.)

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I'm pretty much on the same line as the OP. I have just reached optimized WH/EWH and busted my a** of grinding, RE:ing and raiding for optimized 63 gear for pve. After 2.0 it's all gonna become useless, all the endgame content will become just random low level stuff and were gonna be left with few new flashpoints, 1 new operation and a bunch of new geargrind wich is pointless cos once I obtain all the new gear their just gonna add new gear. This game is less than 1.5 years old and I cant even remember how many different sets of gear were allready grinded and how many sets I have sold to junkvendors after theyve become useless.

 

I just dont have the energy to do it all once again, specially when I will have no time left to enjoy of my achiements before a new set is introduced.

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I guess I'm just desensitized to the phenomenon of gear obsolescence when expansions come out, after dealing with that 3 separate times in WoW, after having the top tier gear for each expansion, and having to start over.

 

I don't mind it actually... and it is by design.. keeps people playing and paying.

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2.0 is free to all players. You don't have to pay for it, and you can level to 55, get new skills and new talent trees. Everything that is on the PTS will be free for everyone, not the expansion.

 

ROTHC is the expansion and requires you to pay for it.

 

Actually, if you had bothered to download and play the PTS, you would have seen that what's on the PTS *is* ROTHC. It just doesn't have Makeb or the other closed-beta content included.

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It's a shame really with such games like The elder scrolls online, EQ Next, Camolot Unchained , The secret world etc etc etc all with new systems, new ways to play, end game progression not just for raiders and pvpers but for everyone, and real inovation that Swtor continues to play it "safe" and just add the same old hum drum content.

 

There is nothing "new" about those games. Upon careful analysis those game are just "repackaging" a "gear grind" or more importantly "stat grind". SWTOR is already a WoW clone. You expected something different? Everything they implement is a WoW knock off in some shape, way or form. But, pretty much everyone else is doing the same thing.

 

I don't have the answers. But, it seems like those in the game industry that make games don't either. We will have to "wait for the chosen one" to be hired by some company. May this be you dear reader? :p

Edited by Urael
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I'm pretty much on the same line as the OP. I have just reached optimized WH/EWH and busted my a** of grinding, RE:ing and raiding for optimized 63 gear for pve. After 2.0 it's all gonna become useless, all the endgame content will become just random low level stuff and were gonna be left with few new flashpoints, 1 new operation and a bunch of new geargrind wich is pointless cos once I obtain all the new gear their just gonna add new gear. This game is less than 1.5 years old and I cant even remember how many different sets of gear were allready grinded and how many sets I have sold to junkvendors after theyve become useless.

 

I just dont have the energy to do it all once again, specially when I will have no time left to enjoy of my achiements before a new set is introduced.

 

Welcome to mainstream MMOs

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Actually, if you had bothered to download and play the PTS, you would have seen that what's on the PTS *is* ROTHC. It just doesn't have Makeb or the other closed-beta content included.

 

Game Update 2.0 is now live on our Public Test Server! Game Update 2.0 features major class changes such as new abilities, updated skill trees, a new Operation (Scum and Villainy), and more! For those of you that have already copied high level characters on our Public Test Server, we encourage you to check out all of these changes and the other new features listed in the Game Update 2.0 PTS Patch Notes. Log on, check everything out, and give us your feedback by posting on the Public Test Server forum.

 

Game Update 2.0 will be available for all players when it is released (Free-to-Play restrictions will still apply).

 

The Rise of the Hutt Cartel digital expansion (which contains the planet-based story content and more) will have a separate, closed beta process which will not appear on the Public Test Server. We are also happy to announce that you will be able to transfer your character to PTS using the new PTS Character Copy Tool (instructions can be found below).

 

Additionally, players will have the option to advance characters immediately to level 55 from the Republic and Imperial Fleets (detailed instructions below).

 

Game Update 2.0 contains a host of new features including:

 

New gear available only to level 55 characters.

A new Operation: Scum and Villainy.

New abilities and skill trees for all 16 Advanced Classes.

New level 55 Hard Mode Flashpoints: Hammer Station, Athiss, Mandalorian Raiders, and Cademimu.

New Nightmare Mode Operation: Terror from Beyond.

Legacy Achievements – Complete challenges to earn unique titles and vanity rewards across your Legacy.

 

The new Operation and Hard Mode Flashpoints in Game Update 2.0 are Level 55 Elder Game Content. The level cap increase to 55 is included with the purchase of the Digital Expansion, Rise of the Hutt Cartel.

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Actually, if you had bothered to download and play the PTS, you would have seen that what's on the PTS *is* ROTHC. It just doesn't have Makeb or the other closed-beta content included.

 

Oh I have played the PTS, and I am aware that many of the things in it were stated as coming in ROTHC. I am positive I saw a dev post (which I can;t find anymore) that stated the 2.0 patch would be free to all players, and was not the expansion, which was going to be internal testing only and not be on the PTS.

 

I could be wrong however.

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There is nothing "new" about those games. Upon careful analysis those game are just "repackaging" a "gear grind" or more importantly "stat grind". SWTOR is already a WoW clone. You expected something different? Everything they implement is a WoW knock off in some shape, way or form. But, pretty much everyone else is doing the same thing.

 

I don't have the answers. But, it seems like those in the game industry that make games don't either. We will have to "wait for the chosen one" to be hired by some company. May this be you dear reader? :p

 

This may not exist on a large scale project. Venture capital is tight now. WoW is like it is because market research showed it would generate an acceptable rate of return. Any new product will have to show it can as well. Capital providers are risk adverse now. (More than usual) I suspect most new games will be build around multiple revenue streams. This means "new" will probably not be that new.

 

I think i read you cancelled your sub. If your not having fun i get that. However i always like reading your take whether i agree or not. I really hope you stick around but best of luck gaming in the future.

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Game Update 2.0 is now live on our Public Test Server! Game Update 2.0 features major class changes such as new abilities, updated skill trees, a new Operation (Scum and Villainy), and more! For those of you that have already copied high level characters on our Public Test Server, we encourage you to check out all of these changes and the other new features listed in the Game Update 2.0 PTS Patch Notes. Log on, check everything out, and give us your feedback by posting on the Public Test Server forum.

 

Game Update 2.0 will be available for all players when it is released (Free-to-Play restrictions will still apply).

 

The Rise of the Hutt Cartel digital expansion (which contains the planet-based story content and more) will have a separate, closed beta process which will not appear on the Public Test Server. We are also happy to announce that you will be able to transfer your character to PTS using the new PTS Character Copy Tool (instructions can be found below).

 

Additionally, players will have the option to advance characters immediately to level 55 from the Republic and Imperial Fleets (detailed instructions below).

 

Game Update 2.0 contains a host of new features including:

 

New gear available only to level 55 characters.

A new Operation: Scum and Villainy.

New abilities and skill trees for all 16 Advanced Classes.

New level 55 Hard Mode Flashpoints: Hammer Station, Athiss, Mandalorian Raiders, and Cademimu.

New Nightmare Mode Operation: Terror from Beyond.

Legacy Achievements – Complete challenges to earn unique titles and vanity rewards across your Legacy.

 

The new Operation and Hard Mode Flashpoints in Game Update 2.0 are Level 55 Elder Game Content. The level cap increase to 55 is included with the purchase of the Digital Expansion, Rise of the Hutt Cartel.

 

Aha thank you.. that is the post I was looking for.. however the level to 55 is only part of the xpac, so I am wrong on that regard, but you do get the new trees and everything else, just cannot level to 55 without the xpac.

Edited by jgoldsack
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Everyone gets 2.0, Makeb is the Expansion, Makeb is not in 2.0

 

lvl 55 increase, new hardmodes and operation is part of Makeb though. what people who didn't buy it get, is the new talents, achievement system etc. changes that affect entire game.

 

P.S. people keep claiming copied WoW etc. but those mechanics existed long before WoW. just saying.

Edited by Jeweledleah
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Everyone gets 2.0, Makeb is the Expansion, Makeb is not in 2.0

Makeb isn't on the test server YET.

 

What makes you think it's not going to be in 2.0 when released?

 

Basic Commendations (used to by Arkanian gear) are obtained by doing 51-55 quests on Makeb.

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Makeb isn't on the test server YET.

 

What makes you think it's not going to be in 2.0 when released?

 

Basic Commendations (used to by Arkanian gear) are obtained by doing 51-55 quests on Makeb.

 

Makeb will NOT be on the PTS... at least it will not be on the PTS to where anyone can access it if it is.

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This may not exist on a large scale project. Venture capital is tight now. WoW is like it is because market research showed it would generate an acceptable rate of return. Any new product will have to show it can as well. Capital providers are risk adverse now. (More than usual) I suspect most new games will be build around multiple revenue streams. This means "new" will probably not be that new.

 

Indeed. And this is why I don't understand why people are so upset. The "new new" is really the "old new" but repackaged. They only thing "new" that SWTOR did was successfully merge the bioware brand RPG with the MMORPG game. It did not implement a successful AAA MMORPG that is "new and innovative" as it was "hyped". Best part of SWTOR is the "RPG" Story part. They are giving this away for free ( go figure ), instead of capitalizing on their strength. They are also for all intents and purposes "abandoning" the Story (again the most successful part of the game) to a watered down "generic planet story" for all. With out the draw of individual "class stories", SWTOR is "just another MMORGP" er ... with lightsabres. It really surprises me how there are those that can't see this. They need to manage their expectations.

 

I think i read you cancelled your sub. If your not having fun i get that. However i always like reading your take whether i agree or not. I really hope you stick around but best of luck gaming in the future.

 

Indeed. I have a few paid days left. I am weening myself slowly off of the forums. Commenting less and less (I am sure to my detractors joy), and not going "cold turkey". I am kinda on "the patch" so to speak. ;) The SWTOR Forums were the only part of SWTOR that I really enjoyed. Well that and the class stories. My favorite part of the forums has been meeting the people who are passionate about their views concerning SWTOR whether I agree with them or not. I enjoyed the "well constructed" debates many have shared in with me. I will admit I will miss that part. I have an open inventation to exchange emails via PM to you or anyone who wished to continue to correspond.

 

Peace and Safe Travels,

Urael :cool:

Edited by Urael
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I'm having fun with the game and I'll be playing ROTHC but the lack of class stories in this 'xpack' is a glaring hole.

This game has always been a WoW derivative which is neither a good or bad thing, it just is what it is. However SWTOR starting to feel less immersive, less like SWTOR in a way.

 

I just hope Bioware continues to do well enough that they can make a 'proper' xpack in the future that continues the class/companion stories with at least the same quality as 1-50.

Edited by Projawa
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There is nothing "new" about those games. Upon careful analysis those game are just "repackaging" a "gear grind" or more importantly "stat grind". SWTOR is already a WoW clone. You expected something different? Everything they implement is a WoW knock off in some shape, way or form. But, pretty much everyone else is doing the same thing.

 

I don't have the answers. But, it seems like those in the game industry that make games don't either. We will have to "wait for the chosen one" to be hired by some company. May this be you dear reader? :p

 

If you think there is nothing new about games like The elder scrolls online then you have done Zero reserch my friend. And im not just talking about the pre release hype im an old school MMO player from the UO area and its safe to say that all that was OLD is becoming New again not this boring wow/eq crap gamestyle where the game does everything for you but push the buttons on your keyboard.

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