Much like with the original Revisited thread, the purpose of this thread is to revise the lists from a developed perspective, to the review all lists pertaining to the lightsaber duelist categories. If you feel there is a placement on the list that needs changing, make your argument/suggestion below and an article will be created.

Also feel free to refer to the project index to remind yourselves of the positions.

I'm just gona quote myself:

What's the current discussion now? Are you still accepting suggestions?

 

With all the force talk I'd like to see some lightsaber based discussions

My suggestions for discussion are (4.)Jaina vs (5.)Obi-Wan in the Jedi lightsaber duelist list and (3.)Kun vs (4.)Vader and (5.)Dooku on the sith one.

Although I'm not so sure about the Jaina vs Kenobi mainly because I haven't found a good lightsaber dueling write-up on Jaina. The closest I found are these:

Though I do think the use of the force during lightsaber combat is being frequently forgotten here, Sidious was a great lightsaber duellist because of his force capabilities.

 

Jaina is similar, she used the force, whilst severely injured to defeat nearly 20 Sith at a time on Coruscant, she won because she was too quick for them to react to.

Sorry but I believe Jaina Solo to be superior to Mace Windu in the force, her Shatterpoint seemed much more effective than his was.

 

Also, she has MANY force abilities at her command, the issue is, all of them are tailored towards close combat, her force cloak is perfect for an ambush, she can see into the past and view flashpoints, she can read and change the minds of her combatants, she is an expert at stealth, probably the greatest sentinel/shadow type of Jedi ever and she also has shown a mastery of force speed.

 

When she defeated Yuuzhan Vong Warmaster Tsavong whilst having almost no use of her legs she was too fast for him to measure,

When she slew Supreme Overlord Shimrra's full group of slayer bodyguards single-handed, she was too fast for them.

Then later on when whilst severely injured she fought nearly twenty Sith of the Lost Tribe and killed all of them with ease because of her speed.

 

It has been noted on multiple occasions that she saved her own life many times with her healing trance, which she wielded mid-combat, effectively making her extremely difficult to kill.

These might suggest that she was good duelist because of her force powers? I don't know, so if there is somewhere a proper Jaina lightsaber write-up could someone link it (or make a new one)?

I'd like to argue a rank up for Obi Wan Kenobi on both of the lists, though I must admit to not having access to much of the EU.

Kenobi is remarked, constantly, by other Jedi to be the absolute master of Soresu, and having advanced capabilities in almost every other form. I believe that the following will prove that Kenobi was at the very least equal to Darth Vader and Mace Windu in terms of lightsaber prowess, though lacking in their ostentatious displays of raw physical might. I'll quote wookieepedia, and use their sources to support for my claims:

n addition to Ataru, Kenobi also studied Shien, as evidenced by his accurate blast-deflections and his occasional use for the reversed grip,[206] and Niman, to develop his ability to incorporate Force abilities into his fighting form.[207]

[206] Fightsaber: Mastering the Art of Lightsaber Combat

[207] The Jedi Path: A Manual for Students of the Force

In addition to Soresu, Kenobi would also master and incorporate elements of Shii-Cho and Niman into his fighting style.[22][209] He also seemed to have been well versed in the art of Jar'Kai, which was perhaps most prominently displayed during his duel with Darth Maul and Savage Opress. His mastery of dual-blade combat allowed him to hold his own against both brothers, and he even managed to break Opress's left knee and sever his left arm. [165]

[22] Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith (novel)

[165] Star Wars: The Clone Wars – "Revival"

[209] Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith: The Visual Dictionary

His blade's intricate pattern of blocks and parries moved just fast enough to subtly interfere with Grievous' multiple strikes, while his slight dodges and shifts of stance allowed him to simply evade the rest. His mastery allowed him to comfortably counter up to eighteen of Grievous's strikes per second. When Grievous intensified his attack, Kenobi stopped stonewalling the general and simply began altering the angle of his parries, cutting off two of Grievous' mechanical hands. Kenobi proved to be one of the only Jedi able to engage Darth Vader and survive, as his Soresu mastery perfectly countered Vader's angry Form V. Kenobi simply gave ground before Vader's onslaught, waiting until Vader grew frustrated and overconfident, and then dismembering the hapless Sith Lord when his defense lapsed.[22]

[22]Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith (novel)

Bump?

Forgot about this thread. I'll respond to Tausra's argument when we get to this thread.

Forgot about this thread. I'll respond to Tausra's argument when we get to this thread.

I should've bump it weeks ago...

Well If nobody else wants to do it...

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/55283426.jpg

Jaina Solo

I used this thread for my write up.

• Jaina Solo defeats the Yuuzhan Vong Warmaster Tsavong Lah with her legs pinioned, years before her prime. She fights roughly evenly with him despite being rendered immobile, and then kills him by telekinetically launching a second lightsaber at his back.
   
  Jaina twisted as she drew her lightsaber, intending to spin away from any attacker, but her feet had somehow gotten stuck to the mineshaft floor, and instead of spinning she sprawled to one side-luckily, because at that moment Tsavong Lah hurled his baton of rank like a spear.
   
  The baton missed Jaina entirely and impaled Lowbacca, piercing him clean through the shoulder. The Wookiee roared and wobbled-like Jaina, blorash jelly had pinned him to the floor-and he fell into Tesar, who was in the act of drawing his blaster.
   
  Little jets of air began to spurt from Lowbacca's wounds, crystallizing immediately in the vacuum and drifting to the floor as glittering snow.
   
  Half deafened by the Wookiee roar she heard over her headset, Jaina hauled herself upright, aided by muscle and low gravity, her lightsaber glowing a soft violet off the cavern walls. Tsavong Lah seized an amphistaff from the weapons he'd strewn nearby and slashed the weapon at Jaina's head.
   
  Jaina was frozen to the floor by blorash jelly, and Tsavong Lah was behind her. Her helmet cut oft" her peripheral vision, and the only way she knew she was being attacked was that she saw Tsavong Lah's madly dancing shadow cast by the powerful lights of the load-lifters. She dropped the point of her lightsaber behind her back to guard against Tsavong Lah's swing, and the impact almost wrenched her arm out of its socket.
   
  Her heart thundered in her cars. She twisted as far to her right as possible in order to see her attacker and managed to parry the next furious series of strikes. Tsavong Lah shifted to her left, and Jaina twisted toward him and swung her lightsaber in a sweeping parry from high to low to catch any possible strike. Again the impact was massive, and nearly tore the weapon from her grasp. The warrior kept chopping at her, the amphistaff held in both hands, and she parried furiously. She had no chance to counterattack, and the impacts were numbing her arm. If something didn't happen soon, her weapon would be knocked from her hand.
   
  The fight in the vacuum was in utter silence. Jaina could hear only her own rasping breath and the throbbing of her heart, and then the silence was broken, over the comm, by Lowbacca's bellow as Tesar yanked the baton out of his shoulder.
   
  "It'z Tsavong Lah!" Jaina was startled by Tesar's words coming through her helmet phones. The warmaster's face was well known in the New Republic.
   
  "Shoot him!" Jaina said. She didn't much care who he was; she only wanted him dead and her friends safe.
   
  Tesar obliged by firing at the warmaster, the brilliant blaster bolts glancing off the rock walls, but the Yuuzhan Vong danced to Jaina's right again to put Jaina between himself and Tesar's blaster.
   
  "This one must patch up Lowie!" Tesar said. "He'z losing air! You've got to hold off the Vong!"
   
  "Thanks," Jaina muttered. She twisted to the right again, turning the movement into a cut. She chopped a chunk oat of the frozen amphistaff, and Tsavong Lah stepped out of range to pick up another weapon. When he came on again he lunged rather than slashed, and Jaina was able to slide her blade into a circular parry and bind. But in her twisted position she lacked the leverage of wrist and arm to force the disarm that followed the bind;instead her blade grated on the amphistaff and locked.
   
  Only a meter away she could see Tsavong Lah's silent snarl of triumph. He kicked and drove his heel into Jaina's thigh.
   
  An overwhelming jolt of pain shot through her thigh and knee. With a cry she lost her grip on her lightsaber and pitched forward.
   
  Jaina snatched Lowie's lightsaber from his belt and triggered it as she pulled herself to her feet. Tsavong Lah had cleared Jaina's lightsaber from his weapon and lunged forward again, and his eyes widened in surprise as Jaina slashed two clawed toes from the radank leg he had implanted as an arm.
   
  The warmaster stepped back as dark blood oozed from the wound and fell with a graceful lack of haste to the floor. Jaina kept the lightsaber on guard, pointed at his face. He glared at her, red murder glowing in his eyes.In front of her Lowbacca crouched before Tesar, both nailed to the ground by blorash jelly. Lowie's hand pressed on his shoulder, trying to hold in his air, while Tesar worked frantically to apply a patch to the wound on the Wookiee's back.
   
  "How's Streak?" she asked.
   
  "He'z passed out. This one has patched the exit wound, but the wound at the front iz still venting."
   
  Jaina watched Tsavong Lah take a grip on his weapon and dig his feet into the ground.
   
  "Hurry," she said, "I think I just made him mad."
   
  Tsavong Lah charged, the amphistaff a blur. He attacked to Jaina's right side, drawing her lightsaber out of line, then shifted to a vicious overhead cut coming in from the left. Jaina managed to block in time, but the impact bent her far over, the air going from her lungs in a whuff. Her head low, she could sec the soft violet radiance of her own lightsaber lying on the floor past the war-master's legs.
   
  She sliced madly at the amphistaff as she straightened again, engaging the furious warrior in a long series of attacks and parries.
   
  And then Jaina reached out with the force, picked up her lightsaber from the ground behind Tsavong Lah, and drove the violet blade point-first through his throat. The warmaster fell. Jaina didn't spare him another glance, but turned to Tesar and Lowbacca.
   
  Important to note:
  -the killing blow was with the force.
  -

  When she defeated Yuuzhan Vong Warmaster Tsavong whilst having almost no use of her legs she was too fast for him to measure.

   
  
• Jaina using the element of surprise, stabs Caedus with her lightsaber. She then engages the disadvantaged Caedus and kills him.
   
  "It's worth a try, but they won't obey." Caedus came to the door and, lacking a second hand to reach for the control pad, stopped to finish his order. "Have my StealthX prepped for immediate:"
   
  He let the sentence trail off as the door opened on its own, revealing a dark-uniformed woman with an athletic build and brown, furious eyes.
   
  "Jaina?"
   
  A lightsaber snap-hissed to life, and suddenly Caedus felt as though he were going to vomit fire.
   
  * * *
   
  The invisible fist of a Force blast slammed Jaina in the chest and sent her flying back, her breath groaning from her lungs and her lightsaber hissing free of Caedus's stomach. From the fight on Nickel One, she had learned the dangers of letting her head snap back on impact. She tucked her chin, then fought to hold it there as she struck the durasteel wall on the far side of the corridor.
   
  Jaina almost wished that she had been knocked unconscious. Stinging needle-thrusts of pain zippered down her spine as her vertebrae rocked beneath the impact, and the synthmesh supporting her half-healed ribs came apart in a single agonizing pop. She dropped to the floor, fighting to keep her pain from carrying her down into numb oblivion, gazing back to where she had surprised Caedus:where Caedus still stood in the doorway, his mouth gaping in surprise, with a thumb-sized scorch hole just below his ribs. But he was still standing.
   
  Jaina's pain-clouded mind did not understand how he could take a lightsaber through the gut and do that. Why didn't Caedus just lie down and die like most people? Didn't he understand she was trying to do him a favor?
   
  Apparently not, because as soon as she began to gasp for breath, his hand shot up, the fingers splayed and pointed in her direction. Jaina barely brought her lightsaber around in time to absorb the forks of blue lightning that came dancing toward her chest.
   
  Then Caedus stepped forward, the Force lightning still shooting from his fingertips. Jaina could not believe what she was seeing. With that wound, he was coming after her. She feinted an attempt to roll to her knees. When Caedus shifted the lightning to block her, she brought her free hand up and gestured toward his shoulder, using the Force to hurl him back through the door. A loud, thudding crash sounded from deep in the shadows, and the voice of an annoyed droid began to complain about the mess.
   
  Jaina was instantly on her feet, springing through the door. But Caedus was just as quick, forgoing his Force lightning in favor of his lightsaber. She saw a fan of crimson light arcing toward her out of the dark side of the pit and spun toward it, blocking and kicking in the same move. Caedus grunted as her boot caught him somewhere above the waist, but behind his crimson blade, he was no more than a gray blur, and it was impossible to tell where the kick had landed.
   
  A black boot heel came shooting under Jaina's guard, driving hard into her sore ribs. She stifled a cry and circled into the shadows, trying to acclimate her eyes to the darkness because it was impossible to sense Caedus in the Force. He fought to keep his advantage, dancing back and forth behind his crimson blade, anticipating her every move-and making her pay for each step with a painful kick or elbow strike.
   
  Knowing that sooner or later one of Caedus's blows could be fatal, Jaina risked a quick look around, searching for something she could Force-hurl. The dark side of the pit was black; she could see nothing in there. And the bright side of the pit was so glaring that she could see only the white, glaring mouth of the fusion incinerator and the conveyor belt that fed it.
   
  Caedus made her pay for the survey in blood, landing a pommel across her cheek that split the flesh and smashed the bone. Jaina countered with a driving knee to the thigh, then a downward slash that Caedus barely turned in time to save his hand.
   
  A flimsiplast crate emerged from the conveyor belt chute beside them. It wasn't much-certainly not heavy enough to do damage-but it was all Jaina had. She gave a little ground, allowing Caedus to force her toward the door so she could let the crate move past him and bring it flying into him from behind.
   
  Then the dark shape of the pit droid came clanking out of the shadows. "Excuse me, please," it said. "I must inspect-"
   
  That was as much as it said before Jaina grasped it in the Force and drew it, stumbling, into Caedus's flank.
   
  The droid was more than heavy enough to send Caedus staggering. He whirled instantly, bringing his blade around at shoulder height. By then Jaina had slipped into the shadows and was lunging forward, her shoulders back but her boot heel driving in under his lightsaber.
   
  Once again, Caedus anticipated her. He spun around, leaning away to protect his vulnerable midsection and bringing his leg up to counterkick. Jaina Force-launched herself into him anyway, whipping her lightsaber around in a down guard to keep his blade at bay. His counterkick landed first, driving into her stomach with a deep sharp ache. Her stomp caught him on the hip and sent him falling onto the conveyor belt.
   
  The flimsicrate burst at the seams as Caedus's shoulder and head came down on top of it. Jaina leapt in to press the attack-and was stunned by how quickly he popped back up. There were more than a dozen used syringes hanging from his shoulder and face. He barely seemed to notice. Letting his lightsaber deactivate and drop to the floor, he reached toward her, making a twisting motion with his hand.
   
  Jaina felt her chin twisting around and went with it, using the Force to accelerate her whole body into a spin, still leaping toward Caedus, bringing her lightsaber around in a clearing arc. She felt the blade meet metal, and the droid's ebony head popped into the air. Then she was on Caedus, slashing at his head with her lightsaber, bringing her boot toe up under his chin when he grew predictable and ducked.
   
  The kick snapped Caedus's head back and sent him tumbling over the conveyor belt. Thinking she had just won the advantage, Jaina dropped her free hand toward the lightsaber he had let fall-then barely saved her arm when the crimson blade snap-hissed to life and went spinning past.
   
  Caedus's hand shot up on the other side of the conveyor belt and caught the hilt; then the rest of his body slowly rose into view. His flesh was bulging around the scorch hole in his abdomen, and there were half a dozen syringes planted in his face almost to the barrels. He was in obvious pain-and he was feeding on it. His eyes were bulging and maniacal, his nostrils red and flaring, his lips drawn back so far it almost appeared that he didn't have any.
   
  Jaina brought her lightsaber to high guard and braced her feet, ready for Caedus's attack.
   
  Instead, he deactivated his blade.
   
  "Jaina, listen to me." There was a throaty, gurgling quality to Caedus's voice, and it seemed obvious that the only thing keeping him on his feet was Force energy-a lot of it. "You need to get out of my way. I'm trying to save Tenel Ka and Allana."
   
  "Sure you are," Jaina scoffed. As she spoke, she extended her Force awareness in all directions, trying to figure out why Caedus was stalling when his body was running out of time. "Just like you saved Isolder."
   
  "Isolder would have made the same choice. In fact, he did." Caedus clipped his lightsaber to his belt, a trust-building gesture that might have had some meaning, had he not been a lying Sith murderer. "Jaina, we don't have time for this."
   
  "So die already."
   
  Jaina launched herself into a Force flip, tumbling over the conveyor belt head-down so that she could strike before Caedus had time to unclip and ignite his lightsaber.
   
  Caedus didn't even try. He simply glanced toward the open mouth of the fusion incinerator. In the next instant Jaina felt herself rushing toward its searing heat, and it took all her Force strength to pull herself aside the half meter that saved her life.
   
  But the durasteel into which she slammed was still scorching, and the pain of impact was nothing compared to the sizzling shock of merely contacting the furnace exterior. She dropped to the floor screaming in rage and anguish, her nostrils filled with the stench of singed hair and charred skin, the black GAG utilities still burning on her back.
   
  Then Jaina opened herself fully to the Force, drawing it in through the power of her emotions-not through her anger or pain, as a Sith might, but through her love of what her brother had been:the teenage jokester who could always find hope in a desperate situation, the questioning warrior who had bested the Yuuzhan Vong warmaster in personal combat, the reluctant champion who had shown a galaxy the way to compassionate victory.
   
  The Force came pouring in from all sides, saturating Jaina and devouring her, filling her with a roaring maelstrom of power, carrying away her pain and leaving in its place the strength not only to survive, but to rise and fight.
   
  Caedus was already on the far side of the conveyor belt, pulling the syringes from his face and shoulder while he staggered toward the exit. Jaina used the Force to depress the control pad, and the door closed in his face.
   
  Caedus whirled with fury in his eyes, but Jaina was already bounding over the conveyor belt, her hair still trailing smoke. He splayed his fingers and sprayed Force lightning at her. Jaina caught it on her lightsaber and whirled past, bringing her blade down where Caedus had been an instant before and leaving a long gouge in the door.
   
  Caedus's blade snapped to life beside her, a crimson fan whirling toward her shoulders. She dropped to her haunches and used her free arm to block the Force-driven snap-kick she knew he would launch at her throat.
   
  Ankle met arm with a sharp crack. What looked like an extra joint appeared in the middle of her forearm, then her wrist flopped over Caedus's leg, a useless throbbing thing no longer under her control.
   
  It didn't matter. Jaina was a dead woman if she didn't win this-maybe even if she did win. She whipped her lightsaber around in a high block and deflected the reverse slash Caedus was bringing down toward her neck.
   
  Then she dived forward, whipping her violet lightsaber at his other foot. Caedus sprang away backward, trying to draw both feet out of harm's way at once, and countered by flipping his own weapon around, bringing it up beneath her belly.
   
  Neither blade cut deep, but both did damage. Jaina felt a searing pain across her abdomen, then felt a terrible uncoiling inside her as something she didn't want to think about bulged into the void left by the slashed muscle.
   
  Jaina's blade tapped Caedus behind the boot, touching just long enough to sever the crucial tendon running up the back of the ankle. He landed in an awkward stagger, nearly falling as his foot flapped and flopped without any control.
   
  Jaina came to a knee facing him and knew Caedus was about to die. He had one arm and one good leg, and they were not even on the same side of the body. He could not pivot and he could not retreat. All she needed was to get past his lightsaber and attack the armless side of his body-before she collapsed herself, or he recovered enough to kill her with one last Force blast.
   
  Jaina sprang.
   
  Caedus tried to turn to meet her, but only staggered, his lightsaber falling to his side as though it were a cane. It wasn't, of course, and his momentum kept him stumbling back toward the bright side of the pit, his eyes filled with rage and exhaustion and despair.
   
  Jaina feinted at his head, then began to whirl toward his armless side, bringing her lightsaber around in a flat, high slash that he could not hope to block. It was a sure kill, one that would land even if she died first-which she thought she might, since the attack would leave her completely open to an avenging counterstrike.
   
  But Caedus seemed to know that Jaina had already killed him, and whatever he had in mind, it was not vengeance. When her blade came around, his lightsaber was still hanging at his side. He was staring up toward the ceiling, his gaze fixed somewhere far beyond the murk overhead, and the only attempt he made to save himself was to take one step back into the light spilling from the furnace.
   
  It would not be enough, Jaina knew. She closed her eyes and felt the lightsaber sink in, felt it slicing through his ribs into his chest. And Jaina felt something in the Force, too-something that made her pulse stop and her chest sink and her blood freeze in her veins. Her brother was reaching out to Tenel Ka, screaming at her through the Force, warning her there was danger, urging her to take Allana and:
   
  Then the blade reached Caedus's heart, and he dropped at her feet, and Jaina felt nothing at all.
   
  Important to note:
  -Caedus had more than one serious injury so he wasn't at his best (neither was Jaina, but still Caedus had it worse)
  -The only reason it didn't end with both of them dead is because Caedus didn't want to kill her.
   
   
  
• Jaina fights three Sith sabers at once on a powerful dark side nexus enhancing their performance whilst hindering hers, yet she kills them all without sustaining any injury to herself.
   
  Luke and Jaina were fighting back-to-back. The Sith attacking them had two advantages. One was the fact that they outnumbered the two Jedi. The second was that they were being reinforced by the emanations of the dark side nexus within the temple. It surged forth like psychic sewage, clogging the Jedi's reflexes as it fueled their enemies.
   
  ...
   
  He felt Jaina in the Force, strong and calm, her back to him but not quite touching his. Bonded by blood and the Force itself, they performed a duet of death tot he half dozen Sith pressing in for the attack. They leapt and swung, ducked and kicked in such swift, perfect harmony that an observer might have thought their moves had been choreographed. More than once, an overly confident Saber charged, only to end up slashing at his fellow Sith. In short order two were on the ground, and the odds were now a mere two to one.
   
  Luke could hear the sizzle of lightsabers clashing behind him, only centimeters away, and then the acrid stench of burned flesh and Jaina's blade struck home.
   
  ...
   
  Lost in that piercing gaze, Ben heard, as if from a great distance, the sound of lightsabers being extinguished and he knew that his father and Jaina had won their fights.
   
  

• When she slew Supreme Overlord Shimrra's full group of slayer bodyguards single-handed, she was too fast for them.
  Then later on when whilst severely injured she fought nearly twenty Sith of the Lost Tribe and killed all of them with ease because of her speed.
  

• Though I do think the use of the force during lightsaber combat is being frequently forgotten here, Sidious was a great lightsaber duellist because of his force capabilities.
   
  Jaina is similar, she used the force, whilst severely injured to defeat nearly 20 Sith at a time on Coruscant, she won because she was too quick for them to react to.

Obi-Wan Kenobi

• Qui-Gon Jinn's death due to Ataru's lack of defensive capabilities prompted Kenobi to abandon Form IV as his primary style, but he mastered it nonetheless. Kenobi began studying the defensive Soresu, intending to create a hybrid between it and Ataru to compensate for Form IV's aforementioned lack of defense. Though Soresu eventually became his primary fighting form, he implemented elements of Ataru into his swordplay.
  He also knew Shien, Niman and Jar'Kai.
   
   
  
• By the time of Revenge of the Sith, Obi-Wan is so skilled in Soresu that he can effortlessly deflect Dooku's strikes when Tyranus thought he would be killing Kenobi.
   
  - and this image, this plan, was so clear in Dooku's mind that he almost failed to notice that Kenobi met every one of his thrusts without so much as moving his feet, staying perfectly centered, perfectly balanced, blade never moving a millimeter more than necessary, deflecting without effort, riposting with flickering strikes and stabs swifter than the tongue of a Garollian ghost viper, and when Dooku felt Skywalker regain his feet and stride once more toward his back, he finally registered the source of that blinding defensive velocity Kenobi had used a moment ago, and only then, belatedly, did he understand that Kenobi's Ataro and Shii-Cho had been ploys, as well.
   
  Kenobi had become a master of Soresu.
   
  
• By the end of the war, Kenobi's study into Soresu had resulted in absolute mastery of the style. His skill was such that he was considered by Mace Windu not to simply be a master of Soresu, but to be the master of Soresu.
   
   
  
• With the help of circumstantial factors (like the aforementioned knowledge of each other's fighting styles and Anakin's hindering mindset), Obi-Wan was a perfect equal for Anakin on Mustafar.
   
  Years of fighting side-by-side left these warriors evenly matched, and their exhausting duel crossed the fiery landscape of a Mustafar refinery.
   
  And in the end he even defeated Anakin with his experience.
   
   
  
• He fought Darth Maul three times and won twice (
  ,
  ), and the second time Maul had the help of Savage Opress who alone is capable of killing Jedi Council members.
   
  
• He fought General Grievous (who is one of the most effective non-force user Jedi killer) several times, and killed him
  .
   
  
• He fought Ventress too and won or got away every time. Ventress is even, for some reason, considered better than Maul.
  

  Ventress wins. She moves on to Round Two, sending Darth Maul to the Loser's Bracket.

   
  
• An older, more out of practice Obi-Wan duels and convincingly wins against A'Sharad Hett (latter Darth Krayt), the latter of whom also had an environmental advantage.
  

Conclusion

In every fight (except against Caedus) Jaina outclassed her opponents in the force making the fight rather one sided, she relied on her outstanding speed to win quickly. While it's impressive I think it's rather a showing of her power in the force than her lightsaber skills.

In the other hand Obi-Wan fought most of the best lightsaber duelists of his time and every time he won or at least didn't lose his life.

So I say Jaina and Kenobi should switch places on The REAL Most Powerful Jedi Lightsaber Duelists list.

And for closure here's the blackjack and the ******

You realize that the repercussions of such a switch would place Kenobi at a level higher than Count Dooku, right?

I would definately not put him above Dooku. And while Force power allows some one to be faster it is dueling ability still. She has skill enough that her opponent can not follow her movement. To me its similar in respects to most Juyo users, it looks unrefined and just fast to the untrained eye. Jaina is just fighting those to untrained in Jedi Martial Arts to understand whats happening.

You realize that the repercussions of such a switch would place Kenobi at a level higher than Count Dooku, right?

Or Jaina goes below.

Or Jaina goes below.

Maybe, but I don't think Jaina should go that far down.

I would definately not put him above Dooku. And while Force power allows some one to be faster it is dueling ability still. She has skill enough that her opponent can not follow her movement. To me its similar in respects to most Juyo users, it looks unrefined and just fast to the untrained eye. Jaina is just fighting those to untrained in Jedi Martial Arts to understand whats happening.

I disagree. Ulic holding his own against a jedi without the force, that's lightsaber dueling skill. Blitz killing someone because you outclass him in the force and you move so fast they can't even react, that's no skill (well not lightsaber dueling but force power skill)

Maybe, but I don't think Jaina should go that far down.

Why not? If they are better...Try to counter my argument and don't look at the numbers

Why not? If they are better...Try to counter my argument and don't look at the numbers

Meh, I don't have a reason to. So long as no one puts Kenobi above Dooku, I'm peachy.

Meh, I don't have a reason to. So long as no one puts Kenobi above Dooku, I'm peachy.

I never intended to.

I never intended to.

Good. Carry on then.

I disagree. Ulic holding his own against a jedi without the force, that's lightsaber dueling skill. Blitz killing someone because you outclass him in the force and you move so fast they can't even react, that's no skill (well not lightsaber dueling but force power skill)

Agreed. If we're talking about raw lightsaber skill, Kun should be above Jaina considering him and Ulic dueled to a draw, supposedly making them equals in lightsaber combat. If Jaina's speed and Force potential actually factors into her skill of a lightsaber, then her position does not need to be changed.

I'm sorry but I really question the validity of that list.

Putting the Emperor and Exar Kun in the top 10 force users while omitting Revan? I know this forum likes to hate on him but that's pretty ridiculous.

The list is fine up until Caedus after it is just ignorance and bias. Galen Marek, Master Fay? Utterly ridiculous.

You also don't rank Revan in any lightsaber duelist lists it's quite laughably false. People here should really ignore their hate for a character if they want to create lists like this.

I'm sorry but I really question the validity of that list.

 

Putting the Emperor and Exar Kun in the top 10 force users while omitting Revan? I know this forum likes to hate on him but that's pretty ridiculous.

 

The list is fine up until Caedus after it is just ignorance and bias. Galen Marek, Master Fay? Utterly ridiculous.

 

You also don't rank Revan in any lightsaber duelist lists it's quite laughably false. People here should really ignore their hate for a character if they want to create lists like this.

Obviously. The list is extremely bias and holds no validity. Even members of SWTOR laugh at it.

I'm sorry but I really question the validity of that list.

 

Putting the Emperor and Exar Kun in the top 10 force users while omitting Revan? I know this forum likes to hate on him but that's pretty ridiculous.

 

The list is fine up until Caedus after it is just ignorance and bias. Galen Marek, Master Fay? Utterly ridiculous.

 

You also don't rank Revan in any lightsaber duelist lists it's quite laughably false. People here should really ignore their hate for a character if they want to create lists like this.

Fay on this list is laughable, as are a solid 40% of it.

The lists are popularity contests, most people, even Beni, are happy to admit that.

You guys see the problems with any list, right?

Personally, I see the lists as living documents. They can always change. Of course people are going to disagree with any list that doesn't fall in line with their opinion, and that's their right, just as the 'listmaker' is entitled to their opinion.

You guys see the problems with any list, right?

 

Personally, I see the lists as living documents. They can always change. Of course people are going to disagree with any list that doesn't fall in line with their opinion, and that's their right, just as the 'listmaker' is entitled to their opinion.

Stop forgoing your colour, you look weird

And the point of this list was supposed to be people all contributing to a list to come up with a community, and deciding it together. Not everyone saying something, then Beni and Rayla saying "We disagree so no it stays."

The list of people against Fey, and the evidence against her easily takes her off this list, yet she remains. That's our problem with this list, and it's not an invalid one to say the least...