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create a new 'Purchase Alert' to protect GTN buyers

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion > Suggestion Box
create a new 'Purchase Alert' to protect GTN buyers

gbrumback's Avatar


gbrumback
03.04.2015 , 01:09 AM | #181
Huh? That made almost no sense, and again just evaded my question. It is quite clear to me that you have no interest in debating, discussing, or brainstorming this topic. You merely wish to dictate your opinions as the only only solution. But here is the rub, your premise is based on opinion, not fact. And a problem that affect a tiny population of the game does not warrant a massive inconvenience to the majority. This is a mentality that I abhor, and is becoming far to common. I do not need someone to protect me from myself. There is something called personal responsibility, and in my opinion, people need more of it. Have I made bad purchases on the GTN? Yep. Do I need someone to hold my hand to make certain it doesn't happen again? Nope. Why not? Because, as an intelligent and rational being, I learned from my mistakes. As has be stated multiple times, there are multiple features already built into the GTN to help protect buyers. If you choose not to utilize those features, that is completely your fault. It was not an accident, a mistake, or a scam. If you are aware of the features and do not use them, then that was your decision. And the majority of the population should not be forced to suffer an inconvenience because of your bad decisions.
Harbinger
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anonnn's Avatar


anonnn
03.04.2015 , 10:18 AM | #182
Your question wasn't evaded, I undermined your perceived validity of your very question. And trying to appease the masses is the reason the Purchase Alert was designed in way that ends up ineffective in the first place. So you can imagine the irony of the loud arguments against making the Purchase Alert finally an effective buyer protection.

Basically you're saying you're fine with the lemming effect ... that time and time again another player will fall prey to the pitfall of making an accidental major GTN purchase and losing some huge number of credits that took many hours to earn, and will "learn their lesson". And some of (or perhaps the majority of) those major GTN accidents are the result of deliberate scam pricing by dishonest players that's meant to evoke the GTN accidents literally exactly as it ends up occurring.

Well that's not very thoughtful, and not very considerate. And exactly zilch on the cleverness and ingenuity.

What you've done is provide another piece of solid data that you remember making an accidental purchase on the GTN. You didn't provide the amount of credits it cost you or the nature of the purchase you accidentally made, but that hardly matters. You had a GTN accident. No doubt many many others have as well. Strip away all the subjective opinions, exaggerations, and pseudo-arguments, and you're left with cold hard facts. Lots of people have GTN accidents. It's just not reported anywhere so it's being pretended that it doesn't happen. Thank you for helping to establish fact.

All you've done is try to spin your limited perspective on the issue the same as others have in this thread. It's the same blind method of exaggeration and ignorant self-promotion, declaring that any sort of tradeoff required by this solution is just SO unfair. The truth is that the tradeoff is very minimal, and has been tuned to be even more minimal over the course of this thread's discussion. Anyone managing to eek a loud argument against this suggestion is only succeeding in declaring how selfish they are.

And consider this... what are the odds that the group of people who've voiced loud over-opinionated opposition to this suggestion are the exact group of people who are posting the GTN items with scam pricing and stealing the millions of credits that has players upset? Taking everything at face value, I'd say it's quite possible they're ALL scammers... now do you feel like arguing a little more loudly about the issue? The game developer would be wise to determine the set of characters of every opposing poster in this thread, and go check whether the GTN items posted by that set of characters happens to be the GTN items with 'odd' pricing. Or, they can continue to be naive, negligent, and disinterested in protecting the playerbase from predatory players. Given the consistency with which opposition to this suggestion involves glossing over the fact that players lose an extraordinarily and painfully large amount of credits, I'd say it's valid (and basically required) to suspect every single one of you of being price-scammers.

An intelligent game designer would boost the level of GTN buyer protection to the level that will prevent GTN accidents that cost the players huge numbers of credits.
Boring conversation anyway.
Think twice. . . Think again.
Nullius in verba. . .

Phyltr's Avatar


Phyltr
03.04.2015 , 12:30 PM | #183
The entire premise is still entirely flawed. BioWare is under no obligation to protect people from themselves just like a grocery store is under no obligation to to stop you from buying cigarettes or 100 packages of twinkies, or 100 liters of vodka. BioWare is under no obligation to protect people from themselves and to claim otherwise is just trying to offload personal responsibility to someone else as to avoid accepting the ramifications of your actions. The owner of the parking lot a farmer's market is held in is under no obligation to stop a shady vendor from selling you "magic beans".

anonnn's Avatar


anonnn
03.04.2015 , 12:47 PM | #184
Quote: Originally Posted by Phyltr View Post
The entire premise is still entirely flawed. BioWare is under no obligation to protect people from themselves just like a grocery store is under no obligation to to stop you from buying cigarettes or 100 packages of twinkies, or 100 liters of vodka. BioWare is under no obligation to protect people from themselves and to claim otherwise is just trying to offload personal responsibility to someone else as to avoid accepting the ramifications of your actions. The owner of the parking lot a farmer's market is held in is under no obligation to stop a shady vendor from selling you "magic beans".
You're still BS'ing with the phrase "protect them from themselves" when it's already been stated that that's a non-objective point of view and fault has nothing to do with this issue. You're also ignoring the fact that some if not most of these major GTN accidents (causing the loss of millions of credits) are the result of predatory scam pricing that's deliberately meant to confuse the person viewing the price listings into buying something thinking it was 1000 times cheaper per-unit than it really was. The PROOF of this fact is the deliberate postings of singular units of materials for the impossible-to-miss price of 1 billion credits which prevents anyone from falling for the pricing scams.

In short, every time you post you're discrediting yourself.

Obligation is yet another moot concept. The question is whether there IS a problem of GTN accidents occurring on a continuous basis. Because if these GTN accidents are ongoing, then regardless of any concepts of fault or obligation, something SHOULD be done to fix the problem. No one's debating whether a problem exists, because clearly there's a problem. Debating that the developer shouldn't fix the problem has become nothing more than a favorite troll topic.

Opposition to this thread has amounted to nothing more than "I don't want obligatory Purchase Confirmation popups" and a lot of ridiculous mileage has been eked out of that one singular objection. I'd also prefer to not have obligatory confirmation popups, however I'm intelligent enough to recognize that the only way to ACTUALLY protect GTN buyers is to make the Purchase Confirmation guaranteed for high-priced items. I'm willing to set aside my personal concerns in order to better protect GTN buyers, because I'm not selfish and I'm willing to accept small tradeoffs for the benefit to be put in place.
Boring conversation anyway.
Think twice. . . Think again.
Nullius in verba. . .

Phyltr's Avatar


Phyltr
03.04.2015 , 12:50 PM | #185
Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
You're still BS'ing with the phrase "protect them from themselves" when it's already been stated that that's a non-objective point of view and fault has nothing to do with this issue.
You claiming something doesn't make it fact. I am claiming it does have plenty to do with the issue and is the root of the problem. So, I guess our claims invalidate one another bringing it back to a neutral point. You aren't the authority on anything, you don't get to make claims and then reference yourself as though it were a supported fact. It is your opinion and that's all and your opinion holds no more weight than mine.

Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
Obligation is yet another moot concept. The question is whether there IS a problem of GTN accidents occurring on a continuous basis. Because if these GTN accidents are ongoing, then regardless of any concepts of fault or obligation, something SHOULD be done to fix the problem. No one's debating whether a problem exists, because clearly there's a problem. Debating that the developer shouldn't fix the problem has become nothing more than a favorite troll topic.
That's just nonsense. Obligation has everything to do with it. You can claim that smoking kills and yet, which is definitively worse than losing some fake money. Yet, no store owner is under any obligation to stop people from buying cigarettes. There is a problem and they aren't correcting it. Its not even that cut and dry because BioWare isn't even selling you the cigarettes or the "magic beans", they are just facilitating the transaction which gives them even LESS obligation to try and fix the problem. The owner of the land on which a farmer's market is held is under no obligation to police its sellers to determine the validity of their sales, or to stop each seller and ask them "do you really want to buy these magic beans?". There is no obligation there and obligation begets action. If they aren't obligated to protect people, then they don't have to take any action.

Your entire premise is that BioWare is obligated to do this and they have to because you said it really loudly and berate and insult anyone who disagrees with you. You're not asking them to do it, you're saying they have to because you're trying to be the loudest voice in the room. In actuality, you're just the vocal minority and a reason BioWare will never implement this.

Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
Opposition to this thread has amounted to nothing more than "I don't want obligatory Purchase Confirmation popups" and a lot of ridiculous mileage has been eked out of that one singular objection. I'd also prefer to not have obligatory confirmation popups, however I'm intelligent enough to recognize that the only way to ACTUALLY protect GTN buyers is to make the Purchase Confirmation guaranteed for high-priced items. I'm willing to set aside my personal concerns in order to better protect GTN buyers, because I'm not selfish and I'm willing to accept small tradeoffs for the benefit to be put in place.
I am an intelligent person and I subscribe to the theory of personal responsibility and reject this proposition entirely.

JPryde's Avatar


JPryde
03.04.2015 , 01:56 PM | #186
Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
You should stop trolling with these all these B.S. responses you've been posting ...
Some fact IS established, and you're choosing to ignore fact. [...]
anonn please... Could you just stop with accusing anyone of trolling, just cause we do not agree with you?

By now you are just making a fool of yourself by your pedantic insistance on a subject that is only made up by yourself. Nowhere was any fact established, that your solution was in any way needed. Just cause you personally feel that way, no matter how strong, does not make it fact.

Continuously claiming it without providing any objective facts and without being open for even the slightest change in your idea, just isn't working.

You did provide the devs with your idea... Let them decide, what is truely worth their time. Hopefully even you will agree, that the implementation of your idea is not somthing that the games life depends on.
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azudelphi's Avatar


azudelphi
03.04.2015 , 02:39 PM | #187
Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
You should stop trolling with these all these B.S. responses you've been posting ...
Ok, real quick because you keep using that term incorrectly...

Trolling is not saying things you disagree with. Trolling is not questioning your premise. Trolling is not the disapproval of your premise. Trolling is not saying the "trade-off" is unacceptable. Trolling is not asking questions you don't want to hear. Trolling is not demonstrating analogies that you disagree with. These things are the nature of putting an idea in a public forum for discussion.

Trolling is posting something that has a primary motivation of soliciting a strong emotional response. Yes, you are very passionate about your idea. That does not give you free reign to accuse, dismiss, or insult those who disagree (no matter how invalid you consider the merits upon which they base their disapproval) as trolling. Very little of what those responding to you have written is trolling; it is dissent.

And honestly, I am surprised this thread is still kicking... didn't it die at the beginning of Feb? Shouldn't this be on page 25 or so?
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azudelphi's Avatar


azudelphi
03.04.2015 , 08:17 PM | #188
Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
How about this...

Anyone wishing to post further disagreement in this thread has
to pay 6 MILLION CREDITS in order to do so.

Will you choose to see my point or will you continue trolling?

.
I will not pay and even if I lost 100 million credits on the GTN I would own my mistake and move on with my life. I see your point, and despite some harsh exchanges between us I will reiterate that I do not agree.

As for your past statement: Please review the my previous post regarding the definition of trolling.
Former Member of Squadron 367 - . = God
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gbrumback's Avatar


gbrumback
03.04.2015 , 08:23 PM | #189
Quote: Originally Posted by anonnn View Post
How about this...

Anyone wishing to post further disagreement in this thread has
to pay 6 MILLION CREDITS in order to do so.

Will you choose to see my point or will you continue trolling?

.
Sure, you get the devs to to enforce your 'post tax' and I will be happy to pay it. And, by the way, good luck with that. Not sure what country you are from, but I am in the U.S. and we have this little thing called freedom of speech. As has been pointed out, disagreeing with you is not trolling. If you truly believe we are trolling feel free to report our posts and see if the devs/forum moderators agree with your viewpoint.

Next, you did actually skip over my original question. And after a massive rant as to how you answered it, you still haven't. You cannot honestly expect a company to do something that they know will drive consumers away, that is simple business. And losing 10 customers to keep 1 will cause profits to plummet. And the entire point of business is to make a profit.

I never said accidents do not happen. What I did say was that if you use the tools Bioware already provides, you can eliminate those accidents. For example: I collect pets, but don't spend absurd amounts of credits on them. Periodically I will go to the GTN and select the category "Pets", then at the bottom I set the max price to 40,000. BAM, I cannot spend absurd amounts of credits on a pet because it will not show me 1 pet over 40,000 credits.

What I am most concerned by is the notion that people must be protected from themselves. When the government does this stuff in real life it irritates me to no end, I despise nanny states. To have it done in a video game is completely and totally asinine.

You constantly stick your fingers in your ears and shout, "I CAN'T HEAR YOU," every time someone points out anything that even remotely disagrees with your ideas. If you want to have sole decision making power over a feature in the game, save up your real money and buy 51% of EA/BW's stock, until then you may find that compromise is a necessity of life. Even the posters who have said they agreed, if it had an option to turn it off, you called trolls. They AGREED with 95% of your plan and they trolled?
Harbinger
Geollelm Legacy
Dabaless Jeraria Chathko Wed'anee

anonnn's Avatar


anonnn
03.04.2015 , 08:47 PM | #190
Quote: Originally Posted by Phyltr View Post
... It is a tradeoff many of us are unwilling to accommodate, you claiming its a "small" tradeoff doesn't make my, and all the other people posting in this thread, invalid.
...
The voice against the tradeoff (that's actually REQUIRED by this suggestion) should never be louder than the magnitude of the tradeoff itself. Remove the tradeoff and the suggestion no longer qualifies as a fix of the problem.

The problem here is that people have become so self-elected by their own selfishness that they're unwilling to compromise in even the slightest way and have even the smallest change to their own GTN experience.

Unwilling to allow the GTN experience to change... . even though we're talking about the GTN and NOT the actual gameplay, and even though the suggestion would almost surely prevent very close to 100% of major GTN accidents that involve real players losing millions of credits.

It looks awfully scant of consideration of other players around these parts ...
Boring conversation anyway.
Think twice. . . Think again.
Nullius in verba. . .