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Remove bolster from ranked and require expertize before Que!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Remove bolster from ranked and require expertize before Que!

L-RANDLE's Avatar


L-RANDLE
06.06.2014 , 08:47 PM | #61
Quote: Originally Posted by Loomi View Post
LMAO Just stop talking. You have no idea what you are talking about. You get told exactly why you are wrong and how you are wrong and you just stick to your guns even though you are out of bullets..... No one said anything about having ZERO grinds except you. You apparently want everything handed to you on a silver platter. Guess what? That is never going to happen.

Performance metric??? ROFLMAO and please, pray tell, what performance metric should be used instead of EXP rating? Win count? MVP votes? OOH I KNOW! What about arbitrary damage quotients that YOU and ONLY YOU decide? For that matter, how are any of these other metrics not, in themselves, a grind that you are so vehemently against? How about offering solutions instead of tearing other peoples ideas down for no reason but your own epeen?

Stop dragging this real conversation ON THE MERITS OF THE TOPIC BROUGHT UP BY THE ORIGINAL POSTER down into the dirt because you think you know something, when it is clear you do not.

While you are at it, stop hiding behind some stupid notion that AFKers are even an issue. Oh and it is amazing how you think just moving around clears the AFK vote..... Go back to WoW.
Oh boy... Facepalm. Guess what? Please dude. You act like you need to actually AFK to AFK. There isn't anyone policing you in regs or lowbie. ANY metric is better than using time played as a determining factor.

Do I know what metric? No, but I for damn sure know gear already broke this game and here you and others are asking for it again. Smh...

Besides the fact that you have no clue full EXP isn't BiS, you are the same type that would come right back here complaining people not being augmented (assuming they implemented something as silly as this), then you would come back complaining about people not being BiS. Then come back complaining ques are dry because people ain't geared. Where does it end?

How about this?

Delete PvP gear, normalize stats to top tier PvE gear regardless of what you are wearing. Skill/class balance the only determining factor.

Quit asking for a abritrary participation trophy(that isn't even BiS all cases) before you can que.
PvP Gear Viability? Read this first.
Tired of being broke? Stop being Felica and read this.
I'm not trying to be Rambo..... I'm trying to be Ray Tango

SgtJeremy's Avatar


SgtJeremy
06.06.2014 , 08:53 PM | #62
I am terrible at PvP and was still hoping that Bolster would be removed from all 55 matches. You don't get better having people hold your hand. You need to get worked over sometimes for your mind to develop ways to ensure that doesn't again. But if the game is holding your hand the community is suffering because of it. Remove bolster from at least the Ranked PvP.
"Victory at all costs, Victory inspite of all terror, victory however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, their is no peace."
http://www.swtor.com/r/pqwT9F Want free stuff, sure you do.

Loomi's Avatar


Loomi
06.06.2014 , 09:25 PM | #63
Quote: Originally Posted by L-RANDLE View Post
Oh boy... Facepalm. Guess what? Please dude. You act like you need to actually AFK to AFK. There isn't anyone policing you in regs or lowbie. ANY metric is better than using time played as a determining factor.

Do I know what metric? No, but I for damn sure know gear already broke this game and here you and others are asking for it again. Smh...

Besides the fact that you have no clue full EXP isn't BiS, you are the same type that would come right back here complaining people not being augmented (assuming they implemented something as silly as this), then you would come back complaining about people not being BiS. Then come back complaining ques are dry because people ain't geared. Where does it end?

How about this?

Delete PvP gear, normalize stats to top tier PvE gear regardless of what you are wearing. Skill/class balance the only determining factor.

Quit asking for a abritrary participation trophy(that isn't even BiS all cases) before you can que.
Normalize stats? Like what Wildstar is doing, and Rift did? And DCU did? All of which garnered little to no praise and endless criticism? I will take my Expertise, tyvm. Gonna drop the B-bomb now, but not even the geniuses at Blizzard ever thought that was a good idea for their MMO, even after utilizing it to great extent with their RTS'es.

You cannot produce a viable metric to go by because you realize any possible metric short of a person to person interview and aptitude test would be a "grind", as you put it.... No matter what stat you can think of isn't going to just be automatic and will require SOME kind of work to obtain.... You say "ANY metric is better than using time played"
and yet you automatically dismiss EXP out of hand.... Make up your mind

I am just going to let everyone else tell you how ridiculous you are. I am done arguing with someone that just wants to argue and produce nothing positive to the conversation. A conversation you are not even participating in.
Yea, I'm a hardcore raider AND hardcore PvPer... Big whoop, want to fight about it?
I have more self-respect than to post my referral link here or beg in-game for clicks.

Candleper's Avatar


Candleper
06.06.2014 , 10:23 PM | #64
Ok, how many anti bolster threads are there? I'm not saying that bolster is good, I hate it.

My point is that the the Devs really need to respond to this issue and let us know why bolster is the way to go for everything.

Devs, I realize that this opens you up to more criticism but let go of your egos and thinking that you're smarter than everyone else and make this more of an open forum. You might actually learn something from your players.

L-RANDLE's Avatar


L-RANDLE
06.07.2014 , 07:09 AM | #65
Quote: Originally Posted by Loomi View Post
Normalize stats? Like what Wildstar is doing, and Rift did? And DCU did? All of which garnered little to no praise and endless criticism? I will take my Expertise, tyvm. Gonna drop the B-bomb now, but not even the geniuses at Blizzard ever thought that was a good idea for their MMO, even after utilizing it to great extent with their RTS'es.

You cannot produce a viable metric to go by because you realize any possible metric short of a person to person interview and aptitude test would be a "grind", as you put it.... No matter what stat you can think of isn't going to just be automatic and will require SOME kind of work to obtain.... You say "ANY metric is better than using time played"
and yet you automatically dismiss EXP out of hand.... Make up your mind

I am just going to let everyone else tell you how ridiculous you are. I am done arguing with someone that just wants to argue and produce nothing positive to the conversation. A conversation you are not even participating in.
EXP isn't a performance metric in no form or fashion, otherwise they wouldn't give it away for free.. Stop trying to convince yourself otherwise. You know what a decent one would be? Objective points, nodes caps, node cap preventions, average damage/heals/protection (versus the other team). You know? **** that actually contributes to WZ wins.

Just as easily as you dismiss AFK in regs being a problem, I can dismiss low EXP players being in the ranked que. It never happens in team because there is policing my teammates, and how many people in yolo show up with less than 1900EXP? I haven't seen any on PoT5. You can quit arguing and run away screaming bolster is the the problem for ranked but there is virtually ZERO STATISTICAL difference between carrying PvP gear and carrying properly bolstered PvE gear. If anything the elimination of PvP gear furthers any sense of "competitve ranked" trying to be achieved.

PS: I can field a competitve ranked PvE set with 2 PvP relics. Why should I be banished to regs until I have full PvP gear on my rerolls? It's a lame *** idea, unimaginative, and just plain dumb. Sorry Nusec, but its true. Augment checks and proper matchmaking/role balancing is why ranked is in a miserable state.

Get your mind right..
PvP Gear Viability? Read this first.
Tired of being broke? Stop being Felica and read this.
I'm not trying to be Rambo..... I'm trying to be Ray Tango

ZooMzy's Avatar


ZooMzy
06.07.2014 , 07:27 AM | #66
Quote: Originally Posted by Candleper View Post
Ok, how many anti bolster threads are there? I'm not saying that bolster is good, I hate it.

My point is that the the Devs really need to respond to this issue and let us know why bolster is the way to go for everything.

Devs, I realize that this opens you up to more criticism but let go of your egos and thinking that you're smarter than everyone else and make this more of an open forum. You might actually learn something from your players.
Because who really gives a **** about the regs?

Regs should be played freely, where there is no restriction, no requirements, and no hindrance from giving PvP a whirl. There are simple concepts of PvP one should know before WZs, but in terms of what you know and what kind of gear you should have, that should be set more by the example of the players rather than the developers putting requirements and hindering certain people from being able to compete in those WZs.

Ranked WZs are an entirely different subject, however, and I feel the developers have actually shot themselves in the foot with their attempt to incentivize people with allowing bolster to exist in ranked on this quest of "we're trying to get more people to queue". It ultimately is a failed concept, as they're basically trying to get casuals to continue queuing for a PvP queue by boosting a very small portion of the true reason someone will keep playing in that queue for (your rating). And the problem is that the rating will get crushed and unsalvageable if you don't effectively attempt to plan your team/have the experience to read an enemy's, don't have at least the cheap PvP gear set augmented, don't know how to manage burst damage, and don't know what the very basics of PvP combat entail.

So why go back to that queue if you've already lost any hope of getting something out of the rewards within the first five matches you play as losses? The current system is too strict and detrimental to the general population when it comes to losing in ranked, the developers need to tweak the amounts lost and gained from ELO if they want to see more people actively beginning to try that queue and embrace competition.

But the only way they can do that is to set a requirement to enter that queue, as the work load should not change too much to make sure people still access the levels of effort needed for success. A full set of the cheapest gear, 2018 Expertise in total, should be required to enter ranked and perhaps, they can even determine an "ok" PvE gear equivalent that people can use that will still get some bolster into it.

So TL;DR, best path of action for ranked = more ELO gained from winning, less from losing and setting a gear requirement to enter the ranked queue. That'll boost ranked activity, and give people reason to support a system based on how the current population treats the game.

Icykill_'s Avatar


Icykill_
06.08.2014 , 12:06 AM | #67
Quote: Originally Posted by Zadtro View Post
/agreed x1000

Ranked pvp is meant to be the top lvl of pvp in the game yet bolster is there. Bolster was made to help first time entry players into endgame pvp and help with equaling out lowby/midby pvp so yeah, in regular wz's that's great for people who have just dinged and starting to farm gear. In ranked their should be no one with 27k HP trying to queue ranked. It increases trolls and screws with rating.

So yes I agree +1 from me dude

AGREED

Bolster should be completely removed from Ranked and you should have to have a certain lvl of Expertise or the game won't let you queue for ranked...
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Icykill_'s Avatar


Icykill_
06.08.2014 , 12:26 AM | #68
Quote: Originally Posted by SgtJeremy View Post
I am terrible at PvP and was still hoping that Bolster would be removed from all 55 matches. You don't get better having people hold your hand. You need to get worked over sometimes for your mind to develop ways to ensure that doesn't again. But if the game is holding your hand the community is suffering because of it. Remove bolster from at least the Ranked PvP.
OMG this is so true... People won't ever get better if you make it easier for them... PVP is an experience learning process... Imagine in the real world if children said it was too hard to learn to read... Would we make it easier for them by saying... Your right... Let's just remove it from school... You don't need it

PVP isn't like PVE where you can watch all the YouTube vids to learn the FP or OPS... AND you require OPS PVEers to have highend gear for NiM or they wipe.... Bolster at lvl 55 is ridiculous and in Ranked it's an insult to those who can actually play...

People shouldn't even be PVPing for the first time at lvl 55... And if you are wanting them too, then drop them into the pre54 bracket and reverse bolster to that bracket until they at least have Valor 54... At least that way, they will have a better "first" experience and learn skills and tactics needed for higher lvl PVP when they get lvl 54 Valor... In that time they could accumulate comms and start buying pvp gear to equip in NON BOLSTER lvl 55 PVP.
RIP APAC Players 😢😢😢😢💦
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Loomi's Avatar


Loomi
06.09.2014 , 01:05 PM | #69
Come on, Bioware. How many threads is it going to take over the past year since Ranked was implemented before you at least acknowledge there is a problem or explain to us why you insist on keeping the structure the way it is?

Are we really going to have to wait until NEXT season, or the season after that before any of these innumerable grievances are addressed?

For that matter, double Ranked comms for the entirety of the next patch???? That will only make the situation WORSE. I understand you are trying to get more people to queue and make teams, but as long as you continue to hold the hands of the people that enter arenas for all the wrong reasons, the ranked system will continue to be broken.
Yea, I'm a hardcore raider AND hardcore PvPer... Big whoop, want to fight about it?
I have more self-respect than to post my referral link here or beg in-game for clicks.

Anariodin's Avatar


Anariodin
06.09.2014 , 01:12 PM | #70
If there is going to be a Expertise requirement for Ranked PVP, and knowing that Ranked PVPers do normal WZ's as well, have there be a lack of Expertise in normal PVP. Seeing as in PVE you do not have a lock out effect if you lack gear, its the groups going in that choose who goes and who does not, seeing as PVP is not 100% group queue, this is a horrible idea.