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New Merc Jetpack Ability!


Warlord_Maliken

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I'd recommend having the distance propelled being a few meters further than Force leap. That way a jedi has to at least take a few steps before they jump to you again.

 

Keep in mind in the description I have of the #1 ability now. The Mercenary would be immune to snares and slows while disengaging for those 2 seconds, which means if a Jedi Knight were to charge you in the middle of your disengage, the knight wouldn't land on you, he'd land short. You'd be immune to his charge root :) Or maybe they could make it where the Mercenary was unable to be Force Charged (as a planted sniper is) while disengaging in the air for those 2 seconds, to keep its validity.

I like your recommendation about the freecast while disengaging, as oppose to the Mercenary automatically firing a barrage of shots with both pistols.

Edited by Warlord_Maliken
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Keep in mind in the description I have of the #1 ability now. The Mercenary would be immune to snares and slows while disengaging for those 2 seconds, which means if a Jedi Knight were to charge you in the middle of your disengage, the knight wouldn't land on you, he'd land short. You'd be immune to his charge root :) Or maybe they could make it where the Mercenary was unable to be Force Charged (as a planted sniper is) while disengaging in the air for those 2 seconds, to keep its validity.

I like your recommendation about the freecast while disengaging, as oppose to the Mercenary automatically firing a barrage of shots with both pistols.

 

Having freecast while leaping feels like it could be a bit OP in my opinion (partly because this would probably also require the ability to be off GCD), and it would also be difficult for the animators to make it looks good, but I like the idea of having the Merc shoot at the target while leaping, this could also be used as the explanation of why the target is slowed (same as with Unload), and it could be made to look awesome. :)

 

I like the idea where it would not be possible to leap to the Merc, and having it basically work the same as the Sniper's cover is. This would also fix the potential issue of an Assassin or Powertech instantly using their pulls on you.

 

The reason why I prefer the Disengage idea over the ground targeted idea, is because I'm worried that the ground targeted ability would be very overpowered especially in Huttball.

Edited by Rassuro
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Developers should allow mercs to fly upwards, straight up, at the very least. This will have an immunity to charge for the duration and interrupts and pulls, and if it's huttball, they will be able to jump up a level to a ground targeted area or just jump up and hover for 3 seconds so that they can move their character onto the above huttball platforms.

 

or add a Disarm/Silence all abilities ability to the mercenary class.

Edited by DkSharktooth
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I'm cool with the idea of a stun rather than freecast. It would be easier to animate the blaster bolts (a la Jango Fett). The disengage takes two seconds to complete, firing a bounty hunter at least twenty meters back. The disengage kicks in a four-second stun so that we can land And prepare to fire something else.

 

I'm not thrilled with the straight up idea. What happens when you land (right in range of that jedi's lightsaber)?

Edited by Nassik
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I think idea 2 would be good for PT so they can get into close rang faster

 

It would be easier just to give them jet charge as a static skill rather than excluding it in the tank tree.

 

I also agree with the OP... some good ideas for better utility on a class that is a glorified sorc with pistols with 1/2 the utility.

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I totally agree with those 2 abilities or at least to apply in game one of em. It would be nice If on my Merc i could jetpack away while shooting. Those shots could do small damage but it would be nice if they would slow target movement :) I have Vanguard and Merc. While Vanguard is simply good, merc has got great potential for being good DPS and enjoyable class, but he lacks mobylity. ON PvP I start making damage and in 95% of situations few seconds later sentinel/guartdian/vanguard is in front of me interupting my tracer mislle and avoiding my heavy armour, so

/signed

 

PS. We could make some kind of petition or something, it would make it more visible to BW if we would posted something like it on forum :)

Edited by Michalrajtar
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I'm a Marauder/operative, and I approve this message.

 

Any time a dps merc is targeted, they're pretty much boned. Their damage is fine, so long as they're left unmolested, but their defensive/kiting options simply aren't up to par with dps sorcs or snipers. They're far too reliant on interruptable casts, and they don't have enough viable means of getting those casts off when under duress. Sure, if no one targets them, they can blow people up, but that doesn't justify their weakness when attention is directed their way.

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Our fragility in PVP is humiliating. I solo queue for war zones, knowing that I'm going to get hammered but I hope that I'll do some good for my team. A jetpack disengage would do wonders for our class. It would greatly increase our survivability and allow us to put out the DPS that our spec (arsenal) is supposed to do.

 

Just today I was repeatedly ganked by a smuggler using stealth. He'd stun me (fair enough), then just stand there and destroy me. Once the stun wore off, there was no where for me to go and nothing for me to do. I got off a shot or two but with no way to disengage, I was doomed the moment the smuggler saw me. This happens with other classes as well. Once a lightsaber-wielder engages me, it's over.

 

The way the mercenary currently is, I've had to resort to playing the sniper. I hide whenever and wherever I can. It's suicide for me to directly engage anyone.

 

It's especially disheartening when I find myself on guard duty. Usually, I end up alone and, when that happens, I know that I'm dead the moment I get an incoming. So I don't even bother taking a shot anymore. Instead, I call incoming with the number and type of incomings. There's no way that I can survive a fight on my own and so I sacrifice myself. At least in my inevitable death I can let my team know what's happening.

 

At first, getting repeatedly reamed was embarrassing. Now it's evolved into complete and utter humiliation.

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Both ability ideas are pretty bad ideas. Mercs already have a knockback that can root, and two slows that don't even need to be spec'd into. Also, there IS a skill (Power Shield of Bodyguard tree) that you can spec into that makes casts uninterruptable during the duration of Energy Shield. OP has no idea what he's talking about and I highly doubt he's even played competitively in PVP.

 

The fact of the matter is, the OP wants Mercs to have all these new tools to get away from people, instead of using the ones already available to him. The leap that PT's have require you to spec into the Shieldtech tree to get - it's not like we all just get it by being a PT. Grapple (the pull) only works if your target's resolve bar is not full - which it never is because of stun overlapping. PT's have no way of escaping combat while Mercs already have a couple of great tools. LEARN TO USE THEM.

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^ Please ignore the sad obvious troll and he will eventually go away, no need to derail a good thread by making it into a pages long trollbait.

 

Just in case some didn't see it, there was a post in the PVP forum regarding Mercs:

Hi everyone! I talked to Austin Peckenpaugh (Senior Designer) about Commandos and Mercenaries and their situation in PvP right now, and he had this to say:

 

I think it's fair to say that Mercenaries and Commandos have escape issues. Admittedly, they can be very hard to catch when used correctly to hug corners, but a lot of that "escapability" falls aside when attacked by multiple melee enemies, at which point they just aren't quite tough enough to sustain without further escapes. We have plans for the future that should give Mercenaries and Commandos better escapes in PvP.

Perhaps not the best, but at least we know that the devs are aware of that something is missing (as all of us have noticed long ago), and that they will at least try to do something about it eventually. :)

 

"give Mercenaries and Commandos better escapes in PvP" in particular sounds to me like there could indeed be something interesting coming up. :)

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Hm.. why not have the Commando's cannon also have an energy surge sort of thing? You fire a concussive bolt that knocks the target down for XX amount of time. Have it grant you a movement speed boost as well, give it an ammo cost and... I suppose a 15 or 20s CD. Homogeneous classes are boring anyway and because I can't think of anything else to give them to mirror a Mercenaries "disengage".

 

 

And replace our current aggrodrop with this disengage. Because it sounds *********** cool.

>____>

Edited by Ovan_Oh-One
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^ Please ignore the sad obvious troll and he will eventually go away, no need to derail a good thread by making it into a pages long trollbait.

 

lol. It doesn't mean I'm trolling just because you don't like my opinion. There was no troll about it. If the designers really thought that Mercs/Comms were in a bad place, they wouldn't have changed the RP/SS knockback into a root. To me, all these abilities sound like are two more crutches for people that don't understand proper pillar humping procedures - and there's corners in EVERY Warzone. Learn to use them.

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Both ability ideas are pretty bad ideas. Mercs already have a knockback that can root, and two slows that don't even need to be spec'd into. Also, there IS a skill (Power Shield of Bodyguard tree) that you can spec into that makes casts uninterruptable during the duration of Energy Shield. OP has no idea what he's talking about and I highly doubt he's even played competitively in PVP.

 

The fact of the matter is, the OP wants Mercs to have all these new tools to get away from people, instead of using the ones already available to him. The leap that PT's have require you to spec into the Shieldtech tree to get - it's not like we all just get it by being a PT. Grapple (the pull) only works if your target's resolve bar is not full - which it never is because of stun overlapping. PT's have no way of escaping combat while Mercs already have a couple of great tools. LEARN TO USE THEM.

 

Check your facts.

 

Both of the Merc's slows HAVE to be specced into, just like the PT's leap that you're talking about. Kolto Residue in the Bodyguard tree (which also requires a point in Kolto Missile), and Pinning Fire in the Arsenal tree, which is VERY deep in the tree (20 points!). For that matter, Kolto Residue is third-tier - as is Power Shield, which has a 2-minute cooldown and only lasts 12 seconds.

 

That root? It's not attached to a knockback. It used to BE a knockback. And it has to be specced into, too.

 

Bodyguard/Healing Mercs probably don't need much help. But Mercs on the whole do. You're counting these abilities as default when you think of Mercs, and they're not at all. Mercs don't have any more chance of escaping combat than PTs do - and probably less of a chance of surviving said combat.

Edited by JimmyTheCannon
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I've been pushing for this sort of idea since beta (but gave up trying to convince BW shortly after launch). It's clear that the jetpack is something nearly everyone identifies with the BH, and in it's current implementation not offering any combat mobility to mercs dissapoints many. I think with the removal of rocket punch KB and devs admitting mercs and commandos are short on gap makers the timing is *perfect* to implement something like the OP suggests.

 

Also I'm not a fan of the idea that core identifying skills of a Star Wars bounty hunter such as combat jetpack mobility are split up half and half among the advanced classes. If BW wants us to love our toons then advanced classes need to both contain the major class defining skills and then find non-core ones to be split up among the advanced classes. Otherwise we will only half love our toons, which will just not compete.

Edited by Pepperawr
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I fully support the jet pack disengage idea. Mercs are considered free kills by literally every class, although it seems like I attract every sentinel in existence. This ability, if added, will allow mercs to perform much better (and those sents/maras will actually have to work for their kill!). For the commando's mirror ability, I was thinking of something similar to the Hope trailer. The mando could pull out an active thermal detonater, and the blast would throw him back away from the enemy. To compete with the cool-factor of the jet pack ability, the commandos ability could leave the ground and their armor scorched (that is if bioware wanted to be generous!) But anyways, this ability is desperately needed for mercs, and I'm glad that we finally got a response out of bw on the issue. Edited by mandoforlife
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lol. It doesn't mean I'm trolling just because you don't like my opinion. There was no troll about it. If the designers really thought that Mercs/Comms were in a bad place, they wouldn't have changed the RP/SS knockback into a root. To me, all these abilities sound like are two more crutches for people that don't understand proper pillar humping procedures - and there's corners in EVERY Warzone. Learn to use them.

 

To be fair the root is only available to merc's who are of a particular spec, what about the other merc's who choose not to be arsenal, what is your advice then? L2respec?

Edited by Fortunefive
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  • 7 months later...
I completely agree even with the hydraulic overides i still feel its to difficult to retreat from any melee as every melee class has stuns slows or pull or something to that nature, and every other ranged class has decent if not perfect defense/escape abilitys. So /sign.
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  • 4 weeks later...
I think it'd be weird because we're talking a disengage here, a defensive ability - not an offensive one.

 

I agree with this. having the ability do damage is silly and a bit OP unless you were to hide the damage portion of the ability deep in one of the trees like with snipers roll skill.

 

A disengage skill that would allow merc's to get some distance on melee is much needed. It's either that or make Electronet spammable so we can slow down melee enough to get away with our overrides.

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I realize this thread is a little old but since someone else dug it up let me give my 2p. When I'm leveling, I don't pay much attention to ability text so when I got Jet Boost, this is exactly what I thought it was. I figured it pushed you around or upped your speed because the idea of Jet Boost pushing enemies back is just odd. Look at the words: "Jet" obviously referring to our jet pack and "boost" which means an increase. Why the hell does that KB? I don't think we should lose the KB, I just think Jet Boost is the wrong name...anyways...

 

Looking at AC and their individual in-combat mobility CDs:

Sith Inquistor - Force Speed

Sith Assassin - Force Pull

Sith Sorcer - Extricate, Surging Speed (Madness Tier 7)

Sith Warrior - Force Charge

Sith Juggernaut - Intercede, Shien Form (Vengeance Tier 3), Obliterate (Rage Tier 3), Rule of Two (Immortal Tier 6)

Sith Marauder - Predation, Ataru Form (Carnage Tier 3), Obliterate (Rage Tier 3)

Imperial Agent - Take Cover, Evasion, Covered Escape

Sniper - Seek Cover (Marksmanship Tier 5), Hit and Run (Lethality Tier 1)

Operative - Exfiltrate, Infiltrator (Concealment Tier 2), Ghost (Concealment Tier 4), Advanced Cloaking (Concealment Tier 5), Hit and Run (Lethality Tier 1)

Bounty Hunter - Hydraulic Overrides

Powertech - Grapple, Jet Charge (Shield Tech Tier 5), Jet Speed (Shield Tech Tier 5), Pneumatic Boots (Advanced Prototype Tier 3)

 

Not counting abilities that can slow or immobilize enemies, these are simply the abilities that allow for movement in combat (including moving an enemy into range, moving a group member into rage, moving yourself into or out of range, etc).

 

Looking at that Mercenaries get ONE ability and not only does it only increase speed by 30% its not even, its not even an exclusive. Look at how Sins/Sorcs were designed: Sorcs can pull friendly targets in to protect them, Sins can pull enemy targets in to control them. By that same logic why is it Snipers that get the backwards escape? And seriously, Operatives get a TON of movement stuff while Mercs get pretty much nothing. The utility of HO comes from its immunity not really from its speed buff because any gap you open up between yourself and a DPS in PvP is going to be closed by them due to their higher regular movement speed and in PvE it just isn't fast enough to get you out of danger like Force Speed does for Sorcs.

 

For those arguing that Mercs either shouldn't have any Jet Pack abilities or have enough (someone listed Recharge and Reload? Seriously? Our out of combat regen ability? The "Jet" effect there has no utility and is purely cosmetic) you are not thinking clearly. The only ability we have that truly uses our Jet Pack as an actual mechanic is Jet Boost. DfA does not *require* a jet pack since its simply pushing you up, you could just as easily fire the missiles from the ground. Jet Boost on the other hand has no way to function without a Jet Pack. Perhaps if it animated similarly to HO and then stomped but...too close to Overload IMO. Add to that the fact that our only defense comes down to that we wear heavy armor and can cast some heals and its just ridiculous. I do NOT use my Merc in PvP ever simply because of how easy it is to tear them up.

 

The WoW Warrior jump seems to close to Jet Charge so I think thats out but the jump backwards while firing is a great idea. Here is my tweak though:

Out of Harm's Way (Generates 30 Heat): Fires your Jet Boosters to blast you backwards 12 meters. When slowed, you only travel 6 meters. This ability is not affected by the global cooldown. Can be used while immobilized. Cooldown: 3 Minutes

Related Talents:

Bodyguard: Emergency Response - Out of Harm's Way now places a Kolto Pool at your feet upon landing which heals up to 4 allies for 3027-3143 over 3 seconds. Additionally, you are immune to damage and movement impairing effects for 2 seconds after activating Out of Harm's Way.

Arsenal: Out of the Fying Pan - Out of Harm's Way now increases critical strike chance by 100% for 6 seconds.

Pyrotech: Destructive Escape - Out of Harm's Way now unloads your blasters at your target while blasting backwards dealing 3087-3690 weapon damage over 3 seconds. Additionally, damage done this way hinders the target, preventing the use of high mobility actions and escapes such as charges, vanishes, and speed boosts. Lasts 2 seconds per charge, stacks up to 3 times.

 

So this puts it on par with the Exfiltrate (in terms of getting us out of bad situations) and Force Barrier (in terms of power VS CD) while also allowing it to be talented for increased PvE or PvP effectiveness. The typical OP argument is countered by the fact that the heat cost is so high. In PvP this shouldn't be an issue as you are rarely able to hunker down and turret for all too long, and in PvE it means that you either need to plan your Heat management around the use of this CD or use it in conjunction with Vent Heat. All of these effects are comparable to similar effects of other classes just tweaked to work for Mercs:

 

The basic concept is the same as a reverse exfiltrate with the exact same distances applied. The heal becomes a similar mechanic to the similar Operative roll, the Arsenal Damage increase works out to 4 instant casts, 4 Tracers, an Unload and a few others etc, and the Pyro effect gives them some additional control and mobility.

 

As for how this could be tuned for Commando's, that is simple: Someone else pointed out the football "spiking" concept, well you could similarly simply point such a high powered canon at the ground for a self-knockback effect. Call it Blast Free and its good.

 

Thoughts?

Edited by kennethdale
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Why not some more charges that can be built up and spent on utility options - like an instant cast, an escape, or whatever? I started off playing a merc, because I love BHs... But really, now I've played scoundrel, sniper, knight, even sorc, the lack of options to BHs is depressing.
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