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Snipers are beyond broken but it's Sins who should be the ones to nerf ? Really ?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Snipers are beyond broken but it's Sins who should be the ones to nerf ? Really ?

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
11.13.2019 , 10:09 PM | #41
Quote: Originally Posted by Snippao View Post
Just to remember:
high skill floor doesnt justify broken numbers.
I say we nerf players and not classes.

LoL, just joking of course. But so much nerf calling over the years hasn’t taken into account player skill or class difficulty.

If you want balance, nerf all players with skill to the lowest denominator. Then we can just face roll the keyboard and hope for the best

Jinre_the_Jedi's Avatar


Jinre_the_Jedi
11.13.2019 , 11:14 PM | #42
Quote: Originally Posted by JediMasterAlex View Post
Someone who wants something nerfed sincerely says "I think x needs to be nerfed because it's overpowered, etc etc," Not "I think x needs to be nerfed so that people will stop ************ about it and realize that other classes were better all along." That's what you've been saying in plain English. It's not like I'm putting words in your mouth or trying to read your mind, I'm directly quoting you.
Interesting that you've chosen the quotes you did about me which were almost 2 weeks ago instead of my most recent comments stating exactly what you ask. In this exact thread, I said "I'm saying this as a Sin, the burst from Sin's opener should be nerfed, that's fair." Yes, I start discussing other classes after that, but as Prum said earlier in this thread, one class being too strong doesn't justify another class being too strong. So my talking about classes other than sin does not detract from my statement saying that their opener should be nerfed.

Surely I'm allowed to change my stance between a week or two ago and now? You honestly come off as the type of person who just likes to argue for the sake of argument. First my stance is clearly biased because I'm a sin player (logic which you yourself then counter by stating that you wish to remain anonymous so that your point isn't detracted from, something which you've been doing to me for weeks now). Then when I change my stance, it's now not genuine enough for you, based on a quote that you dug up from the past when I've clearly made a more recent quote stating that sins opener should be nerfed. I'm not sure what your problem is with me specifically but your constant need to try to discredit me in every thread I end up in is pretty tiring.

JediMasterAlex's Avatar


JediMasterAlex
11.14.2019 , 08:29 AM | #43
Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
Interesting that you've chosen the quotes you did about me which were almost 2 weeks ago instead of my most recent comments stating exactly what you ask.
Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
I 100% support Sins being nerfed if it means people will open their eyes and realize that there are much better specs out there that deserve attention.
Where are you getting weeks from? This quote is from yesterday, post #31 of this thread...so it's clearly how you still feel, unless you changed your mind completely in a matter of hours?

Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
Surely I'm allowed to change my stance between a week or two ago and now?
Of course you are. But given your comments, both in this thread and elsewhere, you've made it clear that you don't think sins actually need nerfs, you just supposedly want it to happen to prove a point. We've been through this. And remember, I'm still reserving judgment on whether sins need nerfs, so I don't care whether you think they should be or not. But I do think it's ******** when you argue in bad faith to try to prove a stupid point.

Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
I'm not sure what your problem is with me specifically but your constant need to try to discredit me in every thread I end up in is pretty tiring.
I have no personal problem with you. However, I do think it's interesting that some players want what they say to be taken as gospel even when there are serious flaws in their reasoning. When you say things that are wrong, or stupid, or I happen to take issue with something you say for any other reason, of course I'm going to point that out. Why shouldn't I? Vigorous argument is often the best way to get to the truth, as long as both parties are arguing in good faith. Just because you're a decent player and you make guides for people doesn't make you immune to criticism.

Jinre_the_Jedi's Avatar


Jinre_the_Jedi
11.14.2019 , 08:56 AM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by JediMasterAlex View Post
snip
When have I ever stated that my opinion should be taken as gospel, ever, anywhere? My opinion is just that, my opinion. And people are allowed to have differing opinions, however for whatever reason, you take every opportunity that you can to try to specifically discredit me to make my opinion seem of lesser value than others. I've never tried to insinuate that because I write guides that I'm more knowledgeable about things that are purely opinion-based, such as the state of the meta. I'm a regular player just like everyone else. Whether it be by you saying that my opinion is biased, stating that I'm arguing in bad faith, or providing misinformation, you are doing all that you can do try to diminish my opinion specifically, for some odd reason. In this very thread you first state that my opinion is of little value because it's biased due to me playing Assassin and then a few posts later admit that you didn't even watch the full podcast, meaning that you don't even know what I said fully before coming to that conclusion. You want to talk about arguing in bad faith, yet you are dismissing what I say based on your own personal biases against me without even hearing my words first. So like I said, it's pretty tiring. Continue on in your crusade to bismirch my character, good luck and have fun friend.

UltraFlashStar's Avatar


UltraFlashStar
11.14.2019 , 09:03 AM | #45
Now starts the 10 extra pages of off topic discussions which is the fate of every thread about either a suggesting a class being nerfed, team ranked, solo ranked, x is op, or x is weak.
Coppes Spacer
“Let me play you a sad song on the galaxy’s smallest xantha.”

JediMasterAlex's Avatar


JediMasterAlex
11.14.2019 , 09:10 AM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
When have I ever stated that my opinion should be taken as gospel, ever, anywhere?
I never said you stated it. It's simply my impression.

Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
Whether it be by you saying that my opinion is biased, stating that I'm arguing in bad faith, or providing misinformation, you are doing all that you can do try to diminish my opinion specifically, for some odd reason. In this very thread you first state that my opinion is of little value because it's biased due to me playing Assassin and then a few posts later admit that you didn't even watch the full podcast, meaning that you don't even know what I said fully before coming to that conclusion.
All I said was that it's hardly surprising that a sin main and an op main didn't consider their mains to be the two highest performing classes right now. And yes, I freely admitted that I didn't watch the whole podcast (not a valuable use of my time when I know 2 of the 4 participants are not to be taken at all seriously-hint, not talking about you or snave), and further admitted that maybe that assertion was unfair of me as a result. I doubt my original statement was wrong though.

Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
You want to talk about arguing in bad faith, yet you are dismissing what I say based on your own personal biases against me without even hearing my words first. So like I said, it's pretty tiring. Continue on in your crusade to bismirch my character, good luck and have fun friend.
I have no personal biases against you, nor am I on a crusade to besmirch* your character. You have argued in bad faith in favor of sin nerfs up until yesterday afternoon. Your own words doom you there I'm afraid.

JediMasterAlex's Avatar


JediMasterAlex
11.14.2019 , 09:11 AM | #47
Quote: Originally Posted by UltraFlashStar View Post
Now starts the 10 extra pages of off topic discussions which is the fate of every thread about either a suggesting a class being nerfed, team ranked, solo ranked, x is op, or x is weak.
I doubt it will go that far. Kre'a seems far more reasonable to me than Zurules.

By the way, anyone notice this?
Quote: Originally Posted by AndriusAjax View Post
Well for example, I was about to gear up my VG after hearing positive things about them... then I realized it was just propaganda to crutch the argument against nerfing sins. They still have the same problems as always, great DPS, terrible survivability. So I'm glad I waited. And the only reason I waited was because I was able to store those pieces another character.
That's why I think it's important to call people out when they spout ******** on the forums.

AndriusAjax's Avatar


AndriusAjax
11.14.2019 , 09:21 AM | #48
Don't use my comment in your silly little debate lol.

I appreciate Krea. If every reviewer/guide maker had to run a strict fact check before putting out their video/guide, we'd have even less guides than we currently do (which is pretty much none). I very much appreciate people who go to the extra effort to help communicate things. And I certainly didn't take anything he said as gospel. I understand that when people have an opinion, they don't always precede it with: "I think..."
| O N D R | scoundrel | O F F D R | operative
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JediMasterAlex's Avatar


JediMasterAlex
11.14.2019 , 09:23 AM | #49
Quote: Originally Posted by AndriusAjax View Post
Don't use my comment in your silly little debate lol.

I appreciate Krea. If every reviewer/guide maker had to run a strict fact check before putting out their video/guide, we'd have even less guides than we currently do (which is pretty much none). I very much appreciate people who go to the extra effort to help communicate things. And I certainly didn't take anything he said as gospel. I understand that when people have an opinion, they don't always precede it with: "I think..."
He was the one who was pumping PTs to defend sins, so it's relevant I'm afraid. How would you have known it was wrong if not for myself and others questioning it?

I only use that to counter the notion that some people have "why argue on the forums, just let people have opinions." If you just let opinions stand unopposed, then people can often get wrong impressions. It's nearly always a good thing to argue against what you think is wrong, especially on a public forum when that's kind of the point lol.

And I never said you couldn't appreciate Kre'a, by all means do. I've also never criticized any of his guides. Ironically though, your attitude towards him here, and defense of him, actually makes it all the more necessary to challenge him when he's wrong.

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
11.14.2019 , 09:32 AM | #50
Quote: Originally Posted by Jinre_the_Jedi View Post
I'm not sure what your problem is with me specifically but your constant need to try to discredit me in every thread I end up in is pretty tiring.
For some reason some people on the forums take discussions about SWTOR personally and then feel a need to stalk you around the forums picking fights. Hey, at least be glad he doesn't report you for hurting his feelings.
TRUE
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
RNG is counterproductive because it massively increases player dissatisfaction.
FALSE
Quote: Originally Posted by olagatonjedi View Post
As I detailed in another thread, RNG give the players more control over their gearing.