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Please stop Hutball from being every match. 10 in a row now.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Please stop Hutball from being every match. 10 in a row now.

xbassdominatorx's Avatar


xbassdominatorx
01.12.2020 , 09:32 PM | #1
Or just remove the damn game.

Lhancelot's Avatar


Lhancelot
01.12.2020 , 11:15 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by xbassdominatorx View Post
Or just remove the damn game.
Would it bother you if BW decided to add another HB map to the game?
BIOWARE
Players quit WZs they do not enjoy. You are losing PVPers.
Give players a choice of WZs, enough is enough (Huttball) already!

Good job increasing rewards for PVP! It was much needed, thank you.

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
01.13.2020 , 08:55 AM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Lhancelot View Post
Would it bother you if BW decided to add another HB map to the game?
Edit: had to remove. My comment a little bit too btichy towards dear old Musco

Nemmar's Avatar


Nemmar
01.13.2020 , 09:57 AM | #4
This only happens cause of people leaving maps. We need a debuff for leavers in warzones.

Huttball does not in fact pop more than other maps, just more people load into the same ones cause of leavers. I tested it. It's a myth that huttball pops more.

Lundorff's Avatar


Lundorff
01.13.2020 , 10:48 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
This only happens cause of people leaving maps. We need a debuff for leavers in warzones.

Huttball does not in fact pop more than other maps, just more people load into the same ones cause of leavers. I tested it. It's a myth that huttball pops more.
I have not played a single buttball match in the last 2-3 years, and I am not about to start now. Its very existence is partial the reason why I seldom border with regs in the first place. A debuff will only make me queue for regs even less and never prevent me from leave.

What they ought to do, is give people a choice. Group regs into Arenas, DsyncBall and Warzones and then allow people to queue for one or more groups. It might increase queue time a bit, but people like me are leaving anyway. I would love to queue for regs arena to practice for ranked.

Alas none of this is ever going to happen.

Edit: And of the last 7 matches 4 was §#§%§#%#§&%§&%§ suckball.

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
01.13.2020 , 07:39 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
This only happens cause of people leaving maps. We need a debuff for leavers in warzones.

Huttball does not in fact pop more than other maps, just more people load into the same ones cause of leavers. I tested it. It's a myth that huttball pops more.
Actually thatís not true. People leaving does not make the same maps or map type pop again. Iím not sure where you got that idea from, but itís fundamentally wrong

You are also incorrect. HB as a group does pop more than any other map. It you take all HB maps and put them in a group type, they definitely pop more.

1. There are 9 maps
2. There are 3 HB maps
3. Three as a percentage of nine is 33.33%
4. Statistically, HB style should pop 33% of the time. Which by definition is more than any other map type, (maths doesnít lie)

But here is the clincher. Not all maps pops at the same rate as others. Iíve tested this by tracking 100s of matches for 3 months earlier in the year and have started doing it again since the beginning of December.

I can tell you that my results show some maps pop more than others. And to be transparent I will admit that is an average over time and some maps do pop more or less on some days.
But, the averages for each week also closely resemble the averages for the months and nothing seems to have changed much since my last experiment earlier in the year.

The results are always the same. The top four maps in pop order are these.
1. Vandin Ball
2. Void Star
3. HB
4. Queshball

So having all maps pop at different amounts than others as well as having 3 HB maps in the top 4 pop spots, this causes a statistically anomaly because HB (thatís all maps combined) no longer pops at 33%, it pops higher than that. The average is actually 41% of the pops are HB type maps. Which obviously means you nearly get 2 HB maps for ever other map pop.

Itís important to note, that testing on one specific day or a few days in a week or for a few hours is not long enough to gather enough data to say if HB pops more or less. Some people will experience days where they may not get a HB pop, while other people mostly get HB pops.
This can also come down to how long your game session is, if you only play a few games at a time and get 3 HB pops in a row, your perception would be that it pops all the time. Itís the same as if you played 3 and didnít get any, your perception would be it never pops.

You donít have to believe me. Iím not asking you to take this on blind faith. I suggest running the experiment yourself by noting every pvp pop you get when you play.
But you also need record how many hours you played that day. What day it was and what time it was.
The longer your play sessions and the more frequently you play and the longer the experiment runs, the more accurate your results.

I split it up like this to make it easier.
1. column that listed every map
2. time of day
3. Day of week
4. Number of pvp matches queued
5. Number of pvp matches played
6. Number of pvp matches requeued before game starts
7. Time between pops
7. Weekly totals
8. Weekly averages
9. Monthly averages

Let me finish by saying I played 100s of hours to get my results and I was completely surprised to see Void Star pop the second most of any map because it always seemed to me like it didnít pop much. Which leads to my last point. Perception is everything. If you love HB, you will say it doesnít pop enough or as much as youíd like. If you hate HB you will say it pops too much. But unless you actually do an experiment like mine, thatís all it is, perception and yours is wrong.

Edit: I would like to add something else. If you requeue these days, you do not pop back into the same match like you used to a few years ago. If there arenít enough people after you leave to back fill, it actually plays the match with 7v8, even though you are sitting in the queue by yourself, it will not back fill you into the same match you just left.
Once again, if you dont believe that, test it yourself and note who was on the team you left and who was on the other team.

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
01.13.2020 , 08:22 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Lundorff View Post
DsyncBall
LoL, Dsync Ball, I love it

Nemmar's Avatar


Nemmar
01.13.2020 , 09:45 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
Actually thatís not true. People leaving does not make the same maps or map type pop again. Iím not sure where you got that idea from, but itís fundamentally wrong

You are also incorrect. HB as a group does pop more than any other map. It you take all HB maps and put them in a group type, they definitely pop more.

1. There are 9 maps
2. There are 3 HB maps
3. Three as a percentage of nine is 33.33%
4. Statistically, HB style should pop 33% of the time. Which by definition is more than any other map type, (maths doesnít lie)

But here is the clincher. Not all maps pops at the same rate as others. Iíve tested this by tracking 100s of matches for 3 months earlier in the year and have started doing it again since the beginning of December.

I can tell you that my results show some maps pop more than others. And to be transparent I will admit that is an average over time and some maps do pop more or less on some days.
But, the averages for each week also closely resemble the averages for the months and nothing seems to have changed much since my last experiment earlier in the year.

The results are always the same. The top four maps in pop order are these.
1. Vandin Ball
2. Void Star
3. HB
4. Queshball

So having all maps pop at different amounts than others as well as having 3 HB maps in the top 4 pop spots, this causes a statistically anomaly because HB (thatís all maps combined) no longer pops at 33%, it pops higher than that. The average is actually 41% of the pops are HB type maps. Which obviously means you nearly get 2 HB maps for ever other map pop.

Itís important to note, that testing on one specific day or a few days in a week or for a few hours is not long enough to gather enough data to say if HB pops more or less. Some people will experience days where they may not get a HB pop, while other people mostly get HB pops.
This can also come down to how long your game session is, if you only play a few games at a time and get 3 HB pops in a row, your perception would be that it pops all the time. Itís the same as if you played 3 and didnít get any, your perception would be it never pops.

You donít have to believe me. Iím not asking you to take this on blind faith. I suggest running the experiment yourself by noting every pvp pop you get when you play.
But you also need record how many hours you played that day. What day it was and what time it was.
The longer your play sessions and the more frequently you play and the longer the experiment runs, the more accurate your results.

I split it up like this to make it easier.
1. column that listed every map
2. time of day
3. Day of week
4. Number of pvp matches queued
5. Number of pvp matches played
6. Number of pvp matches requeued before game starts
7. Time between pops
7. Weekly totals
8. Weekly averages
9. Monthly averages

Let me finish by saying I played 100s of hours to get my results and I was completely surprised to see Void Star pop the second most of any map because it always seemed to me like it didnít pop much. Which leads to my last point. Perception is everything. If you love HB, you will say it doesnít pop enough or as much as youíd like. If you hate HB you will say it pops too much. But unless you actually do an experiment like mine, thatís all it is, perception and yours is wrong.

Edit: I would like to add something else. If you requeue these days, you do not pop back into the same match like you used to a few years ago. If there arenít enough people after you leave to back fill, it actually plays the match with 7v8, even though you are sitting in the queue by yourself, it will not back fill you into the same match you just left.
Once again, if you dont believe that, test it yourself and note who was on the team you left and who was on the other team.
You are not reading correctly, i said people load into the same map. Aka Vandin pops and 8 people load in, 4 leave, 4 moreload in, you now had 12 people loading into Vandin rather than 8. Compound this many times and it's this myth that it pops more when it doesnt.

Also, i have said before that that view is biased. Every map is a different map. If you group huttball maps then you have to group 3 objective maps and the 3 remaining ones. It doesnt change the chance that they pop. And the ones that pop the most are the 3 objective ones. Huttball popped less than 33% of the time on my 5 day sample. Also, i DID run the experiment cause of you and i shared my results. Huttball poping more is a MYTH perpetuated by leavers who don't like it.

That is not what my research yeilded. Maps that popped the most were:

Novare (by far)
Odessen
The pit
Vandin

Quesh was one of the ones that popped the least with void star and hypergates

I did 84 warzones in 5 days across the whole day. This wasnt a short session of 3 for several weeks.
Now, of course there is a randomness to it. But after the study i keep getting a similar experience.
This just confirms it's randomness and it's working as intended. The myth that huttball pops more is a self fulfilling prophecy. While people keep leaving without penalty, more will load into the same huttball matches.

Nemmar's Avatar


Nemmar
01.13.2020 , 10:04 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Lundorff View Post
I have not played a single buttball match in the last 2-3 years, and I am not about to start now. Its very existence is partial the reason why I seldom border with regs in the first place. A debuff will only make me queue for regs even less and never prevent me from leave.

What they ought to do, is give people a choice. Group regs into Arenas, DsyncBall and Warzones and then allow people to queue for one or more groups. It might increase queue time a bit, but people like me are leaving anyway. I would love to queue for regs arena to practice for ranked.

Alas none of this is ever going to happen.

Edit: And of the last 7 matches 4 was §#§%§#%#§&%§&%§ suckball.
Then take the debuff if you are that adamant. But a debuff will allow more people to see more diversity in their maps. So, its not about you, but about the game. Yours and other people's selective queueing is actualy being more detrimental than helpful.

Huttball has been a warzone since day one. It doesnt get to not be cause you don't like it.
Also do you people even know where desync comes from? It's the net code and it's present in all warzones. You just notice it more in huttball cause of the traps. But it can be very noticeable for melee players when chasing someone down when they are right in front of them but they cant hit them.

The whole game needs a net code fix. Street fighter 5 modders just showed it can be easily done too. I really wish something was done about it. It would vastly improve the pvp experience.
None of this is huttball specific as much as you want to peg it.

Lundorff's Avatar


Lundorff
01.14.2020 , 01:45 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Nemmar View Post
Then take the debuff if you are that adamant. But a debuff will allow more people to see more diversity in their maps. So, its not about you, but about the game. Yours and other people's selective queueing is actualy being more detrimental than helpful.
A debuff "will allow more people to see more diversity in their maps"? What does that even mean? That people will be force-exposed to maps they don't like, because they are afraid of the debuff? Please. In the actual world a debuff would kill the queue. People would either still quit or simply afk the match.

Again, if you want a deserter lock-out you first need to:
  • Give people a choice in what to play
  • Fix balancing issues between classes
  • Fix bugs, dsync, hackers
  • Ban all premades to the fiery pits of hades

But of course nothing and more nothing is ever going happen.