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ETA on Advanced Class change?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
ETA on Advanced Class change?

waterboytkd's Avatar


waterboytkd
09.15.2014 , 09:31 AM | #5471
Quote: Originally Posted by Raansu View Post
Its no different than any other MMO. New guy roles a tank but rather heal? Time to reroll. That's how it works. Its no different here. AC's are different classes.

I did it at launch myself. I rolled a sniper and decided I didn't like it. I got him to level 30. I said oh well and made a new toon. Not that big of a deal.
And for some, rerolling is fine. Even preferred. But for other people, they would rather drop some real money to dodge the reroll. How is that a bad thing?
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TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
09.15.2014 , 09:33 AM | #5472
Quote: Originally Posted by waterboytkd View Post
And for some, rerolling is fine. Even preferred. But for other people, they would rather drop some real money to dodge the reroll. How is that a bad thing?
It's not. Some people just like to tell others how they should play. It's beyond absurd.
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Savej's Avatar


Savej
09.15.2014 , 09:47 AM | #5473
Quote: Originally Posted by Raansu View Post
That sounds incredibly silly.
So you never respec any of your characters? To me it is the same thing, one version of respecing just happens to be impossible in this game (arbitrarily) where it is not in other games like wow.

Orizuru's Avatar


Orizuru
09.15.2014 , 10:00 AM | #5474
Quote: Originally Posted by Raansu View Post
Because a shadow plays nothing like a sage. A gunslinger plays nothing like a scoundrel. A commando plays nothing like a vanguard. Guardian would be the only thing that even comes close to being similar to sentinel, and only in focus spec.

Classes sharing some baseline skills doesn't make them the same. They are each their own unique class. If you wanted to play a ranged class instead of a stealther you shouldn't have leveled a stealther. People only want an AC respec so that when their AC counterpart becomes fotm they can easily swap to it.

Again, to use another example from other MMO's, asking for AC respec is like asking to go from a rogue to a ranger. They are fundamentally completely different. If you want to play a different AC then *********** reroll. Get over this silly idea of class vs advanced class. At the end of the day its a DIFFERENT CLASS and just like every other game out there, if you want to play another class you have to REROLL.
Different games, different rules. FFXIV:ARR lets players switch class as easily as changing weapons. /shrug

A Sorceror and an Assassin have exactly the same companions, exactly the same class quests, and share many of the same abilities. This makes them similar in ways that differing classes in different games are not similar. But once again, this is bordering upon being a strawman because it doesn't really matter.

What matters is this... At the end of the day, how does one player being able to pay money to changer their Sorc into an Assassin impact you in a way that can not be prevented or managed appropriately? How does this impact change your experience with the game and why should that be a justifiable reason to not suggest this feature be implemented?

dbears's Avatar


dbears
09.15.2014 , 10:14 AM | #5475
If Bioware is gonna start letting people change their Advanced Classes they may as well start letting people buy level 55 toons.

And buy BiS PvE gear. I've grinded Hardmode and Nightmare Dread Operations for the gear on my Operative. I don't want to, and according to the people Pro-AC change, SHOULDN'T have to grind for it again.

And lemme buy BiS PvP gear. I've played so much Ranked PvP to get the best gear on my agent. Why should I have to do it again?

There should be some way to purchase all the Datacrons too so I don't have to get them on my other toons.

<end sarcasm>

waterboytkd's Avatar


waterboytkd
09.15.2014 , 10:23 AM | #5476
Quote: Originally Posted by dbears View Post
If Bioware is gonna start letting people change their Advanced Classes they may as well start letting people buy level 55 toons.

And buy BiS PvE gear. I've grinded Hardmode and Nightmare Dread Operations for the gear on my Operative. I don't want to, and according to the people Pro-AC change, SHOULDN'T have to grind for it again.

And lemme buy BiS PvP gear. I've played so much Ranked PvP to get the best gear on my agent. Why should I have to do it again?

There should be some way to purchase all the Datacrons too so I don't have to get them on my other toons.

<end sarcasm>
One of these things is not like the others.

Your sarcastic suggestion would allow a player to go from 1 level 55 toon with BiS PvE/PvP gear to, say, 6 level 55 toons, all with BiS PvE/PvP gear, all with very little game time played.

AC switching allows a person to go from 1 level 55 toon with BiS gear to...1 level 55 toon with BiS gear. And that BiS gear might be irrelevant if they switched from, say, Tank Powertech to Healer Mercenary. Or really, from any tank/healer/dps role to a different role.

Not only does AC switching NOT obviate the game, it may even increase the amount of grind a person has to do, since their existing gear might become useless.
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hallucigenocide's Avatar


hallucigenocide
09.15.2014 , 10:26 AM | #5477
some people actually grow attached to their characters due to their story and the experience they've had with it.. lets say that the advance class it's attached to drastically changes(wich it can) and they find them selves no longer enjoying it.. would'nt it be nice if there was an option to switch AC then? especially if they know they'd enjoy that.. things like that can be a huge improvement for some.

Jadescythe's Avatar


Jadescythe
09.15.2014 , 10:30 AM | #5478
Quote: Originally Posted by waterboytkd View Post
One of these things is not like the others.

Your sarcastic suggestion would allow a player to go from 1 level 55 toon with BiS PvE/PvP gear to, say, 6 level 55 toons, all with BiS PvE/PvP gear, all with very little game time played.

AC switching allows a person to go from 1 level 55 toon with BiS gear to...1 level 55 toon with BiS gear. And that BiS gear might be irrelevant if they switched from, say, Tank Powertech to Healer Mercenary. Or really, from any tank/healer/dps role to a different role.

Not only does AC switching NOT obviate the game, it may even increase the amount of grind a person has to do, since their existing gear might become useless.
I think the point is that it's a slippery slope to what is allowed to be purchased in game without working for it. You say you are going from 1 toon to 1 toon, but I have 2 toons to have both ACs and have to grind out two sets of gear or move gear around in ugly Legacy gear to have 2 sets.

So you'll have those with money that can have 2 ACs with 1 toon, while others have to work twice as hard to do the same thing. If you're ok with this, then why should I have to get tank and DPS gear for my Jugg when I already got one set? Wouldn't it just be better to have an option to pay money to swap my DPS gear to tank gear? I mean, I'm trading in one set of gear for another. Less grind is better?
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Savej's Avatar


Savej
09.15.2014 , 10:38 AM | #5479
Quote: Originally Posted by Raansu View Post
Because a shadow plays nothing like a sage. A gunslinger plays nothing like a scoundrel. A commando plays nothing like a vanguard. Guardian would be the only thing that even comes close to being similar to sentinel, and only in focus spec.

Classes sharing some baseline skills doesn't make them the same. They are each their own unique class. If you wanted to play a ranged class instead of a stealther you shouldn't have leveled a stealther. People only want an AC respec so that when their AC counterpart becomes fotm they can easily swap to it.

Again, to use another example from other MMO's, asking for AC respec is like asking to go from a rogue to a ranger. They are fundamentally completely different. If you want to play a different AC then *********** reroll. Get over this silly idea of class vs advanced class. At the end of the day its a DIFFERENT CLASS and just like every other game out there, if you want to play another class you have to REROLL.
ACs aren't completely different classes. No more than tree druids are different from stealth dps druids or healing paladins are different from tank paladin. Sure they all play different, have different rotations, etc.but the
lore for them is all shared and, in swtor's case, the stats, many abilities and most of the gear is shared (can't say the same about spec changes in wow). The notion that acs are completely different is an example of some old devs providing wild turkey while calling it blue label jw and you believing them. Current devs and game docs do not try to say that.

Originally, btw, bw fully intended to allow ac swapping.

Raansu's Avatar


Raansu
09.15.2014 , 10:46 AM | #5480
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
I suppose you judge books by their cover too huh? What do you know at level 10 about end game tanking? Hell, from 10-54 you never even need to tank, so why would it even matter? It's a heads or tails choice at 10.
Sure, if you do zero group content. All the FP's after level 15 needs tanks. Also, the game is pretty self explanatory so no its not a heads or tails choice. Do you want to tank using a single lightsaber and be a heavy armor dps or do you want to be a dual wielding dps with all trees being different styles of dps such as dots, single target burst or aoe burst. Do you want to be a ranged class that can spec heals or dps, or do you want to be a stealth class than can tank or dps. The list goes on and on.

Just because you share some class abilities doesn't mean they are similar because fundamentally the AC's are not even being remotely close to being the same. Yes they all share a tree, but all of them with the exception of focus spec play completely different to one another. Knights are the only AC that are extremely similar to one another.

Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Who cares about W0W? What the hell does W0W have to do with this? The classes are most certainly NOT as different as you profess. Not only do I share EVERY CLASS skill with the other AC (which is half of my entire skills), every AC shares an entire TREE!!!
So you're going to tell me that a sage is not different from a shadow? Even though one is a ranged class and the other is melee stealth? Are you really going to tell me that a gunslinger is not that different from a scoundrel? A commando isn't that different from a vanguard? If you seriously can tell me with a straight face that this classes are not different just because they share a few baseline abilities....well there is something seriously wrong with you. I've leveled a PT and a Merc, played pyro in both. I'm pretty damn sure my PT plays nothing like merc. Hell you don't even use unload as a PT (if you do, please slap yourself for being bad).

Also your shared abilities do not even come close to being half of your skill set. Stop over exaggerating.

Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
I suppose you're against respec's as well? Hell, you should also be against alts too right? I mean, you seem to think the difference is so great that only a few have mastered the art of playing multiple roles, so I guess you think alts should be removed too right? If you want a tank, you should have rolled a tank...right? If you want a DPS, you should have rolled a DPS...I mean, since you seem to think it's such a black and white issue, how could you possibly support alts? If you did support alts, you'd be a hypocrite, because that's the same thing as swapping ACs...it's merely a role change, nothing more. Swapping from my Mando to my Vanguard is really no different than allowing an AC swap...in fact it might be worse because I then have double the companions, double the missions I can run, double the crafting classes...geezus...think of the harm alts cause.
I think your anger and ignorance is impeding what little logic you ever had. Having an alt is not the same as AC switching.

Quote: Originally Posted by Orizuru View Post
Different games, different rules. FFXIV:ARR lets players switch class as easily as changing weapons. /shrug
Erm....not the best example to use in your argument. I like FFXIV's single character concept, however, you still have to level everything. Its not like you can take a black mage to 50 and then swap weapons and be a 50 monk. No, if you switch weapons to a monk and never leveled one, guess what? You're level one now.

Also FFXIV has a two tier system just like SWTOR. You have your class up to level 30 then you do the questline to get your crystal for your job going from say a pugilist to a monk. On top of that you need a sub class. Monk for example needs a level 30 pugilist and a level 15 lancer in order to be able to get the monk quest.

I like FFXIV's system, but at the end of the day you still have to level each class/job individually. So really the concept is exactly the same, as it should be.

Quote: Originally Posted by Orizuru View Post
A Sorceror and an Assassin have exactly the same companions, exactly the same class quests, and share many of the same abilities. This makes them similar in ways that differing classes in different games are not similar. But once again, this is bordering upon being a strawman because it doesn't really matter.
Again, are you people really going to say that a 30m ranged class is the same as a melee stealther? Come on guys, this is kind of pathetic. Assassin and sorcerer are nothing alike. Oh and since this seems to be a common argument of ignorance (not counting things like interrupt/cc breaker/buff/heal since thats baseline with all classes) they share a total of 11 abilities, some of which are not used depending on the class. A sorc is never going to be using saber strike or thrash and an assassin rarely uses force lightning (incredibly situational).

The assassin alone has 30 unique skills/abilities. Soooo ya, not even close to sharing a large amount of skills. They are fundamentally two completely different classes.

Quote: Originally Posted by Orizuru View Post
What matters is this... At the end of the day, how does one player being able to pay money to changer their Sorc into an Assassin impact you in a way that can not be prevented or managed appropriately? How does this impact change your experience with the game and why should that be a justifiable reason to not suggest this feature be implemented?
Because its lazy? You want to play another class? Level it up. Tired of tanking and want to heal? Level up a damn healer.