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Very strong Vanguard dps hybrid

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Vanguard / Powertech
Very strong Vanguard dps hybrid

foofad's Avatar


foofad
01.16.2012 , 12:31 PM | #21
I just wanted to point out that as per the big Mitigation thread in the PVP forums, Assault Plastique (kinetic damage) isn't mitigated by armor. It does full damage.

DelongoWoods's Avatar


DelongoWoods
01.16.2012 , 12:38 PM | #22
seems i do more dps as a Sheild spec then both tatics and assualt. and i gain the ability to tank and guard. but im mostly baseing this off pvp and not so much pve. PVE it dosent seem to matter how much dps you have seems to matter how much hp you have.

NomYamPeng's Avatar


NomYamPeng
01.16.2012 , 04:03 PM | #23
Being tank in pvp means your out there more doing more damage, its why the best pvp specs are a shield/tactics or shield/assault build. Iv tried a shield spec as dps, and its average, i tried it on Soa EV so i could storm the mind traps and hit it with strong stockstrikes, which was nice, but HIB isnt as strong in this spec.
However this build the OP has posted seems a very excellent spec, i am going to try it on our next EV.
Im hoping it gives me a dilemma as i love my current pvp shield/tactics spec, turns me into a 14 medal whore, but i need to feel that great in PVE. Keep us updated on this spec, i am intrigued.

Hirokinae's Avatar


Hirokinae
01.17.2012 , 03:06 PM | #24
Thanks everyone for showing this thread some love, and as it is beginning to grow and expand, I would like to give back to you guys in return.
I'd like to first begin by reminding folks that this spec is currently built around pve, without any pvp in mind.

I am currently in the process of testing something which intrigues me very much. which is what one of the posters commented about - Kinetic damage and mitigation. I assumed that it was only broken in pvp, and for all pve purposes, worked perfectly fine. I went about testing this theory.

For this test, I worked under the safe assumption that a level ~1-10 mob on tython had less mitigation than a ~47-50 Correllia mob. So i flew to tython and decided to raid a flesh raider camp. The suckers never knew what hit them. =P I also decided to NOT include crits, because the random nature of crits would cause me to run into a few outliers, which is never good for data accumulation.
-The first order of business was to establish a control. I decided to use Ion pulse as my control, since it has been confirmed that it is elemental damage, which bypasses armor completely in both pvp and pve. I 1 shotted around 50 mobs, and took the average of my damage, which came out to 980.
- I then proceeded to throw sticky grenades (i dont have AP) which is listed as "kinetic damage" and SHOULD be mitigated by armor. After running around sticking hapless fleshraiders, i came up with an average of 1267 damage
- Next i proceeded to Correllia, and did the same for the none elite mobs there, ion pulsing and sticking the imperial scum on the planet. My averages came out to 987, and 1118 respectively.
- IN ADDITION, i decided to call out elara, and beat on a few gold elite droid, one of the "tanks" on the planet, and pulled up even more interesting numbers. 997 for ion pulse, and 1012 for sticky grenade.

To sum it up, my Data entries are as follows

Ion pulse:
Sub level 10 -------- 980 damage
level 47-50 -------- 987 damage
level 47-50 ELITE -- 997 damage

Sticky Grenade:
Sub level 10 -------- 1267 damage
level 47-50 -------- 1118 damage
level 47-50 ELITE -- 1012 damage

In conclusion, ion pulse's damage seems to bypass armor completely, as the average damage was generally the same for all three levels. However, with sticky grenade's average damage it is VERY apparent that as level on mobs goes up, the damage decreases. This falls very well into the assumption that higher level mobs/elite mobs logically have more armor, and thus, more mitigation than their lower level counterparts.

This data CONFIRMS, that for all intensive purposes, mitigation DOES WORK as intended for pve purposes. I do not want to comment in pvp as I have not done testing and worked the data myself, although I have noted that it is not working as intended for pvp. Please stick around for more updates as i run more tests like this in the future, as well as update information on our trooper dps spec!

Disclaimer: there were many flesh raiders harmed in the making of this test. Many were dismantled, dismembered, and destroyed in the process of testing, and Hironai inc. is not responsible for feelings of guilt, displeasure, or anger towards flesh raider rights activists.

Hirokinae's Avatar


Hirokinae
01.17.2012 , 03:16 PM | #25
One thing I would like to note, is that for general purposes, I personally find that shield specs do less damage than assault/tactics specs, and trades damage for survivability. For pve purposes, shield spec is simply not possible, as maximizing dps requires you to be in ion stance to maximize stockstrikes, which is a HUGE part of your damage. When you factor in the fact that you're generating 50% more threat, you essentially are fighting with tanks for aggro, and might as well be the tank yourself. (although dps output as a tank can be respectable, it is nothing compared to assault/tactics.)

For those in pvp who notice that their damage may be higher while running a shield spec, it could be possible that they are not dying as much, or not used to assault vs. shield in pvp. Higher uptime and active time in pvp will most likely translate into more damage overall during the course of a warzone, and since shield specs survive so much longer, they generally have more active time than assault. With this in mind, I would like to note that I have run both shield and assault in pvp, and while in assault, my average damage falls around 400k, with 300k being the lowpoint, and 500k being high. This versus shield spec, where i found it very hard to push 400k, and often hovered around 200-300k damage, with ~50-100k protection. as the tradeoff.

With that said, I would like to remind everyone that this spec is designed with PVE RAIDING in mind, maximizing dps output. This is actually extremely crucial in hard/nightmare modes, where dps is paramount in reaching the enrage timer for the first, second, and fifth bosses in EV. It is even more crucial in hardmode/nightmare soa, where falling behind on mind traps is one of the main reasons for wiping during the encounter.

Sartified's Avatar


Sartified
01.17.2012 , 11:45 PM | #26
Just to be sure, you are using plasma cell, correct? Someone asked you on the first page but you didn't reply.

Bolvar's Avatar


Bolvar
01.18.2012 , 01:02 AM | #27
I play a BH Powertech and have similar build when i DPS with some point's different but nothing major.

Playing around with the the Assault an Shield trees made me respec and PvP with a totally different build, but similar sustained dmg in PvP, just more mobile + CC and tanky.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#80...MboMZZfhbbdh.1

you only need 18 point's in the Assault tree to get somewhat 80% of the dmg advantage the whole tree has ... so you can further push the dmg or in PvP case i just wanted to be longer alive and mobile. And it's not like you will not feel the 30% more crit/crit dmg from the Tank tree and it's Stock Strike reset, which can reset your HIB, makes some good w t f moments on enemy faces if you get lucky
Motir ca'tra nau tracinya.
Gra'tua cuun hett su dralshy'a.
Aruetyc cet slarycina runi trattok'o.
Sa kyr'am nau tracyn kad, Vode an!

Reteric's Avatar


Reteric
01.18.2012 , 12:31 PM | #28
@ Hirokinae: Just to make sure you are using plasma cell. correct ?
I got drafted to go dps for our guild in nightmare modes. I normally tank but there are currently to many tanks in the guild. I was wondering if you could give me a priority list to go by or a make sure to do list, I know you said the spec is rather ammo intensive.

@ Bolvar: I am going to give your spec a try for pvp. Are you running ion cell? Also your you using dps or tank gear in this spec.

Hirokinae's Avatar


Hirokinae
01.18.2012 , 03:50 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Bolvar View Post
I play a BH Powertech and have similar build when i DPS with some point's different but nothing major.

Playing around with the the Assault an Shield trees made me respec and PvP with a totally different build, but similar sustained dmg in PvP, just more mobile + CC and tanky.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#80...MboMZZfhbbdh.1

you only need 18 point's in the Assault tree to get somewhat 80% of the dmg advantage the whole tree has ... so you can further push the dmg or in PvP case i just wanted to be longer alive and mobile. And it's not like you will not feel the 30% more crit/crit dmg from the Tank tree and it's Stock Strike reset, which can reset your HIB, makes some good w t f moments on enemy faces if you get lucky
I'd like to point out that this spec is mostly a PVP spec, and this is NOT a pvp spec thread. The spec i have listed is purely raid dps, and with your spec you lose ALOT of damage, and trade it for survivability, which like i have stated earlier is great for pvp, but abysmal for pve. You are losing 6 MAJOR damage talents and trading them for pvp survivability which you do not need as a raid dps.

*i've edited my main post to include stance and a basic priority list

Reteric's Avatar


Reteric
01.18.2012 , 03:55 PM | #30
Thanks for all your work I and I assume everyone else appreciates it.