I'm sure I'm not the only one that seems to run into this frequently.

You get a FP or Uprising queue pop, usually in Master Mode/Veteran Mode, and then as soon as the group accepts and sees it's one of the harder or longer ones, someone usually instaquits, usually a healer or tank, leaving the group hanging, waiting for a replacement that may never come or take a long time.

There has to be a way to keep people from doing this. The Groupfinder lockout clearly isn't enough. Is there a way to add something significant for dropping at the start of an activity? CXP penalty? Longer lockout timer? LS/DS points penalty?

I'm sure I'm not the only one that seems to run into this frequently.

 

You get a FP or Uprising queue pop, usually in Master Mode/Veteran Mode, and then as soon as the group accepts and sees it's one of the harder or longer ones, someone usually instaquits, usually a healer or tank, leaving the group hanging, waiting for a replacement that may never come or take a long time.

 

There has to be a way to keep people from doing this. The Groupfinder lockout clearly isn't enough. Is there a way to add something significant for dropping at the start of an activity? CXP penalty? Longer lockout timer? LS/DS points penalty?

While I agree this is annoying, so long as it is not the tank that drops (in Master Mode) you can get away with a high influence companion filling in. You do have to be a LOT more careful with your pulls (use CC and stuns, etc) In veteran mode you barely need the companion...so long as the group knows the FP you can three man a vet mode FP.

In addition, I assume you play DPS most of the time. Have you tried tanking or healing at all? Both roles are not nearly as hard as legends portent. If more players would play tanks and healers they would not be left high and dry as often.

People mainly quit for two reasons:

1. A lack of confidence (or good self-assessment) makes them think they will be a burden to the group in the FPs that are known to be harder. They list for all FPs anyway, because they want the daily reward.

2. A brief inspection of the other group members (or previous experience with one of them) gave them the conclusion that the group is not ready for the harder FPs (to put it nicely).

You'll never know whether they were wrong in case 1, but you'll soon know whether #2 was right or wrong.

The best solution for #1 would be just to reduce the daily reward when FPs are deselected instead of disabling it completely. Not sure about #2, do you really want to force them to stay in the group and then have them quit group when the first (near-)wipe confirms their first impression?

What angers me more are the guys that instantly decline as soon as GF opens.

What angers me more are the guys that instantly decline as soon as GF opens.

That - so much that.

What angers me more are the guys that instantly decline as soon as GF opens.

This might be because they queued for multiple group activities and when one pops, the others do not necessarily unqueue. For example: I KNOW that when I am in queue for PvP and GF, and PvP pops I am not automatically removed from GF queue (I had a few instances where PvP pops, I go into the PvP instance (WZ or arena) and then the GF queue pops). When I queue for both, I do whichever pops first. But when GF pops it specifically states that I will be removed from all other queues once the group starts.

I'm sure I'm not the only one that seems to run into this frequently.

 

You get a FP or Uprising queue pop, usually in Master Mode/Veteran Mode, and then as soon as the group accepts and sees it's one of the harder or longer ones, someone usually instaquits, usually a healer or tank, leaving the group hanging, waiting for a replacement that may never come or take a long time.

 

There has to be a way to keep people from doing this. The Groupfinder lockout clearly isn't enough. Is there a way to add something significant for dropping at the start of an activity? CXP penalty? Longer lockout timer? LS/DS points penalty?

I am a healer and on the rare occasion I use group finder I will leave group for Master (Hardmode) flashpoints if:

(1) I have dealt with one of the members before and do not want to deal with the attitude again. (I don't use ignore except in extreme cases).

(2) I have checked the gear of the individuals and find that some of them still has the gear they started out on leveling and therefore know we are going to have a hard time clearing this flashpoint so I save myself the headache.

(3) Something in real life comes up that I need to deal with.

The way i see things when someone quits team in a veteran or master mode flashpoint :

1. rank 50 influence Torian in healing role FTW !

2. if the quitter is the tank is no big deal, i am like always the highest DPS in group and 99% of mobs ignore tank or other DPS and chase me :D:D

3. so what if the other have bad gear or no idea how to play? as far as i'm concerned they can kiss the floor, i know i won't. besides, i'm a LS and i resurrect them to take their rewards

Can agree with th sentiment ... nothing more annoying that someone who quits before finding out if the group can do the fp.

Had a veteran Depths of Manaan the other day, 70 jugg tank(me), 70 sniper, 26 merc healer 16 shadow dps and thought oh well this'll be interesting ... no one quit, one death (not wipe) on Ortunno due to adds when Ortunno was about 20% health to go same on Stivastin ... just goes to show the harder ones can be done even with low lvls involved. Have had similar experiences on vet Blood Hunt too.

My guess is, (and this will annoy some), is the ones who quit before trying are unsure of their own abilities and need (or want) to be carried ...

Can't speak much for "veteran" flashpoint (Tactical was such a better term) but for HM, I can maybe shed some light on why people leave. (HM = master, but force of habit, I,ll still refer to it as HM)

First off tough, I'd like to clarify I'm not someone who quits group for the reason I'll enumerate. Rather I avoid queuing altogether if not with a premade group, for those reason, and I assume I am not alone in that, resulting in pops being a lot harder to get than in say, 1.0 or 2.0 when people did those HM FPs daily.

1st- Some flashpoint actually have mechanic worthy of HM ops (thats "veteran" ops now. See why I use HM rather han those new titles?). And not everyone has the awareness or class mastery to deal with them. DPS check aren't a very big things in HM FP via "enrage" like they are in ops, but they do have certain mechanic that makes life VERY difficult if dps is lacking. Out of the top of my head, Blood Hunt's first boss, and orturno's, or whatever the spelling, adds.

2nd-Some people are really bad at their class from all the spoon feeding BW did since 2.0. It REALLY shows as soon as they throw something a little harder their way. You can literally go through the solo campaign by spamming the basic attack now if you want, Jedi Knight excluded perhaps. It has an effect on ppl proceeding to end game. So upon seeing a player is still in greens from lvl 45, you have a good idea they also probably dont have the knowledge of their class or playing level required for some HM FPs. Also, assuming average skills, gear is a very nice way to ensure at the very least harder hitting basic attacks.

3rd-Seriously, hitting flashpoint with lots of convo in a pug nowadays mean there is someone that want to see the "story" 80% of the time. I understand the enjoyment story can provide, I really do. I enjoyed everyone of them.

In tactical or solo. Hard Modes are not the place for this, its normally done with people who've ran it dozen of time and are there for progression, not social and narrative. Its not rude to expect that, its the truth, and it used to be widespread as a point of view. I never rushed someone in a "tactical" that didnt have a solo mode because they wanted to see the lines. But in the hard mode, hit that spacebar so we can move on.

So with all of this in mind, lets say I was to queue an HM FP today, here is why I'd leave:

Its either one of this flashpoints in HM:

-Battle of Rishi

-Blood Hunt

-Czerka Core Meltdown (unless I am the tank, then I'll try it)

-Lost Island

If I see worrisome element, particularly healer or tank I'd also drop these

-Kaon

-Czerka Labs

-Red Reaper

So yes, someone suggested that the daily reward be reviewed. Either add another category of HM FP regrouping at the very least the first 4 together as "tier 2 HM", or apply the daily in a way that deselecting some fp only marginally penalize the bonus (wth is it even nowadays? We don't exactly have coms anymore. Chunk of CXP I guess?) and it would probably both bring back people, and lessen the people leaving straight after group formed.

As for people who quit before FP even appears, well it can be either:

They are attempting to join an in progress group (should be queued above you, but sometimes the mechanic bugs, hence why most ppl try to "queue at the same time" to ensure success. Sometime miscommunication happens, and the group doesnt queue and the "relief tank" queue and get a "new pop" they deny when seeing the names aren't the group he's trying to join.

OR

one of you is a player they REALLY don't want to be grouped with from previous experience.

Also, it happened to me once, realized I queued for the wrong thing, refused the pop, corrected my checked boxes and requeued.

1. rank 50 influence Torian in healing role FTW !

Got kicked from story mode Trial and Error yesterday after one of the group members left. What happened: one of the group members said that we can't defeat first boss without healer. We tried anyway and everyone died. Group member left and I call lvl50 Risha to help us. Made sure she is in heal mode. Vote kick reason: we need healer companion. I guess that 137k hp looks like tank hp if you're used to seeing 115k hp on your dps/healer companion. It is true that having high influence companion helps a lot especially in veteran mode FPs when everyone else in group quits after first wipe. Almost all of them are really easy. Only one I haven't been able to do is Mandalorian Raiders. Keep failing in first boss fight. Yeah, I'm really bad at this game.

Red Reaper

What!? They did lazy job at HM version. They barely added anything to it. First two bosses are exactly the same in both difficulties. Only in last boss fight you have one more thing to interrupt.

What I really don't get is when people accept a pop and then never come into the flashpoint but also don't ever quit and never react in chat. I'm always wondering if it's deliberate and that they're hoping to get XP/CXP for doing nothing, or if there's some other issue. I usually wait a few minutes at the starting point, then pull out companion and go on with the others, giving them time until the first boss. If there's still no reaction, kick-vote with reason "absent".

It may just be coincidence, but I've seen that sort of thing more frequently lately.

What!? They did lazy job at HM version. They barely added anything to it. First two bosses are exactly the same in both difficulties. Only in last boss fight you have one more thing to interrupt.

Ya its the thrash that is ridiculous if you don't have a good healer lol.

What I really don't get is when people accept a pop and then never come into the flashpoint but also don't ever quit and never react in chat. I'm always wondering if it's deliberate and that they're hoping to get XP/CXP for doing nothing, or if there's some other issue. I usually wait a few minutes at the starting point, then pull out companion and go on with the others, giving them time until the first boss. If there's still no reaction, kick-vote with reason "absent".

 

It may just be coincidence, but I've seen that sort of thing more frequently lately.

My guess would be, that they want to be kicked from the group because they didn't like the flashpoint that gf gave you. (Usually BoR, BH, Manaan or LI, or the czerka ones because they don't count for the weekly). And beeing kicked meens no lockout from gf.

My pain points in this regard:

1. People who decline as soon as the GF pops; why queue in the first place for things you don't like? (At this point no one knows what the specific Uprising, WZ or FP is but they decline).
   
2. People who don't respond for the entire duration of the timer, wasting everyone's time.
   
3. People who enter higher difficulty stuff without having done the same thing at a lower difficulty.
   
4. Bolster and such not withstanding, people queuing in very weak gear; just disrespectful to rest of the team considering how inexpensive gear is from fleet vendors (not to mention gear from Heroics).
   
5. The bug where everyone accepts but the game thinks someone hasn't, so everyone's time is wasted as the timer goes down to zero and the team is re-queued.
   

I think the issue is that some flashpoints legitimately just suck. I hate most of the newer ones except the Czerka ones I guess. Don't know why, I just prefer the good old ones like Cademimu, Boarding Party, Foundry, Red Reaper and so on. You're free to deselect the FPs that you don't wanna do, but that makes you ineligible for the daily bonus. So my solution to this problem is that they have a separate queue for, as I'm going to call them, the "classic flashpoints" and a separate one for the newer flashpoints like Korriban Incursion, Tython whatever, Manaan, and so on. And if you're the type of person who doesn't care then you can select both and queue for all of them. But then you say "Well then you'd be able to complete 2 daily FP missions, silly!". Well I'm sure they could easily make it so that you can only get the daily once from the 2 different FP types.

Edit: I would like to add that I think there should be separate queues not only for the Master mode FPs at level 70 but the Veteran 10-70 ones as well.

Time is always a limiting factor and a very expensive resource. I insta-quit certain Flashpoints:

1. Blood Hunt - Not doing it at all, waste of time, doesn't matter if its veteran or Master.

2. Lost Island

3. Czerka Meltdown - I won't do it unless I am tanking or healing or on my Sent (pacify ftw).

4. Depths of Manaan

Uprising no point in doing anything except fractured because the rest are way too long and buggy.

The fact is if you wipe, its a waste of time. So, its just better to do the ones you know you are least likely to have a wipe in even if people are very bad.

Battle of Rishi and Assault on Tython uses to be problematic but not anymore.

My pain points in this regard:

 

1. People who decline as soon as the GF pops; why queue in the first place for things you don't like? (At this point no one knows what the specific Uprising, WZ or FP is but they decline).
   
2. People who don't respond for the entire duration of the timer, wasting everyone's time.
   
3. People who enter higher difficulty stuff without having done the same thing at a lower difficulty.
   
4. Bolster and such not withstanding, people queuing in very weak gear; just disrespectful to rest of the team considering how inexpensive gear is from fleet vendors (not to mention gear from Heroics).
   
5. The bug where everyone accepts but the game thinks someone hasn't, so everyone's time is wasted as the timer goes down to zero and the team is re-queued.
   

1. For me, there are a couple of reasons why I leave queue when it pops: as I said in a previous post, I queue for multiple things, one of them pops but does not always remove me from the other queues (if I get into a WZ, the GF queue is still active); or maybe it is a veteran FP and the group consists of 3 tanks or 3 healers...it's doable yes but will take far longer than necessary due to lack of DPS; or maybe I queued it, guild wants to do something, before I can unqueue it pops so I decline the group.

2. I agree that waiting the full two minutes is annoying, and most of the time it is a DPS that is "not ready." Chances are they went AFK, or are watching youtube/netflix while waiting and do not see the pop. If there was a way for the alert to be more "intrusive" (AKA louder) without having to crank the system volume, that might reduce this problem.

3 & 4. Honestly, I do not care what gear/experience my teammates have. What I care about is them knowing the mechanics and if they do not know the mechanics speak up and I will gladly instruct...but they also HAVE to be willing and able to follow those instructions; I would rather have 3 newbies in my groups that will take what I tell them to heart than any veteran player who thinks they know what they are doing and consistently fails.

5. I've only encountered this once.

maybe it is a veteran FP and the group consists of 3 tanks or 3 healers...it's doable yes but will take far longer than necessary due to lack of DPS

Just because group finder says they're a tank doesn't mean they only selected tank. If you select both tank and dps in group finder, it will tell the other group members you're a tank since veteran FPs are role-neutral. Same goes for healers. So just because group finder tells you they're a tank or a healer doesn't mean they actually are. Most likely, they are a dps especially when you consider that by default group finder always has tank and dps or healer and dps both selected.

I cant speak for other players, but the main reason I do FPs is to complete the weekly/daily, but specifically to complete my achievements for each FP. I have run certain FPs the required 25 times, so I dont want to run them again, so I drop a FP that I have completed to have an opportunity to get another one that I need for my achievements. I can also load up an alt to bypass the 15 min lockout.

How to fix it? Not sure. If BW gives people the ability to complete the weekly/daily with selection of specific FPs, some will get more neglected. If BW increases the number of achievements for old FPs, long-time players may get frustrated that they have to go back over the ones they spent so much time already completing. To prevent bypassing the lockout by swapping, BW would be publically ripped to shreds if they prevented swapping toons.

I cant speak for other players, but the main reason I do FPs is to complete the weekly/daily, but specifically to complete my achievements for each FP. I have run certain FPs the required 25 times, so I dont want to run them again, so I drop a FP that I have completed to have an opportunity to get another one that I need for my achievements. I can also load up an alt to bypass the 15 min lockout.

 

How to fix it? Not sure. If BW gives people the ability to complete the weekly/daily with selection of specific FPs, some will get more neglected. If BW increases the number of achievements for old FPs, long-time players may get frustrated that they have to go back over the ones they spent so much time already completing. To prevent bypassing the lockout by swapping, BW would be publically ripped to shreds if they prevented swapping toons.

Or, you can run 1 random fp for daily and then just pick flashpoints you want. Tbh, instaquitets not bother me so mutch, there are always companion and you can do most Masters with comp healer or dps. But those Who not response or decline constantly, those are bad. Not responce is often bug, but when you get pop and sameone decline, and it happens many times a row, it make me Wonder, why You even queue for content you do not like.

but when you get pop and sameone decline, and it happens many times a row, it make me Wonder.

I can riddle that for you.

I recently maxed out my flashpoint achievements which meant over the course of 3 weeks i did 200+ flashpoints.

After a while i started actively declining queues cos either i didn't like the composition or there was a low level scrub that needs to be carried. After /ignore <insert name> on them i just re-queue. Rinse and repeat.

Once i actually accepted a queue and deemed it worth my while i enter the flashpoint then inspect everyone's gear. If the healers gear is garbage i automatically leave, if both DD's gear is garbage same story.

If only one DD's gear is garbage but the other one is decked out i would normally stay, and if later on we fail a damage check (This sounds hilarious when we talk about a flashpoint doesn't it?) i would then get the inferior DD kicked to do it with a companion.

What i just said might sound harsh but i found it to be the only way to invest my time smartly. I would rather leave flashpoints and wait 15 minutes to requeue than to struggle in there for 50 minutes before calling it.

Honestly what needs to change in order to provide a better experience for players who actually want to do flashpoints:

• Do NOT allow sub lvl 70's to queue for Hard-mode flashpoints (They are not able to carry their weight)
  
• There HAS to be a minimum gear level to allow you to queue up.
  

In anyway those of you that don't agree with this. For once i don't care and second, go do 200 flashpoints and tell me your experiences

Or, you can run 1 random fp for daily and then just pick flashpoints you want. Tbh, instaquitets not bother me so mutch, there are always companion and you can do most Masters with comp healer or dps. But those Who not response or decline constantly, those are bad. Not responce is often bug, but when you get pop and sameone decline, and it happens many times a row, it make me Wonder, why You even queue for content you do not like.

As someone else said, I like to maximize my time in game, because I cant play as often as I once did.

As someone else said, I like to maximize my time in game, because I cant play as often as I once did.

Maybe then just check flashpoints you want and stop wasting other peoples time?

....

Honestly what needs to change in order to provide a better experience for players who actually want to do flashpoints:

• Do NOT allow sub lvl 70's to queue for Hard-mode flashpoints (They are not able to carry their weight)
  
• There HAS to be a minimum gear level to allow you to queue up.
  

 

In anyway those of you that don't agree with this. For once i don't care and second, go do 200 flashpoints and tell me your experiences

I'm working on my 100% FP Achievements as well and am almost finished with master mode and most of the veterans too, only the rep only things are left open as i'm mainly playing imperial.

While i have to agree that there are many many many groups with bad players, but the character level is no indication for skill or not. At least as far as i experienced it.

I had a lot of full 70 group not being able to kill the Lost Island bonus boss or struggle with Lorrik, or having each and every boss in Black Talon to end in enrage , while just yesterday i had a level 55 first timer in master LI, that followed all instructions well and it was a breeze to run, bonus included. He died a few times but we still killed everything except of Sav-rak with the first pull.

He just knew how to play his marauder. Just like the others knew their classes, that was what mattered.

Level is no indication about "that guy probably knows what he does" at all.

It can work well with all 70, but it's also possible to have some really bad apples with you like my various all enrage BT runs in the last weeks. Just as it is possible that the 50-69 character accepting the queue pop is a veteran player who knows everything in FPs and his class by heart.

Gear doesn't matter that much either compared to knowledge about the class and FP in question

The only exception is the tank, as bolster doesn't work well with this role. But as i'm tanking most of the time i avoid this problem.

Since i ask at the beginning of every FP to "please speak up if not knowing the master mode mechanics, before we wipe without need" instead of "everyone been here before?" i have the feeling the players are more inclined to tell they need a refresh of what bosses do or realize that there maybe is a differnce between master and solo/veteran. At least i get more pleas to explain lately which enhances the chances of success immensely

The only exception is Blood Hunt and to an extend Battle of Rishi, but the latter i only do with friends and guild groups anyway due to bonus boss, and the first rnds usually leave instantly without even trying it once, i don't bother to list for it.

There are many bads out there, but i usually give them a chance with one try at the boss.

If I'm not in the mood for this *game of dice* the GF is, I have to run with a 3/4 or 4/4 premade group and avoid rnds completely.

I'm working on my 100% FP Achievements as well and am almost finished with master mode and most of the veterans too, only the rep only things are left open as i'm mainly playing imperial.

 

While i have to agree that there are many many many groups with bad players, but the character level is no indication for skill or not. At least as far as i experienced it.

I had a lot of full 70 group not being able to kill the Lost Island bonus boss or struggle with Lorrik, or having each and every boss in Black Talon to end in enrage , while just yesterday i had a level 55 first timer in master LI, that followed all instructions well and it was a breeze to run, bonus included. He died a few times but we still killed everything except of Sav-rak with the first pull.

He just knew how to play his marauder. Just like the others knew their classes, that was what mattered.

 

Level is no indication about "that guy probably knows what he does" at all.

It can work well with all 70, but it's also possible to have some really bad apples with you like my various all enrage BT runs in the last weeks. Just as it is possible that the 50-69 character accepting the queue pop is a veteran player who knows everything in FPs and his class by heart.

Gear doesn't matter that much either compared to knowledge about the class and FP in question

The only exception is the tank, as bolster doesn't work well with this role. But as i'm tanking most of the time i avoid this problem.

 

Since i ask at the beginning of every FP to "please speak up if not knowing the master mode mechanics, before we wipe without need" instead of "everyone been here before?" i have the feeling the players are more inclined to tell they need a refresh of what bosses do or realize that there maybe is a differnce between master and solo/veteran. At least i get more pleas to explain lately which enhances the chances of success immensely

 

The only exception is Blood Hunt and to an extend Battle of Rishi, but the latter i only do with friends and guild groups anyway due to bonus boss, and the first rnds usually leave instantly without even trying it once, i don't bother to list for it.

There are many bads out there, but i usually give them a chance with one try at the boss.

If I'm not in the mood for this *game of dice* the GF is, I have to run with a 3/4 or 4/4 premade group and avoid rnds completely.

sub level 70's are not able to equip high tier gear, unless they have their previous 224's left over they cant pull their weight in 98% of the scenarios. There are always exceptions to this, but the handful of exceptions does not warrant allowing sub 70's for queuing up. At least not for hard-modes, no bolster there...