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The Jedi Knight, and Sith Warrior classes need a huge buff.


brandonspikes

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On my server I can pull 400k+ damage and get 9-11 medals consistently on my Marauder. I wear half columi/rakata PvE gear because I've never found a reason to bother switching to my PvP champion set. It doesn't mean anything because there is obviously an enormous skill gap. I don't think I've seen anyone actually play intelligently against me. Even pre-mades tend to just take a Jugg and two sorcs to just bumrush the goal without any skill involved. There are maybe 3-4 people on my server that actively try to stop me when I'm in their game. Every other time as long as I play smart nobody hunts me down and stops me from running around killing healers and people trying to score/plant/cap objectives.

 

Edit: Here's the four games I played last night before and after helping a friend's guild do reg EV. First game was solo queue. Games 2-4 are with friends but none of them were healers and two of them were alts that hit 50 the other day. I never play with pocket healers because I believe it's very close to cheating on the scoreboard.

 

https://imgur.com/a/1gn33

 

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If I play against any sort of organized team I am useless. I do damage but I have absolutely no utility. Marauders are widely known as the most worthless class in PvP because there is nothing they can do to stop a ball cap or hold off players from capping a point for long. In big groups marauders are worse than worthless because we rely on simply killing people by outplaying them. I don't care who you are because there is no way you can outplay two sorc healers. You'll just be doing damage while they casually heal and throw an attack your way a few times to kill you. Their stupidly short cooldown knockback, dash, and multiple CCs mean we can literally be locked out of dealing damage for 10+ seconds. We absolutely need some way to lock people down to kill them. Every other class in the game has PvP utility. We need PvP utility as well.

 

I can't tell you how frustrating it is in Huttball when your team says "KNOCK HIM BACK! STUN HIM! STOP THEM FROM SCORING!" when I'm the only one around. It doesn't matter who the player is behind the Marauder in this sort of scenario because unlike every other class in the game we have no way to do anything in this situation.

 

 

I agree with everything you say, I am not pro at pvp, I would say I'm decent. I can do well until I play an organized team, no matter what I am useless. Once they notice I am a sentinel, I will get stun locked by the whole team and die first, I can't stop the ball runner in huttball for more than 3 seconds. We are completely worthless when it comes to actual team combat. We just can't contribute to a team no matter what spec we are. This isn't a L2P issue, with an unorganized team I can do well. I use every skill I can and at the best time possible, but it just becomes really hard to keep up and seems like every other class is having an easy time.

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Stream of a marauder who constantly pull 400k+ dps per WZ.

 

http://www.twitch.tv/glutenfreegaming

 

 

Video of a guardian ( jugg equivalent) totally owning in pvp.

 

 

 

 

You all need to learn to play and spec properly.

 

 

This is regarding the guardian as I've never played a sentinel. That video shows an above average PvPer in full battlemaster gear (I assume I think chAmp looks the same) Now I'm not disregarding the evidence here, but my point is that the average mmo pl

ayer that picks up this game and tries say a Guardian a trooper and a sorcerer. The guardian will be there hardest choice. And I gaurantee that someone with an equal skill level and year set of a different class would have an even more impressive result in PvP.

 

My guardians level 41 right now and he is tank specd. I usually end up in the top 5 on the board (almost always highest in protection) I have not tried out the damage spec used here because I primarily tank in pve

 

Sorry about any mistakEs I'm righting this from my phone

Edited by DevonLoy
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I've found that my Sith Warrior is no where near as blaster proof as my BH powertech.

 

I've also found that as an Alt I'm levelling a Jedi Sentinel and it's survivability is rubbish. Even at low levels around 20 I need to heal after 1 or 2 fights.

 

Something has to be done here.

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Soresu alone is actually a huge improvement if compared to marauder. I've seen only one guy able to pwn people with the marauder, quite skilled player that is over the top compared to me and the average derp playing tor. I'm pretty sure that switching class would only make him stronger. I won't talk about guardian / jugg cause the one I'm playing now is overleveled and undergeared for the areas I am going through.
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Huttball is the worst. It's more like Pinball for a Sentinel. Sometimes I don't even bother going on the platforms because I'm instantly knocked back down. I'd rather get some damage fighting on the ground instead of pointlessly getting knocked around. Edited by Meatnose
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  • 2 weeks later...
Yep, that is an issue with the class. Between self-heals and stuns, we are out-classed by every other class out there. Our heavy armor doesn't really come into play (especially since a same-level Sentinel's gear generally has more endurance than ours does - unless you have a good friend who made you decent orange armor (or did it yourself), or have spent money to get it int he market).

 

In any 1v1 match of same level classes, it should be a 50/50 chance to win for either one. Right now, it's more like a 10/90 chance for the Jedi Knight/Sith Warrior because our CCs and Stuns don't work on anything but weak and regular npc's (think again about players). Our 1 skill that does stun someone only lasts for 3 seconds (Force Stasis), is channeled (which means no attacks during), and has a massive cooldown (1m, reducible to like 50 secs with talents). Some of our higher damage skills never proc because we can't apply the condition to the player (incapacitated). If we start moving 95% of the other skills don't work (auto attack and blade storm are the only ones you can use while moving - and even then, blade storm's stun and fire proc don't work on players). Our defense bonus doesn't come into play unless we're in Soresu form, which then severely limits our damage abilities to the point where the other class will just self-heal away any damage we do, while our health dwindles under the dps of the other classes, with a lot of the damage being unmitigated -- our armor is best against melee attacks, not ranged, which is what everyone else uses. With no companion, we can't self-heal (except medpacks) and can't recharge our Saber Ward (our only defense boosting skill) which has an insane cooldown (the skill to recharge saber ward/self-HoT also has a 20m cooldown). If we get stunned or otherwise CC'ed, we have 1 skill that lets us break it, but it also has an insane cooldown (which doesn't reset after death) - the cooldown on our skill to break cc is longer than the cooldown on the skill that caused the cc.

 

This the most sophisticated and precise analysis of the problem with the SW class. Thank u so much Jeffery. You are 100% right, this is exactly what I´ve been thinking ever since I got around lvl 40 with my tank specc jug (lvl 50 and respecced to vengeance). And it is beyond me how anyone in their sane minds can disaggree on this.

 

Besides being easily owned by any sorc with the same gear and even 1-2 levels lower in countless duels, the most remarkable reminder of BWs failure to design the SW class correctly was on Voss when I was around lvl 40. There were 2 quests on the Gormak War camp quest series that drove me insane. The first included killing three Gormak war leaders, all three around lvl 45 and about 34k health elites. I couldnt beat that last one, engineer Palkell for sht, simply because as soon as u attacked him, he summoned two aids and by the time I killed those two and could focus on him, I already took too much damage with my tank jug. It was impossible with any companion but healer and still a desperate and close fight. That revealed the problem of low survivability despite heavy armor and tank spec. The other quest was on the final stage where u had to summon three elites and defeat them. The funny thing was when I got there, there was some Sorc before me so I had to wait and watched him, so he just stunned one of them, killed the other two quickly and took out the third and left in blazing glory in like 1 minute. So it was my turn and it was just incredible how badly I got owned by those 3 elites. The only way to go again was to summon my healer companion, kill 2 of the 3 elites, die in the process, respawn and kill the remaining one. Laughable. If I had HEAVY armor like in the description of my class character sheet and actually being able to sustain all that damage I took due to my laughable DPS, or if I had a real stun, like any other class, so I didnt have to fight all three at the same time, or if my DPS was anywhere within a reasonable range, I would have been able to own those elites like that sorc before me.

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I leveled a BH to 26 and never once felt under powered. I then wanted to try out a melee class and went with Sith Warrior. I have never felt so squishy, ever. I have to let Vette in first on a pack of mobs or I end up beaten and having to use my recover skill. It feels under whelming to have this lightsaber and be such a wimp.:(
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Soresu alone is actually a huge improvement if compared to marauder. I've seen only one guy able to pwn people with the marauder, quite skilled player that is over the top compared to me and the average derp playing tor. I'm pretty sure that switching class would only make him stronger. I won't talk about guardian / jugg cause the one I'm playing now is overleveled and undergeared for the areas I am going through.

 

Sorseu has its downsides, particularly cause it interferes with one's attacking ability.

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i have a Jedi knight sentinel character and a jedi consular shadow character and it's obvious the the jedi shadow is far far stronger then the jedi sentinal.

 

i can hardly beat elites with my sentinel and have to use all my cd's, potions, relic, etc to do so.

 

on my jedi shadow character i can beat CHAMPION class npc's without much trouble.

 

sith warriors and jedi knights need a pritty big buff to be equel to the other classes

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I'd say, from my experience as a lvl 43 Sniper, 40+ Juggernauts, Marauders and Powertechs are my worst nightmares... They simply outlive whatever I can throw at them... Heck Powertechs and Juggernauts can just waltz through my friendlies straight to me, down me and then strut around for quite a while before hitting the dirt, with only exception is me getting a good healing or pulling out a good knockback down the ledge or having them get zerged down hardcore.

 

Maras are particularly depressing with Obfuscate, Undying Rage and Saber Ward... just can't touch them. Their stealth only adds insult to injury.

 

 

Assassins, Ops and Sorcs are much easier - at least you can nuke them down, if they go Rambo on you. I also find it much easier to run away from those.

 

Snipers and Arsenal Mercs are not much of a threat really, just because if you are at a disadvantage you can simply LoS and run away FTW or just wait until they get zerged down...

 

 

Basically over my history of PvP, warriors climbed from "lol free kill" status to something I don't even target anymore, because it is pointless and with all the firepower I need to down one, I would probably kill 2 Sorcs/Sins.

 

 

Mark my words, in 1-2 months you will see a whole *****torm of QQ threads about Warriors, they gain power later on at alarming rates.

 

as a marauder i have to agree with this. if you are having problems in pvp you are doing somthing wrong, you are NOT a tank, so dont rush into mobs of 3-4 ppl and expect to live, instead let a tank grab agro than go in and harass the back end (healers/ranged classes) i constantly get upwards of 200+K dmg in warzones so our damage is fine the only thing i would like to see is some kind of cc for maras. otherwise we are fine

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as a marauder i have to agree with this. if you are having problems in pvp you are doing somthing wrong, you are NOT a tank, so dont rush into mobs of 3-4 ppl and expect to live, instead let a tank grab agro than go in and harass the back end (healers/ranged classes) i constantly get upwards of 200+K dmg in warzones so our damage is fine the only thing i would like to see is some kind of cc for maras. otherwise we are fine

 

As a marauder you are expected to get at least 300K+ every-time especially in battlemaster gears or you should just quit pvping, it's not about how much dps you can do, that's just part of the aspect of pvping.

Edited by bahugboto
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I wont go over pve content as much but it does seem the class doesn't do as well, I didn't have many issues, but then again I pvp'ed so much I was always 5 levels over the content.

 

Its not that the class is overly weak per se but the dynamics of the game;

 

 

  • 4 ranged classes
  • 2 stealth classes
  • 2 melee classes

 

 

In any mmo, there's the middle zerg and ranged players on each side, safely away from each other. Both stealth classes are opportunistic so they can avoid that middle zerg, and with aoe breaking stealth many avoid it. So you basically have 3 melee fighting it out and 6 ranged classes destroying them. In addition the ranged classes were given enough survivability that they can cover each other if a melee attacks.

 

I'm usually tops in deaths in every battleground; and its usually because I'm the only one that has to get in the danger zone to put out dps. I could be more tactical about it; but imo, tactical means ignoring objectives and farming. I do okay in the medal count but medals are easy for our class.

 

Its not our dps that struggles but our survivability. We need something to keep us alive a tad bit longer. Since the objective zerg is so small we are usually the primary targets and go down a lot fast than we should.

 

If they had stats on it I'd say Jugg's and mara's are cc'ed at least 5x more than any class. They give range all these tools to combat melee but they outnumber melee drastically so you end up as a pinball cc machine.

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  • 1 month later...

I don't have a whole lot of experience playing MMO games, so I can't spout off a lot of impressive class stats and the What I can say however is that I play both a Jedi Guardian and a Commando in The Old Republic and words cannot describe how frustrating playing as my Guardian. I have to be 2-3 levels above the level of the quest just to play it normally and leveling has become such a grind that it's no longer fun, its more like a job. Especially when you end up completing every quest on a planet and desperately sc****** the bottom of the barrel for a few more experience points.

 

My Jedi Knight was my first character I played him until around level 20 or 25 and then created a Trooper character. I was completely blown away at how much easier the game was. I no longer had to stock up on thousands of dollars worth of medpacs and stims just to beat the end boss of a side mission. The game was fun again.

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Sith Marauder here.

I can't compare to other classes...yet... so i only can say that i don't have a lot of the difficulties that are mentioned here, also only talking about PvE.

 

with the healer NPC (Quinn) you are nearly invulnerable and since i want to raise affection with a certain sorcerer (not spoiling, if anyone doesn't know who) in my group, i still can do the missions with no issues, EXCEPT that i have to use my healing outside combat ability after every 1-2 groups.

That ability where you can vanish and instantly put your threat level down is a biiiiig help, i deal damage, when it gets close i vanish and let them attack my NPC while still tossing out attacks for a while, getting ignored by the NPC i attack.

 

I'd say you have to play very tactical...decide who to kill first, when to lower your threat level and even more when you get the ability that halves your HP, but gives you 99% defense. That one often saved my *** against those golden NPCs

 

one time in a heroic 4 quest i accidentally targeted the CCd golden enemy instead of the silver one i had to defeat and still managed to kill both of them, while the rest of the group was busy with 3 other enemies.

Sure that time i got some healing buffs from another player 3-4 times, but I'd say that was pretty tanklike, even though the class is no tank.

 

So in the words of my character "I didn't even break a sweat" ^^

Edited by statistx
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