Adding roots to resolve would require a massive nerf to melee DPS specs to balance it out.

Nerf to melee?? Let's see the difference between a marauder and a Sniper..

With all power/surge min/max, 1350+ expertise marauder, my numbers are:

Mara big hit Annihilation - 4.5k max Annihilate when crits...

Carnage - 6k last hit from ravage, 5k force scream..

Smash - 6.5k smash, 4k force scream.

Sniper big hits on me:

Followtrough 4.5k

Ambush 6.2k

Snipe 3.4k

Series of Shots 2.1k per shot, 4x2.1k = 8.4k in 1 skill... (you can not complain about smash damage, only because it's aoe).

The big hits it's almost the same, you have a lot of defensive cooldowns, you can kill a melee easily.

Roots from a sniper it's like a second stun, because you have 2 seconds to damage me and I can do nothing to stop you.

Instant root - 1.5sec cast 2.5k Snipe + 4k Followtrough... I'm still rooted, you have 3 seconds to use another GCD.

Root again from the knockback - 1.5sec (MM) Ambush.. I'm still rooted.

Finally I can reach the sniper, 4sec stun and melee is dead. CC breaker? Flashbang and sniper has 8sec to run, damage me from 35m distance, instant root again and you know what happens.

So, a nerf to melee it's not needed..

A nerf for Assassin, yes they need a nerf in crowd control.

A nerf for Powertech? They need a nerf in crowd control.

Nerf to melee?? Let's see the difference between a marauder and a Sniper..

With all power/surge min/max, 1350+ expertise marauder, my numbers are:

Mara big hit Annihilation - 4.5k max Annihilate when crits...

Carnage - 6k last hit from ravage, 5k force scream..

Smash - 6.5k smash, 4k force scream.

 

Sniper big hits on me:

Followtrough 4.5k

Ambush 6.2k

Snipe 3.4k

Series of Shots 2.1k per shot, 4x2.1k = 8.4k in 1 skill... (you can not complain about smash damage, only because it's aoe).

 

The big hits it's almost the same, you have a lot of defensive cooldowns, you can kill a melee easily.

Roots from a sniper it's like a second stun, because you have 2 seconds to damage me and I can do nothing to stop you.

 

Instant root - 1.5sec cast 2.5k Snipe + 4k Followtrough... I'm still rooted, you have 3 seconds to use another GCD.

Root again from the knockback - 1.5sec (MM) Ambush.. I'm still rooted.

Finally I can reach the sniper, 4sec stun and melee is dead. CC breaker? Flashbang and sniper has 8sec to run, damage me from 35m distance, instant root again and you know what happens.

 

So, a nerf to melee it's not needed..

A nerf for Assassin, yes they need a nerf in crowd control.

A nerf for Powertech? They need a nerf in crowd control.

You completely miss the point.

It isn't a matter of how much damage ranged vs melee does but the defenses they have when at melee range. Melee classes are typically given the mitigation tools to stay alive in melee range. Ranged classes don't. They are typically given tools to keep enemies away from them.

So if you want to nerf snares and slows then Bioware will have to nerf the survivability of melee classes at melee range. It is the same difference. It has NOTHING to do with damage.

There are many tools available for most classes to try to deal with snares and slows. They have to be timed and used accordingly just like ranged classes have to time their defenses against melee attackers.

Let's remember that root/snares do not stop you from attacking and using powers (unless out of range). There is a huge difference between them and other CC abilities. They are core defenses for some classes who lack passive or reactionary defenses against direct damage.

I wouldn't be opposed for having roots and snares having its own resolve system.

It took 27 posts but we finally got the answer.

It took 27 posts but we finally got the answer.

Thank God!!! Now we can end this debate once and for...err...like 6 hours before the next thread.

At this point I think we're gonna have to suffer through incremental changes.

1. Nerf of Bubble Stun

2. Nerf of Smash

3. Increase of Commando viability

then I think they'll come back and look where we are at. At least that would be my best guess as to what BW is going to do.

Various changes/thoughts:

I think giving Commando's gunnery and lightning sorcs a group CC break would be a big help.

I don't think snares should affect resolve, they're a move/counter move for ranged and melee. Roots should have a lower formula for resolve than stuns, maybe 1/3rd or 1/2 the resolve per second of root.

We should go back to the old formula for stacking CC.

some CC such as immobilization and slows do not count towards the resolve mechanic why is this so ????

Because CCs in this game are considered effects that take your ability to act away. Being slowed/rooted doesn't stop you from controlling your character, it might make it harder for you to attack a target but that is not the same as being unable to to do anything.

Because CCs in this game are considered effects that take your ability to act away. Being slowed/rooted doesn't stop you from controlling your character, it might make it harder for you to attack a target but that is not the same as being unable to to do anything.

The root that comes from a leap does in fact mez you. That takes my ability to "act" away. Slows are fine - roots, mezzes and stuns are not.

The root that comes from a leap does in fact mez you. That takes my ability to "act" away. Slows are fine - roots, mezzes and stuns are not.

I think what you are referring to is the interrupt that accompanies the leap. If we lost it as a baseline feature, I think I would be ok with that.

But leap most certainly does NOT apply a break-on-damage stun to the target. Some Jugg's will use their AoE mez after they leap into a pack to position for the Smash, but that isn't part of the leap.

Roots and snares are specifically not on resolve because the devs want it that way, and they're not going to change it. Stop asking for it.

Not gonna happen. I'm fine with snares ignoring it, not roots. A root is the epitome of a CC.

Don't like roots when you have full resolve? Roll a spec that can clear movement impairment (combat sent, any operative, assault vanguard, shadow tank/hybrid, healer sage, etc...) or a sniper that stays put anyway.

 

You're welcome.

I'm sorry, but that's a load of poo. assault has to burn his one dcd for a onetime root/snare dispel. who in their right mind is going to sit on their ONE dcd for one of the handful of moments that they're snared/rooted? most likely, it was necessary just to get to the white bar.

This doesn't mean I'm 100% behind the op or anything else. but this called for some sort of comment. it's incredibly misleading. only the cleansing classes can legitimately claim to have an answer to roots/snares, and those answers are generally only good for self casts because the roots, in particular, have already run their course by the time a teammate is able to communicate the need for a cleanse to the cleanser, who is likely in the midst of another cast.

We do indeed disagree, but it's all based on theory. You know what would be cool? For Bioware to announce and then implement a week where you can't be rooted when you are white-barred. And/or maybe some of the other suggestions given by people when it comes to cc (shorter cc breaker cooldown is one of the few reasonable ones I can think of). They could alternatively put it on the pts server.

 

Then we could actually try it and provide feedback. Let's face it, this would not be hard to code, and a week of different pvp mechanics would not affect anything (oh noes! My preseason rated ranking!). But things like this won't happen in swtor because it's not a primary focus of theirs.

Im glad Ive gotten "alot" of positive feed back with my post and test server test on the changes that could possibly be made Live would be a great Idea Id gladly go to test it.

You don't understand it, I, a Sniper, will root the Sentinel so that he cannot jump at you and kill you. See? Now take the legshot away from me, and i will not be able to save your butt.

don't you have an automatic root on your punt, independent of legshot? or maybe every sniper/gs I encounter has the two abils macro'd (possible).

honestly, though, how long does full resolve (i.e., whitebar) last? 4s? 5s? how long does a root last? 2s. there is not "resolve" system for roots, so they can be daisy chained ad infinitum. half of the whitebar is lost in one root, and anyone else can reroot whenever. meanwhile, the whitebar continues to tick away.

why would anyone ever be upset about that?

the system is bad. but I've already said as much. so flame on.

edit:

I think what you are referring to is the interrupt that accompanies the leap. If we lost it as a baseline feature, I think I would be ok with that.

 

But leap most certainly does NOT apply a break-on-damage stun to the target. Some Jugg's will use their AoE mez after they leap into a pack to position for the Smash, but that isn't part of the leap.

i'm pretty sure I had to spec into that on my watchman.

for the other guy...

a mezz after a leap?

the guardian tanks have something more frustrating where they gain cc immunity after their leap.

the root after leap is specific to combat spec and goes along with master strike. it's core to that spec, and there are a lot of ways to circumvent it anyway.

Not gonna happen. I'm fine with snares ignoring it, not roots. A root is the epitome of a CC.

Play a ranged class and don't use roots when someone is white-barred, and see how fun it is.

Snares/roots are part of the kiting/anti-kiting game mechanic. The devs aren't going to change this w/o completely rebalancing all classe, and that's not going to happen.

Nerf to melee?? Let's see the difference between a marauder and a Sniper..

With all power/surge min/max, 1350+ expertise marauder, my numbers are:

Mara big hit Annihilation - 4.5k max Annihilate when crits...

Carnage - 6k last hit from ravage, 5k force scream..

Smash - 6.5k smash, 4k force scream.

 

Sniper big hits on me:

Followtrough 4.5k

Ambush 6.2k

Snipe 3.4k

Series of Shots 2.1k per shot, 4x2.1k = 8.4k in 1 skill... (you can not complain about smash damage, only because it's aoe).

 

The big hits it's almost the same, you have a lot of defensive cooldowns, you can kill a melee easily.

Roots from a sniper it's like a second stun, because you have 2 seconds to damage me and I can do nothing to stop you.

 

Instant root - 1.5sec cast 2.5k Snipe + 4k Followtrough... I'm still rooted, you have 3 seconds to use another GCD.

Root again from the knockback - 1.5sec (MM) Ambush.. I'm still rooted.

Finally I can reach the sniper, 4sec stun and melee is dead. CC breaker? Flashbang and sniper has 8sec to run, damage me from 35m distance, instant root again and you know what happens.

 

So, a nerf to melee it's not needed..

A nerf for Assassin, yes they need a nerf in crowd control.

A nerf for Powertech? They need a nerf in crowd control.

Wow Nogueira, your sniper probably wears some gear from the future, released in 2017 if he crits on all 4 series of shots

Play a ranged class and don't use roots when someone is white-barred, and see how fun it is.

 

Snares/roots are part of the kiting/anti-kiting game mechanic. The devs aren't going to change this w/o completely rebalancing all classe, and that's not going to happen.

I do, I play a Commando and Vanguard only. CC's are out of **edit**ing hand. Roots NEED to build Resolve, Resolve needs to last longer, CC break needs cooldown to be cut in half. Roots/snares should reduce damage by 75%.

I honestly could have swore you can't root someone when they are full on resolve, but sounds like maybe I was wrong?

At any rate. I think full resolve should include immunity to snares and roots. From there, if they had roots or even snares count toward resolve, it should be small. The problem is not them, IMO. Stuns and Mezzes need to be used more wisely via either them giving a full white bar sort of thing, or making a stunned/mezzed player take no damage, and the breaker having a much shorter cooldown or any combination of everything in order for people to see the stun vs resolve system strategic and not frustrating.

i feel roots should

 

slows no

 

*** is the point of having a full resolve bar if i can be rooted in place and eat lightsabers the whole time until my resolve bar fades

Since you can shoot him back or stab him back as opposed to a stun where you can't do anything.

I'm sorry, but that's a load of poo. assault has to burn his one dcd for a onetime root/snare dispel. who in their right mind is going to sit on their ONE dcd for one of the handful of moments that they're snared/rooted? most likely, it was necessary just to get to the white bar.

Haha, okay maybe I made it sound better than it is. But having the ability to break movement impairment in key situations can prevent a LOT more damage than the reduction from the dcd.

i'm pretty sure I had to spec into that on my watchman.

 

for the other guy...

a mezz after a leap?

 

the guardian tanks have something more frustrating where they gain cc immunity after their leap.

 

the root after leap is specific to combat spec and goes along with master strike. it's core to that spec, and there are a lot of ways to circumvent it anyway.

Leap roots and interrupts in any spec. Watchman spec gets Zero minimum range Leap, which acts like an extra melee interrupt/root. Some specs like combat and Vigilance can spec for an extra second of root to help them get Master Strike off.

I'm honestly a little surprised at your inaccuracy about this.

don't you have an automatic root on your punt, independent of legshot? or maybe every sniper/gs I encounter has the two abils macro'd (possible).

 

honestly, though, how long does full resolve (i.e., whitebar) last? 4s? 5s? how long does a root last? 2s. there is not "resolve" system for roots, so they can be daisy chained ad infinitum. half of the whitebar is lost in one root, and anyone else can reroot whenever. meanwhile, the whitebar continues to tick away.

 

why would anyone ever be upset about that?

 

the system is bad. but I've already said as much. so flame on.

 

edit:

i'm pretty sure I had to spec into that on my watchman.

 

for the other guy...

a mezz after a leap?

 

the guardian tanks have something more frustrating where they gain cc immunity after their leap.

 

the root after leap is specific to combat spec and goes along with master strike. it's core to that spec, and there are a lot of ways to circumvent it anyway.

As you have said while in bar the roots can still be applyed, but im saying they shouldnt be able to used while your in the white bar if you are immune to stuns/roots/slows (white bar) these things shouldnt be able to be used!

Leap roots and interrupts in any spec. Watchman spec gets Zero minimum range Leap, which acts like an extra melee interrupt/root. Some specs like combat and Vigilance can spec for an extra second of root to help them get Master Strike off.

 

I'm honestly a little surprised at your inaccuracy about this.

heh. it's been a loooong while since I played the sent. started doing it again recently. I only ever used leap as a closer or interrupt tbh - maybe also to gen focus in pve. the cd on it is ridiculously short compared to harpoon. I sure notice that.

but yeah...I always looked at it as an int to mess with mercs. lol

and honestly, when a mara/sent leaps to you, it's the easiest thing in the world to counter for any class. punt. if no punt is avail, see if he starts ms for stun or if he cauts you can cleanse/stun. about the only thing you can't counter is an instant smash...unless you react to the leap and not his action...or you're really quick at checking his stance. prolly getting ot here as I have no idea what we were talking about anymore.

edit: I think the mezz after the leap thing was just someone using awe when he lands. that's common. I'm sure there's no mezz.

I do, I play a Commando and Vanguard only. CC's are out of **edit**ing hand. Roots NEED to build Resolve, Resolve needs to last longer, CC break needs cooldown to be cut in half. Roots/snares should reduce damage by 75%.

this ...

1. roots need to build resolve

2. resolve needs last longer, maybe 1 stun/root and 40 secs full resolve

3. roots/snares should reduce dmg by ... root - 75%, stun 100%.

4. cc break button - 40 secs cd ...

personally i would remove all the stuns from pvp, i guess slows and roots ... thats enough ...