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Credit Seller Spam is Getting Worse Lately

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Credit Seller Spam is Getting Worse Lately

DarthTHC's Avatar

01.17.2014 , 01:30 PM | #71
Quote: Originally Posted by Zorvan View Post
Perhaps in addition to their normal methods, but not in replacement of. Free product ( farming ) makes more than bought product ( reselling ).
This would be true if farming were actually free. Farming requires labor, equipment, and utilities, all of which cost money. Same reason General Motors doesn't make tires.

Zorvan's Avatar

01.17.2014 , 01:42 PM | #72
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthTHC View Post
This would be true if farming were actually free. Farming requires labor, equipment, and utilities, all of which cost money. Same reason General Motors doesn't make tires.
Except most of your goldseller companies have been around for *years*. They haven't had to buy new equipment for at least four-five years outside of maybe the occasional hardware piece failure, as far as being able to run any mmo on low settings, and they don't only farm for one game. Farming labor is cheap as hell when you're paying asian students/unemployed and letting them sleep on the floor/keeping them in ramen in exchange for their labor.

So yeah, trust me, the good old ways are still employed. They've just added additional ways to get extra stock if the farming runs low.

GalacticKegger's Avatar

01.19.2014 , 10:24 PM | #73
Quote: Originally Posted by Zorvan View Post
It didn't eradicate the "need" for credsellers, otherwise they wouldn't be selling credits. lol

EAware has overhead. Credsellers don't. EAware has to worry about game and economy balance. Credsellers don't. And no matter how low the cred to CM ratio gets, credsellers can always afford to undercut both legit players and EAware. Because they a.) don't buy CM stuff to get their creds, and b.) use F2P accounts to farm creds.
It did indeed eradicate the need for credit sellers. They are scam artists preying on get rich quick impatience (which is NOT a need) by trying to trick the unsuspecting into believing that their impatience is a need. So they would be out there spamming chat regardless because, like cockroaches infesting plentiful food stores, it's what they do. They are predators. There's nothing lol about it.

To legitimize their efforts as F2Pers, the assumption would have to be that they are licitly farming and selling mats & their crafted wares, questing, leveling and participating in WZs, FPs and space missions for the in-game credits they are advertising to sell for real money. Problem is F2P players are limited to 5 warzones, 3 flashpoints and 3 space missions per week, and their GTN usage is restricted to 2 simultaneous transactions. Oh, don't forget the 200k credit cap.

Which means "spend money to make money" preferred or subbed accounts are doing all the work and making the actual sales. But I'll stick to our credit seller convo because you suggested they use their F2P accounts to farm credits.

Can't make a marketable amount of credits as F2P
Even if they were in fact legit farmers without restrictions it would take them a full balls to the wall 8 hour day farming end game planets to get even a half million credits (personal experience). This assumes they are geared enough to advance their character through their class stories & obtain a starship that allowed them travel to those planets. Have you seen their gear? When was the last time a credit spammer was found in a warzone, in a flashpoint or on an advanced planet?

Exactly. Which means they're limited to selling low level planet farmed items or drops with prohibitive GTN privileges, reselling CM purchases made with achievement coins ... and completing 5 WZs, 3 FPs and 3 SMs a week to get their credits with a 200k credit cap to hold it all. Their earning 500K credits a day is therefore impossible without multi-boxing multiple accounts that take shifts farming and selling, or using an auto-farm bot with a credit cap hack. In 2+ years I have yet to see a farm bot. Likely because the addon APIs are off limits to outsiders. A fair trade for not having addons imho.

Speaking of trade, F2P can't send in-game mail or engage in trading either. So after their website takes your money, who in-game physically delivers your $1M? An F2P account that is incapable of trading and can't possess more than 200K credits at a time?

It's a trap!

Overhead numbers game
You mentioned cred sellers don't have overhead. Assuming an average of 500K credits per day was somehow earnable even with all of the F2P restrictions, and considering the typical spam-advertised rate is $8/1million credits, it would take one farmer 2 full 8-hour work days to cover a single sale. $8 in gross revenue for 16 hours of work equates to a whopping 50 an hour.

At 50 an hour they can't afford to undercut anything - even if everything was free: the computer(s) they work on, the bandwidth they work through, the space they work in, the website they promote (and the IT staff required to maintain it) the EFT payment processing system they use to physically take a customer's money (including all banking, payment gateway and transaction fees), the network they use to connect it all, the electricity they use to power it all, etc.

They have plenty of overhead; and that 50 an hour won't cover expenses and support the worker too, regardless of what country they operate from.

I'm taking an awful risk Vader...
So their end game deduces to the acquisition of some sorry sap's credit card or game account information in the hopes of hitting the "account without a Security Key" mother lode. By hacking into an account they could sell everything that every toon in that player's account has, steal whatever personal information they can from the burgled account then launder the returns in game across multiple accounts before disappearing.

The mother lode part comes from logging into the hacked account (subs are the big target) and purchasing CM items and packs with the hacked account's credit card, then reselling those items in-game for major credits (likely a big reason why there is a 2-day cooldown in C-pack items going BoE) as well as robbing guild banks on all guilded characters.

An ounce of prevention
This is why I have a security key. This is also why our guilds have multiple levels of membership between recruit and officer. The lowest level members & recruits do not have gbank withdrawal privileges. The higher level members and above do, but must show proof of security key ownership before they are so privileged. We do this by having them physically drag & drop a security key vendor Fleet Pass into a trade window, which is easily distinguishable from the CM's Fleet Travel Pass.

If I see a fire sale on a pricey item on the GTN, I don't get greedy and buy it - I report it immediately. In real life I avoid counterfeit goods because their revenue trails have been traced to organized crime and terrorist organizations. I stay away from credit sellers similarly because I don't see how they can legitimately stay in business. Anyone with half a brain doesn't need a terms of service agreement to tell them that offering up their credit card information to these people is stupid, if not outright dangerous.

Even operating as a sweatshop, account theft is how they make their money - and they won't go away until they are made to go away. Sorry, but I find defending credit sellers on any level to be complicit.
Can we please just have our pre-KotFE SWTOR MMORPG back?