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KotFE for non force users.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
KotFE for non force users.

ZanyaCross's Avatar


ZanyaCross
09.21.2016 , 01:52 AM | #11
Honestly I think the story is actually way better with a non-force user. having a part of Valkorion in the strongest Jedi in the last century, you don't really get a sense of the issue. But being a regulat blue-collar smuggler or bounty hunter, and suddenly getting "touched by the Vorlons" as it were, seems to cause a much greater change to the non-force-sensitive, as well as the potential for the fish-out-of-water situation, than the ones who are already steeped in that world and its mysticism.

Rolodome's Avatar


Rolodome
09.21.2016 , 01:55 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by JLazarillo View Post
KotFE makes more sense on non-Force users, if you ask me.

If you really look at the Outlander's role (and heck, the role Lana got him/her to fill), it's always been about the Outlander's ability to lead the Alliance. Having a canon hero who can leave the Force stuff to the Force-users, or who has to fall back on Valkorian (or at least be tempted by it) when it does become absolutely necessary actually fits the story. If the hero could have just easily said "screw it, I'll move the rocks myself" when Lana's in danger, makes the railroading of the story feel pointless.

Sort of related to the previous point, I've seen a lot of people say that, for example, a Knight fits the "you alone are worth my time" line from Valky, but honestly, that seems backwards to me. The Knight was basically raised from birth to be a sword that Jedi could stick into the Emperor and make him die. So someone like that fighting and defeating an avatar of the Emperor? I think a guy who can decimate planets would honestly find that pretty...banal, especially since the Knight failed, and twice at that! Same thing for all those others who start off naturally gifted or otherwise. On the other hand, just a "regular person" who accomplishes, say, everything the Smuggler accomplishes...that actually seems like the sort of thing that would get a cosmic monstrosity interested: pure amusement value. Nobody is a threat to Valky, so it seems like the best choice for the story is someone who would be interesting for a different reason.

A lot of people like to cite "power" as a counterpoint to that last one, but really, "power" has never been about using the Force or not in this game. All 4 non-Force class stories give the hero the chance to trounce Jedi/Sith at at least one point, if not several (Agent requires making certain choices, but it still has it), and the planetary stories never make a big deal out of it either way (and feature plenty of non-Force enemies who are considered just as dangerous/tough in both story and gameplay terms as their Force using peers). And even those who can use it still apparently need a magic weapon to handle Arcann. So "power" has never been a factor.
I can see the reasoning of this. I did smuggler first and didn't really feel out of place.
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FixerFortyKay's Avatar


FixerFortyKay
09.21.2016 , 04:16 AM | #13
There's nothing too unforgivable about the story for the most part. Chapter 12 is weird for a non force user but at least useful in letting you know some more of the motivations of the enemy.

There's one major issue with non force users and that is the sudden expectation that you're going to fight Arcann in a 1v1 duel. If my Agent or Smuggler had to kill Arcann he'd fill his toilet up with detonite and explode him next time he needed to go to the can.

If pressed for a description of the noble duel in how they bested the Emperor in a match of wits and skill, they would lie.


Bigger problem is the whole "Failure for anyone not following the Jedi code" has been running.
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Slecnaztemnot's Avatar


Slecnaztemnot
09.22.2016 , 05:34 AM | #14
What I find interesting that things like chapter 12 and fight(s) with Arcann are more geared towards force-users, yet the companion who appear in the main storyline are mainly non-force users companions.
Agents has Kalyio and Scorpio, BH has Gault and Torian, Trooper Aric Jorgan... Sure, there is T-07 and Vette, but they play more minor role in story, it seems. And Consular and Inquisitor have only Alliance alerts so far. Although true, Smuggler also has only Alliance alerts.

But especially the storyline with Scorpio feels better when playing as Agent, because you have that background, you know more about her than others, how she came to be.

SithKoriandr's Avatar


SithKoriandr
09.27.2016 , 05:00 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Slecnaztemnot View Post
What I find interesting that things like chapter 12 and fight(s) with Arcann are more geared towards force-users, yet the companion who appear in the main storyline are mainly non-force users companions.
Agents has Kalyio and Scorpio, BH has Gault and Torian, Trooper Aric Jorgan... Sure, there is T-07 and Vette, but they play more minor role in story, it seems. And Consular and Inquisitor have only Alliance alerts so far. Although true, Smuggler also has only Alliance alerts.

But especially the storyline with Scorpio feels better when playing as Agent, because you have that background, you know more about her than others, how she came to be.
While I'm one of those who thinks the non-force users don't feel to be the right choice for being the outlander, I do agree on your point of the Agent.

I even said as much to my guild, however, a lot of that can be said for any of the companions that show up in the main story. Scorpio being more prevalent makes Agent more so.

However, that I would think, would change in later chapters.
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Cythereal's Avatar


Cythereal
09.27.2016 , 05:12 PM | #16
On the one hand, I agree that the story is blatantly written with a Force user in mind.

On the other hand, I consider this a serious flaw of KOTFE's mediocre storytelling. Less Force nonsense in the future, please.

Yermog's Avatar


Yermog
09.27.2016 , 08:01 PM | #17
Have any of you guys saying only a JK makes sense played as a SW? That is by far the most interesting class to play as in my mind, because you were once literally the right hand of the Emperor, THEN turned on the Emperor (out of necessity, naturally) and THEN got possessed by him!

Some of the most compelling lines I have heard were from Valkorian to the SW, such as one of the first lines which was something like "You were always so much more to me than a mere servant. You have always been so much more", which, to someone who really loved the role of being the Emperor's enforcer, was fantastic.

I personally believe that playing as a Sith Warrior in KOTFE, especially one who was more neutral than LS or DS, is one of the best classes to play.

But honestly, play all the classes. It's just fun. There are moments where it makes more sense for a force-user, but then there are moments that it makes more sense for a non-force user. Either way, its fun to go through and experience.

SithKoriandr's Avatar


SithKoriandr
09.28.2016 , 04:57 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Cythereal View Post
On the one hand, I agree that the story is blatantly written with a Force user in mind.

On the other hand, I consider this a serious flaw of KOTFE's mediocre storytelling. Less Force nonsense in the future, please.
Or they could write the story for force users AND non-force users in mind.

Right now, we have 1 story and it's all the same, no matter the class. So, instead, make it two stories and have it be force and non-force based. We'd at least have a slight variation in stories, so a bit more like 2 stories instead of 1.
"It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more...than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so *********** what." - Stephen Fry

Azimeir's Avatar


Azimeir
09.29.2016 , 07:07 AM | #19
In lieu of eight separate stories, please cull the force-users from the non-force-using. Hell, you could even have a conversation option at the very beginning where your character's answer channels it down one way or the other (if you've RP'd your trooper/smuggler/agent/hunter as force-sensitive, for instance, or wish to play your force-user in a more meat and potatoes story).

I played through the new story with my Jedi Guardian and it was really good. I even still don't really know if this gray-side force-user nonsense is Bioware re-writing the way the force works or the way that corrupted peeps are trying to corrupt my Jedi. She assumes the latter.

However, now I'm playing through with my Bounty Hunter and the entire story is nonsensical gibberish to her (and for the record, the Bounty Hunter story was my favorite of the original 8). It's not that I can't see a way that she might be a part of some greater cause (not likely, but I can play ball), it's just she rolls her eyes at the whole force thing, so having a force ghost in her head ala the Inquisitor is just wrong in every way. And putting her in charge of everything makes about as much sense as putting Kalliyo in charge. As my Bounty Hunter, I'm making choices to move the story forward because I have to, but it's a purely character-breaking experience of cheese-gathering and nothing more.

My Gunslinger is going to be in the same boat, which sucks because the Smuggler's story was kind of crap too.
Yeah? Well... that's just like... my opinion, man.

Cythereal's Avatar


Cythereal
09.29.2016 , 03:01 PM | #20
I absolutely could see the non-Force classes taking leadership of the alliance, just... not in the way KOTFE presents it with all this destiny and "The Force has a will but it needs a commander" and Valkorion nonsense.

But KOTFE is a ridiculously shallow story and the PC is just a supporting character to the actual main characters anyway.