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Just blew $$18 million creds...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Just blew $$18 million creds...

Darth_Wicked's Avatar


Darth_Wicked
03.10.2015 , 10:12 AM | #211
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
If that's how you want to word it I'm OK with that.
At least I'm not the one agreeing with someone who infers that everyone on the "opposite field" is a scammer itself.

Quote:
Some of us believe in 2nd chances, some of us don't. I've said I 100% agree its buyer error in the first place. Just because there is buyer error occurring does not eliminate the possibility of deceptive selling practices. You fail to acknowledge that this is even a possibility.
Because it isn't a possibility.

As mentioned many times earlier, the GTN is scam free, NOT player inattentiveness free. It is impossible to protect people from their own foolishness.

Quote:
You also still fail to acknowledge what your thoughts are on the similar looking prices are, hiding behind it being irrelevant.
Last I checked, what I said was irrelevant was the seller intent, the latter a convenient scapegoat for people to avoid accounting for their actions while playing with virtual money.

Quote:
You seem like a logical person, you might never tell us why you think someone would price a mat at 9,000,123 when the low price is 90,000.123, but your non answer is all I need to know.
Refer to the earlier point then: me be a scammer. Obviously.

As is EVERYONE who feels the same.

Quote:
TL;RD - We agree it's buyer error first and foremost. We disagree that there is even a remote possibility of sellers trying to be deceptive or game this system. Is this accurate or are you not going to throw me a bone?
There is no deception. There is ONLY player inattentiveness; that, or a complete and utter failure at basic comprehension and math skills.
Quote: Originally Posted by Vowrawn and the Wrath
HAVE FAITH THAT ALL QUESTIONS, ALL CONCERNS, WILL SHORTLY BE RESOLVED.
THE EMPEROR IS RETURNING, AND WE WILL FUEL HIS FLAME.

Pagy's Avatar


Pagy
03.10.2015 , 10:16 AM | #212
Quote: Originally Posted by MillionsKNives View Post
A scam is simply a means of gains through deception or trickery, nothing more.
where is the deception or trickery?

the price is listed using a base 10 numeral system. if the user cannot understand the difference between a decimal and a delimiter then that is their problem.

the price is listed, clearly
the item and quantity is listed, clearly

if a user makes a mistake, then the mistake is on them. not the seller.

Papazmurf's Avatar


Papazmurf
03.10.2015 , 10:42 AM | #213
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Wicked View Post
*snip*.
9,000,123
9,001.23
90,000.123

To me, all of these numbers look similar. They are not the same, but they look similar. Similar defined as - having "a likeness or resemblance, especially in a general way" http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/similar You know just so we are working with the same definition.

The issue is fundamentally that you and others don't believe the GTN can be deceptive because to you these numbers are clear as day different. Not everyone is you. People come in all sizes and shapes. Some people are smarter than others. Some people have disorders like dyslexia. You are saying that there is no possibility for people to see these numbers as the same, but in reality you don't know that. Are you seeing through everyone's eyes? You say I don't speak everyone, well nor do you.

I never said I thought everyone was scammer, but enough people are doing this to where I don't think it's unrealistic to think some sellers have dishonest motives. I don't recall ever calling you or anyone else who posted here a scammer either. You don't have empathy for buyer mistakes, and I've said this is fine and it isn't even a wrong mentality. Your camp doesn't think people are being taken advantage of, whereas my camp at least acknowledges the possibility.

It's clear we're likely not even going to agree on disagreeing. I see your camps point of view and I even agree with some of it. I disagree that they way the GTN is setup that you can't make prices look similar. I don't know what else to say. If you don't think sellers are making numbers look similar on purpose it's a non-issue...however I think a lot of us are thinking that people are doing it on purpose. We'll never prove it, but that doesn't mean it can't be true.
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EllieAnne's Avatar


EllieAnne
03.10.2015 , 10:45 AM | #214
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
9,000,123
9,001.23
90,000.123

To me, all of these numbers look similar. They are not the same, but they look similar. Similar defined as - having "a likeness or resemblance, especially in a general way" http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/similar You know just so we are working with the same definition.

The issue is fundamentally that you and others don't believe the GTN can be deceptive because to you these numbers are clear as day different. Not everyone is you. People come in all sizes and shapes. Some people are smarter than others. Some people have disorders like dyslexia. You are saying that there is no possibility for people to see these numbers as the same, but in reality you don't know that. Are you seeing through everyone's eyes? You say I don't speak everyone, well nor do you.
That is why there is built-in assistance like ability to sort by unit price, total price or limit with a max price.
Not our fault if you don't use all of the tools available.

llayles's Avatar


llayles
03.10.2015 , 10:50 AM | #215
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
9,000,123
9,001.23
90,000.123

To me, all of these numbers look similar. They are not the same, but they look similar. Similar defined as - having "a likeness or resemblance, especially in a general way" http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/similar You know just so we are working with the same definition.

The issue is fundamentally that you and others don't believe the GTN can be deceptive because to you these numbers are clear as day different. Not everyone is you. People come in all sizes and shapes. Some people are smarter than others. Some people have disorders like dyslexia. You are saying that there is no possibility for people to see these numbers as the same, but in reality you don't know that. Are you seeing through everyone's eyes? You say I don't speak everyone, well nor do you.

I never said I thought everyone was scammer, but enough people are doing this to where I don't think it's unrealistic to think some sellers have dishonest motives. I don't recall ever calling you or anyone else who posted here a scammer either. You don't have empathy for buyer mistakes, and I've said this is fine and it isn't even a wrong mentality. Your camp doesn't think people are being taken advantage of, whereas my camp at least acknowledges the possibility.

It's clear we're likely not even going to agree on disagreeing. I see your camps point of view and I even agree with some of it. I disagree that they way the GTN is setup that you can't make prices look similar. I don't know what else to say. If you don't think sellers are making numbers look similar on purpose it's a non-issue...however I think a lot of us are thinking that people are doing it on purpose. We'll never prove it, but that doesn't mean it can't be true.
Clear as day to me.
When I die, the galaxy will feel my passing.
I am Juggernaut.
<Silent Force>

Papazmurf's Avatar


Papazmurf
03.10.2015 , 10:51 AM | #216
Quote: Originally Posted by EllieAnne View Post
That is why there is built-in assistance like ability to sort by unit price, total price or limit with a max price.
Not our fault if you don't use all of the tools available.
Just like it's not the sellers fault some people can't see tell the difference between a decimal and a comma right. Yeah I get it. I keep saying it's buyer's fault first and foremost. I agree with this...but I assume you agree that those numbers do look similar?

Just because I agree with the above doesn't mean I can't think sellers are trying to be slick. That seems to be the main issue here.
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azudelphi's Avatar


azudelphi
03.10.2015 , 10:51 AM | #217
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
9,000,123
9,001.23
90,000.123
Bold one can't exist on the GTN.

I would say there is a strong enough distinction between the other two. But as I have said, I think decimal unification is a low resource change that removes this "confusion" entirely, as then they would be displayed as

9,000,123.00
9,001.23

Much clearer. Whether necessary or not, that debate will run forever... just seems too simple a change to fret over that.
Former Member of Squadron 367
. = God

Papazmurf's Avatar


Papazmurf
03.10.2015 , 10:55 AM | #218
Quote: Originally Posted by llayles View Post
Believe it or not, it's clear to me as well and I haven't been affected personally. Again though, just because you and I can see that clearly and make an informed decision does not mean it's the same for everyone else.
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Darth_Wicked's Avatar


Darth_Wicked
03.10.2015 , 10:56 AM | #219
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
9,000,123
9,001.23
90,000.123

To me, all of these numbers look similar. They are not the same, but they look similar. Similar defined as - having "a likeness or resemblance, especially in a general way" http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/similar You know just so we are working with the same definition.
Similar, NOT identical, which harkens me back to what I said earlier:
Quote:
There is no deception. There is ONLY player inattentiveness; that, or a complete and utter failure at basic comprehension and math skills.
Not the game or the seller's fault that the inattentive buyer skipped math school.

Quote:
The issue is fundamentally that you and others don't believe the GTN can be deceptive because to you these numbers are clear as day different. Not everyone is you. People come in all sizes and shapes. Some people are smarter than others. Some people have disorders like dyslexia. You are saying that there is no possibility for people to see these numbers as the same, but in reality you don't know that. Are you seeing through everyone's eyes? You say I don't speak everyone, well nor do you.
Strawman at this point.

I for one don't remember the OP stating he suffers from dyslexia for example.

Quote:
I never said I thought everyone was scammer, but enough people are doing this to where I don't think it's unrealistic to think some sellers have dishonest motives. I don't recall ever calling you or anyone else who posted here a scammer either.
Then I suggest you reread one of your earlier posts, where you claimed you knew on which side of the field you stood, considering what another used said.

Quote:
You don't have empathy for buyer mistakes, and I've said this is fine and it isn't even a wrong mentality. Your camp doesn't think people are being taken advantage of, whereas my camp at least acknowledges the possibility.
How do you take advantage of people via-GTN exactly?

This is a mind-boggling statement to say the least.

There is no contact between the would-be buyer and the seller prior to the purchase, the listing has available all necessary info, and the would-be buyer has all the time in the world to make an educated purchase, with no pressure at all.

Again, how is that taking advantage of people?

Quote:
It's clear we're likely not even going to agree on disagreeing. I see your camps point of view and I even agree with some of it. I disagree that they way the GTN is setup that you can't make prices look similar. I don't know what else to say. If you don't think sellers are making numbers look similar on purpose it's a non-issue...however I think a lot of us are thinking that people are doing it on purpose. We'll never prove it, but that doesn't mean it can't be true.
Said it before, will say it again: seller intent is irrelevant. All that matters is the listing and said listing doesn't manipulate or attempts to deceive the would-be buyer.

People are just looking up for a convenient scapegoat, nothing more.
Quote: Originally Posted by Vowrawn and the Wrath
HAVE FAITH THAT ALL QUESTIONS, ALL CONCERNS, WILL SHORTLY BE RESOLVED.
THE EMPEROR IS RETURNING, AND WE WILL FUEL HIS FLAME.

llayles's Avatar


llayles
03.10.2015 , 10:58 AM | #220
Quote: Originally Posted by Papazmurf View Post
Believe it or not, it's clear to me as well and I haven't been affected personally. Again though, just because you and I can see that clearly and make an informed decision does not mean it's the same for everyone else.
Then thank god for that little arrow right next to "UNIT PRICE" in the header, amirite?
When I die, the galaxy will feel my passing.
I am Juggernaut.
<Silent Force>