Do tanks need a dps buff to keep up with the current state of dps?

Both, at the same time.

Then you need to play The Secret World

I'd love to see tank stances getting +3% accuracy tied to them, with the tank stance buff in the tree giving a further +3% accuracy at max points. Would prevent these accuracy issues

I also wouldn't mind seeing a high-level requirement talent (e.g. Tier 6/7 of tank tree) that converts 1% of your HP into bonus damage, but that would probably end up going in the realm of "Awesome things but left out so the game remains interesting"

I'm too invested in SWTOR. Besides, I had load of that back in my old WoW glory days. Vanilla old school WoW, TBC Mint WoW, and Lichking Bubblegum blue WoW. I quit during that nasty Cata raspberry Wow and didn't care for Panda lemon, lime and bitters WoW.


Though this talk has awakened a desire for a spider. Sadly I lack ice cream.

Hmm, sounds like the problem there is between the keyboard and the chair. Tank fails, doesn't ask how to fix a problem, no one tells them how to fix it, and people quit. That could be fixed by the players rather than the game.

You're talking about gear here, when the threat generated by DPS and Tanks is more related to playstyle/ skill, don't you think? Also, crappy commendation tank gear is so that it takes longer to min/ max gear. More playtime= more money for BW. It's across all classes, how many times I've seen Sage heals with too mich crit or DPS with not enough accuracy...

Everything you talked about here relates to knowledge and skill. Hopefully I'm not taking your words out of context by my cutting and pasting, but I feel that the above quote reinforces what I'm saying about skill. Which, if lacking, can be fixed by the player and the community.

I don't think the idea of finding out how to do something you're struggling with is crazy. Think of ANY single-player game. Now think about the difficulty difference between the beginning and the end of the game. It scales in difficulty as you acquire new abilities/ skills/ weapons, etc and getting new abilities doesn't make the game easier, it still requires skill. Have you ever looked up a game walkthrough to find out how to get past a difficult part of a game? HOLY **** that's just like visiting this forum! Ever asked a friend how they did that thing with their whatsy in that other game? Just like asking a friendly group mate how to tank something!

And if you tell me that you've never had to do that, congratulations. /slowclap But wait, aren't we talking about the majority that outnumber me 20, maybe 50 to 1, those "average" players? Yeah.

You speak your opinion, as do I and many others who have thoughtfully and considerately given theirs. Have all the opinions you want but unless you have something to back it up, don't claim it as "the truth". Many players I have grouped with have happily accepted and acted on advice I've given. Not all of course. But the information is there and accessible, whether through the community or the Internet, which is why- in my opinion- it's not necessary to increase tank DPS.

Please re-read the numbers in my first post. No matter what, a dps in the same gear level will generate more threat per second than a tank. No matter what. It's not a situation of a tank having bad gear or being under-geared. They will always lose the threat battle (without using taunt).

As a simple example, on my server there are 18 dps players with verified parses above 4000 dps. That equates to more than 4000 threat per second. Without using taunt, there is absolutely no way any tank can generate more than 4000 threat per second. (Sadly, there isn't anyway to do tanking parses to prove this, so you'll just have to trust me).

Now, if you add to this known condition of dps generating more threat than tanks, and then have a tank with inferior gear to dps (new tank in comms gear versus experienced dps in min/maxed gear), and there will be very few tanks with the skill level to overcome the inherent challenge being presented to them by the threat mechanics in this game.

Players like that should stick to Story Mode. If they don't want to put any effort into learning the game, they should avoid HM FPs and Ops. Yes, that means they will never get BiS gear, but then, since they never put any effort into learning the game, they don't even know what that is, right?

That's one nice thing about SWTOR: it offers things for causal players but still presents content options that take a little bit of effort to master.

A better title for this thread might be "Do tanks need a TPS buff to keep up with current state of dps?" because although threat is based on dps, it isn't entirely based on it. *If* there was a threat generation problem, then the solution would not be *buff tank dps*, the solution would be to buff the threat modifier of high threat abilities and / or the threat modifier on tank stances.

That being said, I don't believe that tanks need a threat buff at the moment. They might in the future should threat generation of dps out paces threat generation of tanks, but right now that isn't the case.

As a general rule, that's more or less correct as long a the condition is *without using taunts*. (There are certain dps comps that might break the rule such as all stealth using their exit combat appropriately.) Fortunately, though we have taunts so that isn't the case.

Threat should only really be a problem early on in an encounter - say the first 30s or so. After that, you should be so far ahead on the threat table no dps should pull from you especially when you factor in threat fluffing from taunts. It's quite easy to hit 4500 to 10000 tps within the first 10s of a fight which is more than enough to compensate for high dps.

In encounters without a tank swap, there is no reason you can't taunt on cooldown. I did this on Grob'throk, I'd really like to see a dps pull 175k dps and pull. In encounters with tank swaps, you've already got a mechanism to fluff your threat. And even in those, I can't think of any that occur within the first 30s where the two tanks can't force a tank swap early to boost their threat.

This really isn't an issue. The only time it really matters is in progression raiding and most of the time, you should be gearing the group up at the same pace so that large gear gaps don't exist. The only caveat is if you need to gear up a replacement tank but that can be addressed by having the over-geared dps not use stims, hold off on dps or by other means. In this case, it isn't pure progression so you can handle it differently.

If it is a case of a PUG SM OP where the dps over gears both the tank and the OP, well then let the dps keep the aggro they stole. The dps will learn to control their aggro or die - either will work. I have 0 problems letting a dps take a dirt nap in a PUG SM OP. Now to be fair, that rarely happens to me though.

I've thought about that several times, but at the end of the day, I only have so many hours in the day. How people keep up with multiple MMOs is beyond me, I have a family and a life.

Clearly, you personally understand the threat mechanics better than AVERAGE. You are probably using parsec, and have your target of target enabled in your UI. All of those things are not AVERAGE. They are significantly above average. What you take for granted as a cost of doing business as a tank, the AVERAGE tank really has no comprehension for.

I'm writing here to help the AVERAGE tank. The guy/gal that has never once visited the forums, or dulfy, or reddit. The tank that is just happy to give a HM FP a few runs to get their weekly done, and is considering doing SM Ops. They know how to avoid standing in fire and such, but most boss fights result in them losing aggro constantly. And all they know is that they are told they are a fail tank, or WTB Guard, or learn 2 taunt.