This is a warning to new players that would make the mistake of rolling this class as DPS with the expectation of playing end game content.

You will find when you get there that you do about 15% less damage than most other classes, and will be targeted/focused in most PVP activity first.

You will be asked if you are TROLLING just by showing up in a ranked match, so be ready for that.

As for PVE, you will often be skipped over when trying to get into a PUG operations group, because hey...why take in someone that does 15% less damage?

This is just a friendly warning to the new players...go make a FOTM class and enjoy the game, rather than suffer the heartburn from this massively NERFED class.

FOTM is FOTM. Next balance patch might turn everything over, or not.

Tbh, I very much doubt a new player has needs for the extra "ommph" another class bring to be competitive in harder HMs and NiM raid, so if they want to play a sorc, its still a very fun class to play, very strong in solo pve and somewhat forgiving there. Its also decently paced for leveling, you do not feel like you are totally useless until lvl 50ish (or 59 for PTs).

Its also still very good at regs wz, if you know how to play it correctly.

While there are very valid reasons to ask for buffs right now, having new player run away scared of the class isn't really going to help tjhe case. Its still very fun to play.

FOTM is FOTM. Next balance patch might turn everything over, or not.

Tbh, I very much doubt a new player has needs for the extra "ommph" another class bring to be competitive in harder HMs and NiM raid *snip

 

Ok you failed to read the 1st sentence of my post, so I will post it again and underline it.

 

This is a warning to new players that would make the mistake of rolling this class as DPS with the expectation of playing end game content.

 

 

Also your basically saying: yeah sure the class sucks...but you can still do a few things and that's ok.

 

I'm here to warn new DPS SAGES/SORCS that it's going to be a MAJOR uphill battle until there are changes to the class.

 

Don't sit here and try to rationalize that this class is still viable for serious endgame or ranked pvp cause you are just making yourself look silly.

 

Here is a link to the top 50 on Harbinger server on parsly:

http://parsely.io/parser/leaderboard/all/all/1500000/the-harbinger/live/0/

You will see that there are 0 sorcs on that list. In fact to find a sorc you would have to dig down to around 500 parses before even finding one.

 

Be careful that you do research before trying to "FANBOY" this class as viable.

[FOTM is FOTM. Next balance patch might turn everything over, or not.

Tbh, I very much doubt a new player has needs for the extra "ommph" another class bring to be competitive in harder HMs and NiM raid *snip

 

Ok you failed to read the 1st sentence of my post, so I will post it again and underline it.

 

This is a warning to new players that would make the mistake of rolling this class as DPS with the expectation of playing end game content.

 

 

Also your basically saying: yeah sure the class sucks...but you can still do a few things and that's ok.

 

I'm here to warn new DPS SAGES/SORCS that it's going to be a MAJOR uphill battle until there are changes to the class.

 

Don't sit here and try to rationalize that this class is still viable for serious endgame or ranked pvp cause you are just making yourself look silly.

 

Here is a link to the top 50 on Harbinger server on parsly:

http://parsely.io/parser/leaderboard/all/all/1500000/the-harbinger/live/0/

You will see that there are 0 sorcs on that list. In fact to find a sorc you would have to dig down to around 500 parses before even finding one.

 

Be careful that you do research before trying to "FANBOY" this class as viable.

My post said exactly that, for NiM raids and Ranked pvp its not in a good place. For COMPETITIVE endgame, its not in a good place. Not for ALL endgame.

The vast majority of players have no raid teams and don't do anything "harder" than HM KP (or maybe I should say SM ToS/Rav since I think they are harder).

It has the dps, altough it requires better gear than other class to reach it, to clear most HM fights right now, including HM styrak.

I agreed it needed buffs, I simply disagreed on your view and way of crying on the forum and just going drama queen about it.

Lets be real, no new player will do NiM raid or HM revan. No new player will even do HM SnV or HM EC for a damn while.

The new player you are adressing this post to, even if he goes on a darn merc, and get into a regular warzone, if he meets me on my sorc, I'll 100% sure hand him his arse on a plate. 100%. I don't even have a doubt about it.

And experienced players? They already know where sorc is, and why its there. They are sad that they are using their sorc as a casual alt for reg wz and less hard content, but can still have fun with it.

So, conclusion? Your post is just a bunch of whining and crying that isnt useful to anyone, and at worse will drive new players to become FOTM rollers like the vast majority of merc and snipers I see in WZ.

You can choose to be constructive, like I attempt to be in my posts pointing out HOW, realistically you can fix sorc without creating the "new merc". Or you can be like that guy I now have on ignore list and post all over the forums on whatever thread he can find saying "buff sorc in 5.2 or me and my friends leave the game!"

But if you are unable to SEE sorc current state correctly, the good, the bad, and why its underperforming, YOU are the fanboy that wants OP FOTM, and not true balance, not I.

I actually play my sorc in ranked, I actually bring it in some HM raids. The point of view I'm giving here isnt out of nowhere. I'm also not using MERC as a benchmark for how I'm supposed to be performing.

Oh and btw, dummy parsing isnt everything, and we're actually using the 2.5M dummy for benchmark in 5.0 due to the dps level currently reached and the ammount of time a parse must last to start being representative not 1.5M.

Both specs are very very bad, im top on parsely for 1.5 and 3rd on 2.5, but that doesnt matter on ops cuz even when im having a perfect fight, our mara on our prog can do almost 1k more, and im a better player than him but his spec is way better than mine, i just rerolled to Operative the other day

We should stop supporting the game since they dont want to listen to people that play the game

so sorc/sage is stuck with this gimp dps for an undetermined amount of time. they aren't doing any class balance in 5.2 and have no plans to do so.

it's sad. I love the animations of sorc and the class lore - but I dont want to waste my time on a crap class.

I hate that guns > the force...what kind of starwars game is this?????

so sorc/sage is stuck with this gimp dps for an undetermined amount of time. they aren't doing any class balance in 5.2 and have no plans to do so.

 

it's sad. I love the animations of sorc and the class lore - but I dont want to waste my time on a crap class.

 

I hate that guns > the force...what kind of starwars game is this?????

exactly

I hate that guns > the force...what kind of starwars game is this?????

10/10 for this.

So in your opinion force classes should roll the non-force ones Doesn't feel very balanced

I'm all for buffing sorc to bring them more in line with other classes, but I'm not for having them roll everyone like mercs.

This is a warning to new players that would make the mistake of rolling this class as DPS with the expectation of playing end game content.

 

You will find when you get there that you do about 15% less damage than most other classes, and will be targeted/focused in most PVP activity first.

 

You will be asked if you are TROLLING just by showing up in a ranked match, so be ready for that.

 

As for PVE, you will often be skipped over when trying to get into a PUG operations group, because hey...why take in someone that does 15% less damage?

 

This is just a friendly warning to the new players...go make a FOTM class and enjoy the game, rather than suffer the heartburn from this massively NERFED class.

1 year and 3 months later, has anything changed? Do folks want DPs sorcs in their OPS groups? Can dps sorcs hold their own in PVP? did they finally nerf those MERC DCD's? Where is everyone??? Only 19 threads in the SAGE/SORC forums dating back over 3 months!!

Oh my...guess yall took my advice.

1 year and 3 months later, has anything changed? Do folks want DPs sorcs in their OPS groups? Can dps sorcs hold their own in PVP? did they finally nerf those MERC DCD's? Where is everyone??? Only 19 threads in the SAGE/SORC forums dating back over 3 months!!

 

Oh my...guess yall took my advice.

I get what your saying and all and I agree to certain extent, but you can't expect them to buff their DPS to high levels when they are healing 1 mill + sometimes. I would like to see Sorcs get their turn at being the top RDPS, but they have to be very careful how much they buff their DPS because the second people start feeling they have APEX level DPS and can heal 1 mill + in WZs you might find yourself not only inherting the top level rDPS place by also the hatred people have for mercs and snipers and you know how people are, they will be screaming for nerfs.

As far as the Merc and Sniper DCDs you got tons of support, everyone who doesn't play them sees them for what they are and are resentful.

I'll be honest with you, don't get your hopes up for APEX level DPS because that's not gonna happen for a number of reasons, but that doesn;'t mean you can't find yourself improved and I think you will find that, I really do. But there is a small catch to that, it's not gonna happen before 6.0.

Nothing can save this meta and the strategy they are using for "class balance". It's inherently flawed and cannot lead to class balance. So it will requite a change in strategy to see any significant head way made in class balance. New metas always are kinda a restart and classes get switched around on the DPS chart so that's probably what we're all going to have to wait for to see any real meaningful improvement in class balance.

Bare one more thing in mind, there are many specs of many classes that got the hell nerfed out of them throughout 5.x and Sorc wasn't the one most nerfed, madness got a buff actually, so there are a lot of people in many different classes that feel very wronged right now. [PTs for example] and individual specs on some classes that other wise are considered good save for one spec. Devs are going to be under a lot of pressure to try to make amends to the player base in 6.0 because they know there are a lot of very upself people right now pissed at what class balance has become and they don't want to lose more players than they already have so they are going to be considering lots of different classes and specs to adjust. If they don't revert to earlier methods of class balance [like 4.0 for example which was a decent time I think, though some may disagree] things wont improve in the next meta. I do think they will change the paradim through which they examine class balance through so there is some hope I think.

Everyone cares about their favored classes and they are all going to want a piece of the pie in terms of the aggrieved so it won't be just as simple as saying "but we are the worst!", its business to them, and they want to keep as many customers happy as they can so they have give all of them some consideration. That whole needs of the many vs the few thingy.

Lastly, sorcs no longer have the worst DPS in the game anymore. Aresenal Marcs and Marksmen Snipers do now. They are Ranked 18 and 17 on the DPS chart now, and regarding sorcs, Lightning is Ranked at 16 and Madness is at 15 now.

Naturally they have a much better QOL over all compared to sorcs, or anyone else for that matter heh. I'm just talken DPS strength.

I wouldn't worry too much, I think you'll be in a better place come 6.0, I really do. Before than, get comfy, nothing gonna change much for any of us at this point in the meta, that ship has sailed and there is no saving this meta.

http://parsely.io/parser/stats

This thread is sad and retarded. I really hope it doesn't prevent new players from playing sorcs. Are sorc DPS is a great place DPS wise? Not really. Are they 15% behind everyone else? Not at all. I know this is a year old thread but by bumping it yourself you kinda make it as if it was still relevant (not that it ever really was, but yeah there was a time where sorc DPS was lower comparatively, but then everything got nerfed...)

I see a few people on forums saying they can't get into groups because they DPS on a sorc. This is bullsh*t. Most of the time you guys are talking about story mode, in which class balance it not relevant at all, because the DPS checks could be done with a group of 6 tanks 2 healers. 95% of the people that run story modes don't play their class optimally at all, which is ok, that's what SM is for. I have never seen anyone refused a group spot because of class. It may have happened to you, but it's probably not because for your class and for other reasons. I mean a lvl 55 sorc in 198 gear rating can do the SM DPS checks and survive cause of bolster.

If this is about harder content (HM/NiM), then it's a L2P issue. Is playing a sorc in NiM slightly harder than, let's say a sniper? Yes. Do you have to be the best sorc in the world to pull your weight? No. Yes madness could use a small buff to get closer to merc IO and viru sniper, but in no way this class is unable to compete.

1 year and 3 months later, has anything changed? Do folks want DPs sorcs in their OPS groups? Can dps sorcs hold their own in PVP? did they finally nerf those MERC DCD's? Where is everyone??? Only 19 threads in the SAGE/SORC forums dating back over 3 months!!

 

Oh my...guess yall took my advice.

On that note, look at any other class subforum. It's about the same everywhere. It's not a sorc issue, it's a game issue. Community is not as big as it was...

This thread is sad and retarded. I really hope it doesn't prevent new players from playing sorcs. Are sorc DPS is a great place DPS wise? Not really. Are they 15% behind everyone else? Not at all. I know this is a year old thread but by bumping it yourself you kinda make it as if it was still relevant (not that it ever really was, but yeah there was a time where sorc DPS was lower comparatively, but then everything got nerfed...)

 

I see a few people on forums saying they can't get into groups because they DPS on a sorc. This is bullsh*t. Most of the time you guys are talking about story mode, in which class balance it not relevant at all, because the DPS checks could be done with a group of 6 tanks 2 healers. 95% of the people that run story modes don't play their class optimally at all, which is ok, that's what SM is for. I have never seen anyone refused a group spot because of class. It may have happened to you, but it's probably not because for your class and for other reasons. I mean a lvl 55 sorc in 198 gear rating can do the SM DPS checks and survive cause of bolster.

 

If this is about harder content (HM/NiM), then it's a L2P issue. Is playing a sorc in NiM slightly harder than, let's say a sniper? Yes. Do you have to be the best sorc in the world to pull your weight? No. Yes madness could use a small buff to get closer to merc IO and viru sniper, but in no way this class is unable to compete.

While I tend to agree with you pretty much across the board it would be unfair to say they have as amenable a time in PVP/PVP Ranked as they do in PVE with the exception of HM/NiM. Even with regard to HM/NiM. they are viable but they may have more of an uphill battle at times, they are certainly capable of doing any content if the player is sufficiently skilled.

Sorcs aren't squishy anymore and their mobility is insanely good, but lets not forget something, Madness like all the specs may have taken a small nerf to their heals but they did get a DPS buff in mid 5.x. In a meta that has same many specs taking far more nerfs than they. But even with the heals nerf, they can do insane amounts of healing for DPS, reaching a million + in WZs sometimes which is absoutely insane for a DPS spec.

I think that's why they need to be careful how they tweek Sorcs because the second people start seeing upper tier DPS on specs doing a mill + healing the nerf bats wont be far off. I do believe that their is stigma attached to them that isn't wholey deserved anymore. I think people see them through "old eyes", victim's eyes.

I'm not saying they might not need a tweek or two, but nothing major would be necessary. Even many sorc players have said they want any improvements to be carefully made and not overdone because it wouldn't take much to have them OP again like in earlier metas. It can't have top tier DPS and it shouldn't quite honestly, melee have to have DPS on them due to uptime differences between melee and ranged and mechanics that effect them differently.

Simply put, ranged have it easier than Melee and 5.x has been ranged dominated since day one.

Again, I'm not saying that Lighting can't use a tweek or two, but it has be carefully done and in moderation because players hate on "OP" classes and than they get no respect and that can be even harder on them because they feel wronged after having been weaker and that makes them feel entitled to be "OP" because it's "thier turn". No one deserves to be OP no matter how bad they have been in the past. Simply put moderation in all things. Better to start slow and make further adjustments there after if needed because once a spec is perceived to have been given 'too much', right or wrong, people will scream for nerfs and getting nerfed sucks because you know your in for it for a good long while.

I wouldn't want to be a Merc or a Sniper in this meta and even more so in the next meta because people will be out for revenge against them.

I wouldn't mind seeing Sorcs top RDPS in the next meta over all, but that still should be behind melee DPS.

I love sorcs, I don't play them but I love them, say what you will about them, but as far as I am concerned, you can't ask for a better ally to ride shotgun with you than a Sorc. I would take a sorc over any other class to ally up with. They're just so damn useful and have great utility. I can't tell you how many times as a Marauder a Sorc has saved my *** by a well placed pull when I was either too stupid to see a danger or just too caught up in the battle haze to care heh. A good sorc is a great thing to have at your side. Love em.

Just to remind those who complain about Sorc dps not being viable...

4 Sorc DPS NiM Brontes

Just to remind those who complain about Sorc dps not being viable...

 

4 Sorc DPS NiM Brontes

I saw that already heh unreal. Nice work!

If only there was a time machine and I teleported back to 2012 and didn't pick sorc as my main. Oh geez, the only viable spec (let's be honest) in team ranked is Corruption. Madness and Lightning are so in the bottom right now, that it's just sad. BW just ruined Sorc dps.

Hold out for 6.0. I think you'll find the waters more temperate and to your liking. New Metas can be like a rebirth to some classes.

There is a saying "Calm seas make bad sailors". - Classes and specs do not make good players or bad players. Do not relent in playing what you love.

I play a Carnage Marauder. If I was smart, if I wanted to have a better overall performance ceiling, the smart move would be to switch to Fury. Fury is Rank 2 out of 18 Carnage is Rank 14 out of 18. You know what 15 and 16 are? Madness and Lightning.

Switching to "better specs" [FOTM or "OP"] are great ways of not becoming a better player.

There is no spec in this game, that cannot take the top DPS place in a WZ. There is no spec that cannot out DPS any other spec based on player ability. If you think there is any class or spec that you cannot beat because of the spec you are playing alone, you won't beat that spec ever, even though you can.

Nothing is more sweet than when I am able to do more DPS than a Fury Marauder or a Sniper as a Carnage Marauder. I can't always do it of course, but I can do it enough that no one is going to call it luck. It isn't because I am such a great player, in fact, I'm probably less well rounded than most players because I haven't played all the classes first hand. I have played Carnage in good and bad, and it has never been worse than it is now. I don't care. I will make people fear me using Carnage because I am always going to use Carnage and I am going to keep on getting better at it because I am never giving up on it and I will never stop practicing and trying to get better.

You can be a nightmare on the battlefield with Lightning. I can't tell you how to do it, but I know it can be done, because I know two of them who will destroy anyone and you will never beat them in damage. They are outliers to be sure, the best of the best, but that means, it's possible and if it's possible, that means you can do it too.

Rise to the occasion. Do not give up. Don't let anyone tell you what your limitations are. The only person who can impose limitations on you is yourself.

I may not be the best Marauder there is, in fact, I'm saying i'm not, but that's not ever going to stop me from trying to be. There is always more to learn. There is always room for improvement and there is no such thing as the 'best' for very long.

Playing it safe, is the worst limitation you could ever place on yourself. If you only take on 'easy' you will never have a chance at 'hard'. There is no shame in failure, there is no shame in losing a fight, there is no shame in not being the best, there is only shame in not trying at them.

You don't have to be the best or win every fight to make people afraid to cross sabers with you [or lightning bolts, as it were =] ], you only have to show them that you can kill them sometimes, you can beat them sometimes, that' you are capable of grabbing the top spot sometimes, that's enough to give them pause.

No one never loses a fight, no one always takes the top spot, they are unrealistic goals to set for one's self as they are impossible. You will never have a chance at reaching the top if you too afraid of falling to try. The top, is the only goal worth trying for, even if you never get there.

Specs set ceiling levels, they don't set outcomes.

Hold out for 6.0. I think you'll find the waters more temperate and to your liking. New Metas can be like a rebirth to some classes.

 

There is a saying "Calm seas make bad sailors". - Classes and specs do not make good players or bad players. Do not relent in playing what you love.

 

I play a Carnage Marauder. If I was smart, if I wanted to have a better overall performance ceiling, the smart move would be to switch to Fury. Fury is Rank 2 out of 18 Carnage is Rank 14 out of 18. You know what 15 and 16 are? Madness and Lightning.

 

Switching to "better specs" [FOTM or "OP"] are great ways of not becoming a better player.

 

There is no spec in this game, that cannot take the top DPS place in a WZ. There is no spec that cannot out DPS any other spec based on player ability. If you think there is any class or spec that you cannot beat because of the spec you are playing alone, you won't beat that spec ever, even though you can.

 

Nothing is more sweet than when I am able to do more DPS than a Fury Marauder or a Sniper as a Carnage Marauder. I can't always do it of course, but I can do it enough that no one is going to call it luck. It isn't because I am such a great player, in fact, I'm probably less well rounded than most players because I haven't played all the classes first hand. I have played Carnage in good and bad, and it has never been worse than it is now. I don't care. I will make people fear me using Carnage because I am always going to use Carnage and I am going to keep on getting better at it because I am never giving up on it and I will never stop practicing and trying to get better.

 

You can be a nightmare on the battlefield with Lightning. I can't tell you how to do it, but I know it can be done, because I know two of them who will destroy anyone and you will never beat them in damage. They are outliers to be sure, the best of the best, but that means, it's possible and if it's possible, that means you can do it too.

 

Rise to the occasion. Do not give up. Don't let anyone tell you what your limitations are. The only person who can impose limitations on you is yourself.

 

I may not be the best Marauder there is, in fact, I'm saying i'm not, but that's not ever going to stop me from trying to be. There is always more to learn. There is always room for improvement and there is no such thing as the 'best' for very long.

 

Playing it safe, is the worst limitation you could ever place on yourself. If you only take on 'easy' you will never have a chance at 'hard'. There is no shame in failure, there is no shame in losing a fight, there is no shame in not being the best, there is only shame in not trying at them.

 

You don't have to be the best or win every fight to make people afraid to cross sabers with you [or lightning bolts, as it were =] ], you only have to show them that you can kill them sometimes, you can beat them sometimes, that' you are capable of grabbing the top spot sometimes, that's enough to give them pause.

 

No one never loses a fight, no one always takes the top spot, they are unrealistic goals to set for one's self as they are impossible. You will never have a chance at reaching the top if you too afraid of falling to try. The top, is the only goal worth trying for, even if you never get there.

 

Specs set ceiling levels, they don't set outcomes.

The sarcasm is strong in this one. Looks like Rocky speech xD

The sarcasm is strong in this one. Looks like Rocky speech xD

Sarcastic? I wasn't being sarcastic at all. Perhaps I choose my words poorly as that was not at all my intention.

Far as the Rocky Speech, yeah, I think you got me on that one now that I read it again heh.

Yo Adrian! I did it!!!

Dps sorc master race still exists, unquestionable that we're trash in the elites of ranked but by far not push overs unless you're bad. Not hard to hold your own in pvp. Ranked ehh it gets tough but if a challenge and being handicapped slightly scares you... well playing a light armor class, in general, isn't something you should be interested in. I for one played sorc dps since 1.8 and continue to do so to this day and with a big ol' smile as I beat most players even in Fotm classes. Most people don't know how to play their class outside of their basic function anyway. Its those who continue to fight in the class they enjoy even if it's underperforming and find a way to continue playing competitively those are the people I respect.

I have and always will suggest people play sorc and attempt to master its playstyle and how to fight other classes in pvp because if you can beat most classes as a sorc you're a solid pvper handsdown.

-Zànios

In Pvp even they are not trash tier - they are ok just not Maras/Snipers/Mercs. I am talking about madness though not lightning - lightning is in a sad state in Pvp. Well played operatives are also better (than madness) but you have to be gud on operative and not simply "show up". With all other classes sorc madness is probably better in PvP.

In Pve it is actually an easier ranged class to be playing - no resource management, easy aoe fluff. Ligtning is OK too, it is "harder" because it needs higher apm and is click intensive compared to arsenal and marksman.

In operation boss parses usually only melee to significantly more damage than a sorc now but that is by bioware "design" since those class balance changes. Those melee dps if played well generally do better than snipers and mercs in those parses too.

in pve nightmare the question is mainly not dps but why bring a dps sorc when a sniper brings a raid-wide shield to soak damage for the whole raid for a pretty long time, and a merc brings reflect to cheese some boss enrage mechanics/ makes dpsing certain bosses easier.