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Please stop protecting cheaters/botters.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Please stop protecting cheaters/botters.
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WizardGR's Avatar


WizardGR
03.13.2017 , 08:37 AM | #11
For the time beeing you can ignore these players, so gf will not team up with them.

But no bots, no match also and even with bots (or any other kind of these), you can farm some cxp for you
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EricMusco's Avatar


EricMusco
03.13.2017 , 09:10 AM | #12 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Quote: Originally Posted by LordTurin View Post
They are not protecting them. File a ticket, and send the video to Musco as well and they will look at it. They have a general "no naming & shaming" rule on the forums, and for good reason to be honest, as 90% of the time when someone complains about cheating, it is simply because the person complaining doesn't understand the game as well as they should.
Quoting Turin for accuracy here. Report them to CS and send any information you have to me privately. If you post about it, especially with the inclusion of names, the thread will be removed. We take cheating/exploiting seriously, but we also take everyone's safety and privacy seriously as well.

Send me any information you have.

-eric
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Ramalina's Avatar


Ramalina
03.13.2017 , 10:45 AM | #13
Eric, if you don't mind giving a clarification I'd like to know what official policy is at the moment.

The EULA and TOS got changed from a SWTOR specific set to the generic EA EULA and TOS.

I like very much that they are now much shorter, and much more comprehensible. Whoever wrote them could probably be nominated for a brevity and clarity award of some sort when you compare to most software terms and license documents.

However, with the changes, it's no longer as clear that things like deliberate suicides, or running multiple clients so that you can park a ship in one place and farm yourself with another character is actually against the rules. Especially if you take the trouble to have multiple computers running and do the dummy-target characters' movements by hand rather than with some sort of macro (or use hardware where a single wireless keyboard is giving input to multiple computers, which technically isn't any use of forbidden software).

Is that sort of thing still considered an actionable exploit?

Just wondering because if I were arguing this in front of an arbitrator with the current EULA and TOS I think it'd be easier to argue the, "this is allowed on a technicality even if the player is clearly being an antisocial jerk," position than it would be to argue for, "actionable exploit."

Not that I have much problem with things like multiboxing for things like open world PvE (it tends to sort of weaken the multiboxer compared to doing something with an equivalent number of similarly competent players, so for those purposes there's already a built in penalty of sorts), but it's really unpleasant in PvP(including GSF) when you find that half your team is working to lose, and in a way that doesn't even really benefit their farming character's team. It's a lose-lose situation for everyone except the person farming themselves.

Sorry, that got longer than I wanted, but clarification would be great.
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EricMusco's Avatar


EricMusco
03.13.2017 , 12:26 PM | #14 This is the last staff post in this thread.  
Quote: Originally Posted by Ramalina View Post
Eric, if you don't mind giving a clarification I'd like to know what official policy is at the moment.

The EULA and TOS got changed from a SWTOR specific set to the generic EA EULA and TOS.

I like very much that they are now much shorter, and much more comprehensible. Whoever wrote them could probably be nominated for a brevity and clarity award of some sort when you compare to most software terms and license documents.

However, with the changes, it's no longer as clear that things like deliberate suicides, or running multiple clients so that you can park a ship in one place and farm yourself with another character is actually against the rules. Especially if you take the trouble to have multiple computers running and do the dummy-target characters' movements by hand rather than with some sort of macro (or use hardware where a single wireless keyboard is giving input to multiple computers, which technically isn't any use of forbidden software).

Is that sort of thing still considered an actionable exploit?

Just wondering because if I were arguing this in front of an arbitrator with the current EULA and TOS I think it'd be easier to argue the, "this is allowed on a technicality even if the player is clearly being an antisocial jerk," position than it would be to argue for, "actionable exploit."

Not that I have much problem with things like multiboxing for things like open world PvE (it tends to sort of weaken the multiboxer compared to doing something with an equivalent number of similarly competent players, so for those purposes there's already a built in penalty of sorts), but it's really unpleasant in PvP(including GSF) when you find that half your team is working to lose, and in a way that doesn't even really benefit their farming character's team. It's a lose-lose situation for everyone except the person farming themselves.

Sorry, that got longer than I wanted, but clarification would be great.
This really is a great question, it is one that gets complex quickly. I think ultimately the answer is a bit of a "it depends." I would say err on the side of being overly judicious and let the Terms of Service team work it out. That is, if you think something is exploitive or against the rules, report it. Then the team can investigate and look at if it really is against the rules or not.

The same is true of private reports made to me. I would always prefer you err on the side of being overly critical and let me figure out if it needs to be escalated. I will always try to respond and let people know instances where they are far off the mark on something being against the rules as I know that can be a grey space sometimes.

-eric
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RikuvonDrake's Avatar


RikuvonDrake
03.13.2017 , 03:07 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
This really is a great question, it is one that gets complex quickly. I think ultimately the answer is a bit of a "it depends." I would say err on the side of being overly judicious and let the Terms of Service team work it out. That is, if you think something is exploitive or against the rules, report it. Then the team can investigate and look at if it really is against the rules or not.

The same is true of private reports made to me. I would always prefer you err on the side of being overly critical and let me figure out if it needs to be escalated. I will always try to respond and let people know instances where they are far off the mark on something being against the rules as I know that can be a grey space sometimes.

-eric
Case study time, multiple people over the course of a ~year have sent you reports both here on forum as well as via support tickets about a person using bots in GSF and Warzones. The player has yet to be banned or punished (as far as we know, since he continues to do the same stuff with the same account). Would that mean that what that person is doing is not against the ToS as you would have gotten all information about the possible "exploits" and not followed up on the reports?

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Blakinik's Avatar


Blakinik
03.13.2017 , 05:32 PM | #16
Going to go out on a limb for some, but being crappy at playing certain aspects of the game isn't against the ToS.

There are some things I completely suck at doing in the game. GSF is one of them. I can fire away and couldn't hit the broadside of a barn or wind up having my dog jump up on me and throw me into an asteroid. Given that GSF pops maybe once an hour during the times I play (if even that - sometimes just once a night or never that night), it isn't like they developed some PvE practice modules for GSF to get familiar with the controls. I figured GSF was abandoned myself given the lack of support it has gotten over the years (like rail ship combat, seeker droids, macro binoculars, story mode per class, reputation systems, and strongholds).

Blak
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Darkside's Avatar


Darkside
03.13.2017 , 05:48 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
This really is a great question, it is one that gets complex quickly. I think ultimately the answer is a bit of a "it depends." I would say err on the side of being overly judicious and let the Terms of Service team work it out. That is, if you think something is exploitive or against the rules, report it. Then the team can investigate and look at if it really is against the rules or not.

The same is true of private reports made to me. I would always prefer you err on the side of being overly critical and let me figure out if it needs to be escalated. I will always try to respond and let people know instances where they are far off the mark on something being against the rules as I know that can be a grey space sometimes.

-eric
ERIC'S RESPONSE DECODED:

Bioware generally does not care if you do those sorts of things. They will only step in and care/ban if people are complaining about you on the forums, and/or some evidence on you has been reported. Otherwise, if no one knows, or is upset, then feel free to carry on in your activities.
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BRKMSN's Avatar


BRKMSN
03.13.2017 , 10:46 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Blakinik View Post
Going to go out on a limb for some, but being crappy at playing certain aspects of the game isn't against the ToS.

There are some things I completely suck at doing in the game. GSF is one of them. I can fire away and couldn't hit the broadside of a barn or wind up having my dog jump up on me and throw me into an asteroid. Given that GSF pops maybe once an hour during the times I play (if even that - sometimes just once a night or never that night), it isn't like they developed some PvE practice modules for GSF to get familiar with the controls. I figured GSF was abandoned myself given the lack of support it has gotten over the years (like rail ship combat, seeker droids, macro binoculars, story mode per class, reputation systems, and strongholds).

Blak
GSF can be a disaster if you are personally experiencing consistent lag or lag spikes. It doesn't matter how good you can play if the ship in your sights is not really there anymore.

WizardGR's Avatar


WizardGR
03.14.2017 , 05:11 AM | #19
Everything is legitimate, until someone (many) says the opposite.
Odysseas (Odysseus was a legendary Greek king of Ithaca and the hero of Homer's epic poem the Odyssey). In Greek "Οδυσσέας"
This isn't the link, you are looking for. Move along
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T_T_P's Avatar


T_T_P
03.14.2017 , 05:29 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by WizardGR View Post
Everything is legitimate, until someone (many) says the opposite.
Atleast the people saying the opposite are the ones thinking.
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