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ETA on Advanced Class change?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
ETA on Advanced Class change?

hallucigenocide's Avatar


hallucigenocide
05.05.2014 , 11:56 AM | #4561
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
If you are referring to classes being nerfed and the opposite class being buffed, that is NOT a reason to allow class changes, IMO.

I do understand the desire to keep any unique and no longer obtainable items a given character may have, though. I suggested earlier a compromise that would allow players to keep any unique and no longer obtainable items while at the same time addressing many of the concerns that those against class changes have expressed.


Level is reset to level 10
Planetary quests are reset
Story line quests are unaffected. All companions remain and affection is unaffected.
Passive XP boost is granted to help offset loss of XP from any class quests that have already been completed.
Class change should have a high cost, whether that be paid with CC's or credits.


I would like to add one clarification. Passive XP boost should be effective only until previous level reached. For example, if you were level 25 when you changed class, the XP boost is only effective until you reach level 25. this is to prevent anyone from exploiting by changing class at say level 15 and gaining that XP boost to level to 55.
sure if they get to keep their name and everything they've earned on that character i can see that as a decent compromise.. however if the forcing them to level to learn the new AC is the agenda it's pointless.. you wont really learn it until max level when you have all things available to you anyway. only thing that could help out on that department would be some forced upon trial like the proving grounds in WoW i noticed you're familiar with the game so.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
05.05.2014 , 12:01 PM | #4562
Quote: Originally Posted by undiess View Post
So how many of you will rage and pretend you quit when Bioware finally comes online and states the obvious: they have no intention of doing this for the foreseeable future?

456 pages and Bioware hasn't come in here to say one thing.
Not me Undies. I have no intention of quitting, nor would I even use an AC swap tbh. I have my VG and Mando that I enjoy playing, but I do know players who would have liked this option. They tend to be the guys willing to tank, heal or DPS, depending on whatever the group needs. The people I see using this are the ones this game needs more of...
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Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
05.05.2014 , 12:07 PM | #4563
Quote: Originally Posted by hallucigenocide View Post
sure if they get to keep their name and everything they've earned on that character i can see that as a decent compromise.. however if the forcing them to level to learn the new AC is the agenda it's pointless.. you wont really learn it until max level when you have all things available to you anyway. only thing that could help out on that department would be some forced upon trial like the proving grounds in WoW i noticed you're familiar with the game so.
Resetting to level 10 serves several purposes and addresses most of the concerns raised by those against class changes. Those purposes include, but are not limited to:

It requires that player to earn that new class and not simply have that new class handed to them.

It gives that player the opportunity to learn the new skills one or two at at time, rather than have them all thrust upon them in one lump sum. They are not forced to learn to use those skills as they level, but they are given the opportunity to do so, whether or not they take advantage of that opportunity.

Players get to keep their name and any unique and no longer obtainable items, achievements, etc.

hallucigenocide's Avatar


hallucigenocide
05.05.2014 , 12:14 PM | #4564
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
Resetting to level 10 serves several purposes and addresses most of the concerns raised by those against class changes. Those purposes include, but are not limited to:

It requires that player to earn that new class and not simply have that new class handed to them.

It gives that player the opportunity to learn the new skills one or two at at time, rather than have them all thrust upon them in one lump sum. They are not forced to learn to use those skills as they level, but they are given the opportunity to do so, whether or not they take advantage of that opportunity.

Players get to keep their name and any unique and no longer obtainable items, achievements, etc.
and what about those that allready have leveled the AC they want to switch to? should they be forced to do it yet again? and as i said earlier you will not learn your clas by leveling it.. you learn it once it is at max level.. only difference is there's more to read up on. and those serious enough will do so those who are'nt are the same people you see today at max level who has no clue what it is they're doing.. it does'nt matter that they had to level they still did'nt learn anything from it.

Brewski's Avatar


Brewski
05.05.2014 , 12:15 PM | #4565
The timeline is ... never.

Sorry folks, I know it's been said (repeatedly) in this thread, but this is just not in the cards. Without regard to if you consider AC's to be different classes, switching them would be on par difficultly wise.

You have a myriad of skills that may, or may not, have been trained as you leveled, and many of those are AC specific. What do you do, refund cash for the skills they trained in the old AC? Auto-train them in every skill up to the same level they are at? Try to map each skill 1 to 1 with an equivalent skill in the other AC? Any of these present potential problems in an auto transfer.

Then you get into gear. What do you do with the Guardian who switches to Sentinel before realizing all of his armor will have to be scrapped? Give him a free set? Try to convert his armor to an equivalent he can wear? Tell him tough cookies, he just needs to buy a new set? Can you imagine the kvetching in the forums for that?

And on top of all that, it would encourage FOTM builds, which I think hardly needs more encouragement.

It's not that hard to level a toon in this game, especially if it's not your first. Just level a second with the other AC.

undiess's Avatar


undiess
05.05.2014 , 12:22 PM | #4566
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Not me Undies. I have no intention of quitting, nor would I even use an AC swap tbh. I have my VG and Mando that I enjoy playing, but I do know players who would have liked this option. They tend to be the guys willing to tank, heal or DPS, depending on whatever the group needs. The people I see using this are the ones this game needs more of...
Thats awesome of them. They should then level a tank, healer, or whatever they're willing and wanting to play so that they can then learn that class as they level.

ekwalizer's Avatar


ekwalizer
05.05.2014 , 12:26 PM | #4567
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
No, YOU are the one labeling them as "victims", not me. I'm saying let them pick whatever freaking AC they like because it doesn't impact me, or YOU, one freaking bit. If someone would be happier being a Sage rather than a Shadow, big freaking deal. WHY do YOU care? Let the players who dislike their AC switch it if they want. No victims, just a way to create a happy player from an unhappy player. It's a game, it's meant to be FUN, not punitive.
Is that so?

Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
I'm just trying to give players options, not turn them into victims. I'm trying to add things that make people want to stay in this game longer, not level another toon or leave.
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Ah!!! So it's purely punitive. Punish the player for not liking the AC they chose...that's the best one you have huh? LOL!
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
And for those who don't read about them prior to playing? We just penalize them for picking heads instead of tails? It's a GAME!!!!
Just from this afternoon.

ekwalizer's Avatar


ekwalizer
05.05.2014 , 12:37 PM | #4568
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Not me Undies. I have no intention of quitting, nor would I even use an AC swap tbh. I have my VG and Mando that I enjoy playing, but I do know players who would have liked this option. They tend to be the guys willing to tank, heal or DPS, depending on whatever the group needs. The people I see using this are the ones this game needs more of...
Ironically, I'm exactly the kind of player you speak of ... but not for. I also have field respec on nearly all of my toons, so I can fill a gap if the group needs that particular role and I want to use a certain toon.

I play all three roles.
At 55, I have a Shadow, Assassin, Juggernaut, Guardian, Powertech (and a VG at 50) all tanks
At 55 I have an Operative, Sorc, 2 Mercs, and Commando all healers
At 55 I have Another Merc, Sniper, Slinger, Mara, Sent (and another Merc at 53) all DPS.

Reroll. It's not a punishment, it's an adventure. That's why they are playing right?

For me personally, that's:
5 times through the Bounty Hunter Story
2 times each through Warrior, Knight, Agent, Trooper
1 time through Consular and Smuggler.

There is NO time limit to level up.

You often cite how it will keep people playing longer, until they have finished all 8 stories, that argument doesn't hold water.

hallucigenocide's Avatar


hallucigenocide
05.05.2014 , 12:39 PM | #4569
Quote: Originally Posted by Brewski View Post
The timeline is ... never.

Sorry folks, I know it's been said (repeatedly) in this thread, but this is just not in the cards. Without regard to if you consider AC's to be different classes, switching them would be on par difficultly wise.

You have a myriad of skills that may, or may not, have been trained as you leveled, and many of those are AC specific. What do you do, refund cash for the skills they trained in the old AC? Auto-train them in every skill up to the same level they are at? Try to map each skill 1 to 1 with an equivalent skill in the other AC? Any of these present potential problems in an auto transfer.

Then you get into gear. What do you do with the Guardian who switches to Sentinel before realizing all of his armor will have to be scrapped? Give him a free set? Try to convert his armor to an equivalent he can wear? Tell him tough cookies, he just needs to buy a new set? Can you imagine the kvetching in the forums for that?

And on top of all that, it would encourage FOTM builds, which I think hardly needs more encouragement.

It's not that hard to level a toon in this game, especially if it's not your first. Just level a second with the other AC.

ever heard of adaptive gear? FOTM builds is also no excuse seeing as the FOTM rollers allready go for those anyway so that wont change anything.(except for maybe some more money to BW)

Brewski's Avatar


Brewski
05.05.2014 , 12:52 PM | #4570
Quote: Originally Posted by hallucigenocide View Post
ever heard of adaptive gear? FOTM builds is also no excuse seeing as the FOTM rollers allready go for those anyway so that wont change anything.(except for maybe some more money to BW)
Sure, there's adaptive gear. However, unless you are going to convert all gear to adaptive, and morf offhand sabers into shields/focuses (or offhand blasters into the same, or vibroknives or scatterguns) it's a moot point. Many people (including myself) have a majority of toons in non-adaptive gear. Do they get punished? Or do they get a free set of gear? Free mod removals? Auto-conversion to a slave-girl set? (Including gender switch?)

No matter how you slice it, it's a can of worms TOR is better without. I can just imagine the forum raging that would come out of any solution they could possibly come up with. No matter which way you go you're going to punish or favor some players over others.

As for the FOTM comment, lets face it, FOTM exists in any game no matter what barriers you put in place. So does griefing, trade-killing, exploiting and gold selling. In none of these cases does the existence of the problem justify the inclusion of mechanics to make them easier. That's a losing argument at best.