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Tier 1 3 Changes Coming in 5.2

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Tier 1 3 Changes Coming in 5.2
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Ryenke's Avatar


Ryenke
03.05.2017 , 09:36 AM | #81
Quote: Originally Posted by Darevsool View Post
I'm going to give you MY answer to what 5.0 did to heroics. 5.0 removed a method of allowing me to choose WHICH (near) end game gear I wanted by farming currency crystals that I could use to buy 216/220 gear when the best in game was 224. Now instead of logging in and spending some time farming crystals, I have to suffer (like everyone else) with the RNG system.

EXCEPT....now...there are plans for Operations to get the NON RNG method of gearing back (which was sorely needed) and PVP already has a NON RNG method of gearing (also sorely needed.)

The only style of play that is still NEWLY (since 5.0) limited to RNG gearing at lvl 70 is SOLO PVE.

That's what 5.0 did to heroics.
I enjoyed playing my non-raid alts and gearing them up in the crystal commendation system. Maybe FP or two to get some enhancements. Yes their gear lacked set bonus. Yes the commendation gear was not min-maxed (I usually made sure I could craft pretty good modifications to put in that slot when I bought gear). Certainly the left side of these alts had the comm/crystal gear. How did I get the crystals, often through Heroics/dailies.

Those toons (as most alt play at all) are left high and dry in 5.x - even with the 5.2 improvements. I get that people say these players/toons don't need gear, but it did give that group something to set a goal for. I enjoyed that and since there is no way to enjoy command crates - well, I think the casual group have a legitimate point when they say 5.x ruined heroics/dailies. What I think they mean is the elimination of the crystal/comm gearing system killed off any player agency and gearing control for these types of players.

I'm very glad, I CHEER, that BWA fixed the op gearing problem. I used to be a prog raider, and would still be a substitute healer if I had been able to gear that toon up in 5.x (I didn't have the rng luck to do so). So I am thrilled that problem for that group is gone.

But I played a lot of toons, many of them at the 'casual' level. (Indeed, my raid healer used to only be played for raids). And I haven't logged in in almost a week, and probably will do so only once or twice more before my sub expires in about 10 days. Why? Because 5.0 killed the game I played, and the slow response of BWA to mitigate the problem (b/c c'mon, they haven't fixed it) and the lack of mitigation for most of the casual play I enjoyed.

The 5.x fiasco helped me become uninvested in the game, and watching BWA's mismanaging and seeming lack of resources means I don't want to get reinvested in a service I don't think has long to live.

From what I can see, practically no player 'won' with 5.x. They all got shafted. Yes, cheers to the raiders! I'm glad for them, they NEEDED the fix in 5.2. But that doesn't mean that the non-raiders are happy with what they are left with.
5.0 House of RNG Horror GrindgoRound unsub.

No link for (un)rewarding, (un)exciting and frustrating unmitigated RNG.

Kurj's Avatar


Kurj
03.05.2017 , 09:44 AM | #82
I don't understand why UCs are limited to PVP either, and that's pretty much all I play. If it needs to be at a slower rate to preserve incentive to PVP/play OPs, so be it, but all play styles need a hedge against RNG.
Begeren Colony

Elmendra | Ozeranski | Tr'sain | Kurj

GalacticKegger's Avatar


GalacticKegger
03.05.2017 , 09:51 AM | #83
Quote: Originally Posted by Ryenke View Post
I enjoyed playing my non-raid alts and gearing them up in the crystal commendation system. Maybe FP or two to get some enhancements. Yes their gear lacked set bonus. Yes the commendation gear was not min-maxed (I usually made sure I could craft pretty good modifications to put in that slot when I bought gear). Certainly the left side of these alts had the comm/crystal gear. How did I get the crystals, often through Heroics/dailies.

Those toons (as most alt play at all) are left high and dry in 5.x - even with the 5.2 improvements. I get that people say these players/toons don't need gear, but it did give that group something to set a goal for. I enjoyed that and since there is no way to enjoy command crates - well, I think the casual group have a legitimate point when they say 5.x ruined heroics/dailies. What I think they mean is the elimination of the crystal/comm gearing system killed off any player agency and gearing control for these types of players.

I'm very glad, I CHEER, that BWA fixed the op gearing problem. I used to be a prog raider, and would still be a substitute healer if I had been able to gear that toon up in 5.x (I didn't have the rng luck to do so). So I am thrilled that problem for that group is gone.

But I played a lot of toons, many of them at the 'casual' level. (Indeed, my raid healer used to only be played for raids). And I haven't logged in in almost a week, and probably will do so only once or twice more before my sub expires in about 10 days. Why? Because 5.0 killed the game I played, and the slow response of BWA to mitigate the problem (b/c c'mon, they haven't fixed it) and the lack of mitigation for most of the casual play I enjoyed.

The 5.x fiasco helped me become uninvested in the game, and watching BWA's mismanaging and seeming lack of resources means I don't want to get reinvested in a service I don't think has long to live.

From what I can see, practically no player 'won' with 5.x. They all got shafted. Yes, cheers to the raiders! I'm glad for them, they NEEDED the fix in 5.2. But that doesn't mean that the non-raiders are happy with what they are left with.
Cheers and well met. Prior to KotFE SWTOR's group leveling game was the bomb. It was hands down imho the best of any MMO I have ever played, and I go back to last century.

Quote: Originally Posted by GalacticKegger View Post
Historically (circa 2014) ... it all started with the leveling planets where PvE characters leveled up in tiers on each planet: open world exploration + class / companion story & planet missions → planet heroic 2s → planet heroic 4s → planet flashpoint. Players who preferred to focus on solo story could level through that while players who enjoyed leveling through challenging group content could do that as well. There was plenty of game there to accommodate both.

Each planet had its own mini-elder game (H2s and H4s) and mini-end game (flashpoints). Group players (including 2 players + companions) would complete each planet's elder and end games before going to the next planet, while solo players would usually play up through elder game, go to the next planet for a few levels and come back to run the previous planet's end game flashpoint solo with a companion once they upgraded their gear. Running flashpoints solo at 5-7 levels above the flashpoint's listed level range provided solo players with a challenge similar to what group players experienced when they were running it level appropriate, and still provided drops they could use because the flashpoint boss loot tables and comm system were balanced to carry a player through to the next planet's elder game.
A reboot to this and I'll start back with the 180-day recurrings.
Can we please just have our pre-KotFE SWTOR MMORPG back?

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
03.05.2017 , 12:36 PM | #84
Quote: Originally Posted by Ryenke View Post
I enjoyed playing my non-raid alts and gearing them up in the crystal commendation system. Maybe FP or two to get some enhancements. Yes their gear lacked set bonus. Yes the commendation gear was not min-maxed (I usually made sure I could craft pretty good modifications to put in that slot when I bought gear). Certainly the left side of these alts had the comm/crystal gear. How did I get the crystals, often through Heroics/dailies.
I did the same for the most part in 4.0. For 5.0 same philosophy, but a bit different approach, and certainly more efficient manner ----> I went with crafted gear for most of my alts.

Fast, inexpensive, easy, and no need to grind content for the huge pile of cyrstals needed to do this on every character. Heck, even gathering the materials in 5.0 is way easier then earlier expacs... because they improved mission profiles and efficiencies for gathering crew missions that it is inexpensive to run missions for the materials (even greens) and let's me devote my game time to things other then scrounging for materials out in the field.

5.0 has actually been a boon for gearing alts compared to 4.0... unless it is an alt that is more a second-main that will be doing hard end game content. But honestly... I never have more then 2 alts that fit that heftier category.
When you find yourself surrounded by hostile Clowns... always go for the "Juggler" first.

Ryenke's Avatar


Ryenke
03.05.2017 , 01:12 PM | #85
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
I did the same for the most part in 4.0. For 5.0 same philosophy, but a bit different approach, and certainly more efficient manner ----> I went with crafted gear for most of my alts.

Fast, inexpensive, easy, and no need to grind content for the huge pile of cyrstals needed to do this on every character. Heck, even gathering the materials in 5.0 is way easier then earlier expacs... because they improved mission profiles and efficiencies for gathering crew missions that it is inexpensive to run missions for the materials (even greens) and let's me devote my game time to things other then scrounging for materials out in the field.

5.0 has actually been a boon for gearing alts compared to 4.0... unless it is an alt that is more a second-main that will be doing hard end game content. But honestly... I never have more then 2 alts that fit that heftier category.
Yeah, but I said I liked doing stuff to earn crystals to gear the toon. Go craft it on another toon, and then what, why play at all? I liked feeling like the toon 'earned' the next level gear when the gear level went up - I liked planning how to earn crystals and spend them. But now the toon can't, sure other alts could craft a set of gear and send it to him - but then why even bother to play?

YMMV (and I know your posts indicate that you are reasonably happy with 5.x), but 5.x killed any incentive I had to play alts and have fun. And for the record, before you start up, I'm not playing it wrong ("Josh, you're doing it wrong"... lol) I was playing the game the way I used to like to in 2.x, 3.x, 4.x and had fun. I don't find anything fun in 5.x and imo that is because the game went from an underpinning of earn gear to lotto gear.
5.0 House of RNG Horror GrindgoRound unsub.

No link for (un)rewarding, (un)exciting and frustrating unmitigated RNG.

EricMusco's Avatar


EricMusco
03.06.2017 , 09:16 AM | #86 Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread. Next  
Hey folks,

I got clarification on exactly how the changing drop rates will work based on questions we got in the thread.

If I have Crates before 5.2, will their drop rates adjust after the Update comes out?
They will not change with the Update.

After 5.2, is the drop rate determined when you get the Crate or when you open it?
The drop rate is determined when you acquire the Crate, what is in the Crate is determined when you open it. The Crate you got at Rank 30, will always have Rank 30 drop rates, but you can still change Discipline before opening it to adjust the contents appropriately.

In short, the system is built in a way that we want you to open the crates as you get them, there is no gameplay benefit to holding them.

Thanks everyone.

-eric
Eric Musco | Community Manager
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docbenwayddo's Avatar


docbenwayddo
03.06.2017 , 09:24 AM | #87
You should probably change that "Rank 1" to a "Rank 30" because people will be quick to assume you mean Tier1 and you've already said rates improve as Ranks increase within Tiers. And also because Rank 1 has no crate.
Your first crate is at Rank 2.

casirabit's Avatar


casirabit
03.06.2017 , 09:43 AM | #88
Quote: Originally Posted by Ryenke;9255117[QUOTE
]Yeah, but I said I liked doing stuff to earn crystals to gear the toon. Go craft it on another toon, and then what, why play at all? I liked feeling like the toon 'earned' the next level gear when the gear level went up - I liked planning how to earn crystals and spend them. But now the toon can't, sure other alts could craft a set of gear and send it to him - but then why even bother to play?
I have always like crafting and felt bad that I couldn't craft gear for my other alts but now I can. Some people don't play to acquire gear but to have fun doing things and the gear helps them achieve that. I am one of those people that gear is just a step to doing what I like to do which is doing things with my boyfriend and my guild and not worrying if my gear is okay for what we are going to do.

I also have a friend that never got to do operations because people always said she didnt' have the right gear etc that these commands boxes give her a chance to do that with a friend should she want. She is also one of the lucky ones that her sage actually got a set piece on her very first crate she opened. She already knows that isn't the norm but was excited anyways.

Quote:
YMMV (and I know your posts indicate that you are reasonably happy with 5.x), but 5.x killed any incentive I had to play alts and have fun. And for the record, before you start up, I'm not playing it wrong ("Josh, you're doing it wrong"... lol) I was playing the game the way I used to like to in 2.x, 3.x, 4.x and had fun. I don't find anything fun in 5.x and imo that is because the game went from an underpinning of earn gear to lotto gear
.

Some people are having fun right now as well and they are not playing wrong either. They enjoy what they are doing. This can be taken both ways. I have seen the forums already tell people if you enjoy the command crates then you are doing it wrong so it is not one sided. We actually need to stop telling people when they enjoy something they are doing it wrong and understand that each person has a different version of fun and accept that.

While I think there needs to be some adjustments to the crates, I think the crates are good for people like my friend but that raiders and pvp players need a different way to achieve their gear.
A girl should be two things: classy and fabulous. A girl should also always be a lady even when arguing. If you like redheads click my Referral link Referral: http://www.swtor.com/r/VkfKqj

EricMusco's Avatar


EricMusco
03.06.2017 , 09:53 AM | #89 This is the last staff post in this thread.  
Quote: Originally Posted by docbenwayddo View Post
You should probably change that "Rank 1" to a "Rank 30" because people will be quick to assume you mean Tier1 and you've already said rates improve as Ranks increase within Tiers. And also because Rank 1 has no crate.
Your first crate is at Rank 2.
Gold star for you docbenwayddo! This is what I get for making posts first thing in the morning. I have made your suggested edits .

-eric
Eric Musco | Community Manager
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TPooFlinger's Avatar


TPooFlinger
03.06.2017 , 09:55 AM | #90
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
snip...
In short, the system is built in a way that we want you to open the crates as you get them, there is no gameplay benefit to holding them.

Thanks everyone.

-eric
Sure there is a gameplay benefit to holding on to the crates. If I'm not getting the piece I need now, you're saying I won't be getting it in these old crates after 5.2 hits either. Even so, why disintegrate the crate with poor contents (95%) towards another crate with poor contents before 5.2 when after 5.2, the disintegration cxp gets you closer to a better (?) crate? You've just confirmed its better to save them for better crates if you're already at 300.