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Class Changes: Lightning Sorcerer / Telekinetics Sage

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Class Changes: Lightning Sorcerer / Telekinetics Sage
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timovdt's Avatar


timovdt
09.26.2017 , 03:58 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Equeliber View Post
30%? Admit it, you are just spitting out random numbers and have no clue what you are talking about.
this pretymutch the nerf we got at the start of the epxansion and we hwere only mid table in 4.0

Marauder's Avatar


Marauder
09.26.2017 , 04:19 AM | #22
Looking at the parse numbers from https://torcommunity.com/guides/misc...class-rankings Lightning Sorcerer is already the worst performing PvE spec with ~1400 dps lower then the top performing spec. It sits at the bottom of the dps charts and everybody knows this to be true. How on earth do you justify dropping the dps by another 200-300?

Even with some of the nerfs to the other classes, this will keep Lightning Sorcerer firmly at the bottom and with a wide margin. All the classes should be within ~500dps max of each other. I would just like to understand why the devs and some in this thread think this is ok? I am strictly looking at it from taking a dps role in PvE, our dps is already pretty bad and now it will be worse?

Hoppinswtor's Avatar


Hoppinswtor
09.26.2017 , 04:40 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Marauder View Post
Looking at the parse numbers from https://torcommunity.com/guides/misc...class-rankings Lightning Sorcerer is already the worst performing PvE spec with ~1400 dps lower then the top performing spec. It sits at the bottom of the dps charts and everybody knows this to be true. How on earth do you justify dropping the dps by another 200-300?

Even with some of the nerfs to the other classes, this will keep Lightning Sorcerer firmly at the bottom and with a wide margin. All the classes should be within ~500dps max of each other. I would just like to understand why the devs and some in this thread think this is ok? I am strictly looking at it from taking a dps role in PvE, our dps is already pretty bad and now it will be worse?
Those numbers are both inaccurate and outdated; they don't reflect recent nerfs. Lightning's AVERAGE parse is even higher than 9350; in full min-max 248's with datacrons and optimal force speed use, you should be averaging about 9500 on a dummy, not 9350. Arsenal should be averaging about 9200 on a dummy, not 10.1k. This nerf will put average Lightning parse at anywhere from 9200-9400, or pretty much right where Arsenal and Marksman will be. Heck, the peak parse might even be close to 9500 still.

They want Arsenal, Marksman, and Lightning at around 5 percent below their target DPS (which seems to be around 9750 based on top parses for specs). That puts it firmly in the 9200-9300 range, which is where all three of these specs will be (barring good or bad crits).

I'm not a fan of their choice to nerf everything instead of buffing and rebalancing content (you want people to feel like they are progressing, not regressing) but Lightning is better than people think.
Hoppin <Death Smile>
Hoppinator (Merc), Hoppin (Sorc), Hopposites (Mara), Hoptimal (Sin)
Hopalicious (Jugg), Oppinator (Operative), Hoptimize (PT)

tonitirola's Avatar


tonitirola
09.26.2017 , 05:30 AM | #24
instead of use the time to make new content they waste it on nerf classes all the time.
this devs are rly rly the last and should get fired asap
i dont have mood login to it anymore after 4,5 yrs and sub all time .
i know is long for sub but i didnt want disband guild, cause i was gm and if prefered cant keep the guild.
but now guild is dying too so i dont care anymore and stop my sub.
no more money for YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Marauder's Avatar


Marauder
09.26.2017 , 07:51 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by Hoppinswtor View Post
Those numbers are both inaccurate and outdated; they don't reflect recent nerfs. Lightning's AVERAGE parse is even higher than 9350; in full min-max 248's with datacrons and optimal force speed use, you should be averaging about 9500 on a dummy, not 9350. Arsenal should be averaging about 9200 on a dummy, not 10.1k. This nerf will put average Lightning parse at anywhere from 9200-9400, or pretty much right where Arsenal and Marksman will be. Heck, the peak parse might even be close to 9500 still.

They want Arsenal, Marksman, and Lightning at around 5 percent below their target DPS (which seems to be around 9750 based on top parses for specs). That puts it firmly in the 9200-9300 range, which is where all three of these specs will be (barring good or bad crits).

I'm not a fan of their choice to nerf everything instead of buffing and rebalancing content (you want people to feel like they are progressing, not regressing) but Lightning is better than people think.
OK, I am not a good number cruncher like some but I have a 70 carnage Mara, a 70 infiltration shadow and my 70 lightning Sorcerer. I can tell you from playing my green geared shadow does way more damage then my well geared with augments lightning sorcerer. I really do not understand how they feel a damage nerf makes any sense for this class. Both mara and assassin although melee have the never ending jump to target if you kill the initial target so really melee/ ranged is kind of irrelevant. Sorc has some small attacks you can do while moving but both crushing darkness and your main filler lightning bolt you have to be stationary (except off a proc). I really don't get what they are seeing.

Give sorcerer more mobility then maybe, take lightning bolt off the cant cast and move list. I am not saying some classes might be over performing and need to be adjusted but sorcerer is not in that mix and should be slightly buffed or at least given more freedom to cast and move.

Zasszz's Avatar


Zasszz
09.26.2017 , 07:53 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
To bring the Lightning Sorcerer / Telekinetics Sage to their DPS target, we reduced the critical damage bonus given from Reverberating Force / Reverberation by 5% and increased the damage dealt by Shock / Project while Crushing Darkness / Mind Crush is on the target.
You already nerfed the guaranteed crit of thundering blast. Now you reduce the crit damage of three hardest hitting attacks of the lightning spec. This does not fit the concept of an improvement.

Quote:
- Convulsing Currents now gives Shock a 35% damage increase when the enemy is affected by Crushing Darkness, up from 20%
This doesnt look like a real improvement either. Shock is really bad with crits so buffing its bonus damage when its not very high in the priority list doesnt appear to be a buff either. Especially after nerfing the other abilities that usually crit more often and much higher.

Im not a math expert but improving 1-2 shocks for each crushing darkness by 15% is something we should be looking forward to? Really?

Quote: Originally Posted by Hoppinswtor View Post
Those numbers are both inaccurate and outdated; they don't reflect recent nerfs. Lightning's AVERAGE parse is even higher than 9350; in full min-max 248's with datacrons and optimal force speed use, you should be averaging about 9500 on a dummy, not 9350. Arsenal should be averaging about 9200 on a dummy, not 10.1k. This nerf will put average Lightning parse at anywhere from 9200-9400, or pretty much right where Arsenal and Marksman will be. Heck, the peak parse might even be close to 9500 still.
Maybe leave out the dummy numbers. They only cause confusion and people think this is something they can achieve in heavy movement fights.

Quote: Originally Posted by Hoppinswtor View Post
They want Arsenal, Marksman, and Lightning at around 5 percent below their target DPS (which seems to be around 9750 based on top parses for specs). That puts it firmly in the 9200-9300 range, which is where all three of these specs will be (barring good or bad crits).
This would be nice. But its more likely wishful thinking on our part. If they knew what they were doing they would have balanced classes over a year ago. Or during beta testing.

Quote: Originally Posted by Hoppinswtor View Post
I'm not a fan of their choice to nerf everything instead of buffing and rebalancing content (you want people to feel like they are progressing, not regressing) but Lightning is better than people think.
Balancing by buffing weak specs and abilities is something people like and need. It doesnt just sound like an improvement, it gives players the feeling of getting stronger which is exactly what will happen. Getting nerfed at one end, getting a tiny buff on the other is just not that. If a dev cant grasp this after 2 decades of MMO history then that person is incompetent. Yet thats exactly what we see in every patch here.
If I were a full time raider I would have quit this game a long time ago. And given their level of incompetence I probably wont aspire a raiding career here either.

It just hurts to love a game thats being ruined by a bunch of incompetent devs.
______________
333 - Only half evil.

Free goodies: http://www.swtor.com/r/VcBZjK

Totemdancer's Avatar


Totemdancer
09.26.2017 , 08:56 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by omaan View Post
Wont it make a new fotm lol? Almost everyone got harsh nerfs while lighting gets a good buff... isnt this too much?
Lightning was at the bottom and has already had a defensive nerf a few months ago. They were over due for a small buff.

cyrusramsey's Avatar


cyrusramsey
09.26.2017 , 01:32 PM | #28
It's funny how they were afraid to actually come out and call it for what it was like with the other classes, that the class was overperforming and bringing their DPS down, but talk around it like this.

I dunno, I see someone saying that this is needed to bring them in line with MM and Arsenal, but right now I'd already much favor MM or Arsenal in any and all PVE content that is not a dummy parse or solo play. This feels like yet another big mistake to me.
#alts

Marauder's Avatar


Marauder
09.26.2017 , 04:16 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by cyrusramsey View Post
It's funny how they were afraid to actually come out and call it for what it was like with the other classes, that the class was overperforming and bringing their DPS down, but talk around it like this.

I dunno, I see someone saying that this is needed to bring them in line with MM and Arsenal, but right now I'd already much favor MM or Arsenal in any and all PVE content that is not a dummy parse or solo play. This feels like yet another big mistake to me.
That's what I don't get. The sorcerer has mobility issues with casting its attacks so standing at a dummy is ridiculous. Mara and assassin can basically move/jump to the targets instantly now and just keep running and attacking but if the sorc has to move it limits its damage a lot. If your going to drop the dps again then allow lightning bolt and crushing darkness to be cast on the move or reduce the cast time by 50%.

xJediRyanx's Avatar


xJediRyanx
09.27.2017 , 12:37 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Marauder View Post
That's what I don't get. The sorcerer has mobility issues with casting its attacks so standing at a dummy is ridiculous. Mara and assassin can basically move/jump to the targets instantly now and just keep running and attacking but if the sorc has to move it limits its damage a lot. If your going to drop the dps again then allow lightning bolt and crushing darkness to be cast on the move or reduce the cast time by 50%.
Logic. That just won't happen with Bioware. They just want to make the game unfun to play, which I will say, is one of the first things they may actually succeed at. Sorc DPS going on 2 years now of being complete trash. GG.