Can somebody enlighten me as to what causes a lightning bubble to appear on stormcaller between the start of 'defensive systems activate' and the actual shield popping/folks getting blown off the tank?

With our ops group, this happens semi-randomly -- sometimes never, sometimes 2-3 times during an op (causes a wipe occasionally as people don't jump off stormcaller fast enough). We always use the same players, and we do the same thing every fight.

The other night, I went with a different ops group as a fill-in, and they were having trouble with this as well.

If it is a bug, is the best way to avoid it to simply jump off the stormcaller once defensive systems audio prompt occurs and wait on the ground for the shield to pop?

Thanks in advance.

This can happen when double destruction and defensive systems line up. You can either re-balance dps if Firebrand is ahead or just get more dps and beat the timer. If you can't beat the second double destruction, have the two soakers run to the tank, while the tank steps back as far as possible. The lightning spire will land on the tank and not the dps.

Note 1: Not beating the second double destruction is a sign you will probably hit the enrage. It's quite possible to kill them well into the enrage however.

Note 2: The first phase is the hardest to beat the double destruction. After the first phase, the tanks will be at 78% or so and ranged dps can bring that lower making the next phase easier.

This is becoming frustrating. That bubble should not be popping up there, whatever is your DPS or not, it SHOULD NOT BE popping up.

We allready killed it on HM last week, this week this crap starts to happen all the time with the same set of players.

BW FIX THIS.

We use the tactic where we assign 1 tank, 1 healer and 2 dps to each tank with ranged dps on Firebrand and melee on Stormcaller (we almost always have a slinger, sage and 2 sents as dps). The ranged stand on Firebrand but dps Stormcaller to push through the Defensive System phases as fast as possible (so Stormcaller to below 20%), then all dps switch to Firebrand and kill it before finishing Stormcaller off.

Recently though, we've started running into the "OMG BUBBLE ON TANK" issue again. We now do SO much dps that sometimes Stormcaller skips Double Destruction completely and goes straight to Defensive Systems and this is probably the cause.

So it's either not enough dps on Stormcaller (Double Destruction lining up with Defensive Systems) or, perversely, too much dps on Stormcaller (skipping DD completely) that seems to cause it).

On our latest couple of runs, we've discovered that it's entirely possible to 'break' the Zorn and Toth fight by having too much dps as well - if you push them too fast you end up causing a swap while you still have Fearful from two phases before which can wipe that side if you don't spot it and simply stand there like lemons until it wears off.

Luckily there's no such thing as too much dps for Vorgath or Kephess.

Basically, for Stormcaller and Firebrand you need to have one DD and one DD only between Defensive System phases (so every 20% of Stormcaller's health) to be safe from getting bubbles landing on Stormcaller.

My point remains m8ys, this clearly its not supposed to happen, therefore its a bug in the combat mechanics of this boss and therefore BW must fix this.

I guess we are back to the old days of SoA when the bugs were really the HM and NM of him, whatever sigh....

Freaking unbeliavable.

Split your DPS 1:3. It's the easiest way to avoid a second double destruction.

This. Makes this fight sooo easy.

3 on stormcaller 1 on firebrand. at 20% have all DPS switch to firebrand. Ranged standing on stormcaller. Doing this pushes defensive systems faster and SHOULD prevent you from ever getting 2 double destructions.

My point remains m8ys, this clearly its not supposed to happen, therefore its a bug in the combat mechanics of this boss and therefore BW must fix this.

I guess we are back to the old days of SoA when the bugs were really the HM and NM of him, whatever sigh....

Freaking unbeliavable.

This is not a bug actually. Its all about timing and DPS. Use the 3:1 strat and I guarantee you wont see it happening anymore.

My point remains m8ys, this clearly its not supposed to happen, therefore its a bug in the combat mechanics of this boss and therefore BW must fix this.

I guess we are back to the old days of SoA when the bugs were really the HM and NM of him, whatever sigh....

Freaking unbeliavable.

The reason why this isn't a bug is because double destruction is on a timer (15s and 45s after first pull and each shield phase it think), while the shield phases are based on the boss health (80/60/40/20% health on either of them will trigger the shield phase)

If they line up to happen at the same time, it gets wacky with the pillars on stormcaller. So, the overloading of dps on one tank to push it so you don't have a 2nd double destruction is a great strat. Problem solved.

I agree that mixing health-based and time-based mechanics in the same boss fight can sometimes make things get weird, but I'd hardly call it a bug. If anything, I find it keeps the fights interesting because you need to adjust your strategy as your dps players get better geared.

plain and simple your DPS is too slow. You don't need 3-4 dps on storm caller either, my guild has never done it this way. even if u get the second DD and the lighting spire it is very easily delt with.

First your tank should be moving the DD to the dps not the other way around, this keeps max uptime for the DPS. Second if you do get a second DD all the tank has to do is move off of stormcaller while pulling it around to the dps...the lighting spire drops on the the tank not the dps.

Like i said this isn't a bug u have weak dps stop QQ

Edit: If u have a sniper or op heals you can always start with them dropping and orbital strike on storm caller and pull just as its about to hit them. Other than that you should never need more than 2 dps on either SC or FB.

plain and simple your DPS is too slow. You don't need 3-4 dps on storm caller either, my guild has never done it this way. even if u get the second DD and the lighting spire it is very easily delt with.

 

First your tank should be moving the DD to the dps not the other way around, this keeps max uptime for the DPS. Second if you do get a second DD all the tank has to do is move off of stormcaller while pulling it around to the dps...the lighting spire drops on the the tank not the dps.

 

Like i said this isn't a bug u have weak dps stop QQ

 

 

Edit: If u have a sniper or op heals you can always start with them dropping and orbital strike on storm caller and pull just as its about to hit them. Other than that you should never need more than 2 dps on either SC or FB.

1 - Let me remind you that weve just made this in HM on our 2nd try, never this happened before. We are using the same setup of players. This just started happening this week.

2 - We do know perfectly well how to handle DD

3 - How tha hack is the lighting bubble pretty much doable and dealt with if 3 players are dying literally in 1-2 secs, even with me using FS to get away i drop from 100% HP to 0 in 2 seconds.

4 - The lighting bubble is allways dropping on me (healer).

There are work arounds to avoid this misstactic but defenetly this isnt on the boss intended tactics whatsoever. So stop pretending everything is working as intended.

Reguarding your QQ observation. If this is the help you are offering i pass. Remain silent with your elitist guild and leave us mundane players alone, since defenetly you must be blind to not see this isnt working as intended.

Just putted you on ignore, have a nice day and good luck to your game.

This. Makes this fight sooo easy.

 

3 on stormcaller 1 on firebrand. at 20% have all DPS switch to firebrand. Ranged standing on stormcaller. Doing this pushes defensive systems faster and SHOULD prevent you from ever getting 2 double destructions.

 

 

 

This is not a bug actually. Its all about timing and DPS. Use the 3:1 strat and I guarantee you wont see it happening anymore.

That might overpass this flawed mechanic, thanks m8, ill give it a try. It might not be a bug but its defenetly poor designed tactic that leads to something that shouldnt be happening. If u lack DPS than u just cant endure the enrage timer, plain and simple.

We start with the regular set-up. 2 dps standing on each tank. But in the start of the fight, one of the ranged DPS standing on Firebrand will attack Stormcaller.

This will help you to beat the 2nd DD before the first Defensive systems. During defensive systems we still keep 2 dps under each shield to handle trandoshens. After this 1st defensive system phase we go back to normal where 2 dps on each tank attacking that tank. Once we beat the first defensive system with only 1 double destruction, we never get 2 DD's after that. We don't wait till 20 % like some others have mentioned, but both ways work to beat the timing issue you are having.

Lighting bubbles and defensive phases are triggered by percentages.

Firebrands health percentage triggers defensive phases where sheilds spawn.

Stormcaller's health percentages triggers lighting bubbles and maybe something else.

I sometimes notice defensive phases starting before bubbles go out when firebrand is ahead.

I notice bubbles going out early when stormcaller is ahead.

This should be clear and simple enough to help most anyone.....

If you still have trouble dropping bubbles on your dps, when you go to drop off the bubble step off the back of the tank and drop off Double Destruction far behind the dps/healer.

If you get lightning bubbles dropped on Stormcaller, the problem is usually that Defensive Systems starts while Stormcaller is busy casting a (second) Double Destruction. Stormcaller has to wait until it's done casting DD before it can charge and fire Defensive Systems. Meanwhile, Firebrand has already finished its Defensive Systems, so it will begin launching lightning bubbles at the player who is tanking Stormcaller. If you aren't expecting it, that player is probably standing right on top of your DPS, and since they have the Destruction debuff, the lightning will wreck them. There are a few solutions to this:

1. Intentionally DPS stormcaller faster, so it drives the Defensive Systems phases. You can accomplish this in multiple ways - 0/4 DPS or 1/3 DPS splits until you get Stormcaller below 20%, then switch to 4/0 DPS until Firebrand is dead. You can also go 1/3 for just a short while at the start of the fight, or put your two strongest DPS on Stormcaller and do 2/2 the whole way.

2. Just assume that the bubble is going to drop on the Stormcaller tank at an awkward time, and prepare for it by having the tank move very far behind your DPS for the second DD, actually dropping off the skirt of the hovertank

If you get lightning bubbles dropped on Stormcaller, the problem is usually that Defensive Systems starts while Stormcaller is busy casting a (second) Double Destruction. Stormcaller has to wait until it's done casting DD before it can charge and fire Defensive Systems. Meanwhile, Firebrand has already finished its Defensive Systems, so it will begin launching lightning bubbles at the player who is tanking Stormcaller. If you aren't expecting it, that player is probably standing right on top of your DPS, and since they have the Destruction debuff, the lightning will wreck them. There are a few solutions to this:

 

1. Intentionally DPS stormcaller faster, so it drives the Defensive Systems phases. You can accomplish this in multiple ways - 0/4 DPS or 1/3 DPS splits until you get Stormcaller below 20%, then switch to 4/0 DPS until Firebrand is dead. You can also go 1/3 for just a short while at the start of the fight, or put your two strongest DPS on Stormcaller and do 2/2 the whole way.

2. Just assume that the bubble is going to drop on the Stormcaller tank at an awkward time, and prepare for it by having the tank move very far behind your DPS for the second DD, actually dropping off the skirt of the hovertank

I like to think of the bubbles like this:

If defensive systems isn't up. The bubbles will drop on someone on the ground near Firebrand. If nobody is on the ground, the bubbles will drop on someone standing on Firebrand.

When defensive systems starts, the bubbles switch to Stormcaller and will drop them on the person on the ground near Stormcaller. This should be the tank running around dropping bubbles. If the tank and everyone near Stormcaller is still standing on SC, The bubbles will drop on someone standing on SC.(just like the Firebrand Bubbles- usually the one with the most agro)

As stated, This isn't a bug, your timing of DD and DS are overlapping .

I like to think of the bubbles like this:

If defensive systems isn't up. The bubbles will drop on someone on the ground near Firebrand. If nobody is on the ground, the bubbles will drop on someone standing on Firebrand.

 

When defensive systems starts, the bubbles switch to Stormcaller and will drop them on the person on the ground near Stormcaller. This should be the tank running around dropping bubbles. If the tank and everyone near Stormcaller is still standing on SC, The bubbles will drop on someone standing on SC.(just like the Firebrand Bubbles- usually the one with the most agro)

 

As stated, This isn't a bug, your timing of DD and DS are overlapping .

Sigh.. again, we allready made this fight. We cleared it several times in SM and last week on our 2nd attempt in HM. We know the tactics here, i aint asking for advices on how to do this boss.

Again, the bubble isnt dropping on the tank.

Yes there is 1 player on the ground near firebrand when the defensive systems are up.

Yes the DD and defensive systems are matching on the same time zone.

No, WE DNT HAVE YET SHIELD GENERATORS TO HIDE WITHIN and yet a bubble pops up on top my head (healer on stormcaller). And yes i know i have to get out as fast as possible but than again for the 1 zillion time, me and 2 other DPS'ers are being 1 shotted while still trying to flee from stormcaller and again, nooo, we dnt have the shield generators up yet cause plain and simple its taking too long for the adds to pop up even with defensive systems up.

Bottom line, i dnt need intructions on how to make this boss.

This fight has a flawed mechanic and IT ISNT WORKING AS INTENDED. You guys gave me a workaround on the flaw, great, hurrah, going to try it, tks.

SoA also was bugged and had some flaws in his mechanics and you guys were complaining bout it, however there were guilds that were killing him on NM, seeing the comparison here? And noo, i aint talking about platforms disappearing and SoA not showing up. Im talking about the guy for example that was on the air and we couldnt dps SoA to shift him to the 3rd phase until he hits the ground or that player would go to limbo.

That is a flawed mechanic on the fight, it isnt properlly a bug per say and its whats happening on FB&ST, A FLAWED MECHANIC and every flawed mechanic has a work around.

Just because you can kill bosses with flawed mechanics it doesnt mean it is right to do so, cause plain and simple it isnt performing as it should be.

We can do it but that doesnt mean its working as intended, cause plain and simple it isnt. You guys made this guy, great so have we last week and this week we havent managed too cause of the described above.

Now we are going to try passing that 1st DD and DS by putting a 3rd DPS on ST and see how it goes.

Again, thank you for those that actually tryed to help.

And to BW - PLEASE FIX THIS!!

Sigh.. again, we allready made this fight. We cleared dozens of times in SM and last week on our 2nd attempt in HM. We know the tactics here, i aint asking for advices on how to do this boss.

Again, the bubble isnt dropping on the tank.

Yes there is 1 player on the ground near firebrand when the defensive systems are up.

Yes the DD and defensive systems are matching on the same time zone.

No, WE DNT HAVE YET SHIELD GENERATORS TO HIDE WITHIN and yet a bubble pops up on top my head (healer on stormcaller). And yes i know i have to get out as fast as possible but than again for the 1 zillion time, me and 2 other DPS'ers are being 1 shotted while still trying to flee from stormcaller and again, nooo, we dnt have the shield generators up yet cause plain and simple its taking too long for the adds to pop up even with defensive systems up.

Bottom line, i dnt need intructions on how to make this boss.

This fight has a flaw mechanic and IT ISNT WORKING AS INTENDED. You guys gave me a workaround on the flaw, great, hurrah, going to try it, tks.

SoA also was bugged and had some flaws in his mechanics and you guys were complaining bout it, however there were guilds that were killing him on NM, seeing the comparison here? And noo, i aint talking about platforms disappearing and SoA not showing up. Im talking about the guy for example that was on the air and we couldnt dps SoA to shift him to the 3rd phase until he hits the ground or that player would go to limbo.

That is a flawed mechanic on the fight, it isnt properlly a bug per say and its whats happening on FB&ST, A FLAWED MECHANIC and every flawed mechanic has a work around.

Just because you can kill bosses with flawed mechanics it doesnt mean it is right to do so, cause plain and simple it isnt performing as it should be.

We can do it but that doesnt mean its working as intended, cause plain and simple it isnt. You guys made this guy, great so have we last week and this week we havent managed too cause of the described above.

Now we are going to try passing that 1st DD and DS by putting a 3rd DPS on ST and see how it goes.

Again, thank you for those that actually tryed to help.

And to BW - PLEASE FIX THIS!!

It is working as intended though lol. We already explained it to you. Its all about timing and how you position your DPS.

I agree to disagree, tks again for the info to work around the flaw.

And in time you will see a fix to this.

Signing off from this topic.

Working as intended. Simple as that.

SM is not HM.

If you see the second double destruction, know that you have to move. Enough said.

This is not a bug actually. Its all about timing and DPS. Use the 3:1 strat and I guarantee you wont see it happening anymore.

It can actually. Last week we had to change back to the 2:2 strat because Defensive Systems was backing onto the first DD.

Listen...

Wait until a double D goes out and if one hasn't gone out before 82% then slooooow your dps. Then once it comes you can continue all you're doing is pushing past the threshold into the next mechanic so its happening at the same time..... also if you notice he turns his guns straight up. Just MOVE step to the side hop off and then right back on. It's as simple as that.

We've 6 maned HM EC its not broken.. It's meant to make you check your dps. You can't just go in there and mindless whack away.