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Utilities overhaul 5.6 suggestions everyone contribute their balanced opinions

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Utilities overhaul 5.6 suggestions everyone contribute their balanced opinions

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
10.14.2017 , 07:38 AM | #1
Anyways for what it's worth let's do a thread on this.

I'll start first - I dabble in playing mando, snipy and mara but will refrain from suggesting utilities overhaul for those as those are my secondary toons, someone with a lot of experience maining those can make suggestions that they see as "fair and balanced" - like mando players who say they want to leave their utilities the way they are now are just silly -sure give them good kiting tools but please tone down the three lives thingy just a little bit ? As for mara getting rid of ruthless aggressor outright is also silly but maybe some small adjustment is needed.

Anyways I will list some Sage/Sorc improvements as that is what I play most and I try to get these balanced.

1.) Force Bubble an instant activation and not a channel - with immunity granted anywhere from 5-10sec (10 sec can be a long time though of immunity I grant that). Maybe 5 sec of complete immunity and 5 sec of some form of resistance-interupts damage reduction + passive healing etc?
2.) Suppression dr utility for cloud mind should be a standard default feature of the cloud mind ability.
3.) The utility which makes whirlwind an instant cast should make it that whirlwind does not break from your dots (not all dots just your dots).
4.) Instead of suppression utility introduce a utility that allows your next Demolish, Mind Crush or Benevolence to be activated instantly after using force speed.

There not too much but would be definately an improvement. Also not sure about buffing healers with that suggested Benevolence proc on force speed - maybe too much. Actually if you buff force barrier too much for dps spec that can unbalance the heal spec.

omaan's Avatar


omaan
10.14.2017 , 08:15 AM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by ottffsse View Post
Anyways for what it's worth let's do a thread on this.

I'll start first - I dabble in playing mando, snipy and mara but will refrain from suggesting utilities overhaul for those as those are my secondary toons, someone with a lot of experience maining those can make suggestions that they see as "fair and balanced" - like mando players who say they want to leave their utilities the way they are now are just silly -sure give them good kiting tools but please tone down the three lives thingy just a little bit ? As for mara getting rid of ruthless aggressor outright is also silly but maybe some small adjustment is needed.

Anyways I will list some Sage/Sorc improvements as that is what I play most and I try to get these balanced.

1.) Force Bubble an instant activation and not a channel - with immunity granted anywhere from 5-10sec (10 sec can be a long time though of immunity I grant that). Maybe 5 sec of complete immunity and 5 sec of some form of resistance-interupts damage reduction + passive healing etc?
2.) Suppression dr utility for cloud mind should be a standard default feature of the cloud mind ability.
3.) The utility which makes whirlwind an instant cast should make it that whirlwind does not break from your dots (not all dots just your dots).
4.) Instead of suppression utility introduce a utility that allows your next Demolish, Mind Crush or Benevolence to be activated instantly after using force speed.

There not too much but would be definately an improvement. Also not sure about buffing healers with that suggested Benevolence proc on force speed - maybe too much. Actually if you buff force barrier too much for dps spec that can unbalance the heal spec.
Bad try of making sorc a new fotm. 1/10, devs ignore this completely please.

BraverDre's Avatar


BraverDre
10.14.2017 , 08:19 AM | #3
I support this thread.

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
10.14.2017 , 08:21 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by omaan View Post
Bad try of making sorc a new fotm. 1/10, devs ignore this completely please.
Dude if they nuke that class from orbit which they pretty much did with 5.0 I'll still be playing it, I am beyond the point of really caring about which class is "fotm" or not given the state this game was in the past 12 months. Now if you have so much experience with Van/PT how about you make some constructive suggestions to improve that class?

supertimtaf's Avatar


supertimtaf
10.14.2017 , 10:16 AM | #5
I support this thread, not the utility you posted though. We're talking about balance, not making a class OP. There is too much change in what you proposed that would make an imbalance in terms of gameplay. A "correct" utility balance should look at this imo :

Sorcerer
-Give back the heal on Force Barrier that was given by the "Corrupted Barrier" utility, that's useless as it is now, Force Barrier only making you survive ten seconds before dying. Replace it as it was in 4.0
-Fix the issue with Deathmark stack being eaten by any other Inquisitor dot, this result in a huge dps loss for Madness Sorcerer (This isn't a utility, but should be included in the list of fix as well).
-*add-on will appear later, when peoples make coherent suggestion*

Mercenary
-Remove completely "Kolto Surge", this wasn't needed and must just go. It's more powerfull than Enraged Defense for the Jugg, which is what is the closest to "tank class" imo. Replace it with a 30% DR utility on Kolto Overload, like the one for Pyro Powertech eventually.
-Remove "Trauma Regulator". This is also one of the broken ability that made everyone complain about merc since the start of 5.0 This needs a replacement that does not involve self heal.
-*Another Suggestion ?*

Powertech
-Replace "Pressure Overrides" with a nerfed version of "Trauma Regulator" (not a nerfed Kolto Surge, it would make Pyro PT overpowered). Maybe a 3% heal per stack that can go up to 10 times (I need advice from PT players, I haven't played the class enough to know what could be "balanced").
-Increase the bonus given by "Fuel Additive" by 5%, this is a utility that could need a bit of love imo.
-*need. ideas. here.*

Marauder
-Reduce the Force/Tech resistance given by "Ruthless Aggressor" from 75% to 50%. It will decrease the OP aspect of the utility while still making it viable.
-Fix "Subjugation" so that Cloak of Pain can indeed be used when you're stunned by anything. Currently a lot of stun don't allow you to use Cloak of Pain even if with the utility correctly enabled.
-*no other balance really needed imo, except if someone suggest a better idea*

Sniper
-Remove completely the self heal given by "Defensive Safeguard". The DR effect is fine, the heal was over the top.
-Maybe (maybe !) nerf the self heal given by "Tactical Retreat". Do not remove it, keep it or nerf it.
-*Don't know what else to ask*

Juggernaut
-Fix the "Sonic Wall" utility so that it doesn't remove any Static Barrier applied by a sorcerer or a sage when used on your team. It is a support utility, it shouldn't remove another support ability.
-Fix the "Pooled Hatred" utility for Vengeance Jugg. Currently, the stack are consumed by Shatter's DoT. This isn't intended because the dot don't consume Rage. Make it so that the first hit can still use the stack while the dot resulting from the attack don't. It's a huge dps loss for a Vengeance Jugg and should be fixed ASAP.
-*Suggestion ?*

Assassin
-Improve "Assassin's Shelter". A buff to the heal given could actually make this utility worth taking. Let the DR as it is and improve the heal. It's the only raid utility an assassin has, it shouldn't be this bad.
-Fix "Phasing Phantasm" so that the buff actually use the correct duration of Force Speed. The buff currently last 2.5 sec even if you don't take the utility to make Force Speed last 0.5sec more. It doesn't seem much, but the 60% absorb is really big, even 0.5sec can impact this by a lot. Make the tooltip more clear for every language, for now each state different effect. Nerf the damage reduction granted by the utility from 60% to 40%
-Fix the issue with Deathmark stack being eaten by any other Inquisitor dot, this result in a huge dps loss for Hatred Assassin (This isn't a utility, but should be included in the list of fix as well).
-Give back Phasewalk
-*an idea ? Someone ?*

Operative
-*No changes needed here*


(This is clearly made to be edited, if anyone has a suggestion, say it. I don't know every class well and can maybe be too harsh or too soft on some class.)
Eliadil - Darkness Assassin Darth Malgus

Feel free to use my referal link if you liked my help ! Free stuff for you and me !

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
10.14.2017 , 10:29 AM | #6
What I agree upon in terms of dps sorc is that they should buff dps sorc utilities a little bit without turning the heal spec into raid boss pest again.

benficakungfu's Avatar


benficakungfu
10.14.2017 , 10:43 AM | #7
There isnt much you can do, imo we have reached a place where giving anymore dcds or not is just more clutter, game has too many ccs already, combat should be more fast paced, there are already far too many ccs in game, if you pause and think about it, was there any benefits to buffing mamdo/merc cds? Will there ever be enough counters to satisfy your position? What about the other classes? Is this improving game to anyone?
Dont fotm reroll to whatever fotm is at the time?
Clearly the balance boat has no direction and its a matter of time to crash into some form of obstacle, rock or not.

HanSollo's Avatar


HanSollo
10.15.2017 , 02:09 AM | #8
Im am going to make a more general suggestion.

Devs need to move away from the Paper-Rock-Scissors approach when it comes to balance. This is usually referred to as "prefect imbalance" in the gaming industry.

The purpose of this is simple. It is to get people to explore different content. Forcing them to level differnt character classes and delve into various story lines that they would otherwise not explore.

While it can work for certain games it does not work in MMOs for 5 reasons. First and foremost you will notice in the previous section I used the word "forced". People do not like paying for things, then being forced to participate in things they don't like to do...go figure. Stop trying to cram content down peoples throats.

Next, we have imbalance driving people away. This is due to the fact that people will eventually hit a point where they are simply unwilling to pay for the content you want them to play. Its really simple, if I want to PvP with a Combat Sentinal but can't because "hard counter" class is being played by everyone I then have a choice suck it up and pay for something I dont want or stop playing and as a result stop paying.

Now, we get into the more nuanced meta games. Most games that have the perfect imbalance system in place have a meta game which involves picking which avatar you will be using. This is usually done via a draft setup for selection for your avatar. SWTOR does not posses this system and as such does not allow for "counter picks".

Next comes the global application of rewards earned. MMORPGs don't really have a lot of global rewards. When you level a Charcter to 70 you have 1 character at 70 and if that character is at the bottom of the current meta you feel like you have wasted your time. This drives people away.

Finally the last point of contention which is also the most important. A game on its fundamental level is supposed to be balanced. Most games you can think of that have lasted for very long spans of time are always perfectly balanced, or appear to be balanced. This is because people dont like the idea that they "picked wrong". Espically That phrase right there is death to games. When a person loses and, even if it only appears, they picked wrong. They will be repulsed by your game. Humans have a natural aversion to anything that is seen as unfair and when certain classes seem to be catered to it pushes people away entirely.

MuskyBoy's Avatar


MuskyBoy
10.16.2017 , 05:08 AM | #9
Devs must give Pyro and Hatred AOE damage reduction and bring them in line with all other dps specs especially since both are melee.

ottffsse's Avatar


ottffsse
10.16.2017 , 05:29 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by MuskyBoy View Post
Devs must give Pyro and Hatred AOE damage reduction and bring them in line with all other dps specs especially since both are melee.
Hatred has the same problem as the ranged dot cousin: dps pre execute is a tad underwhelming compared to other classes in it's damage group but get's very good once a target is under 30% health. Oh and the problem of deathmarks being "eaten up" by mirrored dot classes should be fixed.