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Operative DPS Talent Modification

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Scoundrel / Operative
Operative DPS Talent Modification

Arstechnica's Avatar


Arstechnica
11.25.2013 , 07:50 AM | #1
Modification options to Concealment DPS:
1. TA buff duration needs to be augmented.
2. Shiv and Back stab needs some mech to allow their CD to reset.
3. Acid blade and corrosive dart dots needs to last longer or give Acid Blade's dot a chance to tick twice.
4. Instead of 2 TA give a chance to build 3 TA.
5. Remove energy cost from acid blade application or make its action passive.
6. Put Laceration on a normal cool down and allow Shiv and Stim-boost the ability to speed up or reset Laceration CD.
7. Give OP stances like the other classes that boost healing or dps (acid blade buff).
8.TA gives energy regeneration buff, more TA means more energy regeneration.
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DuEldrvarya's Avatar


DuEldrvarya
12.09.2013 , 10:36 PM | #2
Dude you know op dps played well is still one of the best specs in the game. Outside of broken as hell pyro-mercs, it is arguably the best dps (and top 5 are +/- 2% of every other spec out there) by any mixed spec class.

Dak for example on one of his first times using Concealment did a 3200 and probably could have done quite a bit better. ( I raid with the guy and he even talks about how much better he could do, he just prefers lethality)

Why the **** does it need to be buffed more?

Racter's Avatar


Racter
12.10.2013 , 06:03 AM | #3
3200 is still quite a bit lower than most other specs (definitely not 2% more like 10% lol) and both our DPS specs are pretty terrible in competitive PVP. Though these are clearly PVE minded changes they would definitely help on both sides of the fence, especially long TAs. I do have to strongly disagree with longer lasting dots. From a PVP standpoint our dart is already a liability because its duration prevents mezzes.

Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
12.10.2013 , 06:17 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by DuEldrvarya View Post
Dude you know op dps played well is still one of the best specs in the game. Outside of broken as hell pyro-mercs, it is arguably the best dps (and top 5 are +/- 2% of every other spec out there) by any mixed spec class.

Dak for example on one of his first times using Concealment did a 3200 and probably could have done quite a bit better. ( I raid with the guy and he even talks about how much better he could do, he just prefers lethality)

Why the **** does it need to be buffed more?

Good carnage mara do about 3.5 k, the best hybrid snipers about 4k. concealment is not as bad pve wise as some people might think, but it is horrible compared to what sorcs do, mercs do, and ofc lethality operatives (excluding to primary dps classes, which by their pure nature should have higher deeps). I assume your friend Dak on a pure DPS class would do way more as well, since concealment pve wise is about the hardest rotation i can think of (in terms of engery, CD and TA management and actually doing some damage at the same time). Add the stealth dependance and the sometimes annoying positional requirements there are way easier classes pve with and to be more successfull. And no concealment by far isn't by any mixed class, lightning sorcs, lethality ops, mercs on average and at the top level do much better. We are better than assassins though for once :P

DuEldrvarya's Avatar


DuEldrvarya
12.11.2013 , 03:05 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Cordorian View Post
Good carnage mara do about 3.5 k, the best hybrid snipers about 4k. concealment is not as bad pve wise as some people might think, but it is horrible compared to what sorcs do, mercs do, and ofc lethality operatives (excluding to primary dps classes, which by their pure nature should have higher deeps). I assume your friend Dak on a pure DPS class would do way more as well, since concealment pve wise is about the hardest rotation i can think of (in terms of engery, CD and TA management and actually doing some damage at the same time). Add the stealth dependance and the sometimes annoying positional requirements there are way easier classes pve with and to be more successfull. And no concealment by far isn't by any mixed class, lightning sorcs, lethality ops, mercs on average and at the top level do much better. We are better than assassins though for once :P
Here's what you need to take into account... These number one parses for leaderboards are so rng heavy its insane.

Look instead at the averages of the top 5 in the specs. All mara's and snipers are higher ofc. Assassins still under 3k on average (until new "official leaderboard" comes ou)t, sorcs are sitting just over 3200, Vangaurds sitting at 3400 in hybrid, significantly lower in either of the main specs, Juggs at about 3300.

With top 5 lethality being almost 3380 average, that puts them at the top of all non-dps only specs.... (Note that pyro merc asside since they doing merc/sniper numbers, but arsenal is topping out even under lethality)

So explain again how bad op dps is?

DuEldrvarya's Avatar


DuEldrvarya
12.11.2013 , 03:06 PM | #6
Actually even looking at assassin dps popping up into the 33s 34s its still right up there.

RougeBeaver's Avatar


RougeBeaver
12.12.2013 , 10:48 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by DuEldrvarya View Post
Dude you know op dps played well is still one of the best specs in the game. Outside of broken as hell pyro-mercs, it is arguably the best dps (and top 5 are +/- 2% of every other spec out there) by any mixed spec class.

Dak for example on one of his first times using Concealment did a 3200 and probably could have done quite a bit better. ( I raid with the guy and he even talks about how much better he could do, he just prefers lethality)

Why the **** does it need to be buffed more?
What a crock, on all counts.

One of the best specs? "Buffed more?" Are you high?

The only possible way a Concealment can score even remotely that high is on add-heavy fights such as EC Kephess or the first boss of TfB when Orbital hits absolutely everything and produces inflated numbers. Which Lethality can also do, to much greater effect. Nice lie, try again!

Try this on a dummie, and weep at the results, but please stop spewing false information. Concealment is hands down the worst.
The only true profit in this galaxy is freedom.

Arstechnica's Avatar


Arstechnica
12.13.2013 , 02:43 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by DuEldrvarya View Post
Dude you know op dps played well is still one of the best specs in the game. Outside of broken as hell pyro-mercs, it is arguably the best dps (and top 5 are +/- 2% of every other spec out there) by any mixed spec class.

Dak for example on one of his first times using Concealment did a 3200 and probably could have done quite a bit better. ( I raid with the guy and he even talks about how much better he could do, he just prefers lethality)

Why the **** does it need to be buffed more?
The "played well" part is what I am wanting to bring to light. When playing in PVP as a concealment OP we have the rather difficult task of managing both energy and Tactical Advantage, while trying to stay alive.

To make matters worse TA cool down is very short compared to the other adv classes eg. Marauder's Annihilator buff or Sith Assassin Deception buffs ; just examine the amount of time Deception gets on the shock and discharge buff, you can make a PBJ sandwich before they run out! The same is true of the recent changes to Annihilation, Carnage gore buff duration, while not as long still seems appropriate when compared to TA and it's use with Laceration.

I am not asking for a damage increase, the problem is the top heavy rotation. Please re examine, re work it, make it enjoyable and fun.
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Mubrak's Avatar


Mubrak
12.14.2013 , 01:48 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Arstechnica View Post
2. Shiv and Back stab needs some mech to allow their CD to reset.
This only crossed my mind when leveling a scoundrel alt this week: For some reason (the animation I guess?) I use Dirty Kick much more often and naturally than Debilitate, even against trash mobs. The guy convulses in pain or lies flat on the floor, and I walk around to shoot him in the back. How silly is that?

So how about taking some inspiration from D&D's sneak attacks? Give Scouperatives the ability to Backstab/-blast helpless victims from any direction. And when doing so, the cooldown would be reduced to 3s, so we might be able to use another Backstab just before the stun wears off.