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Class Changes: Annihilation Marauder / Watchman Sentinel

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sentinel / Marauder
Class Changes: Annihilation Marauder / Watchman Sentinel
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KendraP's Avatar


KendraP
09.22.2017 , 06:40 PM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by omaan View Post
Everyone told you that mara is a perfectly balanced class. Seriously, what are you doing? How incompetent you are? Now everyone (including me) just switched to fury spec since it's fully outperforms anni and carnage now. With buffing vengeance jugg and nerfing anni mara you just forcing everyone to switch to vengeance. Why you get into something that players DIDNT ASKED you to get into? Your new class balance literally sucks because curtained specs are just nerfed overhigh.
What theyre doing to vigi may or may not be a nerf or buff. I attempted to do some math but I'm no theory crafter. My honest hope for vigi is that it stays where it is now. A 60% nerf to freezing force will hurt and I'm not certain the buff to dots will even bring us back to where we are now.

As a fellow melee sustained dps player I can understand you being upset about a nerf believe me I feel the same currently. To me it seems that BW feels they over buffed dps and are now nerfing basically everyone down to their "target dps" tiers. If this is the case, I request they recheck their target because I know people having issues with dps checks as it is.

But hey what do I know, I'm a tank main who dwebbles in vigi.

Rekkakuski's Avatar


Rekkakuski
09.22.2017 , 06:41 PM | #22
maybe it's finally time to unsub for game. they nerf AGAIN marauders and my favorite Annihilation. why I even play if they always do my main to unplayable for harder ops. pvp gonna be just pure healwars when all dps just nerfed down
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Zez-Kai-Ell's Avatar


Zez-Kai-Ell
09.22.2017 , 06:50 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by KendraP View Post
What theyre doing to vigi may or may not be a nerf or buff. I attempted to do some math but I'm no theory crafter. My honest hope for vigi is that it stays where it is now. A 60% nerf to freezing force will hurt and I'm not certain the buff to dots will even bring us back to where we are now.

As a fellow melee sustained dps player I can understand you being upset about a nerf believe me I feel the same currently. To me it seems that BW feels they over buffed dps and are now nerfing basically everyone down to their "target dps" tiers. If this is the case, I request they recheck their target because I know people having issues with dps checks as it is.

But hey what do I know, I'm a tank main who dwebbles in vigi.
as if freezing force was a frequent skil lto be used right? is just a slow nothing more a slow from sniper or op deals way more damage i know it cant be a op skill aloowing root and big big damage liek force storm was doing in past but imo there is nothing to be nerfed on guardian on dps spec at least, not even utility's, they should is instead fix the crap heals focused/enraged defense gives.....
and about over buff dps? they did that with ranged not melee

Beyrahl's Avatar


Beyrahl
09.22.2017 , 08:38 PM | #24
Hmm, pure dps class not allowed to do the most dps?

Hoppinswtor's Avatar


Hoppinswtor
09.22.2017 , 09:54 PM | #25
How much of a nerf will this be? 300-400 dps or so?
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Exocor's Avatar


Exocor
09.22.2017 , 09:59 PM | #26
In my opinion, the nerf to annihilation/watchman is understandable. A guild member estimated the changes and said it is about ~400 DPS less for the top parse on parsley. Thats not much due to the fact, that annihilation/watchman is the top DPS-spec at the moment. Compared with other melee sustained DPS-specs, Maras/Sents have great off-DPS-abilitys, superior DCD's/survivability and in many situations very good raid utility.
The DPS gets sometimes compared with Operative-Lethality. At this point, we have to consider the things mentioned above and compare both classes/specs: Operatives have a minor raid buff, decent raid utility (off heals/stealth rez) but very bad DCD's and survivability. Annihilation/Watchmen will do slightly less DPS then Lethality. It will still be superior versus Vengeance, Pyrotech and Hatred. From this perspective, they would have been right, to tune down the DPS even more, but, they luckily considered the current state of Carnage/Combat and made a fair compromise.

So, all in all, a slight nerf to DPS won't hurt anyone. It won't be "impossible to beat harder Ops bosses". Annihilation will still be one of the top DPS-classes. Considering Melee-Burst-classes, they maybe consider nerfing Carnage (again) and Advanced Prototype, that are are on par with some of the melee-sustained classes. However, as long as I, as an average DPS-player, am able to beat the hardest content, the classes are overtuned. I would be glad to see harder DPS-checks (tanking enraged bosses is fun ). It took quite some time, until I realized it myself, but in my opinion, we are on the right way. And when the price for making old content challenging again is some scared off sentinels, then it's worth the cost.
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Thaladan's Avatar


Thaladan
09.23.2017 , 12:37 AM | #27
with nerf like this, how some players can continue toi say that all these nerf are PvP oriented...

diversity in PvP is just terrible, 90% of maras are fury and this will be worse.
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AnonymousMi's Avatar


AnonymousMi
09.23.2017 , 12:49 AM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
Hey everyone,

Below you will find the changes planned for Annihilation and Watchman in Game Update 5.5:


-eric
I have no fudging idea on where to begin with this...... Why Bioware are you trying to nerf pure DPS classes to oblivion? Marauder is a pure dps class and it is also melee.... You let snipers with insane DCDs running around freely in PVP, insane DCDs mercs running around in PVP, you make classes unplayable in most scenarios in PVE or rather, useless in comparison to other ones. These class changes since 5.3 have been some of the worse stuff from you that I've seen lately, and it establishes that the dev team forgets simple community math. Nerfs DON'T MAKE PEOPLE HAPPY! Are they ever going to understand that????????? Why introduce a new tier of gear(which mind you,was overpowered and could carry you with everything,but hey their decision,not ours to introduce i) with the sole purpose of nerfing every class down again

Honestly, I'm just disappointed. Nerf Marauder again, and make fudging Fury the top spec because people said it was useless in PVE. 10/10 decision making, would screw classes again. Honestly seeing as to what happened with other classes, this will get ignored and BW will just see the 1-2 positive comments amidst a sea of rage and justify the changes based on that. Disgusting, I try to defend Bioware with content release rates because of limited resources but I cannot, in any way, justify when they make *SILLY* mistakes because of either incompetence, not playing their own game, not listening to the community, or anything else in a list of a million things we can now say about Bioware.

gosh darnit guys, stop finding a way to piss everyone... It's your game but it would seem that you don't like playing it and you're screwing over people who aren't even vocal here, but you have no idea of who they are, because you probably haven't even taken the time or effort to run around in guilds and trying to see the feedback for this. Last thing I have to say is Congratulations for releasing a new set of changes, a new set of nerfs ( as if Carnage nerfs weren't enough, and I am of the opinion that those WERE justified ) but 6% nerf on Deadly Saber? Are you joking me? Crit chance nerf on Juyo Mastery? Another nerf on passive with Annihilate?

Anyone who sees this and is enraged by the changes but doesn't usually post in the forums (like me) please make your voice be heard. Perhaps we can convince them not to go live with these changes at all, or rather a smaller nerf... not fudging 400-450 according to some. I am probably too hopeful to believe that they will listen like they did with Operative Medicine spec, seeing as they don't listen for most of the changes. (Granted, I haven't seen the feedback on all of them, and feedback could be neutral there so BW would go ahead with it anyways). Keith, or Eric, if you're seeing this... Please, reconsider an adjustment on this... Annihilation had only its superior single target DPS going for and now that is getting nerfed badly. Just show the Dev Team the rage that is here in the forums and perhaps they will understand . Sorry Eric, you're probably the scapegoat for everything. But some things must be said because I for one adore this game but I can't stand seeing everything get nerfed, people getting outraged, BW not listening, people quitting. Endless cycle which can very be easily stopped. Have a nice day, gentlemen.

Trogusaurus's Avatar


Trogusaurus
09.23.2017 , 01:01 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Exocor View Post
In my opinion, the nerf to annihilation/watchman is understandable. A guild member estimated the changes and said it is about ~400 DPS less for the top parse on parsley. Thats not much due to the fact, that annihilation/watchman is the top DPS-spec at the moment. Compared with other melee sustained DPS-specs, Maras/Sents have great off-DPS-abilitys, superior DCD's/survivability and in many situations very good raid utility.
The DPS gets sometimes compared with Operative-Lethality. At this point, we have to consider the things mentioned above and compare both classes/specs: Operatives have a minor raid buff, decent raid utility (off heals/stealth rez) but very bad DCD's and survivability. Annihilation/Watchmen will do slightly less DPS then Lethality. It will still be superior versus Vengeance, Pyrotech and Hatred. From this perspective, they would have been right, to tune down the DPS even more, but, they luckily considered the current state of Carnage/Combat and made a fair compromise.

So, all in all, a slight nerf to DPS won't hurt anyone. It won't be "impossible to beat harder Ops bosses". Annihilation will still be one of the top DPS-classes. Considering Melee-Burst-classes, they maybe consider nerfing Carnage (again) and Advanced Prototype, that are are on par with some of the melee-sustained classes. However, as long as I, as an average DPS-player, am able to beat the hardest content, the classes are overtuned. I would be glad to see harder DPS-checks (tanking enraged bosses is fun ). It took quite some time, until I realized it myself, but in my opinion, we are on the right way. And when the price for making old content challenging again is some scared off sentinels, then it's worth the cost.
What you fail to account for here is PvP. Watchman already suffers from a total lack of ability to kill anything supported by a healer, much less a single Sniper, Jugg, or Sin. Aside from the self-heals (which are also nerfed with these changes) and a raid-wide speed boost, there is nothing this spec can do that Vig, Conc, and Serenity can't do better in every other way. Their DoTspread already trails behind even most melee disciplines, and unlike Vig and Serenity, you actually have to regularly disrupt your single target rotation to implement it. Just like in 3.X, the only comparative advantage keeping this spec afloat in PvP is the pure single target dps, and that is being taken away.

Equeliber's Avatar


Equeliber
09.23.2017 , 02:36 AM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Zez-Kai-Ell View Post
as if freezing force was a frequent skil lto be used right? is just a slow nothing more a slow from sniper or op deals way more damage i know it cant be a op skill aloowing root and big big damage liek force storm was doing in past but imo there is nothing to be nerfed on guardian on dps spec at least, not even utility's, they should is instead fix the crap heals focused/enraged defense gives.....
and about over buff dps? they did that with ranged not melee
Freezing force is the 3rd highest damage contributor in both Focus and Vigilance...
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