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What makes PVE enjoyable?


NotAnyOldName's Avatar


NotAnyOldName
02.11.2014 , 04:22 AM | #1
Hello everyone!

Firstly I will state I am a hardcore PVP'er, it is all I do and have been doing for the majority of my time playing this game and others. I now have 11 max level characters which were leveled through a mixture of PVE (Questing and occasional FP) and PVP but I don't enjoy the process of leveling through PVE content. I don't understand how fighting scripted enemies in predictable fights could possibly be entertaining after playing PVP with its unpredictable enemies and dynamic fights. So I was wondering, and I don't mean to cause any offense to anyone in asking this, but how and why do you find it enjoyable?

That said I have done a couple of operations, mostly pugged but one time with a PVP guild I was in (We all ran it in PVP gear haha), and especially with the longer ones such as TFB I got incredibly bored about half way through. There was a measure of enjoyment in there, but what are the things you do to make it really live for you?

And I understand that PVP'ers and PVE'ers seem to have an aggressive air between the two, I personally have called PVE'ers carebears and made jokes about them as if they were a strange people. Really though I respect everyone's right to play the game as they see fit and mean no offense <3 all you carebears out there . In all seriousness though the vast majority of the population are in fact PVE players so I feel like there must be something there that make it so popular, and perhaps I may be missing out on something due to my own ignorance?

Thanks!

CaptainApop's Avatar


CaptainApop
02.11.2014 , 05:35 AM | #2
Personally the non-operations PvE in this game is a bit insultingly easy for my tastes. Storymodes too to a lesser extent. I enjoy walking into a difficult boss, that punishes *********** up and the process of modifying strategy until we can kill it. The rampant insults and banter between the other ops members adds to the fun too.

Well designed PvE bosses will force you play differently than you do for others while the dull ones are the full-on carebear "I am fighting a scripted AI" fights. Grob'thok for example is incredibly dull and you would have to try very hard to fail.

You can boil down PvP to burst, sustained, heals, kiting, LoS'ing and target switching. These are all present in PvE too just in different ways and different magnitudes. Thing is, there's no difficulty setting for pvp. You don't hit a switch and only fight bads. Especially in swtor you're put up against a motley crew of terribads, mediocre players and the best people on the server and so are the other team. Sometimes you will randomly get crushed where generally in pve if you get utterly destroyed you kind of saw it coming.

As to PvP vs PvE. I enjoy both, but one is strategy and one is tactics. They are very different experiences. The general lack of content in pvp does however make it about as monotonous as farm-status pve at times.

(I don't just mean lack of new warzones, more frequent substantial balances would at least shake up the meta. )
"I bind kolto probes to Q, partially for the convenience but mostly for the irony"

Subterfuge legacy - Tomb of Freedon Nadd

Vanarion's Avatar


Vanarion
02.11.2014 , 06:25 AM | #3
I do actually both PVP and PVE and would find it rather boring to do only one of both.
I'd categorize raids into three different types:
  • Progressing:
    That's content my raid group is actually trying to clear.
    For new raid content fun is finding out about the boss mechanics and evolve the tactics ourself.
    For hardmode/nightmare it is fleshing out the tactics and to improve as a team until we master a boss.
  • Raids to gear up:
    Raids we do regularly to get better gear. It's routine spiced up with jokes and smalltalk in TS.
  • Fun Raids:
    Raids done to chill, maybe equip a twink or two and laugh a lot. We create our own level of difficulty by trying to creativly kill certain raid members or maybe wipe in an as absurd way as possible, completly ignoring mechanics, pulling as muss adds as we think we might handle or even more, doing 8/16 man raids with as small groups as possible. Such things. We are not the most disciplined lot .

Sometimes I do some PUG raids to get acquainted to other people and guilds and to pick up some promissing players for our guild (of course only those without a guild ).

All in all for me it's the people of my guild and friends that make raids fun.
Server: Vanjervalis Chain
Gilde: Corellianischer Sonnenregen
Das Anchoi Vermächtnis: Silan, Gelehrte; Beslan, Revolverheldin; Nalis, Saboteur

DomiSotto's Avatar


DomiSotto
02.11.2014 , 07:31 AM | #4
Erm, because you can play it as a game, without depending on anyone else, and enjoy the story without having to be good enough not to be killed by some kid who spends gazillion hours a week to become professional at the art of mouse-click killing and gear-mongering? Because, you know, it takes some over 30 seconds to just rotate the view to see who the heck is shooting at you and another 20 sec to target.... With an absence of skill like that PvP would be neither possible, nor enjoyable. While the PvE is doable and fun. Cause, you know, the story....

AlrikFassbauer's Avatar


AlrikFassbauer
02.11.2014 , 07:40 AM | #5
I don't play PvE for fights. 'Nuff said.

I'm a story player. I play solely for story, for nothing else. The rest is a nice bonus for me.
“ Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius – and a lot of courage – to move in the opposite direction.“ (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)

morfius's Avatar


morfius
02.11.2014 , 08:24 AM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by NotAnyOldName View Post
Hello everyone!

Firstly I will state I am a hardcore PVP'er, it is all I do and have been doing for the majority of my time playing this game and others. I now have 11 max level characters which were leveled through a mixture of PVE (Questing and occasional FP) and PVP but I don't enjoy the process of leveling through PVE content. I don't understand how fighting scripted enemies in predictable fights could possibly be entertaining after playing PVP with its unpredictable enemies and dynamic fights. So I was wondering, and I don't mean to cause any offense to anyone in asking this, but how and why do you find it enjoyable?

That said I have done a couple of operations, mostly pugged but one time with a PVP guild I was in (We all ran it in PVP gear haha), and especially with the longer ones such as TFB I got incredibly bored about half way through. There was a measure of enjoyment in there, but what are the things you do to make it really live for you?

And I understand that PVP'ers and PVE'ers seem to have an aggressive air between the two, I personally have called PVE'ers carebears and made jokes about them as if they were a strange people. Really though I respect everyone's right to play the game as they see fit and mean no offense <3 all you carebears out there . In all seriousness though the vast majority of the population are in fact PVE players so I feel like there must be something there that make it so popular, and perhaps I may be missing out on something due to my own ignorance?

Thanks!
Easy, it is way better than most of media and even books today, playing with family/friends make fun environment and last but not least I take it as rest time not race/sport time.
Most of casual PvEers do same I suppose.
Challenge and self prove in game is not so worth it anymore when you have RL ones.
Progressive PvE players have similar attitude as PvP ones - but they go for tactics and execution, when play come close to a group dance.
As there are those that like to do group dances, there are those that like to play some football.
And much more like to relax watching some dances or sports (reading books, listening music, watching movies or play game just for relax).
"The Aing-Tii have a different view of the Force. Not in terms of Jedi or Dark Jedi—of black and white, as it were—but in a way I like to think of as a full-color rainbow."

Methoxa's Avatar


Methoxa
02.11.2014 , 08:40 AM | #7
I am a pve player, i am only pvping for gear.

To your question "what makes pve enjoyable":

- Playing with friends
-Thinking about tactics, improving your playstyle, learning bosstactic
- better equipment
-joy when killing an encounter, Progression

I think you suggest that pvp is harder than pve because in pve fights are scripted. This is true, encounters follow a certain script that tells the boss what to do unlike in pvp where your opponent could do smth. you wouldnt await. Nevertheless pvp is not harder when you compare it to Nim operations. Of course when you pug for tfb 16 sm it is boring even hm is boring. Most pvp players think pve is boring because they only compare it to sm or hm. If you want to know what pve is about try nightmares youll find a challenge in these fights especially bosses like Styrak, Warlords. But ofc these fights are also scripted so you wont experience a "suprise moment" when you learned the fights, still they are challenging.
Conquerer of the Dread Fortress Methoxa - Gate Crasher - Black Bantha - Vanjervalis Chain EU

PlasmaJohn's Avatar


PlasmaJohn
02.11.2014 , 08:42 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by CaptainApop View Post
The general lack of content in pvp does however make it about as monotonous as farm-status pve at times.
This.

I'm a puzzle person. I like the complicated mechanics of Operations. I also appreciate the reward aspect of the gear grind. It's tedious but... oooh! shiny! The social aspect makes our farm-status EV HM runs super fun. The easy-mode ops also let us try out an off-spec or undergeared alt.

I'm not how true this TOR dev gem is: "PvP players are happy as long as they have somebody to kill". For me, no not in the least. The only positive thing I can say about arenas is that they tend to be quick. Traditional warzones are far more interesting to me. Even though the mechanics are simple, at least they have some and all the maps are different.

I was super excited for GSF until I learned it was PvP only. Even still I was willing to give it a go. I burned out after a month. Why? One mode, two nearly identical maps. 2.6 added Deathmatch and no new maps. In the immortal words of my Sin tank: "Yaaaa-aaaawn".

Audiva - Cogohi - Malkerson - Mysalia - OIejandro - Roxiani - Szachi
Aldriovok - Jubelee - Korduun - Mikkiani - Ojain - Oromunroe - Ryliani

CrazyGreggy's Avatar


CrazyGreggy
02.11.2014 , 10:22 AM | #9
Cos raid bosses don't spam /spit and /laugh.

NoFishing's Avatar


NoFishing
02.11.2014 , 11:23 AM | #10
I love it when PvPers throw around phrases like "scripted enemies in predictable fights." It's a passive-aggressive way of calling us all unskilled baddies. And you wonder why there is sometimes conflict between the two camps.

If you think operations bosses can not be challenging because they are scripted, I'd like to see your PvP guild run S&V NiM in PvP gear, and then come back and tell us how boring it is. Oh, and while the bosses may be scripted, your teammates are not. There are 7 or 15 other people in the group that need to perform at a pretty decent level for you to progress. A missed taunt in PvP reduces one number on a scoreboard, but has little impact overall in most matches...in PvE that mistake can easily wipe the group.

But assuming you are not here just to troll, the reasons I enjoy PvE are:

- The challenge of clearing new content and new mechanics.
- Playing with friends, helping each other succeed in our shared goal.
- Because it's there.
- Better gear.

Personally I gave up on PvP because I found it quite boring, mostly due to really terrible matchmaking. 90% of all matches had one strong team going against a far weaker team. The outcomes were pretty much decided before the spawn doors even opened. If I was on the stronger team, it would be amusing for a bit, at least to get my weekly done, but wasn't all that interesting. Actual close matches or back-n-forths were far too rare.