Don't post if you don't group.

Don't post if you're gonna flame.

 

Due to how every mob is ranged and some bosses have 3 elite adds or something. Has anyone found that the following works?

 

1 MT

1 OT (tank class specced into dmg)

1 DD

1 Healer

 

Seems very odd, because the composition is effective but pug tanking is usually horrid.

 

Anyone try something different for all flashpoints?

Edited December 24, 2011 by Yvin
rude

i usually do MT DD DD H i will admit though being the MT it is very stressful trying to grab all the mobs/adds. OT usually is very helpful but some bosses need to be burned down quickly and mad dps is appreciated.

 

so its up in the air i guess, for now, i guess MTs have to suffer

One tank, 2 DPS of any variety, one healer.

 

The tank's job is to hold the strongest mob around, and anything else he can if possible.

 

The DPS should be killing the weakest thing free leading up to the one being tanked by the mob. DPS can easily offtank, regardless of their class, while they burn down the weaker mobs.

 

As a tank, it just isn't feasible to hold aggro on everything here. Just think about it. When you're soloing you sometimes fight groups of 3-5 mobs. Same principle here.

 

It's okay for some things to be free, just so long as the strongest thing around is being tanked. Kill those weaker/free things, and just make sure they're not on the healer very long.

Edited December 24, 2011 by StealthStalker

One tank, 2 DPS of any variety, one healer.

 

The tank's job is to hold the strongest mob around, and anything else he can if possible.

 

The DPS should be killing the weakest thing free leading up to the one being tanked by the mob. DPS can easily offtank, regardless of their class, while they burn down the weaker mobs.

 

As a tank, it just isn't feasible to hold aggro on everything here. Just think about it. When you're soloing you sometimes fight groups of 3-5 mobs. Same principle here.

 

It's okay for some things to be free, just so long as the strongest thing around is being tanked. Kill those weaker/free things, and just make sure they're not on the healer very long.

 

That's what was bothering me and why we decided to try OT in the mix specced with lots of damage.

 

The way Bioware designed this game makes it a complete pain in the *** for healers and tanks =/

Are you using CC? Unless you're running Guardian/Shadow/Vanguard/NotASmuggler or the Empire equivalents, your group should have at least one method of keeping an enemy out of a fight for a minute at a time.

 

Commandos can Concussive Round anything.

Sages can Force Lift anything.

Sentinels can Disable Droids.

Smugglers can Slice Droids.

Scoundrels can Tranquilize non-Droids.

Very hard to hold aggro of 5 mobs shooting from afar. No tank can seriously be at 5 places at the same time!

 

but like someone said above, you just need to hold aggro of the strongest one.

 

A good healer will easily heal up everyone at the same time if everyone else are doing their job right and the tank will be ok.

Are you using CC? Unless you're running Guardian/Shadow/Vanguard/NotASmuggler or the Empire equivalents, your group should have at least one method of keeping an enemy out of a fight for a minute at a time.

 

Commandos can Concussive Round anything.

Sages can Force Lift anything.

Sentinels can Disable Droids.

Smugglers can Slice Droids.

Scoundrels can Tranquilize non-Droids.

 

You can't CC most elite mobs, some bosses are even immune to taunt.

It usually ends up as most people are saying one main tank, two dps, and a healer. Sometimes we get a DPS who can do off-heals which is actually very nice and can work incredibly well in many situations. I have only had an off-tank/dps in a pug once or twice and I didn't see much difference in benefit. I think perhaps some bosses would be easier with an off-tank for the adds, but otherwise I find them unneeded. I prefer off-heals.

You can't CC most elite mobs, some bosses are even immune to taunt.

 

you can CC almost all of them except for bosses. No idea what flashpoints you're getting this "information" from. The only people immune to CC are strong elites and bosses/world bosses.

But I digress, you want 1 tank, 2 DPS, 1 healer. As long as people know what they are doing, the actual classes don't matter but if you want to maximize buffs as well as have no competition for items and no items go to waste you should try to get 1 of each classes.

 

Also to add to the list of CCs, shadows/assassins can mind maze/trap (WoW equivalent = Sap) any non droid target.

Edited December 24, 2011 by Yvin
removed quote + reply

Does anyone know what the % damage difference is from tank classes going into dmg spec vs pure dmg classes?

 

...Why do I have a feeling there's no way to find out right now.

I noticed a heavy trend toward Melee Main Tanks, and while a talented player can be successful at whatever they do, I find that a lot of the general populous of melee tanks get tunnel vision and fail to gather up ranged mobs properly, causing some stress on the healer as they attempt to keep up with splash damage across the party.

 

This being said, I find the Powertech BH pretty under played. This class allows for a lot of sustained ranged damage and ranged single target and AoE taunts that give them perfect control and perspective over a wider range of the battle. So if you are not in an organized guild or if you find you are suffering sometimes from tunnel vision, you might think about rolling a BH/Trooper for tanking instead of a melee.

 

Groups of course need at least 1 major DPS class. I think the 'perfect' match for your pure DPSer is formulated in what you are tanking with. BH tanks and Marauders for example are less compatible then Powertech's and Snipers, while a Melee Tank will click a lot more with a Marauder in the party, not to say it can't be done, just looking at 'perfect' optimization.

 

As for your 3rd, DPS or Offtank? We have found both obviously it goes from fight to fight and how good your tank is at gathering aggro in the first place. If you have someone that is a 'unique snowflake' and doesn't want to focus fire down targets, then having an Off Tank is a good role for them, because at least they have the survivability to live there their mistakes. If you have two solid DPS though that can focus fire targets and a tank that is good at gathering like a BH PT is, than I would advise going two full DPS if possible. In the end the specific fight and moment are truly what define 'optimal' though, so I think either way is very successful as long as everyone is living up to there role. Sometimes I find actually an 'off healer' to be very successful to, like a Merc, just in case your healer goes down.

 

And of course a pure healer is desired, and running with at least all 3 Empire healers, I find I have less preference of class and more preference of the talent of a given healer. They each have there pro's and con's and across the board are each valuable in specific situations, each one which comes up in any given flashpoint.

Does anyone know what the % damage difference is from tank classes going into dmg spec vs pure dmg classes?

 

...Why do I have a feeling there's no way to find out right now.

 

As per BW, 5% more damage out of a pure DPS class vs a fully DPS spec'd hybrid.

You can't CC most elite mobs, some bosses are even immune to taunt.

Some of the currently taunt-immune bosses (Mandalorian Raiders, for instance) are actually bugged at the moment and are meant to be Tauntable.

 

Most elites are CC-able. The first ones I ran into that weren't were on Taral V, but the next FP after that (Maelstrom Prison) were CC-able.

3 sith warriors and a healer. Back to back to back force chokes trivialize fights.

Best flashpoint comp right now is four people with at least half a brain each.

A Vanguard and three Commandos.

AoE OVERWHELMINNNNNG

Very hard to hold aggro of 5 mobs shooting from afar. No tank can seriously be at 5 places at the same time!

 

but like someone said above, you just need to hold aggro of the strongest one.

 

A good healer will easily heal up everyone at the same time if everyone else are doing their job right and the tank will be ok.

 

Im sorry but thats a terrible approach. In game im a sith sorc heal spec. Ive run plenty of PUGS with terrible tanks who think they only have to solo attk one target and i end up having one mob on them and three mobs on me.

 

If you tank it is your job to grab all the targets. At least start with one and and chain that melee to a ranged then to another ranged mob.

 

Its like people dont have the slightest clue about healing aggro and stand there tanking one mob fight after fight while the cloth wearing healer actually takes all the damage. You can "get away" with it on trash pulls but ive had tanks do the same thing on boss pulls. That 4 mini boss pull on Mand Raiders with a bad tank and your approach Pfft.

 

You do your job i do mine. Dont make me do both thats just lazy, and crap ...

Im sorry but thats a terrible approach. In game im a sith sorc heal spec. Ive run plenty of PUGS with terrible tanks who think they only have to solo attk one target and i end up having one mob on them and three mobs on me.

 

If you tank it is your job to grab all the targets. At least start with one and and chain that melee to a ranged then to another ranged mob.

 

Its like people dont have the slightest clue about healing aggro and stand there tanking one mob fight after fight while the cloth wearing healer actually takes all the damage. You can "get away" with it on trash pulls but ive had tanks do the same thing on boss pulls. That 4 mini boss pull on Mand Raiders with a bad tank and your approach Pfft.

 

You do your job i do mine. Dont make me do both thats just lazy, and crap ...

 

lazy? really? when ive got one taunt thats 15 seconds cd, and one aoe taunt thats 45 seconds cd and one skill (backhand) that generates threat that has a 60 second cd at level 34, how exactly do you think i can get them all when we're fighting 8 mobs?

 

lazy, wow, your post is just plain ignorant.

Edited December 24, 2011 by Ricktur

Due to how every mob is ranged and some bosses have 3 elite adds or something. Has anyone found that the following works?

 

1 MT

1 OT (tank class specced into dmg)

1 DD

1 Healer

 

Seems very odd, because the composition is effective but pug tanking is usually horrid.

 

Anyone try something different for all flashpoints?

 

Can't comment on end game or hard modes yet, but I've definitely liked having two tanks for the zones through The Red Reaper. Really nice to be able to swap aggro if one tank gets low on a boss, ect.

I've had 3 general setups...

 

1 pure tank + 2 pure dps + 1 pure healer = successful. (mandalorian, hammer, bt, athiss)

1 pure tank + 1 pure dps + 1 pure healer + 1 dps that threw out spot heals/shields to stall deaths until healer could efficiently get them back up = successful.(athiss)

1 tank class specced into dps using taunts to hold agro + 2 pure dps + 1 pure healer = successful.(bt, hammer, athiss, manda, +every heroic 4 area)

 

Though my groups also focus on the use of cc whether or not it's needed and focus firing targets so typically holding agro is fairly simple.

 

Though I guess you can come at me with inexperienced if you really want to /shrug I don't really feel a tank even needs to be tank specced, just have to find their taunt button...at least in regular content, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Edited December 25, 2011 by Ghobe

lazy? really? when ive got one taunt thats 15 seconds cd, and one aoe taunt thats 45 seconds cd and one skill (backhand) that generates threat that has a 60 second cd at level 34, how exactly do you think i can get them all when we're fighting 8 mobs?

 

lazy, wow, your post is just plain ignorant.

 

This is the worst excuse I have ever heard. How many taunts do you have in other MMOs? Not more than one, maybe two, and maybe an aoe taunt. All tanks should be able to hold aggro down with their dps. Each tank has a passive form that increases threat by 50%, armor by 150%, etc. Also, the Assassins and Juggernauts have Guard (not sure about PT), which causes the targeted ally to receive 25% less threat and transfers some of their damage over to you.

 

If you are using these abilities you might need to practice your dps rotation and see why you can't hold aggro.

 

If you are grouping with dps who jump the gun and don't let you get aggro first, ask them to let you get a 5-8 second head start.

 

If you are doing both of the above, reroll to dps or healer.

Edited December 25, 2011 by DarthVarrak

There is absolutely no need for an off-tank or off-healer. If you include them, all you're doing is making the run longer. In addition, when tanks get to the 40+ range it becomes feasible to hold onto every single mob -unless- there are multiple ranged mobs that are fairly far apart that cannot be LOS'd (although I do find this to be extremely rare).

 

Personally speaking, as a Shadow tank, once I got Slow Time, I never lost a mob in pulls. The need for any sort of off-tank is non-existent.

I found the imperial boarding party on mandalorian raiders to be very difficult to tank considering the fact that none of the four can be considered a main boss and 3 of them (all but the inquisitor) had the abiltiy to start attacking the healer either interrupting them or from range where it was difficult for me to even notice. An OT would have been a great help.

this is what i've been using to the most sucess

 

1 Tank

1 DPS

1 heals

1 DPS companion.

 

to be honest, the sith warrior companion Vette is far more reliable the the majority of DPS players out there.