Too unskilled to clear NIM raids without VE stacks? Boi do I have a

 

DEAL FOR YOU!!!!

 

SEA BEAR COACHING SERVICES ARE NOW BEING OFFERED!!

 

What is this service? G R E A T Q U E S T I O N!

 

My name is Laet, however, many in the community know me as the Sea-bear. While not running progression threads or participating in 2 man uprising progression, I have had my fair share of dabbling in NIM content. Since late 2.0, I have cleared every piece of high-level content O N T I E R, including WORLD THIRD DESTRUCTION INCARNATE (world first without any Izax reflect).

 

However, farming all of this content for 6 years and Dxun being Dxun has made me yearn for a greater opportunity in this game, which is why I have become inspired to rise to the status of "coach". This paid service would allow me to sit in discord streams during raids, allowing me to carry everyone by making call outs so that each player can focus on maximizing their potential. In simple terms, 9 players> 8 players.

 

My services have already proven to be successful. Take, for example, Ordinance, on Star Forge. The group encountered difficulty killing NIM Aivela and Esne. However, as soon as I stepped into discord to coach the team, they one shot the boss. Additionally, I have also coached a Star Forge PUG to NA first no veteran stacks NIM Brontes. And also helped EU's Team Sandals kill Raptus in a mere 3 nights!!

 

The removal of veterans edge stacks has definitely created challenging gameplay that requires a combined 20 brain cells to complete rather than 5. I guarantee you that with my service, YOU WILL BE ABLE TO COMPLETE THE DIFFICULT TASK OF CLEARING NIM WITHOUT VETERAN'S EDGE.

 

Please come into contact with me on discord, Laet#1859 , if interested, and we can discuss pricing.

 

Thank you, and good luck!

 

-Laet

Edited February 17, 2020 by Pizza_boy

I know most people are quite unreasonable on this forum, but I will try to explain everything in detail so that people can understand why I said what I said.

 

The raid wasn't a pug

 

I knew three people in that group and didn't know about whether or not these people often raid together. They searched on the fleet and in the lfg chat for multiple people, so I just assumed it was a pug.

 

You were running with an optimal setup

 

I don't know in which world three sorc dps are considered optimal in DF. If anything, every class is viable right now, doesn't mean its optimal. The tank and heal roles were good, but there isn't that much variance in those slots anyway. Most people had wrong stats, some relics that were completely useless, didn't slot color crystals or didn't have good tank gear at the start of the raid (at the end they were using drops that they got from the previous bosses). I consider that suboptimal.

 

You didn't kill brontes

 

Yes we didn't but we stopped after 4 wipes. Feel free to have your own opinion on whether or not we could have killed it, but I do personally think so. I still consider the run smooth considering that it was a fleet raid and brontes always was one of the hardest encounters in swtor, so why should it take so little tries to kill it.

On another note, we managed to kill Grob'thok whilst essentially 7-Manning it because two people died early on in the magnet. Corruptor Zero was killed in a try where multiple people died but it was no problem since you could just stealth rez everyone. The boss itself doesn't deal much damage since we could just use the pt dps to offtank multiple times whilst the second tank was dead. We even managed to kill draxus very quickly even though many mechanics were failed. You are still able to compensate for so, so much with your current gear that it is just silly.

 

You said everyone didn't play for a long period of time!

 

No, I didn't say that. I said that I didn't play in a long time and that I don't play the game very often. I also said that one person didn't clear the instance yet, which was false to say since he did get the achievements during 3.0. Nonetheless, we had to explain everything to him, so it doesn't make a huge difference.

 

Anyway, everyone here is entitled to have their own opinion, but maybe start complaining about the difficulty of hardmode operations instead of ruining the experiences for players that play this game for the challenge.

I come from WoW

 

And that is the issue here.

 

You see, this is swtor and we do things differently here. In WoW you beat a raid and then you get a new one next month. It keeps going like this and in 6 months you can solo the 1 raid cause you out level it etc. Here we don't do that. Here we have the same raids the game came out with at current level. In 9 years of existence the game has received less than 10 raids, do you see the difference to WoW? Some of those do not even have a NiM mode.

 

So in order to keep the raiders busy they available operations have to be hard as they were. Not sure you can even say that, cause like I said when Eternity Vault came out we had vastly different abilities etc. So the difficulty now actually balances out the newly gained stuff. For you as a new player you should have it hard as this mode is hard. The veteran players who can do these operations blindfolded focus rather on the newest operation.

 

Plus the operations still contain the same rewards as 9 years ago, same cool mounts, titles etc. People got those things under more difficult circumstances than now. Yes, In WoW you can go back and solo an ops and get the titles and mounts, but not in swtor

Everyone is so good show me a gatecrasher or nim gods kill. Edited February 16, 2020 by missedopps

Plz bring back Stacks.

Pug Raids are completely dead since 6.1 on Tulak Hord.

I guess for Raidgroups its fine, but thats not my playstyle.

The community is to small tbh.

I think i will quit and many others too.

Have fun to all those who love the Fleet Simulator.

Can't clear nim without stacks but want the rewards for it just because it was stupidly easy before?..

Go back to SM/HM & Practice more! Or stop giving up progressing & try harder for something that is not faceroll anymore. If not just take up on Laet's offer & profit lol.

 

I mean it have literally not even been a week yet & a few people are going pathetically silly. Stop crying & play the game, embrace the challenge instead of being spoiled brats that want everything for free without effort.

 

Welcome to NIGHTMARE MODE as it is supposed to be (still not for everyone)

Can't clear nim without stacks but want the rewards for it just because it was stupidly easy before?..

Go back to SM/HM & Practice more! Or stop giving up progressing & try harder for something that is not faceroll anymore. If not just take up on Laet's offer & profit lol.

 

I mean it have literally not even been a week yet & a few people are going pathetically silly. Stop crying & play the game, embrace the challenge instead of being spoiled brats that want everything for free without effort.

 

Welcome to NIGHTMARE MODE as it is supposed to be (still not for everyone)

 

Dude just stop. Everyone pretty much agrees that it was too easy. But lack of new content is the problem, not easy 7 year old raids. No point in suddenly making them more difficult without any warning.

Edited February 17, 2020 by Rion_Starkiller

This lockout alone since the latest patch there have been 2 different teams to have cleared nightmare gods. A quick browse of twitch vods shows 3 different teams killing brontes (plus however many haven't been streamed). I think that addresses the 'show me this kill' comments.

 

Even the current scaling of non-gods nightmares is easier than the launch of 5.0. To those teams who are saying this is too difficult and the veteran's edge stacks should be returned I'd suggest looking at the output of each of your individual players and compare it to those topping the associated specs in those fights. No one's saying play like the 99th percentile players but if you have members who can't even get within 10 or 15 percent of them then perhaps consider addressing that before suggesting the current tuning is too much.

Everyone is so good show me a gatecrasher or nim gods kill.

 

I mean, a group on star forge missed out on gatecrasher by like ten minutes, and it was a PUG with a drunk Swede :-P

The group even sat waiting at draxus for a while to swap players because one person hadn’t patched. i Think brontes was a 2-shot. Gatecrasher is definitely possible.

 

I think people are understandably upset, because there is a large group of raiders who no longer have a tier of difficulty that is both clearable and still satisfying. Problem isn’t that NiM is too hard... the problem is that HM is too easy.

 

Being a NiM raider should mean something. I like it how it is now, cuz I have 50% less naptime during boss pulls.

I think one thing that needs to be said and I sympathize with is that due to the lack of content, the only thing VM level of guilds have other than waiting years for the next op is try their hand at NiM. So I can understand why people would be upset if they can no longer progress on it, but the fact is that the Devs want it to be current content so it has to be challenging. Usually this was done by having gear checks as a form of a gradual soft nerf mechanic like WoW has since only being able to get better gear was by doing the harder content. Now that for the last 3 expacs we have been able to get easy BiS (minus the rng debacle of early 5.x) before even stepping foot in NiM means that they have to keep the tuning of NiM somewhat a challenge especially now with the bolster to 70. The difficulty is still easier than it was in some updates but it’s no longer just complete face roll. I think the biggest issue is that this is caused by lack of content for all tiers of raiders since it leads to using higher tiers as new content and leads to situations like these. That said the choice to remove stacks was the right one. Edited February 18, 2020 by FerkWork

Look at it this way, if you're a group progressing on any of the legacy raids and once you and your group clear -everything- without Veteran's Edge stacks, you'll feel like you actually achieved something, rather than -just- kill it.

 

And if there are any of you that still doubt that it's doable, you can hop onto Youtube and search for kill videos from 6.1, or just DM me and I'll be more than happy to provide you footage

Edited February 18, 2020 by chipequssmlgpro

Just make stacks optional and let people play the content they want. It doesnt take away anything from anyone if another group gets a timed run with or without stacks.

As long as titles and mounts are being sold there should also be a way for people to go get them without being in the 99th percentile. The argument "git gud" is worthless unless you extend it to its full length of "git gud or pay" - which is what it really is. The first price hikes for carries already happened within days of the patch.

 

And still - no word from Bioware as to why they saw fit to introduce all this without any warning.

And still - no word from Bioware as to why they saw fit to introduce all this without any warning.

 

Umm... there was if you know how to read. They released it earlier than planned, and patch notes guy wasn’t up-to-date. May not be the explanation you wanted, but it is an explanation.

 

From Dev Tracker: “Originally this was planned to come in a later Game Update so it could get more bake time, but when it was moved to this release it was missed for patch noting. I understand the frustration around the lack of communication on this one, it was definitely not meant to be a ninja change so apologies for that.

Thats not an explanation, thats a nonsense PR phrase translating into "we messed up but I am not allowed to admit that".

Look at it this way, if you're a group progressing on any of the legacy raids and once you and your group clear -everything- without Veteran's Edge stacks, you'll feel like you actually achieved something, rather than -just- kill it.

 

And if there are any of you that still doubt that it's doable, you can hop onto Youtube and search for kill videos from 6.1, or just DM me and I'll be more than happy to provide you footage

 

People are not contending that this content is undoable. We are saying it is not acceptable for the content to be such that only the top 0.01% of players can complete it, as this is ultimately bad for the larger raiding community. Hence, providing video evidence that the top 0.01% of players can complete the content is entirely useless to this debate.

 

I know you and others arguing that stacks should stay removed aren’t sufficiently dense as to not understand this.

Thats not an explanation, thats a nonsense PR phrase translating into "we messed up but I am not allowed to admit that".

 

Cool, so you figured it out all on your own; i'm so proud of you. If they messed up and made an oopsie, what more of an explanation do you need? They expressed that it is gonna be this way for a while, and they are currently monitoring feedback. I dunno why you expect anything more from them now. It's been two working days for them. Calm down, and if NiM is too hard for you right now, go back to hard mode while you wait for something to change.

WIth the amount of "discussion" about this topic, a reaction was warranted on working day 1.

That whole statement is a noncommittial bit of nothing.

WIth the amount of "discussion" about this topic, a reaction was warranted on working day 1.

That whole statement is a noncommittial bit of nothing.

 

Of course it's noncommittal. You can't have it both ways. First, you complain that they released changes without giving you enough time to prepare yourself emotionally for losing stacks. Then you complain that they haven't announced an immediate, massive functional change to the game without testing?

 

The stacks are gone, and for the immediate future, you can expect them to stay gone. BW is observing and planning next steps. There's all of like ONE person working on this stuff.

So you think its fine leaving both sides of the argument just escalating things like it is happening now ?

Im not asking for a change right now - as you so eloquently pointed out that is unrealistic.

The only change I think possible on such short notice would be reenabling the stacks completely which will piss off one side.

 

A reaction that I would expect would be something like:

"We see this change caused a lot of friction within the community. Please post suggestions for a compromise only in this thread (link to new thread) along with a brief reasoning. This is not the place to discuss or flame each other. if you dont post a suggestion, do not post at all at this point.

In 7 days the suggestion thread will close. Then a community vote will take place and the most popular 5 options will be brought to the dev team to look into. We will come back to you after a couple of days with an answer on whether and how quickly the top 5 selections can be implemented."

 

Being proactive with a statement like that, offering a clear path ahead beats letting issues like this fester.

So you think its fine leaving both sides of the argument just escalating things like it is happening now ?

Im not asking for a change right now - as you so eloquently pointed out that is unrealistic.

The only change I think possible on such short notice would be reenabling the stacks completely which will piss off one side.

 

A reaction that I would expect would be something like:

"We see this change caused a lot of friction within the community. Please post suggestions for a compromise only in this thread (link to new thread) along with a brief reasoning. This is not the place to discuss or flame each other. if you dont post a suggestion, do not post at all at this point.

In 7 days the suggestion thread will close. Then a community vote will take place and the most popular 5 options will be brought to the dev team to look into. We will come back to you after a couple of days with an answer on whether and how quickly the top 5 selections can be implemented."

 

Being proactive with a statement like that, offering a clear path ahead beats letting issues like this fester.

 

Lmao keep dreaming bud. The dev's wanted stacks gone and that's what they implemented. Welcome to NiM raids finally being NiM difficulty again.

So you think its fine leaving both sides of the argument just escalating things like it is happening now ?

Im not asking for a change right now - as you so eloquently pointed out that is unrealistic.

The only change I think possible on such short notice would be reenabling the stacks completely which will piss off one side.

 

A reaction that I would expect would be something like:

"We see this change caused a lot of friction within the community. Please post suggestions for a compromise only in this thread (link to new thread) along with a brief reasoning. This is not the place to discuss or flame each other. if you dont post a suggestion, do not post at all at this point.

In 7 days the suggestion thread will close. Then a community vote will take place and the most popular 5 options will be brought to the dev team to look into. We will come back to you after a couple of days with an answer on whether and how quickly the top 5 selections can be implemented."

 

Being proactive with a statement like that, offering a clear path ahead beats letting issues like this fester.

 

If you expect BW to do any of that I don’t know where you’ve been for past 9 years as that has never happened before for any change. Plus as an aside letting popularity decide on exclusive content is asinine if in some wild delusion they entertained it. BW Devs have decided as that the stacks in MM was excessive trivialization and removed them.

Edited February 19, 2020 by FerkWork

The dev's wanted stacks gone and that's what they implemented.

 

simply not true

simply not true

 

Ehh, it’s pretty close to true. The dev was considering it, and even testing it a little bit. It may not have been planned for this patch, but it was probably coming in some form or another. They have certainly claimed it as a purposeful implementation now.

I just saw a pug group getting Gate Crasher without stacks, is this even legal? #BringBackTheStack

I just saw a pug group getting Gate Crasher without stacks, is this even legal? #BringBackTheStack

 

nice hacks bro