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Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

bryanboomer's Avatar


bryanboomer
12.13.2013 , 12:13 AM | #6691
the premades, don't bother me in the least, what bothers me is, the trend of character people are playing and why they are playing them. I started out with my BH when the game launched, I love my BH, I love playing my BH, but if my BH in anyway starts gaining attention I'm dead in less than 10 seconds, 2 seconds if more than 1 smash ***** jumps me. I can't kill anything that fast, I could have the best gear, min/maxed but bounty hunters cannot stun lock kill like ***'s/ops can or just plain destroy you like smash spec.

I've been keeping tabs of what toons people are playing recently and 80% in the WZ's I play are either smash spec or steath/damage spec. That is what makes pvp not fun for me anymore and why I cancelled my sub yet again, and possibly for the last time, I've given BW 2 years to fix pvp, resolve equals a joke. I can still be stunlocked to death by assassins, no amount of skill can change that. Might get lucky to escape every know and again if the *** is a bad one, but a good one you're dead. Granted that may not be the case on all classes, just referring to my BH. I've said it before and BW still refuses to listen to the community which is probably why there is only a handful of servers left. but instead of taking away all these immunities and stuns, they just keep adding more, I would say 70% of the time, my push and stun never actually do anything, my hydraulic override only work on a pin even though it say movement impairing effects, well getting stunned is a movement impairing effect last I checked. Sure it's great on PT, whole different animal is the PT.

You don't necessarily need 100% balance between the classes, but I also don't want to roll a toon because it's the flavor of the month, I want my toon to have the ability to be competitive, and leave the skill up to the player. Any Dps can do 900k damage in a WZ if no one is targeting them, but it's survivability of that toon is what matters, PT's mara's/jugs can do massive damage, but they also have outs and survivability something the BH and non stealth sorc lack, and if you think a bubble is the saving grace, not many have played the non-stealth sorc. Again super squishy not many outs a 2.5 sprint, that of which the *** gets as well, the range of the backstab is incredible, jumping, jumping, jumping of the knights/mara's makes escape impossible. I don't see the difficulty in what they are doing, have 2 years of idea's and feedback but still can't get it right. It's just sad too, the pvp initially showed great promise, and I had hoped BW would listen to the masses and do away with the already to many, stuns, launchs, pins, stuns, ect.... at launch. Also don't give me that crap of how hard mara's and ***'s are to play, while I'm stun locked, all I see them doing other than keeping me stunned is backstabbing, tough class to play

Azzataky's Avatar


Azzataky
12.13.2013 , 12:16 AM | #6692
Quote: Originally Posted by Marrius View Post
I am not answering your questions because they are off topic. This thread is not about my, nor anyone elses, prowess at pvp.

And on that note... Premades are ruining pvp!

PUGs have less organization / Premades have more organization
PUGs consist mostly of casual players / Premades are more likely to have more experienced players than PUGs
PUGs never use VOIP / Premades often use VOIP

Based on these simple understandings it is easy to conclude that PUGs < Premades.

Hense my new signature.... hope you like it....
So as I thought, no arguments on my obvious facts, you are a troll sir nothing more. I'd like to parafrase one quote so you would understand what I mean.

Its not possible to discuss something with someone who thinks he has found the truth (which seems you think you did), its only possible to discuss with someone who is looking for the truth.

And yes, my questions are PUG vs premade so they can't be off topic. You just can't disprove it so you choose to ignore it. Its like a discussion about god with hardcore religious person. ^^

Marrius's Avatar


Marrius
12.13.2013 , 12:20 AM | #6693
Quote: Originally Posted by Azzataky View Post
But in my experience the best learning is not from being in team with better players, but being against them.

A wondreful reason why premades should only join ranked WZs.
Thank you

Quote: Originally Posted by Azzataky View Post
Thats why I think there should be a PvP tutorials (or at least links to forum guides or another website guides) for this game so we all could learn.
They already exist on the forums. The search bar is your friend.

Quote: Originally Posted by Azzataky View Post
About the fact that you get better in premade team - in my opinion with good players in your team you can learn only if they teach you something, you need to ask or they need to see you are doing it wrong and point it out how to do it better. That usualy doesn't happen if you play against worse enemy, because you win anyway which means your mistakes are easily overlooked. But if you play against better players your mistakes are there seen by everyone. I try to give advices in ops chat while I pvp, when I die or when I defend and no enemy is there. If more people would do that and others would listen! (yes, thats the key part,, try to listen to those who you believe are better players than you - I mean that in general) it might get better in time since most people don't want to read any guides.
Or... if you play against better premades (i.e. ranked) you will learn even better!
- group queue in normal WZ
+ 8v8 ranked
=========================
fair for the majority

BuzzingFridge's Avatar


BuzzingFridge
12.13.2013 , 12:40 AM | #6694
Quote: Originally Posted by Marrius View Post
This game is in trouble.
You're right. SWTOR is in trouble. PvP populations are consistently falling, which is why splitting the queue between Solo and Grouped is not a good idea. There just aren't enough players for Ranked, Solo Regs, Group Regs and Galactic Starfighter. Maybe the biggest servers (like Pot5) would be able to manage it. But for smaller servers like mine, it would just completely kill PvP.

I would be comfortable with splitting the queue if BioWare introduced cross-server queuing. But we all know that is never going to happen.

I guess the other alternative is to remove groups entirely, except for Ranked, but this will also lead to a mass exodus. I have the most fun in this game when I'm playing with my friends. If I can't group with them from time to time, there's really no point in me playing.

Merry Christmas.

IStillWantMySWG's Avatar


IStillWantMySWG
12.13.2013 , 12:57 AM | #6695
Quote: Originally Posted by BuzzingFridge View Post
You're right. SWTOR is in trouble. PvP populations are consistently falling, which is why splitting the queue between Solo and Grouped is not a good idea. There just aren't enough players for Ranked, Solo Regs, Group Regs and Galactic Starfighter. Maybe the biggest servers (like Pot5) would be able to manage it. But for smaller servers like mine, it would just completely kill PvP.

I would be comfortable with splitting the queue if BioWare introduced cross-server queuing. But we all know that is never going to happen.

I guess the other alternative is to remove groups entirely, except for Ranked, but this will also lead to a mass exodus. I have the most fun in this game when I'm playing with my friends. If I can't group with them from time to time, there's really no point in me playing.

Merry Christmas.
I kno im very critical when it comes to SWTOR, but tbh Pot5 is not as big as it used to be. Even tho The Fatman merged into it, unfortunately the ranked scene in that server has pretty much died off, for the most part. It's a pvp server and pvp is just very, very small now as a whole so even Pot5 ranked Q's are dead w/ premades abusing solo Q's.

PvP in all is on life support and w/ BioFail lacking support for exisiting pvp models, removing old ones and bringing in new ones that only live for about 1 or 2 months our player-base is in trouble as a whole.

DarthRaika's Avatar


DarthRaika
12.13.2013 , 01:18 AM | #6696
Quote: Originally Posted by BuzzingFridge View Post
You're right. SWTOR is in trouble. PvP populations are consistently falling, which is why splitting the queue between Solo and Grouped is not a good idea. There just aren't enough players for Ranked, Solo Regs, Group Regs and Galactic Starfighter. Maybe the biggest servers (like Pot5) would be able to manage it. But for smaller servers like mine, it would just completely kill PvP.

I would be comfortable with splitting the queue if BioWare introduced cross-server queuing. But we all know that is never going to happen.

I guess the other alternative is to remove groups entirely, except for Ranked, but this will also lead to a mass exodus. I have the most fun in this game when I'm playing with my friends. If I can't group with them from time to time, there's really no point in me playing.

Merry Christmas.
This is more of a logic issue that your bring up. You say too many people are leaving and so therefor we can't split up groups. As someone who has played from release I would say that many of the people I know who have left have told me that most matches are uneven. Also, I premaded a lot early on and most of the people I am talking about premaded as well. They became bored because matches were too easy. This is why matchmaking is important. Good premaders with decent irls want to win but they also want a lot of matches to be close. Pugstomping is boring. Please support matchmaking.

Marrius's Avatar


Marrius
12.13.2013 , 01:29 AM | #6697
Quote: Originally Posted by Azzataky View Post
Now your reasoning says that we won only because we are premade.
No my reasoning states that a premade is more likely to win.

Quote: Originally Posted by Azzataky View Post
How is it possible that on Voidstar I was able on my scoundrel to stealth behind enemy line, get one door, get the bridge, another door etc., till the end? Imps weren't defending, they weren't following the objective - not playing that warzone well. Usualy though I get interrupted almost imidiately when I try to put bomb on doors.

Now what do you think is the difference between teams who interupt my bomb and those who don't? And no, its not that they have premades every time.
I didn't answer this before because it was not only off topic. but it was rhetorical. Meaning that it was self evident and needn't an answer. I didn't think you so simple minded that you needed me to state that the difference between people that interrupt or disarm and people that don't is both knowledge and skill. Knowledge for what to do and skill in executing it.

Now that being said, I have already posted how skill and organization are separate entities and seeing as I took the time to go back and answer your rhetoric, you can take the time to go back and educate yourself.

Furthermore in your next post you compare pugs to choosing from world class players for a football team. This example gave me a chuckle to think you have such high regard for pug players. PUGs may, on occasion, have higher calibre players in them (more often, and unfortunately, premades have the more skilled players).

The thing is even an unskilled team can win over a skilled team if the unskilled team is organized and this is what I have been saying all along about premades. As a rule premades have more organization than pugs.

Now I have answered your silly questions and tried to stay on topic. Will you now (if you are able) please do likewise in your future posts?

Merry Christmas.
- group queue in normal WZ
+ 8v8 ranked
=========================
fair for the majority

Marrius's Avatar


Marrius
12.13.2013 , 01:38 AM | #6698
Quote: Originally Posted by BuzzingFridge View Post
You're right. SWTOR is in trouble. PvP populations are consistently falling, which is why splitting the queue between Solo and Grouped is not a good idea. There just aren't enough players for Ranked, Solo Regs, Group Regs and Galactic Starfighter. Maybe the biggest servers (like Pot5) would be able to manage it. But for smaller servers like mine, it would just completely kill PvP.

I would be comfortable with splitting the queue if BioWare introduced cross-server queuing. But we all know that is never going to happen.

I guess the other alternative is to remove groups entirely, except for Ranked, but this will also lead to a mass exodus. I have the most fun in this game when I'm playing with my friends. If I can't group with them from time to time, there's really no point in me playing.

Merry Christmas.
Please read my posts and find one time I have suggested splitting the queue. What I have suggested is that group queues be forbidden in normal WZs and 8v8 be brought back. If you had taken the time to read rather than brag about your apparent pvp skillz you would have learned this.

Merry Christmas.

PS If you'd like to PM me your mailing address I can send you some reading material, and exercises I have left over from my classes. This may improve your reading/writing, assuming the case of you not reading was inability over lack of will.
- group queue in normal WZ
+ 8v8 ranked
=========================
fair for the majority

Ren_simp's Avatar


Ren_simp
12.13.2013 , 01:42 AM | #6699
Quote: Originally Posted by Marrius View Post
No my reasoning states that a premade is more likely to win.



I didn't answer this before because it was not only off topic. but it was rhetorical. Meaning that it was self evident and needn't an answer. I didn't think you so simple minded that you needed me to state that the difference between people that interrupt or disarm and people that don't is both knowledge and skill. Knowledge for what to do and skill in executing it.

Now that being said, I have already posted how skill and organization or separate entities and seeing as I took the time to go back and answer your rhetoric, you can take the time to go back and educate yourself.

Furthermore in your next post you compare pugs to choosing from world class players for a football team. This example gave me a chuckle to think you have such high regard for pug players. PUGs may have higher calibre players in them (more often, and unfortunately, premades have the more skilled players) The thing is even an unskilled team can win over a skilled team if the unskilled team is organized and this is what I have been saying all along about premades. As a rule premades have more organization than pugs.

Now I have answered your silly questions and tried to stay on topic. will you now (if you are able) please do likewise in your future posts?

Merry Christmas.
Go form a group run some wz for a few hrs that should give you an idea
You will soon learn that you will face other premades a lot and that pugs aren't as helpless as your making them out to be.

You have very minimal experience in pvp I can tell just from your post that this is the case.

Marrius's Avatar


Marrius
12.13.2013 , 01:47 AM | #6700
Quote: Originally Posted by Ren_simp View Post
Go form a group run some wz for a few hrs that should give you an idea
You will soon learn that you will face other premades a lot and that pugs aren't as helpless as your making them out to be.
.
Been there done it. And yup stomped my share of pugs. It hurts the game and I (as I have posted before) now refuse to join unless they queue for ranked. Call me a reformed pugstomper

Quote: Originally Posted by Ren_simp View Post
You have very minimal experience in pvp I can tell just from your post that this is the case.
Only an idiot or a psychic would make wild claims about who someone is or what they have done without knowing said person.... What number am I thinking of?

Merry Christmas.
- group queue in normal WZ
+ 8v8 ranked
=========================
fair for the majority