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To those that argued against Expertise coming back.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
To those that argued against Expertise coming back.

Totemdancer's Avatar


Totemdancer
09.14.2019 , 09:08 PM | #1
Way back in the year when Eric asked us about pvp gearing and possibly Expertise there were some people (mainly causal pvpers who pve’d too) who argued against Expertise because they didn’t want to grind two gear sets or have two gear sets in their inventory (too hard to swap back and forth)
Well I hope you guys realise they are implementing a gearing system so complicated and grindy that you’ll wish they had implemented a two tiered gearing system and had expertise back for a pvp set. You will still need two sets or even more.
People here tried to explain that a seperate Expertise set obtained as fast as the old pvp set was the way to go. But you whined about how “hard” and “unfair” that is. I can’t wait to see the exact same people start to moaning about the 6.0 system when it’s released.
Then when you finally get your BiS after 6 months you’ll be back here lording it over full time pvpers or casual (time poor) players saying how easy it was for you to gear up.
Hope you’re all happy with Bioware’s solution to a no pvp Expertise set.
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alexzk's Avatar


alexzk
09.14.2019 , 09:40 PM | #2
It's ok ...6 mo doing what i want is ok.
Bad was backdays prior 2014. When I had to spend 2 weeks pvp non stop (10hrs/day) for me, then another 2 weeks for comp (yeh, pvp was fastest way to gear/boost companion), then another 4 weeks to get 2nd tier pvp ...and when guild invites me to FP ...boom - noob detected - wrong gear. Go spend some weeks for.
And when I came out to open world ....boom - wrong gear again. It was like - "pvp" - stealth.- .found quest mob, looking all around - nobody - "pve", killing mob - stealth fast - "pvp" ...lucky if not hit while with mob otherwise 1shooted.

So ye,thanks, no need for expertise. Just let me get gear by doing anything i want right now. That how should be.

Actual trick is, you can do PVE alone, while PVP not. So that's why PVE'rs will gear faster - because they can keep gearing deep night or early morning, while pvp happens only late evening. If you don't like be last - go farm mobs.
There is no ignorance - there is knowledge.

Totemdancer's Avatar


Totemdancer
09.14.2019 , 10:50 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by alexzk View Post
It's ok ...6 mo doing what i want is ok.
Bad was backdays prior 2014. When I had to spend 2 weeks pvp non stop (10hrs/day) for me, then another 2 weeks for comp (yeh, pvp was fastest way to gear/boost companion), then another 4 weeks to get 2nd tier pvp ...and when guild invites me to FP ...boom - noob detected - wrong gear. Go spend some weeks for.
And when I came out to open world ....boom - wrong gear again. It was like - "pvp" - stealth.- .found quest mob, looking all around - nobody - "pve", killing mob - stealth fast - "pvp" ...lucky if not hit while with mob otherwise 1shooted.

So ye,thanks, no need for expertise. Just let me get gear by doing anything i want right now. That how should be.

Actual trick is, you can do PVE alone, while PVP not. So that's why PVE'rs will gear faster - because they can keep gearing deep night or early morning, while pvp happens only late evening. If you don't like be last - go farm mobs.
Have you even read what the 6.0 gearing is going to be? Looking forward to your QQ after 6.0 is released
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alexzk's Avatar


alexzk
09.15.2019 , 01:01 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Totemdancer View Post
Have you even read what the 6.0 gearing is going to be? Looking forward to your QQ after 6.0 is released
Will see what it be, don't care
Longer it take - better. I would play something what takes 3mo to gather resources for craft. It gives point to play.
Because everybody will be in such situation. So it will be more - less even for long time.
There is no ignorance - there is knowledge.

NogueiraA's Avatar


NogueiraA
09.15.2019 , 01:28 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Totemdancer View Post
Way back in the year when Eric asked us about pvp gearing and possibly Expertise there were some people (mainly causal pvpers who pve’d too) who argued against Expertise because they didn’t want to grind two gear sets or have two gear sets in their inventory (too hard to swap back and forth)
Well I hope you guys realise they are implementing a gearing system so complicated and grindy that you’ll wish they had implemented a two tiered gearing system and had expertise back for a pvp set. You will still need two sets or even more.
People here tried to explain that a seperate Expertise set obtained as fast as the old pvp set was the way to go. But you whined about how “hard” and “unfair” that is. I can’t wait to see the exact same people start to moaning about the 6.0 system when it’s released.
Then when you finally get your BiS after 6 months you’ll be back here lording it over full time pvpers or casual (time poor) players saying how easy it was for you to gear up.
Hope you’re all happy with Bioware’s solution to a no pvp Expertise set.
People are more concerned about turning Jaesa light side than gearing system.
They just don't care. Here in the forums we do have some people who proved using facts that 6.0 gearing will be a failure.
Look at Reddit, posts about gearing system ideas and facts have very low Upvote numbers. Posts about useless stuff gets hundreds of upvotes.
I'm on this game since the very first Beta, I remember most of the atrocious decisions Bioware made since then, I can confirm adding RNG to the game was the worst decision.
4.0+ before 5.0 had the best gearing this game ever had, NO ONE, literally NO ONE complained about it, but I learned that Bioware is too stubborn to revert anything.
I'm currently playing Star Wars Battlefront 2, DICE just reverted an update because the update was bad for the game. Bioware is the opposite, they won't revert it, they will spend thousands of hours and resources to "fix" that wrong decision, this is what I hate most about Bioware, this is what I saw them doing for over 7 years of Swtor.
La'izen | Sentinel
Jedi Laizen | Guardian
Satele Shan
BETA tester

Zurules's Avatar


Zurules
09.15.2019 , 08:05 AM | #6
I started that thread in which i say that expertise has nothing to do with pvp. It was just a stat that only worked in pvp plain and simple. But it forced players to get 2 sets of gear which was its biggest problem.

What you want which i agree with would be a way to save up a "currency" that you can acquire from lowbie/midbie wzs which you can then use to purchase gear at max lvl. That is what you really want.

I find it funny hearing all these complaints about the grind it will be in 6.0 when bolster will put everyone at max in wzs in 6.0. Gear means less and less with 6.0. which is what pvpers wanted too.

You got your wish with bolster, yet you still complain about gearing. If they did put back expertise, guess what, that stat would be bolstered too. It is a pointless stat in the end which is why i had created that thread a while back.
All Galaxy Hybrid-Clicker Shadow

Seterade's Avatar


Seterade
09.15.2019 , 06:13 PM | #7
meh. zurules, go play regs in 230s on a class that cant stealth out and then tell everyone bolster is going to save this game. I did it for giggles. and well.... the result was kinda comical

teclado's Avatar


teclado
09.15.2019 , 09:16 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Zurules View Post
I started that thread in which i say that expertise has nothing to do with pvp. It was just a stat that only worked in pvp plain and simple. But it forced players to get 2 sets of gear which was its biggest problem.

What you want which i agree with would be a way to save up a "currency" that you can acquire from lowbie/midbie wzs which you can then use to purchase gear at max lvl. That is what you really want.

I find it funny hearing all these complaints about the grind it will be in 6.0 when bolster will put everyone at max in wzs in 6.0. Gear means less and less with 6.0. which is what pvpers wanted too.

You got your wish with bolster, yet you still complain about gearing. If they did put back expertise, guess what, that stat would be bolstered too. It is a pointless stat in the end which is why i had created that thread a while back.
You people are really starting to infuriate me. Like, I'm about to go full darkside on y'all.

I'm still waiting to hear why having another gear set is such a big deal. We can port to our stronghold to change clothes in under 30 seconds. Oh, and every single freaking one of you move legacy gear around on a regular basis, a process which requires more steps (logging off, then on to another character). EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU. Now stop with that. *force chokes entire room* Or you could always, you know, create an alt (which you already have 100 of), have one for pve, one for pvp. Easy. But NOOOOooooooooo!!!!!!!!

Gaining currency at lower levels does absolutely nothing for the majority of us who are already at level.

Ah yes, bolster will fix everything. I mean, you may have little to no control over your stat allocation and end up wasting a buttload of points in alacrity (well exceeding the threshold after which more points do absolutely nothing - go look up the alacrity thresholds) because the 6.0 system doesn't let you get modifiable gear or mods themselves very easily, which also means that you won't be augmenting gear anytime soon (unless you have millions of credits to burn as you have to keep re-augmenting pieces over and over as you slow march from 270 to 306 in 2 point increments). Oh, and that's just one character. Have fun.

Bolstering expertise???? Dude, no. We previously had bolster and expertise at the same time. Expertise isn't bolstered. That's not what expertise is or how that works at all. Don't talk about stuff that you have never experienced in this game.

So, in summary: we cannot have a quick and easy pvp gearing system because it's such a pain to change clothes or have an alt. Therefore we must have the same grindy progression ops style gearing (because it would be totally unfair if it were quick and easy to get ops gear without doing ops). But no worries, bolster will save us! Er...actually, not really. Only if you close your eyes and pretend to not understand how stat allocations with crit / alac / acc work.

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
09.16.2019 , 11:38 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by teclado View Post
Only if you close your eyes and pretend to not understand how stat allocations with crit / alac / acc work.
My concern about bolster in 6.0 is that it will neuter all stats across the board. Meaning say you have a high alacrity build mara, and a high crit build mara... I am worried bolster will take both builds and make their effective stats essentially the same. If that happens, the different variations of gameplay will be eliminated and that would make the game far less enjoyable. But that's what they been doing, whatever seems to make the game less enjoyable, BW game design has routinely taken that route with every large update since 4.0.
TRUE
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
RNG is counterproductive because it massively increases player dissatisfaction.
FALSE
Quote: Originally Posted by olagatonjedi View Post
As I detailed in another thread, RNG give the players more control over their gearing.

Zurules's Avatar


Zurules
09.17.2019 , 07:51 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by teclado View Post
You people are really starting to infuriate me. Like, I'm about to go full darkside on y'all.

I'm still waiting to hear why having another gear set is such a big deal. We can port to our stronghold to change clothes in under 30 seconds. Oh, and every single freaking one of you move legacy gear around on a regular basis, a process which requires more steps (logging off, then on to another character). EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU. Now stop with that. *force chokes entire room* Or you could always, you know, create an alt (which you already have 100 of), have one for pve, one for pvp. Easy. But NOOOOooooooooo!!!!!!!!

Gaining currency at lower levels does absolutely nothing for the majority of us who are already at level.

Ah yes, bolster will fix everything. I mean, you may have little to no control over your stat allocation and end up wasting a buttload of points in alacrity (well exceeding the threshold after which more points do absolutely nothing - go look up the alacrity thresholds) because the 6.0 system doesn't let you get modifiable gear or mods themselves very easily, which also means that you won't be augmenting gear anytime soon (unless you have millions of credits to burn as you have to keep re-augmenting pieces over and over as you slow march from 270 to 306 in 2 point increments). Oh, and that's just one character. Have fun.

Bolstering expertise???? Dude, no. We previously had bolster and expertise at the same time. Expertise isn't bolstered. That's not what expertise is or how that works at all. Don't talk about stuff that you have never experienced in this game.

So, in summary: we cannot have a quick and easy pvp gearing system because it's such a pain to change clothes or have an alt. Therefore we must have the same grindy progression ops style gearing (because it would be totally unfair if it were quick and easy to get ops gear without doing ops). But no worries, bolster will save us! Er...actually, not really. Only if you close your eyes and pretend to not understand how stat allocations with crit / alac / acc work.
You fail to see the simple point that with expertise in the game, any player who wants to participate in both pve and pvp needed 2 sets of gear to play the game. Without expertise, everyone only needs 1 set of gear to play the whole game. Having 1 set of gear is better for everyone.

100 alts......I personally hate alts and do not have a single double on any server outside of mirror to play on either faction.

The loss of earning currency to buy gear from low/midbies i think is a big reason for the lower quality of pvpers that decide to try pvp for the first time at max lvl. No one has any real incentive to play in those lower brackets anymore since they removed gaining currency. They have no practice as they lvl up their characters and do not learn how to pvp or play their class properly which is why the quality of pvp right now is as bad as ever. This is why i think getting currency in low/midbies is important.

Bolster definitely wont give us optimal stats. But guess what! It is the same for everyone meaning no one will have gear advantage over anyone else unless you actual reach this new highest gear rating without bolster and mix/max to what you want.

As for augmenting your gear and spending millions of credits. I am biased since other than pvp, making credits via crafting is the other thing I do for fun in this game so whatever the cost, it will not have an impact on me.

In the past, stats were never bolstered to the max, that included expertise, but it was bolstered. But guess what, now they are! Therefore expertise would be too making it completely useless. As for understanding stat allocation, i always do my own thing. I try difference stats lvls out, get a feel for it and if i like it and it feels good for me and how i want to play, i use it. According to all the experts, i currently waste a lot of stats and i don't care because playing at those "perfect" lvls does not feel good for how i like to play my class and is therefore worse for me. Find what works for you and go with it.
All Galaxy Hybrid-Clicker Shadow