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What makes PVE enjoyable?


Khevar's Avatar


Khevar
02.11.2014 , 02:18 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by NoFishing View Post
... Oh, and while the bosses may be scripted, your teammates are not. ....
YESSS. NoFishing, this is a brilliant statement, and 100% accurate.

To answer the OP: When I started the game, I found PvE enjoyable because I liked the setting and the stories and learning the different clasess (I've now played every AC on both factions).

However, I currently find PvE enjoyable because my guild is fun to hang out with in game. We have a great time doing pretty much anything together, though we like operations the most. Heck, we'll even log onto mumble while playing our own single player games just to shoot the s**t.

Jeweledleah's Avatar


Jeweledleah
02.11.2014 , 02:43 PM | #12
simple answer? to each their own.

complicated answer? you play pvp long enough and it becasue just as "scripted" as what you claim pve to be. you learn what people tend to do in which situations, most pvp in TOR is objective based, so you can often predict what other team will do and counter it.

the fun of it is subjective.
I like pvp as a change of pace and becasue when done with friends can sometimes give me the same rush I get from downing a particularly intricate boss fight.
I like solo pve becasue i can play at my own pace, on my own terms, tailor my experience to my exact moods. I like group pve for the same reason I like ballroom dancing - its social and requires teamwork, learning the steps together and group coordination. (which is not that much different from pvp - you still have strategies and tactics and plans, there's just more chances for improv)

pvp is not objectively harder than pve. THAT is a misconception and frankly? an attempt to elevate your preferred activity through the means of putting down other possible activities and to make yourself feel superior. whenever I see people do that I feel sad for them.

pvp is a bit DIFFERENT from pve. and different people enjoy different things. just because YOU don't get something, doesn't mean its not awesome.

NotAnyOldName's Avatar


NotAnyOldName
02.11.2014 , 06:02 PM | #13
Thanks for the replies everyone, I gather that some think I am 'trolling' or that I think PVP and it's players are superior to PVE , I never intended to imply that in my OP and I didn't think I had worded it in a way that portrays it as that; but I appologise non-the-less if thats what it looks like. I have done one of the Dread thingy operations with PVP gear and wiped repeatedly on the first boss, I know that these fights are not easy mode.

Quote:
As to PvP vs PvE. I enjoy both, but one is strategy and one is tactics. They are very different experiences. The general lack of content in pvp does however make it about as monotonous as farm-status pve at times.
Yeah I agree with you about that to an extent, the lack of content is a true shame and can sometimes make it farm like.

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Cos raid bosses don't spam /spit and /laugh.
You definitely get that a fair bit in PVP, I have personally learned to just ignore it, but im sure there are ego problems with some PVE players too?

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I love it when PvPers throw around phrases like "scripted enemies in predictable fights." It's a passive-aggressive way of calling us all unskilled baddies. And you wonder why there is sometimes conflict between the two camps.
I know of PVE players who are excellent at PVP, and of course some that are not. That said there are full time PVP players who are terrible at PVP also. Both aspects take skill.

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Oh, and while the bosses may be scripted, your teammates are not.
Good point, I have never thought of it that way before.

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Actual close matches or back-n-forths were far too rare.
Yeah these are the matches I live for, but I can still have fun in not so balanced macthes even when I am on the losing side (Provided we arent getting absolutely completely face rolled).

Quote:
pvp is a bit DIFFERENT from pve. and different people enjoy different things. just because YOU don't get something, doesn't mean its not awesome.
Completely agree with you on that, thats why I am asking about it because I will freely admit I am ignorant on the matter.

Overall from what I have read I feel that it is very much the community aspect of playing with friends and trying to take down tough boss fights with different tactics that brings much enjoyment. Gearing seems to be important also, getting a reward for your work is always enjoyable even in PVP. Don't know if I will start actively doing PVE but it has been somewhat enlightening, I feel the social and fun guild aspect of it would attract me the most but I don't know if I could find a guild that would take a complete scrub and one that likes to actively PVP aswell as PVE.

Thanks everyone and feel free to keep adding to this thread.

magi_melcior's Avatar


magi_melcior
02.12.2014 , 07:11 AM | #14
I would be careful including the term "scripted boss fights" as many PvPers use this as basically an insult against PvEers, although I realize in your case that it was not meant to be an insult but a genuine question.

While it is true all PvE encounters are scripted, they have to be that's what makes them PvE, being scripted doesn't automatically mean they are easy.

I mean you said you tried TFB, even in HM the only boss that ever causes people any issues is the 3rd (weekly) boss and in SM even the most moronic PuG can clear the entire Op (assuming they don't all leave once the weekly is done). Now NiM TFB on the other hand is a far more challenging prospect, you aren't going to walk through that no matter how many times you've watched the fights on Youtube.

Each boss has a different level of skill and gear required to clear it, sometimes gear can compensate for lack of skill and vice versa. As you move on to the more challenging bosses the level of skill, coordination and gear required increases, while the number of mistakes and errors the mechanics allow you to make without wiping the group decreases. Corrupter Zero (DF HM) for example is very highly tuned so that even the slightest error or lack of concentration can wipe the raid. Whereas Grob'Thok in the same Operation only really requires the Tanks to be awake and even then is no harder to Tank than SOA in EV.

PvP is about the competitive element, you are testing yourself against another team to see who is the best. PvE is about either challenging yourself, social gameplay or both. That is not to say PvP can't be social and self-challenging or that PvE can't be competitive but it is just that PvP lends itself more easily to the completive element and PvE to the more social and challenge based game type.

I do both, I enjoy both and I am probably decent (but not great) at both. I know great PvP players who don't PvE and I know great PvE players that have never PvP'd. At the end of the day it is all about what YOU like to do. If you've given both of them a good try and decided PvE is not for you then there is no problem as far as I can see.
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darkmauleous's Avatar


darkmauleous
02.12.2014 , 08:49 AM | #15
I love Challenging Boss fights. It seems frustrating when we wipe 4,5,6 times on one boss, but we all learn our parts as guild. It's a fun part of the game, and while i do like pvp i seem to do better in pvE
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Xikks
02.12.2014 , 09:11 AM | #16
This game isn't very good for PvP IMO. I never enjoyed the PvP in this game and was an avid PvP player on EQ2.

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Ottoattack
02.12.2014 , 10:12 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by NotAnyOldName View Post
Hello everyone!

Firstly I will state I am a hardcore PVP'er, it is all I do and have been doing for the majority of my time playing this game and others. I now have 11 max level characters which were leveled through a mixture of PVE (Questing and occasional FP) and PVP but I don't enjoy the process of leveling through PVE content. I don't understand how fighting scripted enemies in predictable fights could possibly be entertaining after playing PVP with its unpredictable enemies and dynamic fights. So I was wondering, and I don't mean to cause any offense to anyone in asking this, but how and why do you find it enjoyable?

That said I have done a couple of operations, mostly pugged but one time with a PVP guild I was in (We all ran it in PVP gear haha), and especially with the longer ones such as TFB I got incredibly bored about half way through. There was a measure of enjoyment in there, but what are the things you do to make it really live for you?

And I understand that PVP'ers and PVE'ers seem to have an aggressive air between the two, I personally have called PVE'ers carebears and made jokes about them as if they were a strange people. Really though I respect everyone's right to play the game as they see fit and mean no offense <3 all you carebears out there . In all seriousness though the vast majority of the population are in fact PVE players so I feel like there must be something there that make it so popular, and perhaps I may be missing out on something due to my own ignorance?

Thanks!
As a person who played on both sides. What I can tell you about PvE is:

1- It is a win-win kind of scenario. Almost no one loses, which is the biggest bother in PvP. Even harder content, if you have a dedicated group that understands the game mechanics well, can be burned down relatively easy.

2- It gives better change for all classes to perform. In PvP half the game spec are down right unviable.

3- It does not require major understanding of every single spec in the game. Closet thing in PvE is boss fights, which are relatively easier to understand and much more predictable.

4- It is a lot less egoistic, and much more friendly. I am in fully auged obroan, and I get really frustrated when I see ppl in WZs with 26K HP and 1,600 expertise unstimmed. In PvE there is no such thing. There is a gear requirement, and most people can easily out gear the highest content, so it is just the process of them understanding the mechanics.

5- The gearing in PvE is straight forward that people can understand very easily with gear rating and clear system. In PvP gearing is so convoluted, that you have to tinker with 20 million things in order to be effective in WZs with low gear.

6- PvE has no entry barriers. You have been gearing up for it since level 1 and everything in the game educates you on how to gear up. Even if you are not good, you can still do most content easily. The skill and gap required to compete effectively in PvP is not easy to attain and nothing educates you to improve, except joining WZs and getting obliterated.

Having said all the above, I prefer solo PvE content or FPs, over ops. I got extremely bored in ops. I hate 16 man ops in particular, cuz there is so much skills flying, my eyes get fuzzy. In addition, I prefer that fights break every 1-2 minutes. In ops you can stay in a constant fight for 10+ minutes. Also you need to block 2-3 hours to get anything done, were in PvP and PvE solo content/FPs, all I need is 1 hour.

mastirkal's Avatar


mastirkal
02.12.2014 , 10:44 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Ottoattack View Post
As a person who played on both sides. What I can tell you about PvE is:

1- It is a win-win kind of scenario. Almost no one loses, which is the biggest bother in PvP. Even harder content, if you have a dedicated group that understands the game mechanics well, can be burned down relatively easy.

2- It gives better change for all classes to perform. In PvP half the game spec are down right unviable.

3- It does not require major understanding of every single spec in the game. Closet thing in PvE is boss fights, which are relatively easier to understand and much more predictable.

4- It is a lot less egoistic, and much more friendly. I am in fully auged obroan, and I get really frustrated when I see ppl in WZs with 26K HP and 1,600 expertise unstimmed. In PvE there is no such thing. There is a gear requirement, and most people can easily out gear the highest content, so it is just the process of them understanding the mechanics.

5- The gearing in PvE is straight forward that people can understand very easily with gear rating and clear system. In PvP gearing is so convoluted, that you have to tinker with 20 million things in order to be effective in WZs with low gear.

6- PvE has no entry barriers. You have been gearing up for it since level 1 and everything in the game educates you on how to gear up. Even if you are not good, you can still do most content easily. The skill and gap required to compete effectively in PvP is not easy to attain and nothing educates you to improve, except joining WZs and getting obliterated.

Having said all the above, I prefer solo PvE content or FPs, over ops. I got extremely bored in ops. I hate 16 man ops in particular, cuz there is so much skills flying, my eyes get fuzzy. In addition, I prefer that fights break every 1-2 minutes. In ops you can stay in a constant fight for 10+ minutes. Also you need to block 2-3 hours to get anything done, were in PvP and PvE solo content/FPs, all I need is 1 hour.
This really just speaks for how bad PvP is in this game. When BiS is a *********** matrix cube and wearing a 61 hilt buffed up there's a problem. The closest PVE has to backwards BiS is for dot/healing specs that can utilize the double proc on kell dragon SA relics.
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AlrikFassbauer's Avatar


AlrikFassbauer
02.12.2014 , 11:24 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by NoFishing View Post
I love it when PvPers throw around phrases like "scripted enemies in predictable fights." It's a passive-aggressive way of calling us all unskilled baddies. And you wonder why there is sometimes conflict between the two camps.
I agree to that.
"Just say no." If you feel like you are only there for generating Comms for someone else, then just stay away from PvP. Don't let yourself get farmed !

Margoth's Avatar


Margoth
02.12.2014 , 11:41 AM | #20
Even though a pretty obvious troll I'll actually answer the question.

1. The story. I like how the different class story lines inter relate to each other. I like seeing the reactions to different dialogue options.
2. Learning different classes. I like the variety of different classes in an environment where I am not ridiculed, called a stupid f***in' noob for not being the most awesome mouse clicker in the world.
3. Playing with my friends. I like to be able to play with my friends.
4. Seeing if I can better my own personal bests, be it healing, DPSing or tanking.
5. It's NOT PVP. I hate PVP. I hate the uber wiener measuring morons that think because they can click buttons faster they are somehow superior to me in RL instead of just better at playing a game.
6. I like being able to progress at my own pace. Being able to step away from keyboard if I need to.
7. I like being able to set personal goals for myself that I can accomplish on my own. Be that accumulating a certain amount of credits, getting a piece of gear, completing an achievement.