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Understanding what the smash nerf ACTUALLY does.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Understanding what the smash nerf ACTUALLY does.

MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
02.28.2014 , 04:58 PM | #41
Quote: Originally Posted by Vodrin View Post
Your math is off a bit as well. Fully buffed smash will be 8-9K. Losing the effect of singularity cuts that to 4-4.5K, and losing the effect of crit cuts that to 2-2.25K. Chance of a crit without Felling blow is going to be around 15% if you are stacking enough surge and power to get to a 8-9K smash on most targets. So that is a strong single target attack with mediocre (2K) hits on secondary targets unless you get the 1 in 8 chance to crit. The spec will underperform unless it receives other single target damage buffs.
It will hit for more than 2k hits, more like 4.5 at least. You can't just go by tooltip dmg. You have to factor in bonus dmg, etc. And I am wondering what you are comparing it to when you say under-perform? Offhand I can't think of any other ability that does 9k on a single target with 4-5k AoE dmg ( or more) on a short CD. It still is OP.

If not having OP abilities means a spec is unplayable for someone, good.

XnibiruX's Avatar


XnibiruX
02.28.2014 , 05:00 PM | #42
Quote: Originally Posted by MotorCityMan View Post
4 meter radius is small? And it's someone else fault for getting hit? Everyone is supposed to spread out to be at least 5 meters from any other person and maintain that spacing throughout a warzone encounter or it's there fault they get hit by smash? Seriously?

That's like telling the judge, "Your honor, I'm innocent, the other guy is guilty of assault because he ran into my fist."
LOL, You obviously don't understand pvp. Why would everyone need to spread out 5m from everyone else? You only need to not go stand on top of smashers. When a sorc puts an aoe on the ground do you go stand on it? Yes, if you stack on a smasher and you are ranged it is your fault. Your analogy doesnt make sense. In a fight, if a guy held out a knife it would be pretty dumb to run at the knife so it sticks into you, regardless of fault. In MMO's if you get hit from something that can be avoided you can only blame yourself. Same goes for PVE, if a dps gets hit and dies from a bosses aoe circle on the ground, is it the bosses fault?

XnibiruX's Avatar


XnibiruX
02.28.2014 , 05:09 PM | #43
Quote: Originally Posted by MotorCityMan View Post
No I believe the crit effects base dmg. It will hit for more than 2k hits, more like 4.5 at least. You can't just go by tooltip dmg. You have to factor in bonus dmg, etc. And I am wondering what you are comparing it to when you say under-perform? Offhand I can't think of any other ability that does 9k on a single target with 4-5k AoE dmg ( or more) on a short CD. It still is OP.

If not having OP abilities means a spec is unplayable for someone, good.
Its a 12 sec CD, that can be reduced but needs a 18sec skill, or one that takes awhile to build up. If it should be nerfed again, then what do you think they should buff instead, because the spec only puts up equal overall damage compared to combat spec. And then look at all the classes that put up equal damage, good sorcerers, slingers, pyro's etc. Almost every class can put up equal damage if played right. The real problem with the smash spec is that there are too many bad players that whine. I have multiple 55's and I have no problem going against smashers.

MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
02.28.2014 , 05:11 PM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by XnibiruX View Post
LOL, You obviously don't understand pvp. Why would everyone need to spread out 5m from everyone else?
Ahh, it's the 4 meter radius that threw ya.

So you are suggesting that smashers never leap to their targets and also that wherever a smasher goes, players should move at least 4 meters away from them. And of course do this while protecting or trying to take a node, trying to focus, and engaged in combat with other players. And if they don't do that, it's their fault they get hit.

Back to the analogy "judge, it's his fault, he ran into my fist".

And by the way, as far as I am concerned, I think it entirely reasonable for a big circle on the ground to appear a few seconds before a smasher did their AoE so people could indeed move out of the way. It would put them on equal footing with other players that have to contend with telegraphing while utilizing their AoEs.

MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
02.28.2014 , 05:15 PM | #45
Quote: Originally Posted by XnibiruX View Post
Its a 12 sec CD, that can be reduced but needs a 18sec skill, or one that takes awhile to build up. If it should be nerfed again, then what do you think they should buff instead, because the spec only puts up equal overall damage compared to combat spec. And then look at all the classes that put up equal damage, good sorcerers, slingers, pyro's etc. Almost every class can put up equal damage if played right. The real problem with the smash spec is that there are too many bad players that whine. I have multiple 55's and I have no problem going against smashers.

Oh for Pete's sake, they have tons of other abilities already. They just have to learn to press more than 2 buttons.

XnibiruX's Avatar


XnibiruX
02.28.2014 , 05:19 PM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by MotorCityMan View Post
Ahh, it's the 4 meter radius that threw ya.

So you are suggesting that smashers never leap to their targets and also that wherever a smasher goes, players should move at least 4 meters away from them. And of course do this while protecting or trying to take a node, trying to focus, and engaged in combat with other players. And if they don't do that, it's their fault they get hit.

Back to the analogy "judge, it's his fault, he ran into my fist".

And by the way, as far as I am concerned, I think it entirely reasonable for a big circle on the ground to appear a few seconds before a smasher did their AoE so people could indeed move out of the way. It would put them on equal footing with other players that have to contend with telegraphing while utilizing their AoEs.
I don't think you understand, smashers leap to their primary targets, not secondary. Yes you should move if a smasher stands on top of you, while you are fighting, taking a node, etc. That's the difference between good and bad players. Or you can counter the smash as a sorc if you are good, but it takes a well timed knockback. Nobody ever told you that stacking in pvp is usually bad?

XnibiruX's Avatar


XnibiruX
02.28.2014 , 05:22 PM | #47
Quote: Originally Posted by MotorCityMan View Post
Oh for Pete's sake, they have tons of other abilities already. They just have to learn to press more than 2 buttons.
Another ignorant comment, just cuz alot of whiners think they only use a couple abilities doesn't make it true. Good smashers actually use as many abilities as every other spec, just not the same exact ones.

orryko's Avatar


orryko
02.28.2014 , 05:24 PM | #48
It's definitely the responsibility of the smashees to be aware of the smashers and the spacing

Smash isn't just about mindless cleave. It's on demand, consistent, guaranteed, single target burst as well. Smash will still be effective in the hands of those who know what to do with it

Tevzz's Avatar


Tevzz
02.28.2014 , 05:27 PM | #49
Quote: Originally Posted by MotorCityMan View Post
It will hit for more than 2k hits, more like 4.5 at least. You can't just go by tooltip dmg. You have to factor in bonus dmg, etc. And I am wondering what you are comparing it to when you say under-perform? Offhand I can't think of any other ability that does 9k on a single target with 4-5k AoE dmg ( or more) on a short CD. It still is OP.

If not having OP abilities means a spec is unplayable for someone, good.
Go an play Smash and come back when your non-crit non-shockwave-stacked Smashes hit for 4.5k. WON'T EVER HAPPEN!
Vanov - CarnageVanôv - VengeanceDarrthvanov - DeceptionVânôv - FocusVa'nov - APVânov - Concealment
The Shadowlands - Reading Rainbow - Triumph

MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
02.28.2014 , 05:30 PM | #50
Quote: Originally Posted by XnibiruX View Post
Another ignorant comment, just cuz alot of whiners think they only use a couple abilities doesn't make it true. Good smashers actually use as many abilities as every other spec, just not the same exact ones.
Smashers could power Hoover dam with all their hysterical whining, prognostications of doom and tears.