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"I think the Empire needs sane leaders."


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HAHAHAHAHA! Playing a light side sith character rocks! The title of this thread was from a dialogue exchange between my sorc and Ashara Zavros on my ship shortly after I acquired her on Taris.

 

I have been actively guiding my toon down a LS path because, frankly, the Empire is ran by a bunch of cartoonish, power hunger morons. A light side character allows you to openly question and mock them. And this totally carries over into the player base.

 

Nearly every time I run a FP, everyone usually chooses the dark side and mean dialogue options in cutscenes.

"BOW TO ME!" or some crap like that.

 

Imagine my delight when I win a dialogue roll and get to respond to some Darth or Grand Moff (and by extension everyone in my group) with something like, "Kill everyone on board. Have you completely lost your mind?" What's particularly amusing is telling Darth Malgus repeatedly after FPs that he has no idea what he's talking about.

 

When I had this talk with Ashara I just thought it was really cool that BioWare themselves acknowledged that the Empire is in fact run by lunatics. :D

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HAHAHAHAHA! Playing a light side sith character rocks! The title of this thread was from a dialogue exchange between my sorc and Ashara Zavros on my ship shortly after I acquired her on Taris.

 

I have been actively guiding my toon down a LS path because, frankly, the Empire is ran by a bunch of cartoonish, power hunger morons. A light side character allows you to openly question and mock them. And this totally carries over into the player base.

 

Nearly every time I run a FP, everyone usually chooses the dark side and mean dialogue options in cutscenes.

"BOW TO ME!" or some crap like that.

 

Imagine my delight when I win a dialogue roll and get to respond to some Darth or Grand Moff (and by extension everyone in my group) with something like, "Kill everyone on board. Have you completely lost your mind?" What's particularly amusing is telling Darth Malgus repeatedly after FPs that he has no idea what he's talking about.

 

When I had this talk with Ashara I just thought it was really cool that BioWare themselves acknowledged that the Empire is in fact run by lunatics. :D

 

That's why the Empire always ends up losing to the Republic. If they all stopped bickering and backstabbing each other, they'd have taken over the galaxy long ago.

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I enjoyed being a LS Warrior. Secretly plotting to take them down from the inside. Killing the craziest Sith and sparing/turning the ones with half a brain. And of course the Sith don't question it cause when the people don't come back they just assumed I killed them all like a good little Sith. :p
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That's why the Empire always ends up losing to the Republic. If they all stopped bickering and backstabbing each other, they'd have taken over the galaxy long ago.

This. 100% this.

 

If the Sith stopped getting in the way of my IA, we'd have won the war a long time ago.

 

Not to mention

the top Sith is a power-hungry lunatic that wants to snuff out all life in the galaxy.

 

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The dark choices do tend to be very "derp, me evil, SMASH!", which is kinda sad really. The clever kind of evil doesn't get portrayed a lot and if you want to act sensibly or intelligent, you usually have to pick the light or neutral dialogue choices. Though, as you said, it seems a lot of players -wants- the derpy kind of "evil" or just picks the dark choices because they have DSPs attached. Can't be Sith without being a brainless dolt that just smashes everything right? Edited by Pscyon
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I kept my SW dark to go for the full LS0/DS -10000. Wanted to get that at least once. I enjoyed a lot of the neutral smart alec responses I could make without taking LS points though. Baras didn't approve, but Vette sure enjoyed it. Edited by DarthLeeloo
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this DS choice problem is annoying. There are numerous accounts of sith doing what the game calls LS choices to further their goals. Most ds choices vs ls choices, are kill vs spare...... that is so children's story book esque its ridiculous. I cant even hit DS 2 w/o farming because I've only taken the few sensible ds choices in the game as my SW who seeks to make the empire stronger not play sith politics. My IA is mostly LS but does understand the sacrifice for the greater good and shooting backstabbers is legit too (no spoilers)
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this DS choice problem is annoying. There are numerous accounts of sith doing what the game calls LS choices to further their goals. Most ds choices vs ls choices, are kill vs spare...... that is so children's story book esque its ridiculous. I cant even hit DS 2 w/o farming because I've only taken the few sensible ds choices in the game as my SW who seeks to make the empire stronger not play sith politics. My IA is mostly LS but does understand the sacrifice for the greater good and shooting backstabbers is legit too (no spoilers)

 

This is exactly why I play LS. I spare people and do the "right" thing not because my SI is virtuous or heroic, but because she sees the strategic importance of leaving some high value targets alive, rescuing a group of people or organization because they will come to the Empire's aid when needed down the road.

 

This includes working with the Jedi and the Republic. My character is forward thinking. She's like Revan was while everyone else is like Malak.

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thing is a lotta people who play pure LS imp side and talk about strategic choices tend to miss out on sometimes the DS choices are better.

 

the revolting slaves on Drummond Kass are an excellent example.

 

Yes you can kill them faster with the LS option. but the DSoption isn't about just being sadistic. it's about cowing future slave revolts as well. every slave whom dies slowly and painfully is 3 of his buddies whom will strongly reconsider any future revolt attempt. yeah sure sometimes the LS choice is smarter. but sometimes the dark side choice is likewise smarter.

 

You have to remember that Tarkin Doctrine. No power has sufficant military force to rule the galaxy or even just large sections of it by might alone. it's rather more effective to rule by fear of that might being brought to power. which means brutal action that will cow the oppisition into not just surrendering, but not even RESISTING

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thing is a lotta people who play pure LS imp side and talk about strategic choices tend to miss out on sometimes the DS choices are better.

 

the revolting slaves on Drummond Kass are an excellent example.

 

Yes you can kill them faster with the LS option. but the DSoption isn't about just being sadistic. it's about cowing future slave revolts as well. every slave whom dies slowly and painfully is 3 of his buddies whom will strongly reconsider any future revolt attempt. yeah sure sometimes the LS choice is smarter. but sometimes the dark side choice is likewise smarter.

 

You have to remember that Tarkin Doctrine. No power has sufficant military force to rule the galaxy or even just large sections of it by might alone. it's rather more effective to rule by fear of that might being brought to power. which means brutal action that will cow the oppisition into not just surrendering, but not even RESISTING

 

Also have the one in the same area where you let the strongest and most brutal slaves move up in the ranks, a tactic used in real life because of the efficiency

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thing is a lotta people who play pure LS imp side and talk about strategic choices tend to miss out on sometimes the DS choices are better.

 

the revolting slaves on Drummond Kass are an excellent example.

 

Yes you can kill them faster with the LS option. but the DSoption isn't about just being sadistic. it's about cowing future slave revolts as well. every slave whom dies slowly and painfully is 3 of his buddies whom will strongly reconsider any future revolt attempt. yeah sure sometimes the LS choice is smarter. but sometimes the dark side choice is likewise smarter.

 

You have to remember that Tarkin Doctrine. No power has sufficant military force to rule the galaxy or even just large sections of it by might alone. it's rather more effective to rule by fear of that might being brought to power. which means brutal action that will cow the oppisition into not just surrendering, but not even RESISTING

 

Fear only causes more rebellions in the long run. Sure, that particular group may never rise up again. But you can bet others will, using the atrocities of what happened to the other slaves as proof that the Empire is evil and sadistic.

 

Real life history has shown this repeatedly. Or, hell, just read the Hunger Games.

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Fear only causes more rebellions in the long run. Sure, that particular group may never rise up again. But you can bet others will, using the atrocities of what happened to the other slaves as proof that the Empire is evil and sadistic.

 

Real life history has shown this repeatedly. Or, hell, just read the Hunger Games.

 

I wouldn't exactly cite the hunger games as a good source for society progression

 

Also real life does show that the population in countries like China seem at least a lot less noisy than their western counterparts, I'm not saying China is going to last as a oppressive regime forever, but neither will all the western democracies

Edited by SNCommand
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That's why the Empire always ends up losing to the Republic. If they all stopped bickering and backstabbing each other, they'd have taken over the galaxy long ago.

 

Empire always ends up losing because Republic is "good" and Empire is "bad". Good guys always have to beat bad guys in fantasy stories. And, in case anyone is wondering, SW is just a fantasy story with lasers and space ships.

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... I'm not saying China is going to last as a oppressive regime forever...
And Russians are all in ushankas and always wth a bottle of vodka and also have bears riding bicycles everyone on streets.

 

But then who am I kidding? Fox news is still in high demand.

 

On a more serious note, China has no longer an oppressive regime in it's full meaning for several decades. It can be characterised as a soft-core authoritarian country with plenty of social democracy elements and even market economy, however without many of it's flaws that can be seen in developed western capitalistic countries.

 

But I am not here to argue about China's political system, you are free to keep believing in whatever you want, it's just a shame people continue to stick to old stereotypes.

 

P.S. Unfortunately most of Light Side choices for Republic are just as dumb as Dark Side choice for Empire. I guess those are the flaws that keep both sides at relative balance (more like a fluctuating system). Neither radical democracy (yeah, weird, I know) nor all kinds of radical authoritarian regimes work.

Edited by Ceyvel
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And Russians are all in ushankas and always wth a bottle of vodka and also have bears riding bicycles everyone on streets.

 

But then who am I kidding? Fox news is still in high demand.

 

On a more serious note, China has no longer an oppressive regime in it's full meaning for several decades. It can be characterised as a soft-core authoritarian country with plenty of social democracy elements and even market economy, however without many of it's flaws that can be seen in developed western capitalistic countries.

 

But I am not here to argue about China's political system, you are free to keep believing in whatever you want, it's just a shame people continue to stick to old stereotypes.

 

Like you said, don't want a political discussion in the star wars forum, probably against the rules, but I do feel the need for at least one rebuttal

 

Because I do feel that I can characterize China as a oppressive regime compared to the world at large, now it's not North Korea, no USSR and certainly no SIth Empire, but it is a country based on authoritative principles, no freedom of election, no freedom of speech, no freedom of religion, no justice for all

 

No state is truly free, but at least some countries don't send tanks after protesters or create prison camps for dissidents

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P.S. Unfortunately most of Light Side choices for Republic are just as dumb as Dark Side choice for Empire.

 

Urgh. I've yet to level a republican all the way to 50 I admit, but I've played far enough to hit more than plenty of those nauseatingly patriotic "Derp, for the Republic!" or "It is my duty to always serve!" lines when I just wanted to say what it says clicking "Sure, I'll help" or "No additional reward neccessary" in conversation with a quest giver. So now I always try picking the more neutral options to not seem like a completely brainwashed door mat.

Edited by Pscyon
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The difference between why some make LS and DS choices really comes down to what is realistic.

 

None of us has ever been in a situation where if someone angers us we can just kill them and there are literally zero repercussions. It's tempting to say "LS is the smart way", but it isn't always, and not just because of the Tarkin Doctrine.

 

In the context of the society the Sith live in, anything that doesn't serve you personally is likely to be wasted in the long run. What's the point of letting someone go in a society that values and cherishes betrayal and where perceived weakness is a liability? What's the point of working with Jedi when the Jedi are utterly inflexible about accepting the Sith doctrines as having any validity at all?

 

But on a larger scale, the LS choices all too often turn out to be of dubious moral value. Actions that seem "good" have ramifications, but the entire society is rotten to it's core. Doing things 'for the evulz' is not always needed, but you literally can't be sure someone you let live today won't get used against you in some plot tomorrow. Every action you think you're taking to make the Empire a better place may get twisted into something worse by a power-tripping lunatic you aren't even aware of.

 

 

For example, all Malgus managed to do with his revolution to make the Empire a better place was get a lot of people needlessly killed.

 

 

Better to electrocute everything. There can be no uncertainty with the finality of death.

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I am actually enjoying playing my LS Sorc. But she isn't without her flaws.

 

A little background info. She is a twi'lek that doesn't care all that much about the Empire. After all she has two strikes against her when it comes to Empire society. One, she's an alien and we all know how much the empire loves aliens, and two she was a slave, which are the lowest class of Empire. She does enjoy her relative freedom going around and exploring the galaxy. However she does have principals and knows the value of allies to consolidate her power and influence in the Empire. She doesn't torture when interrogating someone since she thinks it's a useless tool and she doesn't kill unless they threaten her with violence or they betray her. She applies this to both non force sensitives and force sensitives. Plus some other things that would be non expectant of a stereotypical Sith but keeping in line with her character background and development.

 

I remember the quest line on Alderaan where you are given the choice to spare or kill the Rist guys who try to take you hostage after betrayal of the House Thul information.

 

Yeah I killed them both. She doesn't tolerate betrayal. Then there are some DS points that are just hilarious to take such as the following.

 

 

On Balmorra I saved the son of the officer of the Imperial reclamation service. After of course his son being a dick to me, threatening to kill me and blah blah and such. But I looked at him as being an idiot. He told me he hated his father's guts for some reason (daddy issues?) so that pretty much reinforced my thought of him being an idiot. Well anyways I get back to the officer and he asked me about his son. I told him that he hated his guts. Best 50 DS points I ever got. It was hilarious, especially when he was in denial of the whole thing.

 

 

The other one where I took some DS points is when the officer on Quesh says it wasn't a woman's place to be on the front lines. Needless to say I corrected that behavior really quick with some shocking results.

 

But still even though I have some DS (about 2500 I think) I am LS three. I am liking how my character is developing throughout her questing and story.

Edited by NightshadeBlue
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On Balmorra I saved the son of the officer of the Imperial reclamation service. After of course his son being a dick to me, threatening to kill me and blah blah and such. But I looked at him as being an idiot. He told me he hated his father's guts for some reason (daddy issues?) so that pretty much reinforced my thought of him being an idiot. Well anyways I get back to the officer and he asked me about his son. I told him that he hated his guts. Best 50 DS points I ever got. It was hilarious, especially when he was in denial of the whole thing.

 

 

 

Huh, killed the son for not releasing vital information and being an insufferable jerk, didn't plan on killing the Major, but his emotional actions forced my hand, got a cool "Congratulations with your promotion commander" moment with his subordinate though, he proved helpful thankfully, and no idiot son as well

 

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HAHAHAHAHA! Playing a light side sith character rocks! The title of this thread was from a dialogue exchange between my sorc and Ashara Zavros on my ship shortly after I acquired her on Taris.

 

I have been actively guiding my toon down a LS path because, frankly, the Empire is ran by a bunch of cartoonish, power hunger morons. A light side character allows you to openly question and mock them. And this totally carries over into the player base.

 

Nearly every time I run a FP, everyone usually chooses the dark side and mean dialogue options in cutscenes.

"BOW TO ME!" or some crap like that.

 

Imagine my delight when I win a dialogue roll and get to respond to some Darth or Grand Moff (and by extension everyone in my group) with something like, "Kill everyone on board. Have you completely lost your mind?" What's particularly amusing is telling Darth Malgus repeatedly after FPs that he has no idea what he's talking about.

 

When I had this talk with Ashara I just thought it was really cool that BioWare themselves acknowledged that the Empire is in fact run by lunatics. :D

 

Agreed. It's why I do not believe that the Empire could have every become a galaxy spanning Empire.

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Yeah, there's never been any huge oppressive empires throughout history

 

No, I'm not aware of any galaxy spanning empires. I am aware of Earth regimes that died in a generation or less under the weight of their evil. I would provide examples, but it's against the forum rules. But in any event, the Sith are a particularly idiotic form of evil regime. The Emperor allows his subjects to waste resources fighting each other that could be better spent on conquest.

 

In the game:

 

 

Corellia is basically lost because the Sith are all fighting each other while the Republic is systematically dismantling their various power bases.

 

 

Also as Malgus observed,

they let their ridiculous species-ism limit their potential.

 

 

The Empire is a caricature of an evil empire. There's no way it could exist in reality.

Edited by Master-Nala
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