I think sometimes Raiders need to be reminded a Flashpoint isn't an OP

I had someone try to initiate a kick on me when I went to fill for them at the final boss. The reason? I was a tank and they felt they needed a healer Apparently it never occurred to the 3 dps to use the healing stations.

I go with the flow on GF FPs, and that turns out great like 99% of the time. The vast majority of groups want to go pretty fast, which almost always works fine. Every once in a while there is a group that just isn't good enough to do it without some ops-like coordination, which is easily identified by the associated wipes

What I don't appreciate though is someone who wants to push the pace really hard, then blames someone else if it doesn't work out. If you push the envelope too far and die, trying to finish a few seconds faster, that's your mistake. Own it.

I must admit that I had MOST fun when the group had wiped several times until they got optimized so much that they'd beat any further enemy within the FP ... Playing with complete Newbies is *so* much more fun ... Than with veterans, who know everything so well that they begin to criticize even the slightest wrong wind movement by another player - plus when they totally rush through the FP like there was no tomorrow ... I absolutely hate that.

The problem is, that people like you take the rest of the player base as hostages to your play style, so to say.

People like you are forcing everyone to follow your code / kind of gameplay the way YOU like it - and I often read in these forums that people like you, who sacrifice the "fun" of other people on your altar of Efficiency, to this kind of players, the word "tolerance" is often nothing, void, nihil, zero, forgettagble, and nothing but a word no-one cares about.

I far too often read about players who just do not tolerate other play styles. Like fanatics, who do not tolerate any other way of thinking.

This is the impression I get.

And most of you tolerate the intolerance of those "efficiency mowers".

That wasnt a hard mode

That was storymode at level (30ish range)
But was a exact example of someone ignoring the needs of the group to try and force them into a speed run they were not ready for.

well said

your right, once I weeded out the common trouble players (amazing how its always the same names causing drama and trouble. Doesn't matter if its Flash points or War zones. The names are easily recognized after a couple days) 90% of the runs are fine and drama free. Be it at level story mode, tactical, or even HM. Still get odd bad one here and there but mass majority of tactical and HMs are drama free once the problem children have been removed from the equation.

And yup, its pretty clear pretty early in a FP if the group is able to speed run or not.
And when they are not, you have to slow down and organize
or god forbid even teach and instruct some times

One of my biggest pet peeves is players who will not admit and speak up if they first timers or not sure on mechanics.

But its hard to get mad at them when you watch others try to kick them or belittle them for not knowing the flash point.

Personally I'm of the opinion there has been a recent rash of veteran accounts sold because I been seeing a ton of players in 156, 162, 168, and even 180 gear who claim to have no knowledge of any flash points and don't seem to understand their class what so ever.

Added a DPS to ignore on my tank character earlier today
she kept running in and hitting her sages aoe knock back at start of fights when I was trying to gather the mobs together for easy AOEing despite me asking her multiple times to stop doing that while I'm gathering mobs together for easy AOEing.

Experienced DPS know not to do such things and in some fights to even hold off attacking for a second or two, to allow the tank the time to control the pull properly.

She figured she knew best and wouldn't bother even trying to work with group. Which caused a couple deaths.

Doesn't this work exactly the same way in the reverse? An 'inefficient' player holds others 'hostage' just as much. If that is being the one person who wants to see all the cutscenes*, or has to kill all the mobs, or get the bonus even though all 4 are overgeared as it is ... doesn't that person owe just as much of a 'duty' to suck it up as you claim the 'efficiency-focused' person should?

What I propose is this: all 4 should find an equitable common ground that just gets the damn FP done. If 3 want to skip the cutscene, just skip the damn cutscene. If 3 want to see it, just suck it up and watch it again. I don't know, maybe I am lucky, but the majority of my PUGs result in an equilibrium of conflicting desires by the halfway mark.

It isn't like doing a FP is rocket surgery, after all.

* - of all my pet peeves in a PUG, someone watching the cutscenes isn't one of them.

Oh, I bet it had occured to all 3 of them that one of the OTHERS should use the healing stations! Just none of them could be arsed enough to stop their uber-deeps long enough.

LOL dont you just hate that?

Very often in tactical s I end up playing a fake tank role in tactical's when I play my DPS commando or DPS Merc (both heavy armor and at 35k health).

And I'm happy to do so
Gives me a chance to practice my tanking abilities in controlling a mob (for when I play my sub 55 tank characters I'm raising up) as well as work on my DPS rotation to hold agro with out an actual taunt ability.

But it drives me absolutely mental when other ranged DPSer (Specifically snipers and gunslingers ) when they take up position as far away from the healing terminals as they possibly can so they never have to click a terminal and help out group.

Drives me absolutely mental when your in a group of 4 DPS and the least mobile range DPSers refuse to help group out with an easy click of a terminal.

I have asked a few why they do that (I seriously don't understand how anyone could be so selfish at any level) and the answer is always the same

"I'm here to DPS, I dont heal. If I wanted to heal I would play a healer class"

I play a sniper and have had to tank, dps, and heal on tacticals more than I should. The fault isn't with the class, it's with the player.

Just like dps mercs and sorcs (I play them too) that have heals at their command but let people die due to refusal to throw in a patch or a cleanse. I've had the unfortunate experience of having to "tank" on my corruption sorc more than I want to admit.

Tanks (got one from each AC) that guard no one and get mifflepissed if someone draws aggro.

Extrapolating a different perspective based on your case, an arsenal merc who for no good reason ("I have 35k time to face-pull so I can 'practice' tanking") assumes the role of tank and then doesn't dump aggro when they get into trouble. Not saying you're guilty of that; just saying I've seen it. And so on...

The list of pug gripes is tedious and lengthy, don't let bone-headedness jade your perspective. Idiots roll toons from every class and role. If you stick around long enough that will become more than apparent.

Personally, I like when people don't have a clue with what they are doing, it allows me to attempt to pick up the slack and makes the fp less of a face roll.

Oh think you misread what I wrote.
I meant the player
Just I personally find (and obviously with any generality there is exceptions, its never 100%) the worst offenders are those players attracted to the Sniper/Gunslinger classes.

But that doesn't mean I haven't see commandos, mercs, sages, and sorcs be just as guilty of this. I have.

Just of all the classes, the most consistent offenders are the players drawn to Gunslingers and Sniper classes.

PS: and yup, Threat reduction skills are my friend

But its hard to do in say Meltdown when you're trying to move the Wraid to the active terminal. Really need your group mates to run and hit terminal some times (not to often as I always hit hold the line/hydraulics and run to terminal unslowed).

When I get a really bad DPSer who wants to only DPS and not hit terminals I'll actually just add my argo dump to my rotation and let them attempt to tank (after asking why they wont hit terminal of course. I never do it out of the box). Usually they either get the message or rage quit in a hufff (which honestly solves issue either way).

But you're right and yes many players don't understand they have a de taunt and it can save their life if need be.
Just like many troopers/Bounty Hunters don't understand hold the line and hydraulics removes movement impairment effects and allows them to move out of electrical feild much faster taking far less damage.

As I said, im actually of the mind set that recently a while whack of old accounts were sold on EBay opr something because I seen a rash of players with fully geared out character who have no clue how to play the game regarding even the most basic mechanics.