Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Restructuring Classes in SWTOR

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Restructuring Classes in SWTOR

Zoom_VI's Avatar


Zoom_VI
05.19.2014 , 04:46 PM | #81
I'm sorry but the idea of warriors running around with UR, SR, SW, Camo, ED, Obfuscate, push, etc is giving me nightmares. Or snipers with stealth, assassins with barrier.

I'm sorry but your suggestion pretty much breaks the game.
Crinn

Sanity is for the weak minded.

Styxx's Avatar


Styxx
05.19.2014 , 04:48 PM | #82
Quote: Originally Posted by Superman_AZ View Post
In my most recent revision:

You would simply play one character, have access to 5 skill trees, use various gear and weapons based on your class, and the advanced class would simply disappear.

The significance? Your Bounty Hunter can now be a PowerTech, a Mercenary, or a Hybrid combo of the two. Now you can experience the story, and respec from Tank, to DPS (any of the 3), or Heal, without ever having to roll another Bounty Hunter unless you want one. This puts the complete control and customization in the hands of the player. ACs were a mistake, and AC swapping would just be a bigger band-aid on an existing issue. Removing the AC entirely and building the 2 spare Damage trees into every build would open up all kinds of doors.

So, let me ask you: Would you rather play with two different Bounty Hunters, two different sets of gear, and double the playtime and expense, OR would you rather have access to all 5 skill trees and gear on ONE Bounty Hunter with the ability to field respec as a Tank / DPS / Heal?
1. The story is the same for any base class, so mercenary and powertech have the same story anyway, NOW.

2. I don`t like universal classes. Never have and never will. Also, I will need gear for each spec ANYWAY, so I am ONLY gaining the extra 1 - 55 trip in your request. And I sincerely don`t think it is unreasonable to need ONLY TWO toons for all 3 roles as they are.

All this cluster**** is just to avoid ONE MORE toon to 55, with opening all sorts of potential stupidity and problems in balancing the classes, without the original crew to do it - which they didn`t do TOO bad up to 50 - and the new ones that still are clueless on how to balance them properly, 2 years later. And we are expecting 5 more levels worth of balancing at one point also, which will have people screaming murder soon.

I`m sorry, but the potential for having bigger issues with class balance is too high for just the time you save for one toon. Especially when we are talking about the new emerging FOTM`s - stackers and CC automatic machines - and THAT will be true murder for most.
Quote: Originally Posted by John Riccitiello View Post
When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging.

ZETA_SCORPII's Avatar


ZETA_SCORPII
05.19.2014 , 04:51 PM | #83
Quote: Originally Posted by SW_display_name View Post
I doubt that would be the case, since we already see within each AC that you can't share gear very effectively.

Tanks in DPS gear, and DPS in Tank gear, are quite gimped. Likewise, Healers and DPS have very different uses for their stat budgets — you "can" share, but you're not being optimal.

It would probably end up like it currently is — each Role needs its own gear (and perhaps each Spec, if you're really optimizing your DPS trees). All that really changes is the number of characters you collect that gear on, and how much you can do with one character.

There isn't. But objectively, there also isn't a need for most of the theoretical discussions that occur in eg, academic environments, yet they sometimes lead to surprising practical developments.

This topic is interesting in the sense of: "Would this work? Would the players be able to handle the change? Would it improve the game?" etc.

You're correct, this isn't needed. At all. But it could work and improve the system, and that's interesting to discuss IMO.
The need for 2 sets of gear on 1 char doesn't solve or improve much, plus you'd earn comms in half the time because of lockouts. In my opinion having to grind 2 sets of gear is just like having 2 characters anyway. Most can power-level in a few days so I just don't see the need to go from 16 to 8 classes.
I understand the argument being made and like I said before, the devs are constantly improving classes so we're good the way we have it for now imo.

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:04 PM | #84
Quote: Originally Posted by ZETA_SCORPII View Post
How many geared 55's do you have? Be honest plz. (by geared I mean 180+)
I can see how your idea would have made sense when the game launched but those of us who have already put in the time to level and GEAR separate alts would be getting the shaft so others can get a shortcut.
Zero. I only RP.
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:04 PM | #85
Quote: Originally Posted by SW_display_name View Post
Being honest with yourself, does the amount of time you chose to invest in something really justify the developers witholding positive improvements to the game later?

As Blizzard devs have stressed over and over, to make a good game, developers can't be held hostage by player emotions or entitlement senses. These things are not trivial, because gaming is inherently an emotional experience (as a hobby / pleasure craft), but they also can't dominate development decisions.

I mean (non-rhetorical here), how many other QoL changes can we think of in SWTOR or any other MMO that invalidated, trivialized, or otherwise rendered someone's "hard work" (always a creepy term in gaming...) obsolete or unnecessary?

At some point you have to accept that — just like IRL — things that are difficult or costly for you today, may not be for future generations. It's really about how much benefit and satisfaction you got from doing it when it mattered, not permanently hampering all future users just to make you feel better.

I mean gawsh, I leveled several alts before they implemented Double XP Weekends, Complimentary XP Boosts, I didn't have a steady income (so couldn't afford infinite CC to keep myself Boosted / twinked) ... took me way longer. Hours and hours I didn't "need" to spend.

But uh... it's cool, you know? I don't want them to deliberately make all future users' level-up process slower just because it took me longer when I first joined the game and has improved since then.

etc etc.
Some very valid points
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:05 PM | #86
Quote: Originally Posted by Reno_Tarshil View Post
That's the problem though. I enjoy my Advance Class title. Sith Marauder sound infinitely better than Sith Warrior.
The class title could be wrapped into the Skill tree. i.e. - Once you have 30 points in a tree associated with the prior advanced class, you gain that title.
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:09 PM | #87
Quote: Originally Posted by Zoom_VI View Post
Because the possibility of having a tank/healer hybrid totally wouldn't completely and utterly break PvP......
The goal in setting up the trees is to balance them so the more powerful Tanking mitigation, or healing concept is only available after you have 25-30 points in that skill tree. Thus making a Tank/DPS or Heal/DPS hybrid the more logical choice. Speccing into Tank and Heals would actually backfire if the trees were set up correctly. Also, as a pure tank you will seldom beat a DPS. As pure heals, you could just sit and laugh. As a gimped hybrid, you would spend more time trying to find your way back to your body than you would fighting.
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:11 PM | #88
Quote: Originally Posted by ZETA_SCORPII View Post
So by merging AC's you'd use the same gear (armoring, earpiece, implants, relics) for your "merged" char without having to switch if you're going from tank to dps and vice versa?
To an extent. If you are speccd into Damage, you will also want to mod for it. It would still require some slight regearing in certain circumstances. But, for the most part, if you have your Hybrid of all 5 trees just as you like it, respeccing and AC swapping would never be needed again. Unless you are a FotM'er, and then you would still respec with, or without this idea.
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy

BrianDavion's Avatar


BrianDavion
05.19.2014 , 05:12 PM | #89
the reason ACs exist is because BW wanted 16 classes but only wanted to write 8 stories. fact is most ACs are VERY differnt from one another. Jedi sage vs Jedi shadow are good examples. these classes are TOTALLY differnt

Superman_AZ's Avatar


Superman_AZ
05.19.2014 , 05:13 PM | #90
Quote: Originally Posted by Styxx View Post
1. The story is the same for any base class, so mercenary and powertech have the same story anyway, NOW.

2. I don`t like universal classes. Never have and never will. Also, I will need gear for each spec ANYWAY, so I am ONLY gaining the extra 1 - 55 trip in your request. And I sincerely don`t think it is unreasonable to need ONLY TWO toons for all 3 roles as they are.

All this cluster**** is just to avoid ONE MORE toon to 55, with opening all sorts of potential stupidity and problems in balancing the classes, without the original crew to do it - which they didn`t do TOO bad up to 50 - and the new ones that still are clueless on how to balance them properly, 2 years later. And we are expecting 5 more levels worth of balancing at one point also, which will have people screaming murder soon.

I`m sorry, but the potential for having bigger issues with class balance is too high for just the time you save for one toon. Especially when we are talking about the new emerging FOTM`s - stackers and CC automatic machines - and THAT will be true murder for most.
So your opinion is leave it all as is. No AC swapping, no streamlining, and even potentially remove respeccing just to "maintain balance"? You do realize, if implemented correctly, this could balance things even more than they are currently, and it would certainly improve QoL for some.
"Be yourself, no one can ever tell you you're doing it wrong." ~ James Leo Herlihy