Swoop Rally PTS Feedback

So, after the first hour of figuring out how to actually do these, I was hooked and did them all.
I wish we could redo for fun/top time/etc

Were the Missions fun?
- Dantooine:
- Blatant Beks was a bit confusing at very first, but it was interesting. I found it a lot easier to get dioriented when looking for barrels to explode.
- Razors: Fun, it was straight forward but it felt a lot more like racing than the Beks did. The orbs were a little buggy at first and on the last big jump you sometimes hit an invisible wall, but other than that it was a very fun race
- Pit Screamers: It was also fun, but the Flare ability was either buggy, or the target area is too small because it didn't count one time the first run, and still missed half the second try. The animation is cool, but as with the razors that last jump hits a wall and it kind of ruins the fun for a second.
- Tatooine:
- Blatant Beks: Best one for these guys. It was clear and they were properly spaced so it was easy to get the bonus too.
- Razors: Very Fun, the course was laid out nicely and i felt like i was skirting the sandstorms at a close range to feel danger, but never forced to hit them if i was paying attention. The orbs are useable on this one too, I was able to use the 3 orb boost more than twice unlike Dantooine
- Pit Screamers: Also a lot of fun here. There were way less buggy jumps on this one and I was able to hit lots of flares and rings. However, that middle ring on the broken crawler is sometimes easy to smash into instead of jump through
- Onderon:
- Blatant Beks: Not that fun. Very buggy and I was never able to hit them all because it wasn't counting the explosions. The barrels and fireworks are laid out in really inuntuitive ways and i felt more like i was just hunting for barrels, not racing.
- Pit Screamers: This was a lot of fun for the most part. The first section where you should drop down to get rings instead of the high road feels a little wonky as you have to crash to go the right way. The stands were easy to see and near jumps which was awesome.
- Razors: Least fun of the 3 planets easily. The issues here are the way the orbs are set up, and the path is not clear which way to go in a few instances (do i go left and take the big jump through loops, or go right to the orb, and hit a spike trap?). Also that first jump in the cave is murder. It's so buggy and when it does work, you just smack into a little rock pltform and bug out to the ground. It's a really weird jump.
Overall:
Lots of fun overall. There is excellent potential here if the bugs are worked out and something is done about the Beks terrible aiming and timing

Were the Missions the right length (not too long, not too short)?
- I think the individual missions are the right length so as not to feel like a grind, but I wish i could do practice runs.

Were the objectives for each Mission clear?
- Not at all. First of all if you don't have a clean tracking log, they'll get lost immediately. Also because the bikes immediately move, I feel scrambled to quickly read the missions and figure out how to use the abilities for the mission quickly, or jam my bike into a kiosk to read.
- The Flare ability is clear but where the stands are isnt, the explosive and fireworks ones are not intuitive at all.

Which gang's Missions did you like the most? The least?
- Overall the Razors and Pit screamers were the most fun as they generally felt like racing and running a course. The Beks missions were the least fun. They felt like hunting and it was very frustrating to search for targets while moving, especially on Dantooine where it's very easy to get turned around.

Did each gang's objectives make the course feel a little different?
- Yes they did. It was clear what the differences were. If the orbs and loops are moved around more to make take the faster or more exciting path as appropriate they will feel more refined and unique

Were you able to easily stay on the course?
- On Tattooine and Onderon it was pretty easy to stay on course. Onderon jumps in the waterfall area got a little confusing but other than that area it's straightforward. Dantooine was confusing to me. Some of the areas were clear, but when you get into the farms and have to hunt for explosive barrels it's very easy to get lost.

Did you understand the bike abilities?
- After a few rounds yes. If we had a practice round first it would have helped greatly. With Dantooine's navigation issues on top of being the first course to learn on, it was very tough to get used to the vehicles at first.

Did the speed of the bike feel good?
- For me they felt too slow for the Razors. This was really hard to judge because there were so many instances where i would stop, jitter, or just fall doing a jump, which completely destroyed momentum. It was pretty random too, because i'd hit the same jump the same way twice and end up in very different spots, or just smack into an invisible wall.

What did you enjoy the most? What did you dislike?
- I loved the variety and the interesting locations. I also really enjoyed the orbs on the Razors missions as i felt like I was racing.
- I really didn't like the controls or the objectives for the Beks, combined with the navigation, control learning curve, instant movement, and leack of clear objectives, these were by far the least fun.

Also, not instancing these seems an odd choice. I was zooming through people fighting Sand People, which felt weird, and all the track elements loaded very laggy and randomly on approach in the real world.

PS: The swoop bike from KOTOR was perfect and no reason we couldn't fly those instead

Were the Missions fun? Yes, but I did not like the bomb throwing, especially on Onderon, it's hard to control while on ramps, I also fell trying to throw one and got knocked off the swoop by an arkonak.
Were the Missions the right length (not too long, not too short)? Seems good.
Were the objectives for each Mission clear? Yes, but the firework throwing could be more clear, or redesigned to not have us use a targeting reticle while trying to drive.
Which gang's Missions did you like the most? The least? Horizon's razer, because it felt like a race. Beks because of reasons above.
Did each gang's objectives make the course feel a little different? decent enough
Were you able to easily stay on the course? Once I understood the visuals, except on Onderon trying to throw.
Did you understand the bike abilities? Yes, but it was a little annoying at first to read them while moving.
Did the speed of the bike feel good? I think it could be faster, but at the same time I was recoiling on some high jumps, mostly on Dantooine.
What did you enjoy the most? What did you dislike? I liked the look of the courses, and the feel of horizon's razer missions. The Sandstorm on Tattooine, was a bit frustrating, took me a bit to realize what was even slowing me. Didn't like the bomb throwing.

For the most part, I liked what I saw, but I have a few concerns. I couldn't tell if when other people blow up the fireworks, it makes you not be able to.(I was on a different mission but the guy in front me detonated a firework and I saw it destroyed.) That could be problematic with so many people likely to run it on live. Also wondering about the feel of the races with lots of people running them, lag and such.

You can, although it is extremely imprecise. They throw you (roughly) away from the centre of the mine, so to get thrown (for example) forward-left, loop around and hit the rear-left of the mine.

TWITCH VIDEO OF THE FULL EVENT TEST
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/616104855
START AT 39 MINUTES FOR RACING TEST


MAJOR FEEDBACK

1. If possible, please put the '5' key that makes you discount on the 0 key and farthest side of the abilities bar. Multiples times I accidentally dismounted myself when trying mash the 4 firework key. Definitely user error, but took away form the fun!
2. Can you put a medcenter droid at the start line area. If you switch instances to meet a friend somewhere on onderon it teleports you in the middle of nowhere.
3. Unless you have bigger plans / achievements please make it so you are invincible on the bike. There is too much of potential for trolling if you get hit once you get knocked off by players dragging enemies in. Being kicked off in pvp instance is kinda hilarious though.
4. I had weird results if someone else was on the track... I had trouble testing due to the low amount of players online. If someone else triggered a spike trap, I didn't get caught on it. If someone else triggered fireworks I had to wait for the short respawn, but it might be too late by the time I moved on. How is that going to work with dozens of players in one instance?
5. I think I had some trouble with the speed boost orbs. I felt like I was picking some up and they weren't counting for my "collect 3 use the special ability". Other times I got three, was ready to use the ability, then I would.. go .. through a jump or something and it would disappear and be wasted.

Were the Missions fun?

Yes! I liked.

Were the Missions the right length (not too long, not too short)?


Yes! I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of story cutscenes and the tracks feel a good length.

Were the objectives for each Mission clear?


Yes and not.
The text in the missions tells you what to do, the text that pops shows you what to do, the text in your mission log tells you what you need to do, but I still felt I struggled a lot to figure out what I needed to do on a track. But once I got it it was easy to understand - ex blow up the things that look like fireworks with the 4 key, blow up th red canisters with the 3 key, don't crash!

Which gang's Missions did you like the most? The least?


I honestly like them all equally.
Speed - blow things up - tricks, ALL GOOD

Did each gang's objectives make the course feel a little different?


Yes. Especially once I fully understood everything I think it will be more fun to start meta-gaming the different races on the same track.

Were you able to easily stay on the course?


A few times I fell off but it was not too bad and motivated me to not "fail" at that point again.
Though sometimes like on Dantooine it felt difficult to figure out where the track was once I fell off.
Its fine though.

I had some trouble with the starts of the course
1- I accidentally entered from the back of the start of the dantooine course LOL so I was swooping my way in to the encampment
2 - Later I accidentally entered the "end" of the swoop race because the two large structures for the start and end looked very similar to me. Then I figured out there was a blue line across the end. Then I STILL did it again because they looked so similar at a quick glance lol. Not a major issue worth fixing tho unless you can make some flags or something near the beginning idk?

Did you understand the bike abilities?


Yes hovering over them made sense.
Except braking, couldn't really see a use for it.

Did the speed of the bike feel good?


Saw people saying it was slow, I was happy with the speed. It felt faster than it was because you need to focus on the objectives and not pure racing.

What did you enjoy the most? What did you dislike?


I REALLY LIKE HOW IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO FAIL AND EVEN CASUAL GAMERS CAN PLAY. You can go backwards. There's no time limit. You can go back and get objectives you missed. I like that the objectives have a "wide radius" to hit them. I LOVE THIS. And if you are someone who wants to "do better" you have the timed trial - but nothing bad happens if you miss it.

Dislike... things that felt buggy. Desync rubber banding obviously. Little issues like the speed orbs above. Being confused about the course traps/objectives when another player was on it.

This seems like it is going to be a fun event for players to play and talk about, I'm looking forward to trying to reach the speed timer when it comes out next month now that I know how to play!

• Were the Missions fun?
It was fun to do, nice change

• Were the Missions the right length (not too long, not too short)?
Length was fine, maybe a bit longer would be nice, and focus a bit more on racing (against time)

• Were the objectives for each Mission clear?
At first not, but of course you need to get used to it as well

• Which gang's Missions did you like the most? The least?
I liked the "Horizon's Razor", and "Pit Screamers" the best as that comes much closer to actual racing. Please stop doing "Blatent Bek" it has nothing to do with racing, and the event is called Swoop RACE-ing

• Did each gang's objectives make the course feel a little different?
The changes between the three are nicely done, but please stay closer to actual racing

• Were you able to easily stay on the course?
Yes

• Did you understand the bike abilities?
Yes, but currently the break is not really needed, and in "Blatent Bek" you have to do too much, it doesn’t feel that you are racing anymore.

• Did the speed of the bike feel good?
Would be nicer to have slow, medium and fast bikes be more away from each other (in speed), and as mentioned by others before me change the speeds to a bit faster.

• What did you enjoy the most? What did you dislike?
Nice to have boost pads, but it would be more fun if they would stay on a bit longer and a bit faster
My main dislike as mentioned before is the "Blatent Bek" runs as it doesn’t feel that you are racing

What I am missing is that you are racing against time ( I know it is a bonus, but it would be more "real racing", if that was the main mission) or when you are done with the weekly, be able to activate a time based race and then randomly on one (or all three) of the 3 planets (or let it open up after the weekly)

There is a time limit in the Horizon's Razor races. Well, in reality, there are *two* different time limits. One cuts off one of the bonuses, and the other fails the whole race.

And if you dismount yourself (ref. your point - and mine - about the Dismount key being too close to the others), the race is automatically failed.

All in all, the missions were fun once you got the hang of it. The issues I had personally were that I didn't feel that the track was well fleshed out. I kept getting off track and had a hard time finding it again. Full disclosure: I am a fairly new player and have only been playing for a few months. My roommates, however, have been playing for years and had similar issues. After a few tries, I got the hang of it and had fun.

Were the Missions fun?
I did enjoy trying something new.
Were the Missions the right length (not too long, not too short)?
The length was okay. Some of the tracks seemed a little short while others seemed just right.
Were the objectives for each Mission clear?
The objectives were clear; however, I did find that some of the containers were more difficult to hit.
Which gang's Missions did you like the most? The least?
I did enjoy the Pit Screamers. Having the loops truly helped with following the course. My least favorite was the demolition. If the containers were more targetable it would have made it easier and less frustrating.
Did each gang's objectives make the course feel a little different?
Yes. I did enjoy doing the same course but with different objectives.
Were you able to easily stay on the course?
NO!!! There were numerous times I could not determine where the course was going. Also, after a certain jump, the camera shifted so bad, I couldn't see where I was. I know of a mission in the game currently, On the House in Ziost, that has arrows that lead you down a path for the mission. Having something like this would help tremendously. Another issue I had with the course was the dust storms on Tatooine. They were barely visible and had no time to readjust the course.
Did you understand the bike abilities?
Yes, they seemed pretty self explanatory. I would suggest allowing us to move them prior to the race. My finger slipped a few times and I accidently dismounted.
Did the speed of the bike feel good?
In some parts it seemed fine. In others it felt as though it was dragging. The speed boost on the bike abilities bar took too long to recharge.
What did you enjoy the most? What did you dislike?
I enjoyed trying something different. The courses were fun, for the most part. The parts I didn't like were: 1. Not knowing the course/ not having proper direction of course. 2. Not having the containers targetable for the demolition objectives. 3. Some jumps were glitchy and I never completed them. 4. Dust storms not being more visible.

On a side note, this was my first attempt at doing a PTS. I hope to try more in the future.

Reminds me of the Space missions. Too confined and "set up". There are over 300 mounts in game, so why introduce new ones? Why can't we use our own, with possibly advantages of one over another? Competition is a feature of TOR, so why introduce a solo event? Can't we have several people racing? Make it a old-fashion horse race. Rather than have guides that prevent going off course, why not have a real-world style penalty like falling off a cliff or into a lake? What rewards will there be for CQ, which has come to dominate player's time allocation?

We could, but it would not work well because of network-sync issues.

Not long ago, I spent some time on two adjacent PCs, with a level 75 from my main account escorting a lowbie from my second account round the Esseles or the Black Talon.

So, what we have is two PCs using the same Ethernet to access the same fibre line in northern France that gives me a server ping around 25 ms. They are side-by-side, which lets me see both screens at the same time.

Standing both characters next to each other pointing in the same direction, I pressed the "run forward" key on both keyboards simultaneously. Each PC showed *its* character in the lead by ten to fifteen feet (i.e. between a third and half a second). (That is, on the left we see character A accompanied by character B, with A in the lead, while on the right we see character B accompanied by character A, with B in the lead.)

Translate that into a swoop race, where the margin for overlap is correspondingly larger, and it should be clear that the idea of the race having a clear winner would be difficult to achieve. Each player in a really tight race would think he was in the lead, and the result would surprise everyone but the actual winner.

No, I think that what's on PTS is the best, or if you prefer, the least-worst, compromise we're going to be able to get without a major overhaul of the game's systems.