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ETA on Advanced Class change?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
ETA on Advanced Class change?

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
11.23.2013 , 04:59 PM | #4011
Quote: Originally Posted by ZeroPlus View Post
Hmmm... I see you missed the point. Let me try and explain it better...
At 55 the Trooper Vanguard has 22 abilities that belong to the BASE CLASS and only about 15 that belong to the ADVANCED CLASS. Notice how the Bounty Hunter (the mirror of the Trooper) Mercenary has those same 22 abilities in the BASE CLASS and only about 17 that belongs to the ADVANCED CLASS.

Are they different? Yes they are different.
However, if you are basing your argumente on this statement of yours: "Are you saying that a vanguard has different skills than a trooper or a commando? That would lead me to believe that they were <GASP> DIFFERENT CLASSES, not the same class.", then let me pick that apart for you.
First of all, I'm not saying that a Vanguard has different skills than a Trooper or a Commando. What I am saying is that the Vanguard and the Commando have 22 skills that are EXACTLY THE SAME because they are both Troopers. They only differ in about 15 - 17 skills depending on the Skill Tree they are using.
Second of all, are you trying to state that just because some skills are different, that it make for a different class? If so then a Tactics Vanguard is a different Class from an Assault Vanguard? Is that what you are saying? (OR am I just twisting your words they way you enjoy doing?)

The point I was making is that the Advanced Classes share the same foundation. They are essentially the base class with a specialization that sets them apart from the other specialization in some way.

I'm not trying to convince you of that. It is a plain fact. You may try and deny it all you want; you may say that others are grabbing onto that as the basis for wanting to be able to change ACs; the fact of the matter is that at the end of the day, all the advanced classes are in essence just a specialization of the base class. Nothing more. Nothing less.
A Navy seal, submariner and Navy pilot all share the same foundation. They are all Navy personnel and went through the same boot camp.

By your logic, that submariner would be able to hop in an F-14 tomorrow and go to TOP GUN, as submariner and pilot are only a specializations and NOT a jobs/classes unto themselves. But, wait...it doesn't work that way. Sure, that submariner can request to be a pilot, but he still needs to start at ground zero. He is not simply handed his pilot's wings just because he can throw a little money at the Department of the Navy. He has to EARN them.

Much like the players who wants to play a powertech after leveling a mercenary should level that powertech.

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
11.23.2013 , 05:00 PM | #4012
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
The problem is that those statements from DE remain the last word from the devs on AC's being different classes. I'm also noticing that those quotes do not have dates attached to them, so I wonder if they are in the actual chronological order in which those statements were made. It's very possible that the last statement from DE was the first one that you listed and that makes a HUGE difference. As has been noted by others, the devs can change their minds at any time. The latter statements from DE in your post could very well have been made early in the development, after which the devs changed their minds (views) and therefore issued the "final" statement, the one you listed first.

I'm not saying that this is what happened, but if those statements you list are not in the correct chronological order, it muddies the waters. Correct chronological order, on the other hand, leads to a clearer picture.

This is why I agree with you in that I wold like to see the devs should pop their heads into this thread and make a definitive statement on the AC's and whether or not they are classes or specs. I would also like to see a more definitive statement as to whether they are working on, or even still considering, allowing AC (class) changes or if they have decided to hold to the stance they took before launch and not allow AC (class) changing.
I can find out the chronilogical order if you like. I believe the statement from Zoeller is the most recent in that list.

I certainly hope they decided against AC change. If not, I hope they at least limit it's impact on the game if allowed.

Again, if this is something the masses want I would not campaign against it. Majority rules.

branmakmuffin's Avatar


branmakmuffin
11.23.2013 , 05:07 PM | #4013
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
I can find out the chronilogical order if you like. I believe the statement from Zoeller is the most recent in that list.

I certainly hope they decided against AC change. If not, I hope they at least limit it's impact on the game if allowed.
Here is its negative impact on the game:


Would you like to see it again?

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
11.23.2013 , 05:10 PM | #4014
Quote: Originally Posted by LordArtemis View Post
I can find out the chronilogical order if you like. I believe the statement from Zoeller is the most recent in that list.

I certainly hope they decided against AC change. If not, I hope they at least limit it's impact on the game if allowed.

Again, if this is something the masses want I would not campaign against it. Majority rules.
I'd be very interested to see those statements in their chronological order, even if that order only muddies things further.

Even if they attempt to implement AC changes in a limited fashion, it would likely be no time at all before the forums were full of people clamoring for the removal of those limitations. To see that, one has only to look at the numerous threads clamoring for the current limitations on AC changes to be removed.

Since the forums only represent a very minor portion of the player base as a whole, who can know what the majority wants? There is not even a clear majority in this thread.

ZeroPlus's Avatar


ZeroPlus
11.23.2013 , 06:00 PM | #4015
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
A Navy seal, submariner and Navy pilot all share the same foundation. They are all Navy personnel and went through the same boot camp.

By your logic, that submariner would be able to hop in an F-14 tomorrow and go to TOP GUN, as submariner and pilot are only a specializations and NOT a jobs/classes unto themselves. But, wait...it doesn't work that way. Sure, that submariner can request to be a pilot, but he still needs to start at ground zero. He is not simply handed his pilot's wings just because he can throw a little money at the Department of the Navy. He has to EARN them.

Much like the players who wants to play a powertech after leveling a mercenary should level that powertech.
LOL! You did not just go there, did you?

You really believe that a Navy Seal, Navy Submariner and Navy pilot went through the same boot camp? As an ex-marine myself, I can definetely tell you that at least in my country that isn't the case. From what I know of the other navies I had contact with, it isn't the case in those countries either.

But hey, let's continue to confuse real life with a game some more shall we? Next you will be complaining that vehicles in game should not just pop out of the air, we should have to park them somewhere, fuel them up every now and then and once a year take them into the shop for repairs. Right?

You're right on one point in your post though. Right now, the only solution for a player who wants to play a powertech after leveling a mercenary is to level a powertech.

Who knows what his/her solution will be in a year or two's time...
If you seek answers, you must always ask questions. - Master Vandar Tokare.

[Suggestion] Add another Blaster Pistol with the "A-300 Heavy Sonic Needler" model = DONE!

branmakmuffin's Avatar


branmakmuffin
11.23.2013 , 06:11 PM | #4016
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
There is not even a clear majority in this thread.
That's you trying to spin a "loss" into a "tie."

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
11.23.2013 , 06:39 PM | #4017
Quote: Originally Posted by branmakmuffin View Post
That's you trying to spin a "loss" into a "tie."
By all means, prove my "loss".

Go back through the thread and count each individual poster on both sides, then post the results. .

You won't, though, as that might require effort, and it is easier for you to simply continue to claim the majority wants class changes.

BTW, I'm not the one claiming a clear majority, so the onus is on YOU to provide proof, not me. Until such time as you provide proof by posting the numbers of unique posters on both sides of this debate, you are simply talking out of an orifice other than your mouth.

branmakmuffin's Avatar


branmakmuffin
11.23.2013 , 06:45 PM | #4018
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
By all means, prove my "loss".

Go back through the thread and count each individual poster on both sides, then post the results. .

You won't, though
Neither are you.

Ratajack's Avatar


Ratajack
11.23.2013 , 07:15 PM | #4019
Quote: Originally Posted by branmakmuffin View Post
Neither are you.
But I am not the one claiming a "clear majority", am I? Therefore, as I said, the onus is on you, not me.

branmakmuffin's Avatar


branmakmuffin
11.23.2013 , 07:21 PM | #4020
Quote: Originally Posted by Ratajack View Post
But I am not the one claiming a "clear majority", am I? Therefore, as I said, the onus is on you, not me.
You're claiming a toss-up. I also did not use the phrase "clear majority."