What would be the optimal tank stats for a tank in PvP? Absorption any use? High shielding or high defense? Got a friend coming up in levels she's using her sorc to get the wh gear for the war and we're curious as to how to min/max a hybrid tank. Pretty sure she gonna use the 29/12 build. I pved tank with my jugg but got bored with it in PvP went dps so any suggestions are welcome.

If you attain at least 35percent shield/absorb, and at least 25percent defence ratings, you'll do just fine. Try switching out yer expertise crystals with endurance ones, and then tweak yer setup from there. I think my tanks stats percentages are 43shield/41absorb, and 27defence chance. I have replaced all mods/enhancements for ones that have highest endurance values. My percentages are just the end result of that process. I will never have 30percent defence chance because of this.

My Stats (Fully Buffed with Exotech Fortitude):

Exp - 1180

End - 2384 (26345hp)

Str - 1255

Def - 32.57%

I use Advanced Fortitude 22 Augments in all my gear, although I'm not fully maxed out yet on my customizations.

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/023f8d01-cc32-4e11-b10e-164d4aa3c3d9

Personally I run a 29/12/0 build. This allows me to get Unremitting/Unstoppable as well as to make myself impossible to kill. I'd tell you right now, anyone who says spec Vengeance to tank needs their head examined. If you're going to tank, commit to being a tank, otherwise you're not being good at two things, but bad at everything.

Stats, fully buffed with Exotech

Exp: 1046 (17% Mitigation)

End: 2558 (28,358 Hitpoints)

Armor: 8183 (49% Mitigation)

Def: 32.81% Chance

Shield: 38.7% Chance

Absorb: 20%

Things to remember about Shield and Absorb, they do very, very little for you in PvP. Shield chance only applies to White, Non-Critical Damage, and Absorb only works off of shield chance. Defense is king as it ties in directly to the players accuracy, as well as any accuracy debuffs you provide to the target. Remember that you're not there to DPS and your primary function is area denial, debuffing and control, and you become the cornerstone to a well rounded PvP team.

Talon,

Do you have an Ask Mr. Robot link to your build? I'm pretty sure we have close to the same gear setup/philosophy, but I'd like compare a few things.

Talon,

Do you have an Ask Mr. Robot link to your build? I'm pretty sure we have close to the same gear setup/philosophy, but I'd like compare a few things.

Should be able to click "Cates" in my sig for my profile. Or you can search by that name on ask mr robot (Jedi Covenant) server. Everything's up to date, wish list as well.

Personally I run a 29/12/0 build. This allows me to get Unremitting/Unstoppable as well as to make myself impossible to kill. I'd tell you right now, anyone who says spec Vengeance to tank needs their head examined. If you're going to tank, commit to being a tank, otherwise you're not being good at two things, but bad at everything.

*sigh* Not trying to start an argument here, but I've got to reply.

I'm one of those "uncommitted" tanks who specs into "the wrong tree". My build is 18/23/0: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101rrhdzzMZforMrhzzM.2

Let's examine how much more "impossible to kill" you are with 29/12/0:

+ 5 more seconds of Enure

+ 4% internal/elemental DR

+ 15 sec off force-push

+ Hilt Strike (an extra stun)

+ Some focus savings due to 1/2 courage

+ Cheaper Riposte

+ +3% ranged/melee avoidance from Bbar

- Various dps stuff which, since we're considering pure tank only, has no bearing on this discussion

- loss of 6% strength, which has a small (very small) impact on BB size.

- 3 sec longer CD on blade storm, meaning fewer barriers vs. a veng tank

- focus cost on force sweep vs. free as veng

Looks pretty terrible so far right? Sure you get impale, a DoT, etc. but none of those matter if you're "committed to being a tank". But wait, here's the big one, the real reason people tank in 18/23 spec instead of 29/12:

- 4% overall DR to all damage types

- 15 seconds off Awe

- +15% DR when Focused Defense is active (making it even more awesome than it already is)

So re: "impossible to kill" it comes down to 4% DR to all and 15% added DR on Focused Defense <-- vs. --> 4% int/ele DR, 3% ranged/melee defense chance, and 5sec on Enure. This is not a significant difference, and if anything I feel that 18/23 pulls ahead.

I am _not_ saying that 29/12 is bad. It's a great spec. I would _love_ to have another stun in my toolbox. But it is not the only "best" tanking spec in PvP.

Can we please get along as tanks, and just disagree mildly on spec preference?

I agree with Khalhazar. IMO going up to Deafening Defense benefits more for tanking in PvP.

I also don't subscribe to the 1000 range Expertise mark but more in the 1200's. (around 2% more DR)

My Stats (Fully Buffed with Exotech Fortitude):

 

Exp - 1180

End - 2384 (26345hp)

Str - 1255

Def - 32.57%

 

I use Advanced Fortitude 22 Augments in all my gear, although I'm not fully maxed out yet on my customizations.

 

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/023f8d01-cc32-4e11-b10e-164d4aa3c3d9

I play dps myself and checked your build just out of curiosity, but why take Improved Sundering Assault instead of Dreadnaughts 6% strenght. Both are offencive but sustained 6% is better imo than 1 additional stack of sunder every now and then.

*sigh* Not trying to start an argument here, but I've got to reply.

 

I'm one of those "uncommitted" tanks who specs into "the wrong tree". My build is 18/23/0: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101rrhdzzMZforMrhzzM.2

 

Let's examine how much more "impossible to kill" you are with 29/12/0:

 

+ 5 more seconds of Enure

+ 4% internal/elemental DR

+ 15 sec off force-push

+ Hilt Strike (an extra stun)

+ Some focus savings due to 1/2 courage

+ Cheaper Riposte

+ +3% ranged/melee avoidance from Bbar

 

- Various dps stuff which, since we're considering pure tank only, has no bearing on this discussion

- loss of 6% strength, which has a small (very small) impact on BB size.

- 3 sec longer CD on blade storm, meaning fewer barriers vs. a veng tank

- focus cost on force sweep vs. free as veng

 

Looks pretty terrible so far right? Sure you get impale, a DoT, etc. but none of those matter if you're "committed to being a tank". But wait, here's the big one, the real reason people tank in 18/23 spec instead of 29/12:

 

- 4% overall DR to all damage types

- 15 seconds off Awe

- +15% DR when Focused Defense is active (making it even more awesome than it already is)

 

So re: "impossible to kill" it comes down to 4% DR to all and 15% added DR on Focused Defense <-- vs. --> 4% int/ele DR, 3% ranged/melee defense chance, and 5sec on Enure. This is not a significant difference, and if anything I feel that 18/23 pulls ahead.

 

I am _not_ saying that 29/12 is bad. It's a great spec. I would _love_ to have another stun in my toolbox. But it is not the only "best" tanking spec in PvP.

 

Can we please get along as tanks, and just disagree mildly on spec preference?

$$$$pretty much this$$$$

Except when I tank I use a 19/22 hybrid.

Cheers.

I play dps myself and checked your build just out of curiosity, but why take Improved Sundering Assault instead of Dreadnaughts 6% strenght. Both are offencive but sustained 6% is better imo than 1 additional stack of sunder every now and then.

Because as a tank, I feel my job is more to support the dps dealing the damage than doing the damage myself. Therefore, mitigation, protecting healers, protecting nodes, cc's and interrupts. The sunders indirectly support the dps more than what an extra 6% str would do for my damage output.

As a tank you feel that your role is to support the DPS? I don't understand what you mean by this. Sure, we apply sunder stack with smash, and sundering assault, but i support my team, primarily my healer.

From what I have seen in the past week since i started tanking regs and rated, I focus target my healer, Taunt the enemy high DPS on CD, maintain my chilling scream's snare, Swap guard to who ever is getting focused. I do not attack the enemy healer. If i do, i waste too much time and give my healer a high risk of being focused. Guard has a 10 M range, be aware of that.

Master Cates, you must fight the fight for 29/12/0 !

EDIT: my bad, i didnt see the second half of your post =p!

$$$$pretty much this$$$$

 

Except when I tank I use a 19/22 hybrid.

 

Cheers.

I'm using 19/22 as well.

After making the switch, I don't think I could tank without Commanding Awe (not sure of the Jugg mirror) again. I'd love to have that extra stun, but the incredibly short CD on Enraged Defense means I pretty much always have a defense CD when I need one.

(Guardian version)

Saber ward -> Focused Defense -> Warding Call -> Focused Defense

Warding Call and Saber Ward are nice, but their cooldowns are just too long. As someone else mentioned, the constant 4% damage reduction is hella nice too.

Yup. Focused Defense (Enraged Defense for juggs) is an amazing PvP cooldown, and 18/23 and 19/22 just make it better. It gets a lot of bad press because of the aggro drop in PvE, which is meaningless in PvP! =D Given how important cooldowns are to a jugg tank's game in PvP, an extra CD is a sexy thing.

I'm writing some materials up for my server's RP forum, so figured I'd talk about ED (the cooldown, not the disorder) here among the other cooldowns:

Cooldowns, irrespective of order-of-use:

- Saber Ward (100% M/R def for 2 sec, 50% M/R def for 10 more sec, -25% I/E damage for full 12sec; 3m cd)

- Enraged Defense (-15% + heal when damaged)

- Invincible (-40% dmg for 10sec; 3m cooldown)

- Endure Pain (+30% HP for 10 sec; 90sec cd; best use with WZ medpac)

- WZ adrenal (-15% dmg for 15 sec, 3m cooldown)

- Force Charge becomes a minor defensive cooldown (-20% dmg, 4sec) as well.

Notice the cooldowns. Most are 3m --- a 45sec decent mitigation ability + rage dump is incredible. Maybe you want to save invincible for special occasions, but ED can be blown regularly.

Of course CC abilities are really defensive cooldowns hiding under the table:

- Grenade (anyone can use! 4sec AE mez, 3min cooldown)

- Awe (6sec AE mez, 45sec CD)

- Instant choke (3sec stun, 1m CD)

Controls are defensive cooldowns hiding in the _closet_:

- force push (1m cooldown)

- Chilling Scream (9 sec AE 50% snare. free and low CD for tanks)

- Charge Root (3sec)

Taunts and Interrupt are obvious.

And finally, my favorite Jugg/Guard ability:

- intercede with 2pc set bonus, which moves you out of harm's way, protects a team member, and heals you 8%.

so after looking at this hybrid (i run 29/12/0), i see where you guys are comming from, but why these points that improve damage output? I dont want DPS i want to protect my healers. Can anyone give me a good argument? Cates your from JC too, can you elaborate, For or Against?

Thanks, Krayshawn

so after looking at this hybrid (i run 29/12/0), i see where you guys are comming from, but why these points that improve damage output? I dont want DPS i want to protect my healers. Can anyone give me a good argument?

A lot of the dps points are just plain filler in order to get Deafening Defense (Commanding Awe). In the build that I posted above, you could view the following as choices for DPS rather than crunch (instead of required filler):

- Impale (1pt in Veng)

- Heavy Handed (1pt in Immortal)

- Crushing Fist (2pt in Immortal)

With a free Smash, and with the debuff proc from Quake, I tend to use Smash as part of my normal tanky rotation. This means that the debuff from Crushing Fist gets applied often, and helps out the DPS. So I view it as group-utility, not personal DPS, and buy it.

Impale is a great ability. It's a "dps" ability, yes, but it's nice to have. It might be worth dropping for some, but I consider it more worthwhile than 1% M/R defense.

Heavy Handed is "meh". I keep thinking I should move it somewhere else. It's still there because I can't decide between cheaper retaliation (and hybrid does sometimes have rage problems, especially if you make proper use of Enraged Defense) and 1% M/R defense.

So my 18/23 build posted above has anywhere from 1 to 2 points suboptimally allocated, depending on your goals. :-) But I'd really think twice before dropping the group utility from Crushing Fist.

Can anyone give me a good argument? Cates your from JC too, can you elaborate, For or Against?

In the past I've been adamant for strictly the 29/12. I'm not really like that anymore. It has its strengths. Typically I view the 18/23 or w/e hybrid is a reg WZ hero build, where the enemies wont be entirely focused on burning down your one guard target, and you have the opportunity at times to do a little bit of DPS. 29/12 is my ranked build however. In ranked, your job (in addition to guarding/taunting, etc) is to CC the other team until they're ineffectual, and 29/12 has the largest toolbox for that job.

A lot of the dps points are just plain filler in order to get Deafening Defense (Commanding Awe). In the build that I posted above, you could view the following as choices for DPS rather than crunch (instead of required filler):

 

- Impale (1pt in Veng)

- Heavy Handed (1pt in Immortal)

- Crushing Fist (2pt in Immortal)

 

With a free Smash, and with the debuff proc from Quake, I tend to use Smash as part of my normal tanky rotation. This means that the debuff from Crushing Fist gets applied often, and helps out the DPS. So I view it as group-utility, not personal DPS, and buy it.

 

Impale is a great ability. It's a "dps" ability, yes, but it's nice to have. It might be worth dropping for some, but I consider it more worthwhile than 1% M/R defense.

 

Heavy Handed is "meh". I keep thinking I should move it somewhere else. It's still there because I can't decide between cheaper retaliation (and hybrid does sometimes have rage problems, especially if you make proper use of Enraged Defense) and 1% M/R defense.

 

So my 18/23 build posted above has anywhere from 1 to 2 points suboptimally allocated, depending on your goals. :-) But I'd really think twice before dropping the group utility from Crushing Fist.

Thanks for your clarifications.

In the past I've been adamant for strictly the 29/12. I'm not really like that anymore. It has its strengths. Typically I view the 18/23 or w/e hybrid is a reg WZ hero build, where the enemies wont be entirely focused on burning down your one guard target, and you have the opportunity at times to do a little bit of DPS. 29/12 is my ranked build however. In ranked, your job (in addition to guarding/taunting, etc) is to CC the other team until they're ineffectual, and 29/12 has the largest toolbox for that job.

Hey Cates, thanks for responding. I wanted to see your advice because, well im a huge fan of your node guarding montage. Today i was think the pros and cons, and talking with Ijis, the healer i play with most, I definitely agree that 29/12 offers way more support for the team, and ultimately for my healers. Having one more stun in my arsenal is a pretty nice thing.

I have yet to try 18/23, maybe i will try it in regs tonight since im puging atm. I was under the impression that 29/12 was the only tank spec, now im hearing 18/23 is in fact more common, i just started tanking last week so thanks for the help and your AskMRrobot.