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Suggested Mercenary/Commando Changes for 1.6


cashogy

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You've got to realize that the only updates to the merc class that everyone (except mercs) will approve would be to replace our blasters with rubber chickens and let us throw eggs at opponents. That way it's more of a laugh when we get slaughtered.

 

They don't want a fighting merc and they don't want competition. It's a shame that the instant Tracer Missile idea was abandoned. That had true potential.

 

Let me know when we get those chickens.

 

Run and Gun would be proc'd off of Rocket Punch, which is only a 9 second cooldown. so if need be, every 9s you could use 3 casted abilities as instants. use all 3 in a row, and that is 4.5s, and Rocket Punch is halfway done its cooldown already.

 

i think it would be very well balanced, especially in conjunction with the relatively wimpy knockback on Rocket Punch for Arsenal. it would allow the merc to create additional space. and after 3x instant tracers, heatseeker missiles, rail shot, and explosive dart, your opponent should be pretty dang close to dead. at that point use jet boost, and finish them off.

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Egg Toss

Activation: 5 secs

Heat: 16

Range: 15 m

Launches an egg at the target that deals 20 kinetic damage and applies a 2 second stun. Requires the use of the DL-CHKN blaster. An interrupted shot cause the DL-CHKN to backfire, stunning the bounty hunter for 10 seconds.

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Run and Gun would be proc'd off of Rocket Punch, which is only a 9 second cooldown. so if need be, every 9s you could use 3 casted abilities as instants. use all 3 in a row, and that is 4.5s, and Rocket Punch is halfway done its cooldown already.

 

i think it would be very well balanced, especially in conjunction with the relatively wimpy knockback on Rocket Punch for Arsenal. it would allow the merc to create additional space. and after 3x instant tracers, heatseeker missiles, rail shot, and explosive dart, your opponent should be pretty dang close to dead. at that point use jet boost, and finish them off.

 

I still see some problem with this. After all a sniper while being able to do that must stay still to nuke you down, If this change to rocket punch was implemented there would 0 chances for a meele class to ever kill a commando. I charge and you knock me back, root and start running away while insta casting. Now i have to get back to you with the leap in cooldown and after having eat 3 nukes straight in the face. Even if for some reason i make it there alive you still have the knockback and a stun, and obviously you can do that again, after all it has only 9 sec cd.

 

Sorry as much as i agree that the commando need something, this would make them the new FOTM.

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I still see some problem with this. After all a sniper while being able to do that must stay still to nuke you down, If this change to rocket punch was implemented there would 0 chances for a meele class to ever kill a commando. I charge and you knock me back, root and start running away while insta casting. Now i have to get back to you with the leap in cooldown and after having eat 3 nukes straight in the face. Even if for some reason i make it there alive you still have the knockback and a stun, and obviously you can do that again, after all it has only 9 sec cd.

 

Sorry as much as i agree that the commando need something, this would make them the new FOTM.

 

1. if youre using charge to initiate combat, youre doing it wrong.

2. the knockback on Rocket Punch is ~10m. damage breaks the root after 2s. and the knockback + root is only available to 1 spec.

3. melee classes dont have slows/root/stuns of their own?

 

merc would no longer be a free kill if what i proposed happens. apparently that idea is unpopular with a lot of people

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Like I said, no one wants a fighting merc. Players are used to the easy kills and anything that would change that would disrupt game balance. The game's current balance is that mercs are free kills. If you change that, you make mercs over-powered (to some people).
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Man i'm trying to help this class, and just so you know i'm an healer, i couldn't be more unbiased in this matter.

You are not going to obtain anything with unreasonable requests.

Well you are probably not going to obtain anything even with reasonable ones, but there is still a glimmer of hope :D.

 

Having such a skill on a 9 sec cooldown is too much, no matter how you look at it. Now if you were to give commandos a skill with a 45 sec cd that makes the next stock strike have those effects then we can get somewhere.

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Man i'm trying to help this class, and just so you know i'm an healer, i couldn't be more unbiased in this matter.

You are not going to obtain anything with unreasonable requests.

Well you are probably not going to obtain anything even with reasonable ones, but there is still a glimmer of hope :D.

 

Having such a skill on a 9 sec cooldown is too much, no matter how you look at it. Now if you were to give commandos a skill with a 45 sec cd that makes the next stock strike have those effects then we can get somewhere.

 

45s cooldown? not sure if serious.

 

Mercs would be *required* to be within melee range to get the effect of Run and Gun. which means they are coming under attack from at least one, possibly multiple melee opponents. the knock-back effect would only be available to the Arsenal spec which, even with all the changes i suggested, would be a sub-par PvP spec to Pyrotech.

 

 

 

do you not play a merc? while i appreciate your opinion, if you have not played a Merc at high-level end game PvP, you do not really understand what the problems with the class are. its performance against bad pugs is irrelevant; that is not how you balance a game. you balance a game based on the highest level of play, where the balance is actually important and highly visible.

 

i have to play at an obnoxiously high skill level in order to compete with even bad FOTM players.

 

and ive said this multiple times: damage output does not suddenly magnify when casted abilities activate instantly. the difference is Merc would actually be able to use those abilities when they are having lightsabers inserted into their rectum.

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I am currently leveling a merc atm but i thought id weigh in with a 50 jugg/ 50 assassins point of view mercs/commandos need simple changes to make them competitive. Having two melee 50s doing end game pvp i can say everything u are asking isnt even close to asking for to much, these changes are a great start and its nice to see the community reacting so well to it. Now as far as the rocket punch knockback i can tell u that 9 sec cd for something like that is not only needed but the class will be broken with out something of its nature. lets face it mercs are a long range dps/heal with no utilities to keep melee at bay. I cant tell you how many times im able to kill a arsenal merc without him getting a shot off (besides insta casts) as melee i have multiple utilities to keep u in range. Mercs/commandos need this and im all for it i hope to get knockback stunned post 1.6 cant say it'll help the unskilled but thats the point isnt it as you said u have to be more skilled than your opponents to be equal with them and thats not right. Mercs need help or they will continue to be the laughing stock of pvp. btw the chicken idea is awesome
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I am currently leveling a merc atm but i thought id weigh in with a 50 jugg/ 50 assassins point of view mercs/commandos need simple changes to make them competitive. Having two melee 50s doing end game pvp i can say everything u are asking isnt even close to asking for to much, these changes are a great start and its nice to see the community reacting so well to it. Now as far as the rocket punch knockback i can tell u that 9 sec cd for something like that is not only needed but the class will be broken with out something of its nature. lets face it mercs are a long range dps/heal with no utilities to keep melee at bay. I cant tell you how many times im able to kill a arsenal merc without him getting a shot off (besides insta casts) as melee i have multiple utilities to keep u in range. Mercs/commandos need this and im all for it i hope to get knockback stunned post 1.6 cant say it'll help the unskilled but thats the point isnt it as you said u have to be more skilled than your opponents to be equal with them and thats not right. Mercs need help or they will continue to be the laughing stock of pvp. btw the chicken idea is awesome

 

thanks for you support!

 

:cool:

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Like I said, no one wants a fighting merc. Players are used to the easy kills and anything that would change that would disrupt game balance. The game's current balance is that mercs are free kills. If you change that, you make mercs over-powered (to some people).

 

This is unfortunately exactly what I see happening. Once we get a buff that actually gives us a fair chance, people will be crying OP because they can't kill us as fast and as effortlessly as they used to. Even if the buff put us in a perfect spot, many would cry OP, especially because those of us who have stuck with the class have developed excellent skill and survival talent (only we are missing the tools to make those skills effective).

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45s cooldown? not sure if serious.

 

Mercs would be *required* to be within melee range to get the effect of Run and Gun. which means they are coming under attack from at least one, possibly multiple melee opponents. the knock-back effect would only be available to the Arsenal spec which, even with all the changes i suggested, would be a sub-par PvP spec to Pyrotech.

 

 

 

do you not play a merc? while i appreciate your opinion, if you have not played a Merc at high-level end game PvP, you do not really understand what the problems with the class are. its performance against bad pugs is irrelevant; that is not how you balance a game. you balance a game based on the highest level of play, where the balance is actually important and highly visible.

 

i have to play at an obnoxiously high skill level in order to compete with even bad FOTM players.

 

and ive said this multiple times: damage output does not suddenly magnify when casted abilities activate instantly. the difference is Merc would actually be able to use those abilities when they are having lightsabers inserted into their rectum.

 

I agree. Having Run and Gun attached to rocket punch would not be OP. I wouldn't risk my safety to walk all the way up to my target just to proc 3 instant-cast abilities. I currently only use rocket punch when I am confronted in close range, and that wouldn't change. People are just disgusted by the thought of a mercenary actually fighting back.

On an off note, I think pyros could use a little love in the escape department also, but that's a different story.

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I agree. Having Run and Gun attached to rocket punch would not be OP. I wouldn't risk my safety to walk all the way up to my target just to proc 3 instant-cast abilities. I currently only use rocket punch when I am confronted in close range, and that wouldn't change. People are just disgusted by the thought of a mercenary actually fighting back.

On an off note, I think pyros could use a little love in the escape department also, but that's a different story.

 

i have suggested that Energy Shield for Pyrotechs be able to not only remove current root/slows, but provide immunity to those effects for the full duration of Energy Shield. that should be enough of an escape mechanism without adding in a whole new ability.

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I fully support the implementation of run and gun through rocket punch, but for all talent trees. I don't see how this is over powered at all seeing that we are a ranged class, from afar all of our abilities would need channeling still. Once the battle is up close we would finally have a tool at our disposal to give us some help. Ranged distance = nothing really changes with run and gun, melee distance means we have some tools to help us out close up.

Great Idea, sadly I doubt there will be any changes made to this class.

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i have suggested that Energy Shield for Pyrotechs be able to not only remove current root/slows, but provide immunity to those effects for the full duration of Energy Shield. that should be enough of an escape mechanism without adding in a whole new ability.

 

Ah, I missed that one. Sorry 'bout that. What do you think about the nerf to the cgc proc? I think it was a very bad move by BW that gimmped our kiting ability even more. Plus the fact that it's rng... its just not that great anymore.

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Ah, I missed that one. Sorry 'bout that. What do you think about the nerf to the cgc proc? I think it was a very bad move by BW that gimmped our kiting ability even more. Plus the fact that it's rng... its just not that great anymore.

 

it should go back to a 50% slow, absolutely

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Just 2 charges of Run and Gun and you have my vote good sir.

 

Run and Gun should be a Tier 3 talent.

 

Why? It drastically changes the play style of whatever build it goes into. It should require a hybrid build if used outside of the Arsenal tree.

 

Can u imagine Thermal detonator+explosive Dart and then Railshot with back to back instant powershots? Cuz that was my first thought. forget the heat management, i just killed a healer in like 5 seconds. Or rapid scan with 2 fast healing scans? Near immortality.

 

Tier 3 please or we'll be eyed for nerf bats soon.

Edited by TyrellJonez
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Just 2 charges of Run and Gun and you have my vote good sir.

 

Run and Gun should be a Tier 3 talent.

 

Why? It drastically changes the play style of whatever build it goes into. It should require a hybrid build if used outside of the Arsenal tree.

 

Can u imagine Thermal detonator+explosive Dart and then Railshot with back to back instant powershots? Cuz that was my first thought. forget the heat management, i just killed a healer in like 5 seconds. Or rapid scan with 2 fast healing scans? Near immortality.

 

Tier 3 please or we'll be eyed for nerf bats soon.

 

Can you imagine thermal detonator + explosive dart and then rail shot with back to back flame bursts that guarantee tech damage and a refresh on cgc? Shouldn't be very hard at all considering a class already has that in game.... with instant powershot we still don't get a 100% application chance to cgc. Also powershart is white damage which is easily mitigated and once again your run and gun proc wouldn't really come into effect at ranged distances unless you rocket punched someone and jet boosted them or rocket punched someone and ran 30m away to kite. (waste of time) So I don't think a nerf would be in order.....

 

Run and Gun should be applicable to all merc classes. Some classes need more charges than others hence the talent trees. Healing would be fine with one or two run and gun procs only applicable to heals (three is just over kill/OP imo for heals in pvp situations), Arsenal and Pyro would fair better with two charges only applicable to damage skills.

 

This is the best idea I have heard yet. Also a reduced CD on power overrides with a chance to reduce CD through crit chance wouldn't be a bad idea either...

Edited by physicXx
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Just 2 charges of Run and Gun and you have my vote good sir.

 

Run and Gun should be a Tier 3 talent.

 

Why? It drastically changes the play style of whatever build it goes into. It should require a hybrid build if used outside of the Arsenal tree.

 

Can u imagine Thermal detonator+explosive Dart and then Railshot with back to back instant powershots? Cuz that was my first thought. forget the heat management, i just killed a healer in like 5 seconds. Or rapid scan with 2 fast healing scans? Near immortality.

 

Tier 3 please or we'll be eyed for nerf bats soon.

 

i think 3 charges are fine. it gives us the freedom of having the chance to use 3 casted abilities instantly, which when under pressure would be a massive improvement.

 

tier 3? no. this is a change that needs to benefit ALL Merc DPS. Pyrotech is as much reliant on casting as Arsenal is.

 

um, i can ALREADY perform the combo that you describe. and in no way whatsoever is the damage that results from it overpowered. at most, youre going to be looking at 10-14k damage over 5 GCDs.

 

yeah, you could use the 3 charges on Rapid Scan, but you just maxed out your heat and are useless for the next ~10s while it comes down.

 

 

as far as drastically changing the play-style, say what? you would get a Run and Gun proc from Rocket Punch, and only Rocket Punch. how many successful Mercs do you see purposefully closing to melee range to do their damage? the answer to that question is NONE. this proc would be the ideal way for Mercs to have a reliable mechanism for combating melee opponents who get into our faces. if there is no melee player near you, you will be casting from range just like always. the only change is that Merc actually would stand a chance against melee opponents.

 

 

and people will absolutely cry for Merc to be nerfed if these changes go through. that is because they are use to Mercs literally being a free kill. suddenly we would be as effective as any other DPS class, and our enemies would not like that.

Edited by cashogy
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Whoa whoa whoa, i been rolling a merc since beta don't jump down my throat assuming i don't know what i'm talking about. Its a VERY good idea/mechanic that i fully support.

 

I just see it as a tradeoff. HSM/Thermal Detenator/Emergency Scan for the ability to hybrid effectively. Arsenal spec won't care because of course they are gunna take it, but the other 2 specs will hafta sacrifice something for it. a 1pt talent that can drastically change how you play.

 

Imagine a pyro merc shooting off instant big heals? A Bodyguard merc spamming instant tracer missle? People wouldn't be able to say "hes wearing combat support cylinder, hes a healer" they hafta watch how you PLAY and see what your doing.

 

I see room for abuse, i just want this idea to get off the ground and hopefully implemented before the developers (hah, like they even notice) decide its just a stupid fanboy wish and write us all off. Can't argue with that

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- change Deguass, a tier 3 box, to the following: Energy Shield has a [50 / 100]% chance to remove all movement-impairing effects when activated and a [50 / 100]% chance to be immune to all movement-impairing effects for the duration of Energy Shield

 

 

.

 

Yup, that was my idea a while back =)

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Whoa whoa whoa, i been rolling a merc since beta don't jump down my throat assuming i don't know what i'm talking about. Its a VERY good idea/mechanic that i fully support.

 

I just see it as a tradeoff. HSM/Thermal Detenator/Emergency Scan for the ability to hybrid effectively. Arsenal spec won't care because of course they are gunna take it, but the other 2 specs will hafta sacrifice something for it. a 1pt talent that can drastically change how you play.

 

Imagine a pyro merc shooting off instant big heals? A Bodyguard merc spamming instant tracer missle? People wouldn't be able to say "hes wearing combat support cylinder, hes a healer" they hafta watch how you PLAY and see what your doing.

 

I see room for abuse, i just want this idea to get off the ground and hopefully implemented before the developers (hah, like they even notice) decide its just a stupid fanboy wish and write us all off. Can't argue with that

 

except you WOULD NOT be able to hybrid effectively. you could get Rail Shot resets, and basically thats it. and you absolutely WOULD NOT be able to gain enough damage output from "run and gun" to make up for using a absolutely ridiculous Merc DPS hybrid build. Merc DPS hyrid WILL NOT WORK.

 

do you not understand that what i am proposing WOULD NOT be available all the time? only IMMEDIATELY AFTER USING ROCKET PUNCH. so "a pyro merc shooting off instant big heals" would not happen UNLESS THEY WERE BEING ATTACKED BY MELEE.

 

oh, and btw an Arsenal Merc can *already* get 2 instant heals back-to-back. there are literally ZERO people complaining about that.

 

healers spamming tracer missile? 1) 3 casted instants =/= SPAMMING, 2) why on earth would a healer take Tracer Missile? its a tier 3 ability, and you would have to give up Bodyguards ONLY instant single target heal. that makes no sense.

 

this would absolutely NOT be able to be abused. if, as a Merc RANGED DPS, you are closing to melee distance constantly, YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG! Rocket Punch is used WHEN WE ARE IN MELEE RANGE, which is most often WHEN WE ARE BEING ATTACKED BY MELEE OPPONENTS.

 

i really do not see how you think this will be abused? purposefully closing to melee distance as a Merc is a GREAT way to get yourself killed. "Run and Gun" would be designed to allow you 3 casted instants, only after using Rocket Punch on an enemy in melee range. which likely already means you have been slowed/rooted, unless your opponent is terrible.

 

this is not rocket science......

Edited by cashogy
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